Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

(01-03-2019, 03:05 PM)StroudCrowd1 Wrote: [ -> ]You can't simply look at the "needs" of the teams drafting in front of you to dictate your trade-up strategy. If you intend to trade up to get your guy, you need to trade all the way up to the top. What do you gain by trading up to #2 then having someone leapfrog you and taking your guy? (minus lost draft picks).

If you are going to make the deal before draft day, I agree completely with this take.  That's what happened to the Raiders a few years back, when they moved up to get Pace (at least that's what the speculation was at the time)http://www.spokesman.com/stories/1997/ap...-in-draft/ , only to have the Rams deal up over them to get Orlando Pace, IIRC.  https://cover7.wordpress.com/2015/04/29/...nfl-draft/

However, you may not be able to trade all the way up to one. Maybe the Cards ask for an exorbitant price for trading out of 1. Maybe the Cards have their eyes firmly on Bosa and do not want to deal out of that spot.  Be prepared to trade all the way up to the top spot?  Absolutely.  But I would add be prepared to trade up to 2, 3, 4, etc.

By the way, the considerations to deal up in both of those scenarios were not prohibitive.  Of course, there was no stud QB at the top of that draft.  Perhaps if there was something in between those deals and the Colts-Jets deal last year, it might be palatable for me.

(01-06-2019, 12:26 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-03-2019, 03:05 PM)StroudCrowd1 Wrote: [ -> ]You can't simply look at the "needs" of the teams drafting in front of you to dictate your trade-up strategy. If you intend to trade up to get your guy, you need to trade all the way up to the top. What do you gain by trading up to #2 then having someone leapfrog you and taking your guy? (minus lost draft picks).

If you are going to make the deal before draft day, I agree completely with this take.  That's what happened to the Raiders a few years back, when they moved up to get Pace (at least that's what the speculation was at the time)http://www.spokesman.com/stories/1997/ap...-in-draft/ , only to have the Rams deal up over them to get Orlando Pace, IIRC.  https://cover7.wordpress.com/2015/04/29/...nfl-draft/

However, you may not be able to trade all the way up to one. Maybe the Cards ask for an exorbitant price for trading out of 1. Maybe the Cards have their eyes firmly on Bosa and do not want to deal out of that spot.  Be prepared to trade all the way up to the top spot?  Absolutely.  But I would add be prepared to trade up to 2, 3, 4, etc.

By the way, the considerations to deal up in both of those scenarios were not prohibitive.  Of course, there was no stud QB at the top of that draft.  Perhaps if there was something in between those deals and the Colts-Jets deal last year, it might be palatable for me.

A few years back?  Lol, that was over 20 years ago

(01-06-2019, 02:18 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-06-2019, 12:26 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]If you are going to make the deal before draft day, I agree completely with this take.  That's what happened to the Raiders a few years back, when they moved up to get Pace (at least that's what the speculation was at the time)http://www.spokesman.com/stories/1997/ap...-in-draft/ , only to have the Rams deal up over them to get Orlando Pace, IIRC.  https://cover7.wordpress.com/2015/04/29/...nfl-draft/

However, you may not be able to trade all the way up to one. Maybe the Cards ask for an exorbitant price for trading out of 1. Maybe the Cards have their eyes firmly on Bosa and do not want to deal out of that spot.  Be prepared to trade all the way up to the top spot?  Absolutely.  But I would add be prepared to trade up to 2, 3, 4, etc.

By the way, the considerations to deal up in both of those scenarios were not prohibitive.  Of course, there was no stud QB at the top of that draft.  Perhaps if there was something in between those deals and the Colts-Jets deal last year, it might be palatable for me.

A few years back?  Lol, that was over 20 years ago

For old timers like me, that was a few years back.  

Haskins just declared.

LET'S GO!

We all knew he would, but it’s cool that it’s finally official.

(01-03-2019, 07:20 PM)Jags02 Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-03-2019, 03:58 PM)StroudCrowd1 Wrote: [ -> ]But what does taking them at their word of staying put really mean? What if they intend to stay put and we move up to #2, then NYG make them an offer they can't refuse. If we want him, we need to convince ARI to trade down. 

If the powers that be decide the talent gap between Haskins, Lock, Grier, etc, isn't significant enough, then they should stay put. It will take massive draft capital to move up to #1.

