(06-14-2017, 02:05 PM)FBT Wrote: [ -> ] (06-14-2017, 01:21 PM)Kotite Wrote: [ -> ]"Why do we have the Second Amendment? It's not to shoot deer. It's to shoot at the government when it becomes tyrannical." - Senator Rand Paul
It's a fine line between rhetoric and regrettable.
So, you're good with this shooting?
That's what you're getting out of this?
(06-14-2017, 02:51 PM)rollerjag Wrote: [ -> ]This can't be put on one side more than the other, rhetoric on both sides has the potential to light a maniac's fuse.
Thank God for the two police personnel, who shot the attacker after receiving injuries themselves. They prevented a much greater tragedy.
Maybe, but this guy was a typical liberal Dem just repeating on social media the mantra he was continually fed from left wing sources. He's no different than Kotite or Nate in his rhetoric, he just went way too far over the edge.
And there were not attempted mass political killings from the right when Obama was POTUS.
(06-14-2017, 02:57 PM)MalabarJag Wrote: [ -> ] (06-14-2017, 02:51 PM)rollerjag Wrote: [ -> ]This can't be put on one side more than the other, rhetoric on both sides has the potential to light a maniac's fuse.
Thank God for the two police personnel, who shot the attacker after receiving injuries themselves. They prevented a much greater tragedy.
Maybe, but this guy was a typical liberal Dem just repeating on social media the mantra he was continually fed from left wing sources. He's no different than Kotite or Nate in his rhetoric, he just went way too far over the edge.
And there were not attempted mass political killings from the right when Obama was POTUS.
No, he was NOT a typical liberal Democrat, and your view of this is a shining example of what's wrong with our current political climate.
This was one attack from one lunatic, don't act as if it's an epidemic.
(06-14-2017, 03:21 PM)rollerjag Wrote: [ -> ] (06-14-2017, 02:57 PM)MalabarJag Wrote: [ -> ]Maybe, but this guy was a typical liberal Dem just repeating on social media the mantra he was continually fed from left wing sources. He's no different than Kotite or Nate in his rhetoric, he just went way too far over the edge.
And there were not attempted mass political killings from the right when Obama was POTUS.
No, he was NOT a typical liberal Democrat, and your view of this is a shining example of what's wrong with our current political climate.
This was one attack from one lunatic, don't act as if it's an epidemic.
Let's just ignore Kathy Griffin and the Central Park Actors symbolically stabbing Trump to thunderous applause. Or the (presumably) mainstream Tim Kaine suggesting the Left take the fight to the streets.
There are millions just like Hodgkinson posting and/or repeating political statements just as he has. Was he a lunatic or a normal person who got swept away in the hatred for Trump? I guess you could make the case that anyone who tries to kill a bunch of congressmen is a lunatic, but before this he was just your typical Democrat. Even here we had at least two posters making undocumented claims of Trump being a "traitor." It's far worse on Facebook.
And your post of false equivalence, as if right wingers do this too, falls flat when the actual events are viewed. The only shooting or attempted shooting of a congressperson during the Obama years was by a left winger too.
That's the good ol American way on display...point fingers.
[BLEEP] looking for solutions, that's too hard. Much easier to place blame.
Another shining example we've become as " world leaders".
IF this nut does have mental,issues, let's start with keeping weapons out of their hands. Mental issues, such as those who cannot control finances and need govt intervention, for example, have no restrictions on a purchase. Not meaning to make this about gun control, perhaps there's too much water under bridge to do much about it...but on a no fly list? Mental disabilities? Can buy firearms?
No one deserves this due to differences of opinions.
Those pointing fingers or making excuses are the [BLEEP] holes who do nothing about it.
Thankfully this guy was a poor shot.
(06-14-2017, 03:21 PM)rollerjag Wrote: [ -> ]No, he was NOT a typical liberal Democrat, and your view of this is a shining example of what's wrong with our current political climate.
