2013- 28.1 points per game allowed- 28th in NFL- 379.4 YPG
2014- 25.8 points per game allowed- 26th in NFL- 370.8 YPG
2015- 27.1 points per game allowed- 30th in NFL- 361.5 YPG
Where's the improvement?! Like one other poster said, Gus sure as heck will NEVER beat any good QB's like Brees, Rodgers, Brady, etc with this pathetic defense. He's only beaten BAD QB's and even gave up 34 points to EJ Manuel this year and 50 points to (3-12) Marcus Mariota this year.
Playoff teams the past 3 years have averaged giving up 14 ppg- 21 ppg. The Jags have a LOT of work to do in the offseason to get this defense down 6-7 ppg. Firing Gus would be a good step.
Bro we allowed 3 less points from 2013 - 2014 chill out. #improvement
Its freaking pathetic. Khan better wake up.
but.. but... we don't want to ruin the continuity of our young defense! They could regress... :teehee:
Quote:2013- 28.1 points per game allowed- 28th in NFL- 379.4 YPG
2014- 25.8 points per game allowed- 26th in NFL- 370.8 YPG
2015- 27.1 points per game allowed- 30th in NFL- 361.5 YPG
Where's the improvement?! Like one other poster said, Gus sure as heck will NEVER beat any good QB's like Brees, Rodgers, Brady, etc with this pathetic defense. He's only beaten BAD QB's and even gave up 34 points to EJ Manuel this year and 50 points to (3-12) Marcus Mariota this year.
Playoff teams the past 3 years have averaged giving up 14 ppg- 21 ppg. The Jags have a LOT of work to do in the offseason to get this defense down 6-7 ppg. Firing Gus would be a good step.
Your stats show the Jags have improved by 1 point per game in only two years.
By 2028 Gus should have us right where you think we need to be. You impatient posters really need to chill.
No improvement
Somebody forgot to fix the brakes on the Gus Bus. We're riding this thing until it crashes
Are these the same whiners who cried about Gus hiring "The only OC worse than Jedd Fisch"?
But...but.....but....I am sure Tony Khan has some analytic figures to show massive improvement. You just need to dig deeper.
Not that I'm defending Bradley here, but isn't it odd that a defensive coach like Bradley could have the side of the ball that ISN'T his specialty show DRAMATIC improvement from last year to this one?
I mean if he were incapable of improving the side of the ball that falls within his area of specialty, certainly, then, he should be vastly incapable of dramatically improving the side of the ball that ISN'T in his wheelhouse, correct?
So what's the difference? Why did the offense show so much improvement while the defense did not?
Well, you can make the argument that coaching-a change in coordinators and offensive line coaches-did the trick, going from Fisch to Olson and an inexperienced Luke Butkus to Marrone. You could then speculate that a similar defensive coaching overhaul would do the same on the defensive side.
But such a theory would be incomplete without examination of the disparate infusion of talent on both sides of the ball.
If you examined the offense, there hasn't been much in the way of super star talent added on that side of the ball from free agency. Yes, Julius Thomas was a pro bowler in Denver catching passes from Manning, but few expected him to come close to replicating those numbers here, plus injuries slowed his integration into the offense. Beadles is seen as a liability, and the other major free agency addition, Toby Gerhart, is viewed as a complete waste by most Jaguars fans. Most of the talent infusion on that side of the ball-that which is attributable to the improved productivity-has come in the form of the investment of high draft picks. Since Bradley and Caldwell arrived, the Jaguars have invested SEVEN (7) draft picks in the top three rounds on the offensive side of the ball, and had the added bonus of Allen Hurns, an undrafted free agent find. Of those players, only Lee is not a regular starter. The rest are not only starters, but quality, long term starters. The worst of the bunch is Joeckel.
An examination of the defense, on the other hand, tells a different story. In the same time frame that begins with Bradley's and Caldwell's arrival here, the Jaguars have invested three (3) draft picks in the top three rounds of the draft: Cyprien, Gratz, and Fowler. Cyprien has been inconsistent. Gratz has been benched, and their biggest defensive investment in terms of draft choice-Fowler-got injured about 30 minutes into his first mini camp workout. The defense DID get some mid round surprises in Aaron Colvin and Telvin Smith-both of whom are starting, with Smith looking like a Pro Bowl caliber player. Free agency hasn't exactly been a boon to the defense, either. They've signed guys like Senderrick Marks, Ziggy Hood, Chris Clemons, Sergio Brown, and Dan Skuta. None of these guys were viewed as true catalysts when they were signed. They got a decent year out of thirsty something year old Clemons in 2014, who notched 8 sacks, but predictably his productivity dropped off dramatically with age. Senderrick Marks was still in his prime when he came over from Tennessee, and flourished in Bradley's system-until he got hurt and missed most of this year. They signed another Seattle castoff in Red Bryant, who provided size along the DL and great intangibles, but also a lot of age. He stayed a year. Jared Odrick replaced him, and he was never a guy that has generated a lot of sacks or game changing plays. Skuta is okay, but not a game changer. They went after a star caliber safety in McCourty, but he chose to re-sign with new England. Also, because they are free agents, they are typically older, which means they are more apt to show decline over time than improvement.
