(08-17-2023, 09:58 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 09:56 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Freedom fighters by definition only exist in places that aren't free. You are free. You can spout your nonsense about the election to anyone except for certain election officials who are in the process of performing their duties. And you won't be punished. If you are already free, you are not a freedom fighter.
Bleat on baby.
Careful what you wish for.
https://xkcd.com/1013/
(08-17-2023, 10:11 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 09:58 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Bleat on baby.
Careful what you wish for. https://xkcd.com/1013/
No man fights harder for his chains than the contented slave.
(08-17-2023, 12:06 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 10:11 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Careful what you wish for. https://xkcd.com/1013/
No man fights harder for his chains than the contented slave.
Name one thing that I should be free to do that I am not free to do.
(08-17-2023, 01:13 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 12:06 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]No man fights harder for his chains than the contented slave.
Name one thing that I should be free to do that I am not free to do.
Manufacture an incandescent light bulb.
(08-17-2023, 01:34 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 01:13 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Name one thing that I should be free to do that I am not free to do.
Manufacture an incandescent light bulb.
Interesting. Should I also be free to remove my catalytic converter and replace it with straight pipe?
(08-17-2023, 02:32 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 02:01 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Interesting. Should I also be free to remove my catalytic converter and replace it with straight pipe?
Yes
But what about the rights of people with athsma?
(08-17-2023, 02:52 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 02:32 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Yes
But what about the rights of people with athsma?
Feel free to move somewhere else. It's not unknown in human history, we just have a coddled generation that thinks they're entitled to tell other people how to live.
(08-17-2023, 01:34 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 01:13 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Name one thing that I should be free to do that I am not free to do.
Manufacture an incandescent light bulb.
Are we going to fight the new Civil War over incandescent light bulbs?
(08-17-2023, 04:49 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 01:34 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Manufacture an incandescent light bulb.
Are we going to fight the new Civil War over incandescent light bulbs?
My freedom to be minimally illuminated with poor energy efficiency has been stolen from me.
Stolen, I say!
I'm calling up the militia.
(08-17-2023, 04:21 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 02:52 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]But what about the rights of people with athsma?
Feel free to move somewhere else. It's not unknown in human history, we just have a coddled generation that thinks they're entitled to tell other people how to live.
Move somewhere else?
So if an Indian person living with some of the dirtiest air in the world wants to have cleaner air, they should just move? Where? Here?
(08-17-2023, 04:49 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 01:34 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Manufacture an incandescent light bulb.
Are we going to fight the new Civil War over incandescent light bulbs?
He asked for an example. I provided one. You can be ok with the petty tyranny of your masters, I don't have to be.
(08-17-2023, 05:07 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 04:21 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Feel free to move somewhere else. It's not unknown in human history, we just have a coddled generation that thinks they're entitled to tell other people how to live.
Move somewhere else?
So if an Indian person living with some of the dirtiest air in the world wants to have cleaner air, they should just move? Where? Here?
With all the love in my heart I say that I don't give two [BLEEP] about what an Indian person chooses to do or not do.
(08-17-2023, 05:06 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 04:49 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]Are we going to fight the new Civil War over incandescent light bulbs?
My freedom to be minimally illuminated with poor energy efficiency do what I like in my own best interests has been stolen from me.
Stolen, I say!
I'm calling up the militia.
FTFY, and as I said, you can be fine with petty tyranny, it's simply one example of a multitude of similar aggressions against your natural rights to be left the [BLEEP] alone.
(08-18-2023, 12:14 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 05:07 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Move somewhere else?
So if an Indian person living with some of the dirtiest air in the world wants to have cleaner air, they should just move? Where? Here?
With all the love in my heart I say that I don't give two [BLEEP] about what an Indian person chooses to do or not do.
(08-17-2023, 05:06 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]My freedom to be minimally illuminated with poor energy efficiency do what I like in my own best interests has been stolen from me.
Stolen, I say!
I'm calling up the militia.
FTFY, and as I said, you can be fine with petty tyranny, it's simply one example of a multitude of similar aggressions against your natural rights to be left the [BLEEP] alone.
Interesting word choice
Inaccurate, but interesting anyway.
(08-18-2023, 12:14 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2023, 05:07 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Move somewhere else?
So if an Indian person living with some of the dirtiest air in the world wants to have cleaner air, they should just move? Where? Here?
With all the love in my heart I say that I don't give two [BLEEP] about what an Indian person chooses to do or not do.