This was one attack from one lunatic, don't act as if it's an epidemic.
Yet, the church shooter in Charleston was somehow the typical southern conservative, and not an attack by one lunatic based on how people responded to that incident. Subsequent to the Charleston shooting, we've had an effort to completely eradicate genuine historical references in this country, legitimate scars of our past, and much of that movement picked up momentum right there in South Carolina. But, that's okay because he was considered conservative.
So, if someone goes on a shooting spree and he's conservative, it's an indictment of anyone on the right. If a liberal does the same thing, he's a lone wolf and not indicative of a radical ideology.
While I do agree with you that this was just an attack by one lunatic, this is a guy that we're discovering was a masterful parrot of almost every media derived opinion on whatever the hot topic of the day is. Whatever "scandal" the media manufactures on any given day, this guy was a reliable regurgitator of the party line. His Facebook wall and letters he wrote to the editor of his local newspaper could just as easily be transcripts of liberal discussions taking place on CNN or MSNBC. The rhetoric they use was parroted throughout his writings on any topic. That kind of rhetoric has ultimately lead us to the point where you've got someone so ingrained in their political hatred that they're willing to do violence to support their viewpoint while squelching that of anyone they happen to disagree with.
We've seen similar behavior in Berkley where liberals have protested, rioted, attacked, and committed acts of violence against anyone with whom they disagree politically.
We've seen the same thing happen in Wisconsin, Chicago, New York, Washington State, and elsewhere where violence is a perfectly acceptable tactic to silence the opposition. This incident is in reality an extension of that behavior, and as hard as the media tries to spin it like this violent rhetoric is coming from the right, the reality is that almost every documented incident of violence is coming from the people who claim to be the most tolerant. Why is that?
(06-14-2017, 05:28 PM)Ringo Wrote: [ -> ]That's the good ol American way on display...point fingers.
[BLEEP] looking for solutions, that's too hard. Much easier to place blame.
Another shining example we've become as " world leaders".
IF this nut does have mental,issues, let's start with keeping weapons out of their hands. Mental issues, such as those who cannot control finances and need govt intervention, for example, have no restrictions on a purchase. Not meaning to make this about gun control, perhaps there's too much water under bridge to do much about it...but on a no fly list? Mental disabilities? Can buy firearms?
No one deserves this due to differences of opinions.
Those pointing fingers or making excuses are the [BLEEP] holes who do nothing about it.
Thankfully this guy was a poor shot.
This isn't about pointing fingers. It's about taking an honest look at where we are today, and identifying the root of the problem. The escalating intolerance and the subsequent violence that has followed suit has a point of origin. As desperately as you and your fellow leftists want to spin it to the right, events indicate otherwise. This shooting is just the latest.
There are already laws on the books to prevent people from purchasing firearms if they have a history of mental health issues. This guy had a violent history that SHOULD have prevented him from passing any reasonable background check allowing him to purchase firearms. The fact that he had a semi-automatic rifle is not because there aren't enough laws on the books. No fly lists? You might want to refresh your talking points.
If you look at this guys Facebook wall, he was sending up flags left and right with his escalating rhetoric. He was definitely feeling the Bern, and not in a good way.
I agree with you that nobody deserves this because of differing opinions. But, it sure does seem like there's a political viewpoint that claims to be tolerant, yet they are systematically trying to silence any viewpoints that they don't agree with. If that means they need to do violence to accomplish that feat, they're more than willing to go down that path.
(06-14-2017, 02:52 PM)Kotite Wrote: [ -> ] (06-14-2017, 02:05 PM)FBT Wrote: [ -> ]So, you're good with this shooting?
That's what you're getting out of this?
I asked a simple question and you deflected.