Considering the comparative lack of investment in the defense, it shouldn't come as much of a shock to see the lack of a similar level of improvement as the offense.
While I have some issue with Babich, I don't think the defense's performance under Bradley and Babich should be judged in an overly harsh manner, especially in comparison to the offense, until you see similar resources dedicated to its improvement.
Quote:Not that I'm defending Bradley here, but isn't it odd that a defensive coach like Bradley could have the side of the ball that ISN'T his specialty show DRAMATIC improvement from last year to this one?
I mean if he were incapable of improving the side of the ball that falls within his area of specialty, certainly, then, he should be vastly incapable of dramatically improving the side of the ball that ISN'T in his wheelhouse, correct?
So what's the difference? Why did the offense show so much improvement while the defense did not?
Well, you can make the argument that coaching-a change in coordinators and offensive line coaches-did the trick, going from Fisch to Olson and an inexperienced Luke Butkus to Marrone. You could then speculate that a similar defensive coaching overhaul would do the same on the defensive side.
But such a theory would be incomplete without examination of the disparate infusion of talent on both sides of the ball.
If you examined the offense, there hasn't been much in the way of super star talent added on that side of the ball from free agency. Yes, Julius Thomas was a pro bowler in Denver catching passes from Manning, but few expected him to come close to replicating those numbers here, plus injuries slowed his integration into the offense. Beadles is seen as a liability, and the other major free agency addition, Toby Gerhart, is viewed as a complete waste by most Jaguars fans. Most of the talent infusion on that side of the ball-that which is attributable to the improved productivity-has come in the form of the investment of high draft picks. Since Bradley and Caldwell arrived, the Jaguars have invested SEVEN (7) draft picks in the top three rounds on the offensive side of the ball, and had the added bonus of Allen Hurns, an undrafted free agent find. Of those players, only Lee is not a regular starter. The rest are not only starters, but quality, long term starters. The worst of the bunch is Joeckel.
An examination of the defense, on the other hand, tells a different story. In the same time frame that begins with Bradley's and Caldwell's arrival here, the Jaguars have invested three (3) draft picks in the top three rounds of the draft: Cyprien, Gratz, and Fowler. Cyprien has been inconsistent. Gratz has been benched, and their biggest defensive investment in terms of draft choice-Fowler-got injured about 30 minutes into his first mini camp workout. The defense DID get some mid round surprises in Aaron Colvin and Telvin Smith-both of whom are starting, with Smith looking like a Pro Bowl caliber player. Free agency hasn't exactly been a boon to the defense, either. They've signed guys like Senderrick Marks, Ziggy Hood, Chris Clemons, Sergio Brown, and Dan Skuta. None of these guys were viewed as true catalysts when they were signed. They got a decent year out of thirsty something year old Clemons in 2014, who notched 8 sacks, but predictably his productivity dropped off dramatically with age. Senderrick Marks was still in his prime when he came over from Tennessee, and flourished in Bradley's system-until he got hurt and missed most of this year. They signed another Seattle castoff in Red Bryant, who provided size along the DL and great intangibles, but also a lot of age. He stayed a year. Jared Odrick replaced him, and he was never a guy that has generated a lot of sacks or game changing plays. Skuta is okay, but not a game changer. They went after a star caliber safety in McCourty, but he chose to re-sign with new England. Also, because they are free agents, they are typically older, which means they are more apt to show decline over time than improvement.
Considering the comparative lack of investment in the defense, it shouldn't come as much of a shock to see the lack of a similar level of improvement as the offense.
While I have some issue with Babich, I don't think the defense's performance under Bradley and Babich should be judged in an overly harsh manner, especially in comparison to the offense, until you see similar resources dedicated to its improvement.
There's NO reason or excuse to be 30th in defense in your 3rd year if you're truly a "defensive guru".
Marvin Lewis was a defensive coach who had a Cincy team mostly known for a Palmer led offense for a long time.