I'm hoping they're able to keep close enough tabs on the situation that in the end they can get Haskins at #3. #3 makes for a nice and easy trade up whereas getting the #2 would virtually wipe out our early picks. We'd have to literally sell the farm to get the first overall pick. 

(01-07-2019, 04:02 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Haskins just declared.

LET'S GO!

Your excitement is contagious on this guy. You even have me excited for him.

I just hope the FO doesn't disappoint you when they draft the DE from Toledo State who showed serious flashes of athleticism in the Mott's Fruit Bowl last week.

(01-07-2019, 04:30 PM)StroudCrowd1 Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-03-2019, 07:20 PM)Jags02 Wrote: [ -> ]I'm hoping they're able to keep close enough tabs on the situation that in the end they can get Haskins at #3. #3 makes for a nice and easy trade up whereas getting the #2 would virtually wipe out our early picks. We'd have to literally sell the farm to get the first overall pick. 

(01-07-2019, 04:02 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Haskins just declared.

LET'S GO!

Your excitement is contagious on this guy. You even have me excited for him.

I just hope the FO doesn't disappoint you when they draft the DE from Toledo State who showed serious flashes of athleticism in the Mott's Fruit Bowl last week.

Yea but that Motts Fruit Bowl is juicy.....

I'm not sure what it is about Haskins but I've been following him closely ever since he initially committed to the University of Maryland (my alma mater). Then he decided to go to OSU and I watched him, hoping he would fail considering he just burned my Terps. However the more I watched him, the more I liked. He came into the Michigan OSU game last year and helped bring them back for a victory after Barrett went down.

Then he's named the starter this year and is immediately asked to be the focal point of the offense. Not just hand the ball off every play but be the man. He responded with one of the best seasons a Big Ten QB has ever had. He's cool, calm and extremely accurate. 

Every season I have a couple guys that I get really pumped about. Some pan out (Earl Thomas, AJ Green, Yannick Ngakoue, David Johnson, Leonard Williams) and others who bust (Blackmon even before he was a Jag, Trae Waynes, Warmack, Watkins). I'm clearly all in on Haskins. For better or for worse.

Do what the Saints did under Ditka. Trade all the draft picks to the Cardinals because a franchise QB is worth that.

It's gonna be hilarious when Tom moves up in the draft to take Drew Lock over Haskins

(01-07-2019, 04:53 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]It's gonna be hilarious when Tom moves up in the draft to take Drew Lock over Haskins

This would be a Gene Smith type move, after hearing rumblings that Denver was going to jump to 6 and get him.

(01-07-2019, 04:53 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]It's gonna be hilarious when Tom moves up in the draft to take Drew Lock over Haskins

That's not funny.

(01-07-2019, 04:53 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]It's gonna be hilarious when Tom moves up in the draft to take Drew Lock over Haskins

(01-07-2019, 04:53 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]It's gonna be hilarious when Tom moves up in the draft to take Drew Lock over Haskins

(01-07-2019, 04:30 PM)StroudCrowd1 Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-03-2019, 07:20 PM)Jags02 Wrote: [ -> ]I'm hoping they're able to keep close enough tabs on the situation that in the end they can get Haskins at #3. #3 makes for a nice and easy trade up whereas getting the #2 would virtually wipe out our early picks. We'd have to literally sell the farm to get the first overall pick. 

(01-07-2019, 04:02 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Haskins just declared.

LET'S GO!

Your excitement is contagious on this guy. You even have me excited for him.

I just hope the FO doesn't disappoint you when they draft the DE from Toledo State who showed serious flashes of athleticism in the Mott's Fruit Bowl last week.

Mott’s Fruit Bowl....that’s some funny stuff.  In all seriousness we need Kevin Costner to come in and make it happen where we get Haskins and another Stud and don’t give up anything.

(01-07-2019, 04:53 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]It's gonna be hilarious when Tom moves up in the draft to take Drew Lock over Haskins

Smarter than selecting Haskins.

He's fool's gold.

Folks in Ohio are saying he needs to stay in another year to grow (and they're not saying that because they selfishly want him to stay at OH St.)

Personally, I'd pass on both.  But yeah, some folks (and maybe even Tom) are desperate and insistent we draft the future this year.

I just don't see any long term answer in either draft or free agency this season.  Very poor QB crop in the draft, exceptionally so... and only very short term bridges in FA.

If I'd draft, I'd draft Jones.  Otherwise, you're getting a backup ceiling QB.