I understand there can be radical left, and radical right.. One can be just as equally dangerous to society as the next.. But my biggest beef and concern is that the left doesn't seem like they're condemning much of the violence that stems from the left, itself.. Will we see the Hollywood Elitists condemn such actions? Of course not.. They're the one's lighting the fuses to these radical leftists. They're the one's that act like it's O.K to portray the severed head of our President, or carry out a faux execution of our President by shooting him in the head.. There's always going to be idiots from both sides who like to pretend to decapitate our President, or hang a noose from a tree.. But when you have access to millions of people and your main platform is violence against our President, that's a bit different than Joe Blow on Facebook acting stupid since he doesn't have the platform Kathy Griffin or Snoop Dog does..
I understand free speech.. I agree with free speech.. But when it starts to incite violence, there needs to be charges brought up and carried out..
Kathy Griffin should be in prison for nice long sentence..
Snoop Dog should be in prison for a nice long sentence..
Those kids from Berkley should be in prison for a nice long sentence..
If you can't see anything wrong with the actions of those despicable sub-humans, than you're no better...
(06-14-2017, 06:01 PM)WingerDinger Wrote: [ -> ]I understand there can be radical left, and radical right.. One can be just as equally dangerous to society as the next.. But my biggest beef and concern is that the left doesn't seem like they're condemning much of the violence that stems from the left, itself.. Will we see the Hollywood Elitists condemn such actions? Of course not.. They're the one's lighting the fuses to these radical leftists. They're the one's that act like it's O.K to portray the severed head of our President, or carry out a faux execution of our President by shooting him in the head.. There's always going to be idiots from both sides who like to pretend to decapitate our President, or hang a noose from a tree.. But when you have access to millions of people and your main platform is violence against our President, that's a bit different than Joe Blow on Facebook acting stupid since he doesn't have the platform Kathy Griffin or Snoop Dog does..
I understand free speech.. I agree with free speech.. But when it starts to incite violence, there needs to be charges brought up and carried out..
Kathy Griffin should be in prison for nice long sentence..
Snoop Dog should be in prison for a nice long sentence..
Those kids from Berkley should be in prison for a nice long sentence..
If you can't see anything wrong with the actions of those despicable sub-humans, than you're no better...
Therein lies the problem. They don't condemn it. They'll foam at the mouth over words they find offensive, but not a peep when one of their own acts out violently.
The left has been on a violent downward spiral in the last several years. Look at events like the violence at the Occupy cites, burning and looting during BLM riots, or people getting attacked while attending Trump rallies. The left media does little to condone it and that is not really that shocking when you have leaders talking about #summer of resistance ect.
Also lest we forget the organizer in chief Obama "If they bring a knife to the fight we will bring a gun."
(06-14-2017, 05:55 PM)FBT Wrote: [ -> ] (06-14-2017, 02:52 PM)Kotite Wrote: [ -> ]That's what you're getting out of this?
I asked a simple question and you deflected.
I have been posting here long enough for you to know the answer to that question.
I was merely pointing out that the rhetoric and reality often paint very different images. Thought that was evident.
(06-14-2017, 03:21 PM)rollerjag Wrote: [ -> ] (06-14-2017, 02:57 PM)MalabarJag Wrote: [ -> ]Maybe, but this guy was a typical liberal Dem just repeating on social media the mantra he was continually fed from left wing sources. He's no different than Kotite or Nate in his rhetoric, he just went way too far over the edge.
And there were not attempted mass political killings from the right when Obama was POTUS.
No, he was NOT a typical liberal Democrat, and your view of this is a shining example of what's wrong with our current political climate.
This was one attack from one lunatic, don't act as if it's an epidemic.
Shhh... You don't know. Just watch Fox and Friends tomorrow. You'll see.
I was listening to the news in the background talking about the shooting, and they mention the hate seen on social media. They need to take a look in the mirror. It's mainstream media that's created this hate.
Now the Huffington Post is criticizing the shooter for not being more organized saying that individual acts of violence can be counter-productive. They're literally calling for assassinations suggesting the shooter had the right intentions but failed.
