Quote:Someone tell me what new gun law would have avoided this sick individual from getting a gun?
You are missing the point. We have a gun violence problem in the US. There are things we can do to lower the numbers. Do you really think other nations are just lucky to have less gun related murders? Or do you think it directly correlates with their laws?
Quote:With as many guns as there are in the United States, there is no gun law that would be enforceable. The horse is out of the barn on that one.
The question we should be asking is, is there any way to minimize these incidents. One thing I believe we can point to is that lonely, shy, frustrated young men are very susceptible to going off the rails of reality and doing things like this. They suddenly become terrorists, or mass murderers, or both. Maybe as a society we can become more aware of these people and do something for them. Be their friend, get them a girlfriend, initiate some social programs (locally based, church based, private charities, whatever) and get them integrated back into society. It's very difficult to stop them once they get it into their head that they have nothing to lose and then they find someone else to blame for their situation. Donning the Confederate flag and posing with a firearm is a big red flag, no pun intended. They need to get laid.
Bingo.
Let me throw some crazy idea out there. Should we not look at the laws of other countries and compare it with their gun related murders and come to a conclusion on how those laws shape gun related murders? Not theories, but look at these laws and their impact on gun related murders. They are there for us all to see.
Quote:Bingo.
Let me throw some crazy idea out there. Should we not look at the laws of other countries and compare it with their gun related murders and come to a conclusion on how those laws shape gun related murders? Not theories, but look at these laws and their impact on gun related murders. They are there for us all to see.
Nah, that's just crazy talk. Everyone knows America is different from the rest of the world. That'll just lead us to being North Korea or China. Instead of the UK or Australia.
Quote:You are missing the point. We have a gun violence problem in the US. There are things we can do to lower the numbers. Do you really think other nations are just lucky to have less gun related murders? Or do you think it directly correlates with their laws?
Like what? What steps would have or could have prevented this tragedy?
You think a national registration would've changed anything? Maybe an assault rifle ban? An ammo limit?
Quote:Bingo.
Let me throw some crazy idea out there. Should we not look at the laws of other countries and compare it with their gun related murders and come to a conclusion on how those laws shape gun related murders? Not theories, but look at these laws and their impact on gun related murders. They are there for us all to see.
Sure but you can't look at "gun crime" and ignore all other crime.
Quote:https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/our...ng-america
Couldn't agree more^^^
I can agree with this.
Fear is a major driving force in America. For both the Republicans and Democrats.
Democrats use fear of shootings to try to ban guns outright, whereas Republicans use fear of having their guns taken away to stop any gun control laws from going into effect at all. They'll cite statistics about cities where guns are banned, but ignore the fact that those areas aren't an island.
How about Ebola? And Terrorism. Fear of Terrorism led both parties to enact the Patriot Act a major violation of civil liberties.
We have a culture driven much by fear. Fear of the Government going too far. Fear of the Government not going far enough. Fear of whatever is out there.
Quote:Bingo.
Let me throw some crazy idea out there. Should we not look at the laws of other countries and compare it with their gun related murders and come to a conclusion on how those laws shape gun related murders? Not theories, but look at these laws and their impact on gun related murders. They are there for us all to see.
Short answer, NOPE.
There is no other country that enjoys the one thing that we have that they don't. FREEDOM.
What percentage of gun violence is done by law abiding citizens?
I'm guessing that in Chicago, Detroit, NYC, California, etc. there was a few murders or killings done last night. How many of those were done by law abiding citizens?
Why not address the root of today's social problems, rather than trying to address the outcome?
Quote:Short answer, NOPE.
There is no other country that enjoys the one thing that we have that they don't. FREEDOM.
What percentage of gun violence is done by law abiding citizens?
I'm guessing that in Chicago, Detroit, NYC, California, etc. there was a few murders or killings done last night. How many of those were done by law abiding citizens?
Why not address the root of today's social problems, rather than trying to address the outcome?
No other country in the world enjoys freedom? You post some strange ideas, but this one may top the list.
What percentage of any crime is committed by law abiding citizens? Given that premise, we should have no laws.
