Quote:Guess you don't read all that good. You asked another poster to name HOF QBs who had worse starts to their career. I named two off the top of my head, and could probably make that list grow much larger if i felt like putting some time in it, which i don't. Continue on your Bortles rampage, i don't really care. I'm sorry for you that you spend so much time hating on a player on a team that we watch for entertainment purposes only. It's a game. Get your emotions under control, it's embarassing.
Don't take shots at my intelligence, It was a simple oversight. In case you didn't notice I was responding do many people at once. Aikman and Steve Young? That's the best you could do? Aikman was another mediocre QB carried by the talent around him, his BEST season was 23 TDS: 14 INTS and 3,000+ yards. If not for the talent around him, he would not nearly be as successful, he got into the HoF because he was a 'winner,' something very foreign to Bortles. Young struggled with injuries in his early career and spent a lot of time as a fill in for Montana. His first full season starting and healthy he lead the league in TD passes and won MVP. Different eras of football. But sure, I'll grant you Steve Young.
That makes for ONE QB in the past 30 years who has gone from bad to HoF. If anything all you've done is prove the point that bad players can get better. How does any of this suggest that Bortles will turn it around and become an elite QB? The odds are not on his side.
Quote:one of these twits has to be TMD lol
Still pretty sure that Baconator is actually JAGANTIUS
Quote: If anything all you've done is prove the point that bad players can get better.
Um, isn't that the topic at hand?
Quote:That makes for ONE QB in the past 30 years who has gone from bad to HoF. If anything all you've done is prove the point that bad players can get better. How does any of this suggest that Bortles will turn it around and become an elite QB? The odds are not on his side.
Him being elite isn't a question. You said he sucks. That's not exactly a fine line.
This is the problem I have with the 'realists'. For being
realists, they have an awfully difficult time sticking to the truth. And if it is even close to the truth, it's a very skewed version of such.
Then again, I'm sure they know that....being
realists and all.
Quote:Him being elite isn't a question. You said he sucks. That's not exactly a fine line.
This is the problem I have with the 'realists'. For being realists, they have an awfully difficult time sticking to the truth. And if it is even close to the truth, it's a very skewed version of such.
Then again, I'm sure they know that....being realists and all.
Self described "realists", cracks me up.
Quote:Um, isn't that the topic at hand?
Show me a player who has gotten better after his rookie year.
(Shown players who got better after their rookie years)
All you showed me was players who got better after their rookie year.
Quote:Show me a player who has gotten better after his rookie year.
(Shown players who got better after their rookie years)
All you showed me was players who got better after their rookie year.
Hahaha! Am i missing something here?!?
Mike Sando NFL Insider
Blake Bortles has completed 5 of 7 passes traveling 30-plus yards past the line of scrimmage. His 71.4 percent completion rate on those throes leads the NFL. He completed only 4 of 17 such throws all last season.
Quote:Um, isn't that the topic at hand?
No, the topic is whether or not he is the answer. Going from an D- to a C- is still an improvement, but not significant enough to have me believe that Bortles will be the long term answer. Citing a couple QBs who had bad rookie seasons then go on to be 'winners' because they were an ancillary piece to a HoF team doesn't prove anything in regards to Bortles. Waiting on him to develop into an average to slightly above average QB while hoping to surround him with multiple HoFers isn't a road to success that has a high probability. In the NFL today, your team's chances start and end with the QB. We need better.
Quote:Him being elite isn't a question. You said he sucks. That's not exactly a fine line.
This is the problem I have with the 'realists'. For being realists, they have an awfully difficult time sticking to the truth. And if it is even close to the truth, it's a very skewed version of such.
Then again, I'm sure they know that....being realists and all.
He does suck as of right now,and I will stand by that statement. Just because he isn't the worst QB in the league and does some things well doesn't mean he's good. He is still very much a below average QB and I don't see his ceiling being any higher than Tannehil or the 3rd tier range of QBs.
Quote:Mike Sando NFL Insider
Blake Bortles has completed 5 of 7 passes traveling 30-plus yards past the line of scrimmage. His 71.4 percent completion rate on those throes leads the NFL. He completed only 4 of 17 such throws all last season.
Nice. Allen Robinson has been the beneficiary of many of those.