(06-14-2017, 05:33 PM)FBT Wrote: [ -> ] (06-14-2017, 03:21 PM)rollerjag Wrote: [ -> ]No, he was NOT a typical liberal Democrat, and your view of this is a shining example of what's wrong with our current political climate.
This was one attack from one lunatic, don't act as if it's an epidemic.
Yet, the church shooter in Charleston was somehow the typical southern conservative, and not an attack by one lunatic based on how people responded to that incident. Subsequent to the Charleston shooting, we've had an effort to completely eradicate genuine historical references in this country, legitimate scars of our past, and much of that movement picked up momentum right there in South Carolina. But, that's okay because he was considered conservative.
So, if someone goes on a shooting spree and he's conservative, it's an indictment of anyone on the right. If a liberal does the same thing, he's a lone wolf and not indicative of a radical ideology.
While I do agree with you that this was just an attack by one lunatic, this is a guy that we're discovering was a masterful parrot of almost every media derived opinion on whatever the hot topic of the day is. Whatever "scandal" the media manufactures on any given day, this guy was a reliable regurgitator of the party line. His Facebook wall and letters he wrote to the editor of his local newspaper could just as easily be transcripts of liberal discussions taking place on CNN or MSNBC. The rhetoric they use was parroted throughout his writings on any topic. That kind of rhetoric has ultimately lead us to the point where you've got someone so ingrained in their political hatred that they're willing to do violence to support their viewpoint while squelching that of anyone they happen to disagree with.
We've seen similar behavior in Berkley where liberals have protested, rioted, attacked, and committed acts of violence against anyone with whom they disagree politically.
We've seen the same thing happen in Wisconsin, Chicago, New York, Washington State, and elsewhere where violence is a perfectly acceptable tactic to silence the opposition. This incident is in reality an extension of that behavior, and as hard as the media tries to spin it like this violent rhetoric is coming from the right, the reality is that almost every documented incident of violence is coming from the people who claim to be the most tolerant. Why is that?
Where was the outrage when
a conservative attacked liberals with a machete in Kentucky?
When Ted Nugent said President Obama was a "subhuman mongrel" who can "suck his machine gun" did his buddy Mike Huckabee disavow or agree with him?
Are "conservatives" in denial about:
![[Image: hqdefault.jpg]](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/2LX4Q643aEU/hqdefault.jpg)
I concede the attacks on Trump supporters by liberal extremists are despicable, but don't forget how Trump encouraged his supporters.
There's bad on both sides, but today's attacker was an outlier.
[url=https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2017/04/28/machete-wielding-assailant-asked-about-political-affiliation-before-campus-attack-witness-says/?utm_term=.006c21dff8af][/url]
I personally think that the root cause of what we are seeing today is that society as a whole has been spiraling downhill and out of control. It's not really a "left wing vs. right wing" thing or a "liberal vs. conservative" thing or a "democrat vs. republican thing... at least as a whole.
It's more about society and how certain acts, lifestyles, behavior, etc. that once was frowned upon is now socially "acceptable". Making things that once were not acceptable more 'socially acceptable" now is sped up in this age of social media, 24/7 news, 24/7 "fake news" and the need for people to be "connected" at all times.
Another huge factor is Hollywood, Broadway and the media. It's no secret that the main stream media is biased. A play depicting the assassination of a sitting President is heralded as "brilliant" and "artful", while it's actually pretty disgusting and shouldn't be acceptable.
You have an "entertainer" thinking that it's alright to post a disgusting picture of her holding the bloody "head" of a sitting President, and it's not treated in a way that would make it unacceptable, the excuse is "free speech". This "entertainer" wasn't trying to entertain anybody, she was trying to "make a political statement". What kind of statement is that? How is that moral? What kind of values does that teach?
Then you have radicals like this guy who go over the edge and actually hurt somebody. This guy thinks thought that because the sitting President has an R next to his name he is somehow "evil". Where does he get such ideas?