(08-17-2023, 05:06 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]My freedom to be minimally illuminated with poor energy efficiency do what I like in my own best interests has been stolen from me.
Stolen, I say!
I'm calling up the militia.
FTFY, and as I said, you can be fine with petty tyranny, it's simply one example of a multitude of similar aggressions against your natural rights to be left the [BLEEP] alone.
OK, say they are Americans then. Say the US government listens to you and catalytic converters are no longer required, and more and more people don't have them in their cars anymore. Now, say you develop athsma. Where are you going to move to?
(08-18-2023, 08:22 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-18-2023, 12:14 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]With all the love in my heart I say that I don't give two [BLEEP] about what an Indian person chooses to do or not do.
FTFY, and as I said, you can be fine with petty tyranny, it's simply one example of a multitude of similar aggressions against your natural rights to be left the [BLEEP] alone.
OK, say they are Americans then. Say the US government listens to you and catalytic converters are no longer required, and more and more people don't have them in their cars anymore. Now, say you develop athsma. Where are you going to move to?
Somewhere else, pretty simple answer. Plus meds control asthma, so likely no need to move, but you choose to ignore that in your ham fisted attempt to make a point.
(08-18-2023, 07:37 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (08-18-2023, 12:14 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]With all the love in my heart I say that I don't give two [BLEEP] about what an Indian person chooses to do or not do.
FTFY, and as I said, you can be fine with petty tyranny, it's simply one example of a multitude of similar aggressions against your natural rights to be left the [BLEEP] alone.
Interesting word choice
Inaccurate, but interesting anyway.
Completely accurate way to describe the regulatory state. Bureaucrats and busy bodies writing more and more rules so you can pay more and do less, all the while tightening those chains around your ankles.
(08-18-2023, 09:05 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (08-18-2023, 08:22 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]OK, say they are Americans then. Say the US government listens to you and catalytic converters are no longer required, and more and more people don't have them in their cars anymore. Now, say you develop athsma. Where are you going to move to?
Somewhere else, pretty simple answer. Plus meds control asthma, so likely no need to move, but you choose to ignore that in your ham fisted attempt to make a point.
(08-18-2023, 07:37 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Interesting word choice
Inaccurate, but interesting anyway.
Completely accurate way to describe the regulatory state. Bureaucrats and busy bodies writing more and more rules so you can pay more and do less, all the while tightening those chains around your ankles.
Where would you move to that would have less pollution in this scenario? The entire country would have cars with no converters. What if you can't afford this medicine? What if you can't afford to move?
(08-18-2023, 09:42 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-18-2023, 09:05 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Somewhere else, pretty simple answer. Plus meds control asthma, so likely no need to move, but you choose to ignore that in your ham fisted attempt to make a point.
Completely accurate way to describe the regulatory state. Bureaucrats and busy bodies writing more and more rules so you can pay more and do less, all the while tightening those chains around your ankles.
Where would you move to that would have less pollution in this scenario? The entire country would have cars with no converters. What if you can't afford this medicine? What if you can't afford to move?
Those really sound like "you" problems to me. Your entire scenario is based on no one doing those things even though the current EV nonsense clearly shows you that companies and people will still act to solve those problems. You think that if we roll back regulatory overreach the whole world will become a barren polluted hellscape but really you've just watched way too many environmentalist propaganda flicks.
(08-18-2023, 09:58 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (08-18-2023, 09:42 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Where would you move to that would have less pollution in this scenario? The entire country would have cars with no converters. What if you can't afford this medicine? What if you can't afford to move?
Those really sound like "you" problems to me. Your entire scenario is based on no one doing those things even though the current EV nonsense clearly shows you that companies and people will still act to solve those problems. You think that if we roll back regulatory overreach the whole world will become a barren polluted hellscape but really you've just watched way too many environmentalist propaganda flicks.
I assume you are a relatively healthy man with a decent income. I am too. But not everyone is. What if you weren't? That's what I'm asking.
EVs are supported by tax breaks that you oppose. Hybrids are supported by fleet efficiency requirements that you oppose. Neither would be on the market at all if not for these policies. The current market allows it to look like a choice where I care about the environment and buy a hybrid and you don't and buy conventional, but those choices don't exist without the government regulation creating them. And you oppose that. You are not for me having these choices. You are for me choosing the color and size of the conventional gas vehicle with high emissions that I want.