Quote:No other country in the world enjoys freedom? You post some strange ideas, but this one may top the list.
What percentage of any crime is committed by law abiding citizens? Given that premise, we should have no laws.
The LAW is by nature reactionary and cannot actively prevent any crime ever without total controls that we are unwilling to accept. Therefore the best thing is for the law to play out and for this shooter to be put to death for his choice to violate the law. To punish those who did not choose to break the law by rescinding their rights because of the actions of the law breaker is immoral.
Quote:Short answer, NOPE.
There is no other country that enjoys the one thing that we have that they don't. FREEDOM.
What percentage of gun violence is done by law abiding citizens?
I'm guessing that in Chicago, Detroit, NYC, California, etc. there was a few murders or killings done last night. How many of those were done by law abiding citizens?
Why not address the root of today's social problems, rather than trying to address the outcome?
Lol @ freedom. What are you even talking about? The guy should the never have had access to a gun. Period. It was, in fact, illegal for him to have one. Yet because "freedom" we have a crazed people with guns shooting up churches. It's stupid.
Here's the easy fix:
You want a gun? Fine.
Go to a registered dealer. Get your background check. Come back three days later, buy your gun registered to your name. You can't sell or trade it. You get fined if you 'lose it' or don't report it stolen. Tired of it? Sell it back to a registered re-distributer. This way the state can track where all guns are and hold owners liable.
But Lordy no think about our FREEDOM.
Quote:Like what? What steps would have or could have prevented this tragedy?
You think a national registration would've changed anything? Maybe an assault rifle ban? An ammo limit?
I think there are steps that we can take to reduce gun related deaths. Again, other countries have different laws and they also have much lower gun related deaths. Do you not think there is a correlation? Is there nothing we can do? Should we just accept it?
Quote:Short answer, NOPE.
There is no other country that enjoys the one thing that we have that they don't. FREEDOM.
What percentage of gun violence is done by law abiding citizens?
I'm guessing that in Chicago, Detroit, NYC, California, etc. there was a few murders or killings done last night. How many of those were done by law abiding citizens?
Why not address the root of today's social problems, rather than trying to address the outcome?
Again, other countries have stricter gun laws and shockingly have lower deaths by gun. We can address the issue in more then one way.
Quote:The LAW is by nature reactionary and cannot actively prevent any crime ever without total controls that we are unwilling to accept. Therefore the best thing is for the law to play out and for this shooter to be put to death for his choice to violate the law. To punish those who did not choose to break the law by rescinding their rights because of the actions of the law breaker is immoral.
Why must rights be rescinded? That's the typical overreaction to any notion of increased gun control. Restriction is not necessarily rescinding rights.
You cannot take a knife on a commercial airplane. Is that immoral?
Quote:Can you separate the effect of laws from the effect of culture when you're comparing two different countries? And why just use "gun related" murders, rather than all murders? Is it better to kill someone with a knife, or poison?
I think you can kill more easily with a gun and more people at a time.
It's difficult to do with adding culture to the mix. You should however start to question how we do things when you look how far US is above other countries. Culture plays a part, but too many other countries from different parts of the world are doing a far better job. I think it is time to ask why.
Quote:Sure but you can't look at "gun crime" and ignore all other crime.
No, but this topic was about a mass shooting with a gun.
Quote:Why must rights be rescinded? That's the typical overreaction to any notion of increased gun control. Restriction is not necessarily rescinding rights.
You cannot take a knife on a commercial airplane. Is that immoral?
Because it is much easier to redirect the argument into something it is not.
Can someone explain what purpose a pistol has? Seriously...maybe I'm naive. I know rifles, shotguns are used for hunting. But let's say a 5 round derringer I just saw in the ads for $170.
Again, I'm no gun expert, but have shot a few. A pistol was good for extreme close range, and in most cases doesn't have the knock down power for hunting, much less accuracy.
I know it's much too late but if pistols were not abundantly available, would that decrease crime?
Gun advocates " blast away", but the flooding the market with pistols has been a mistake IMO.