Billick went to Baltimore as some offensive minded guy and they won with Dilfer and defense...
Players and talent matter more than anything. And the defensive side of the ball, save for a few bright spots, is still vastly void of talent.
but carry on...
here... I'll join...
WAAAHHHH PLEASE FIRE SOMEONE WAAAAH
I feel better.
Quote:There's NO reason or excuse to be 30th in defense in your 3rd year if you're truly a "defensive guru".
You are incorrect.
Quote:There's NO reason or excuse to be 30th in defense in your 3rd year if you're truly a "defensive guru".
Bullseye provided several valid reasons for the struggles on defense. I'm not sure anyone labeled Gus a guru, but few gurus could get much more out of this bunch.
Quote:Not that I'm defending Bradley here, but isn't it odd that a defensive coach like Bradley could have the side of the ball that ISN'T his specialty show DRAMATIC improvement from last year to this one?
I mean if he were incapable of improving the side of the ball that falls within his area of specialty, certainly, then, he should be vastly incapable of dramatically improving the side of the ball that ISN'T in his wheelhouse, correct?
So what's the difference? Why did the offense show so much improvement while the defense did not?
The head coach is supposed to have coordinators to run the offense and defense. A head coach may start coaching over his coordinator on the side he's familiar with, but almost never has much effect on the other side of the ball. Coughlin just let his DC run the defense. JDR just let his OC run the offense. The only thing a head coach can do with a bad coordinator on the other side is fire him.
In Bradley's case, he'll have very little say in the offense week to week. He did chew out Fisch, and eventually fire him, but Bradley still was not coaching the offensive players nor calling the plays. Fisch got fired because of the way he handled Bortles, basically shutting him down after an interception in the Indy game.
Olson is running the offense. He's responsible for the success or failure of the offense. A year of development by Bortles and the WRs, and improvement at both OTs has no doubt been at least partly responsible for the huge improvement on that side.
Babich is running the defense. He has a history of being a bad coordinator with the Bears. Bradley could take over the DC job, he may or may not have done so. If so, it hasn't helped. Either Bradley is the problem, or Babich is the problem and Bradley hasn't taken steps to fix it.
Some people blame the lack of Marks and Fowler, but Fowler wasn't here last year and the Jags improved at RDE, CB, linebacker, and safety which should compensate for the dropoff without Marks, yet the defense has fewer sacks and is giving up more points per game than last year, in spite of playing against backup and rookie QBs and OLs in shambles this year. There are plenty of teams with worse defensive personnel playing much tougher schedules with more success. The Bears, Eagles, and Ravens come to mind.
Quote:You are incorrect.
Good explanation.
Quote:2013- 28.1 points per game allowed- 28th in NFL- 379.4 YPG
2014- 25.8 points per game allowed- 26th in NFL- 370.8 YPG
2015- 27.1 points per game allowed- 30th in NFL- 361.5 YPG
Where's the improvement?! Like one other poster said, Gus sure as heck will NEVER beat any good QB's like Brees, Rodgers, Brady, etc with this pathetic defense. He's only beaten BAD QB's and even gave up 34 points to EJ Manuel this year and 50 points to (3-12) Marcus Mariota this year.
Playoff teams the past 3 years have averaged giving up 14 ppg- 21 ppg. The Jags have a LOT of work to do in the offseason to get this defense down 6-7 ppg. Firing Gus would be a good step.
He beat Eli FWIW.
Quote:Marvin Lewis was a defensive coach who had a Cincy team mostly known for a Palmer led offense for a long time.
Billick went to Baltimore as some offensive minded guy and they won with Dilfer and defense...
Players and talent matter more than anything. And the defensive side of the ball, save for a few bright spots, is still vastly void of talent.
but carry on...
here... I'll join...
WAAAHHHH PLEASE FIRE SOMEONE WAAAAH
I feel better.
I was just about to make a comment regarding Marvin Lewis as well. It was basically the same situation. High powered offense, stinky defense. Like you said, we need better players on that side
Malabar, you mentioned the Jaguars improved RDE in Marks' absence.
How? Who is this improved RDE/LEO?
Spacecoastjag, if they didn't substantially improve the overall talent level on defense, how could you expect substantially improved results?
I dislike Gus as our head coach, but to be fair, the defense does lack talent. Caldwell spent all of his draft resources building up the offense, which he has done a good job doing.
If Gus is kept, which looks to be the case , the defensive staff needs a little overhauling. Gus might be stubborn about firing his buddy though, or changing his scheme at all. If that's the case, hand the keys to Marrone and see what he does.