Quote:He does suck as of right now,and I will stand by that statement. Just because he isn't the worst QB in the league and does some things well doesn't mean he's good. He is still very much a below average QB and I don't see his ceiling being any higher than Tannehil or the 3rd tier range of QBs.
Ok, I'll bite...humor me. What is your definition of "good?" The reason I ask is this: They way you and some of your kin talk, it reads to a casualish fan like myself that you're looking for Philip Rivers already from a kid who's about to make his what? 17th start?
Now take a step back...take a deep breath and explain to me how/why/in what alternate "Bizarro" world is that realistic or reasonable?
Quote:Ok, I'll bite...humor me. What is your definition of "good?" The reason I ask is this: They way you and some of your kin talk, it reads to a casualish fan like myself that you're looking for Philip Rivers already from a kid who's about to make his what? 17th start?
Now take a step back...take a deep breath and explain to me how/why/in what alternate "Bizarro" world is that realistic or reasonable?
In what bizarro world is it reasonable to expect young talented quarterbacks to produce and have success? How about one where Carr, who was a 2nd round pick in the same draft as Bortles threw for 21 TDs and only 12 INTs in his rookie year. Or Marcus Mariota, 8 TDs 2 INTs in three games with a worse supporting cast of offensive talent than Bortles. Luck had 23 TDs and a positive INT ratio in his rookie year, and showed his ability to elevate his team. Its not an uncommon thing for good players to have an immediate impact.
What is uncommon though, is for QBs who were as bad as Bortles in their early career to go on to be more than a middle of the pack tier QB. We've seen one QB in the past 30 years have a comparably awful start as Bortles and go on to be elite. The odds are not in Bortles favor, especially in this day and age where passing stats are so inflated and prospects are more pro ready than ever.
Unbelievable outlook. Really.
Quote:Unbelievable outlook. Really.
Believe it. I've seen this franchise trot out worse QBs hoping they would 'turn the corner' or 'take that next step' while it never happens. But that never stops a lot of posters from deluding themselves and making every possible excuse to defend him. Every excuse made for Bortles now was made for Gabbert then, and so on for every other. Maybe if we had only given him a little more time? But the drops, and the play-calling, and the offensive line, and the defense, and everybody, and everything but him. When do you bite the bullet and call a spade a spade?
If Bortles doesn't show considerable improvement by the end of the season, the team will have to seriously begin to re-evaluate the QB position.
Wait, isn't baconator a tacks fan???
What's this, "we" nonsense he's talking about??
Quote:In what bizarro world is it reasonable to expect young talented quarterbacks to produce and have success? How about one where Carr, who was a 2nd round pick in the same draft as Bortles threw for 21 TDs and only 12 INTs in his rookie year. Or Marcus Mariota, 8 TDs 2 INTs in three games with a worse supporting cast of offensive talent than Bortles. Luck had 23 TDs and a positive INT ratio in his rookie year, and showed his ability to elevate his team. Its not an uncommon thing for good players to have an immediate impact.
What is uncommon though, is for QBs who were as bad as Bortles in their early career to go on to be more than a middle of the pack tier QB. We've seen one QB in the past 30 years have a comparably awful start as Bortles and go on to be elite. The odds are not in Bortles favor, especially in this day and age where passing stats are so inflated and prospects are more pro ready than ever.
Carr relied on a short high % passing game his first year, again since it was ignored the first time I posted it for you- 4 touchdowns 5 turnovers make up Mariotas last 2 games.
Quote:Carr relied on a short high % passing game his first year, again since it was ignored the first time I posted it for you- 4 touchdowns 5 turnovers make up Mariotas last 2 games.
The point was young QBs can come in a be effective, and that it isn't unreasonable for the #3 pick, first QB overall to be producing at a comparable level to the guy taken in the 2nd round. The best QBs rely on a short passing game to be effective, what's the problem with that? It's worked wonders for Tom Brady. I don't see how Mariota's struggles are relevant to that point, and he only had 4 turnovers (one of which wasn't even his fault). EVERY rookie QB is going to struggle at some point or another, but it takes a pretty darn good one to also set the NFL record for Passing TDs. You also forgot to mention while skewing those stats that Mariota averaged over 300 passing yards in those 2 games. And he was supposed to be a bigger project than Bortles.
do you guys know baconator is a titans fan?
Quote:do you guys know baconator is a titans fan?
And all this time I thought it was a hamburger at Wendys.
You just never know what you might learn on this MB.