(01-07-2019, 07:36 PM)pirkster Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-07-2019, 04:53 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]It's gonna be hilarious when Tom moves up in the draft to take Drew Lock over Haskins

Smarter than selecting Haskins.

He's fool's gold.

Folks in Ohio are saying he needs to stay in another year to grow (and they're not saying that because they selfishly want him to stay at OH St.)

Personally, I'd pass on both.  But yeah, some folks (and maybe even Tom) are desperate and insistent we draft the future this year.

I just don't see any long term answer in either draft or free agency this season.  Very poor QB crop in the draft, exceptionally so... and only very short term bridges in FA.

If I'd draft, I'd draft Jones.  Otherwise, you're getting a backup ceiling QB.

Apart from having a bigger arm what does Lock do better than Haskins as a QB?  I'm all ears.    

Yeah this year's class is pretty much Haskins or bust for me. The rest of those guys like Lock and Daniel Jones would be afterthoughts if not for a very weak QB class.

(01-07-2019, 07:36 PM)pirkster Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-07-2019, 04:53 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]It's gonna be hilarious when Tom moves up in the draft to take Drew Lock over Haskins

Smarter than selecting Haskins.

He's fool's gold.

Folks in Ohio are saying he needs to stay in another year to grow (and they're not saying that because they selfishly want him to stay at OH St.)

Personally, I'd pass on both.  But yeah, some folks (and maybe even Tom) are desperate and insistent we draft the future this year.

I just don't see any long term answer in either draft or free agency this season.  Very poor QB crop in the draft, exceptionally so... and only very short term bridges in FA.

If I'd draft, I'd draft Jones.  Otherwise, you're getting a backup ceiling QB.

Just curious, what was your impression of Watson, Mahomes, Mayfield or Darnold coming out?

You seem very sure about Haskins so I’m curious how the rest of analyses have played out.

---

(01-07-2019, 07:46 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]

(01-07-2019, 07:36 PM)pirkster Wrote: [ -> ]Smarter than selecting Haskins.

He's fool's gold.

Folks in Ohio are saying he needs to stay in another year to grow (and they're not saying that because they selfishly want him to stay at OH St.)

Personally, I'd pass on both.  But yeah, some folks (and maybe even Tom) are desperate and insistent we draft the future this year.

I just don't see any long term answer in either draft or free agency this season.  Very poor QB crop in the draft, exceptionally so... and only very short term bridges in FA.

If I'd draft, I'd draft Jones.  Otherwise, you're getting a backup ceiling QB.

Apart from having a bigger arm what does Lock do better than Haskins as a QB?  I'm all ears.    

Yeah this year's class is pretty much Haskins or bust for me. The rest of those guys like Lock and Daniel Jones would be afterthoughts if not for a very weak QB class.

Same boat as you.

Haskins, to me, is in a tier far above the rest.

Last year, I would have taken a chance on Jackson, and worked him in the same way the Ravens did.

I also thought Mayfield had the best chance of success... otherwise, I said last year's class was a minefield and a poor class, too.

I see absolutely nothing special in any of these QBs, and am baffled by what some think makes Haskins any different than any of the others... he's extremely green/raw and has nothing that separates him from the others at all.

(01-07-2019, 07:56 PM)pirkster Wrote: [ -> ]Last year, I would have taken a chance on Jackson, and worked him in the same way the Ravens did.

I also thought Mayfield had the best chance of success... otherwise, I said last year's class was a minefield and a poor class, too.

I see absolutely nothing special in any of these QBs, and am baffled by what some think makes Haskins any different than any of the others... he's extremely green/raw and has nothing that separates him from the others at all.

Ok. And what about Mahomes? Have you ever been wrong about a QB? lol 

Haskins has elite accuracy and stays cool/calm in the pocket. He was asked to be the man in year 1 and surpassed all expectations with flying colors.

(01-07-2019, 07:56 PM)pirkster Wrote: [ -> ]Last year, I would have taken a chance on Jackson, and worked him in the same way the Ravens did.

I also thought Mayfield had the best chance of success... otherwise, I said last year's class was a minefield and a poor class, too.

I see absolutely nothing special in any of these QBs, and am baffled by what some think makes Haskins any different than any of the others... he's extremely green/raw and has nothing that separates him from the others at all.

You don't see anything special in Mahomes? 5100 yards, 50 TD and only 12 INT in your first year playing is pretty special I'd say..