Of course, within hours of the shooting you have some politicians scrambling to get in front of a "news" camera trying to politicize the event. More subtly though, watching the coverage from different "news" sources throughout the day, it was interesting to see how some "reported" the story. The main headline theme on some was the fact that the Congress was "coming together in solidarity" or something like that while other sources were reporting on the radical and partisan history of the shooter. While learning about who the shooter was and his history, they all reported that "authorities are trying to determine a motive".
What?
(06-14-2017, 09:32 PM)rollerjag Wrote: [ -> ] (06-14-2017, 05:33 PM)FBT Wrote: [ -> ]Yet, the church shooter in Charleston was somehow the typical southern conservative, and not an attack by one lunatic based on how people responded to that incident. Subsequent to the Charleston shooting, we've had an effort to completely eradicate genuine historical references in this country, legitimate scars of our past, and much of that movement picked up momentum right there in South Carolina. But, that's okay because he was considered conservative.
So, if someone goes on a shooting spree and he's conservative, it's an indictment of anyone on the right. If a liberal does the same thing, he's a lone wolf and not indicative of a radical ideology.
While I do agree with you that this was just an attack by one lunatic, this is a guy that we're discovering was a masterful parrot of almost every media derived opinion on whatever the hot topic of the day is. Whatever "scandal" the media manufactures on any given day, this guy was a reliable regurgitator of the party line. His Facebook wall and letters he wrote to the editor of his local newspaper could just as easily be transcripts of liberal discussions taking place on CNN or MSNBC. The rhetoric they use was parroted throughout his writings on any topic. That kind of rhetoric has ultimately lead us to the point where you've got someone so ingrained in their political hatred that they're willing to do violence to support their viewpoint while squelching that of anyone they happen to disagree with.
We've seen similar behavior in Berkley where liberals have protested, rioted, attacked, and committed acts of violence against anyone with whom they disagree politically.
We've seen the same thing happen in Wisconsin, Chicago, New York, Washington State, and elsewhere where violence is a perfectly acceptable tactic to silence the opposition. This incident is in reality an extension of that behavior, and as hard as the media tries to spin it like this violent rhetoric is coming from the right, the reality is that almost every documented incident of violence is coming from the people who claim to be the most tolerant. Why is that?
Where was the outrage when a conservative attacked liberals with a machete in Kentucky?
When Ted Nugent said President Obama was a "subhuman mongrel" who can "suck his machine gun" did his buddy Mike Huckabee disavow or agree with him?
Are "conservatives" in denial about:
I concede the attacks on Trump supporters by liberal extremists are despicable, but don't forget how Trump encouraged his supporters.
There's bad on both sides, but today's attacker was an outlier.
[url=https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2017/04/28/machete-wielding-assailant-asked-about-political-affiliation-before-campus-attack-witness-says/?utm_term=.006c21dff8af][/url]
Two links to the WaPo which are grayed out because WaPo doesn't like my ad blocker. One blurry picture of ... what exactly?
Come on RJ, you can at least post things that are legible to prove your point.
I don't remember Ted Nugent every killing anyone. I don't even remember anyone posting his remarks and then attempting to kill a politician.
"If she (Hillary) gets to pick her judges.. Nothing you can do folks.. Although the 2nd Amendment people, maybe there is, I don't know.." - DJT
Just another example of the rhetoric that is totally excused because the right never thought they would be the target.
Not justifying violence or condoning this sad act. Just pointing out that words matter. And not a one of you on this board condemned this statement or countless others like it. Trump can promptly speak out on violence when his own people are the target, but has been silent or severely tardy on several other acts of violence perpetrated by people who are aligned to his base. It's farcical.
Im glad to see the media not making this a left or right issue.
On that note, again gun violence is out of control, another person who has had convictions of domestic violence and other crimes had access to a gun that he probably brought off the street.
Hopefully this will squelch some of the childish and hate-filled rhetoric from the left. At least for a little while.
It's as if the past 8 years didn't happen huh...