Only two impressions from last night. 


First is Josh Allen looks like Khalil Mack, he's going to be an all pro player for years if doesn't suffer some kind of major injury.

Second is Foles is just a middle of the road QB and will need to be carried by the defense and running game, so the Jaguars didn't gain much by moving on to him.

Bonus take: the sloppy kisses Minshew gets around here puzzle me, he looks like just another backup level QB, could have signed someone if his quality in free agency instead of needing to use a draft pick.

So pay, at best, vet minimum for production you could get from a 6th round rookie. Brilliant!

Or, the argument could go,  sign a young udfa for less per year than a 6th round pick.  I'm not taking sides here, and not jumping on Minshew,  but Taysom Hill was a udfa in 2017,  was in camp with the Packers,  who cut him going down to 53 and brought in by the Saints.  The Bills have Tyree Jackson this year,  udfa QB.  Again, not bashing Minshew, just saying that the argument that someone similar could be gotten through fa doesn't require that QB would have to cost more.  The Jaguars liked Minshew enough to draft him,  a 6th round pick isn't much for a backup who really hasn't looked terrible despite scoring few points in many quarters. 

Some teams have a backup who they don't want to start games, but is good enough to finish a game.  Maybe that's the Jaguars.

I'd be mostly worried about the fact that the first 4 drives were almost entirely 1) the new, expensive and presumably good new QB 2) the top first round RB who has had at least 1 very good year and 3) the leading WR from last year who most would argue is the Jaguars best WR.  4 drives, almost all plays were either Foles to Fournette or Foles to Westbrook.  3 and out, then 3 and out,  then TD w/ big assist from 28 yard pass interference to Conley (only pass not to Fournette or Westbrook in the first 4 drives) and interception.

Westbrook was 4.1 yards per target.  29 yards,  4 catches, 7 targets.  Not great.  Fournette was 3.9 yards per carry.  Not great, not terrible, but not great.  2/3 for 19 yards receiving was a little better for Fournette.   But these 3, these are the stars, right?  These are not the stats of stars who win you games.  You can watch each of Foles, Fournette and Westbrook and take out the highlights, and ignore the low points and say "well we're good if there are just the highlights".  Ok, maybe.  And, it's preseason, and that doesn't matter.  

A lot of teams though,  they would put their starting QB out there, the starting QB goes 6/6 with a TD,  with a 120 passer rating and comes off the field.   That kind of performance is kind of what would be expected.  A lot of the starting QBs who are considered "good" have been doing something like this.  Here, it was not that.   Not something to worry about, but something to look at.  One point might be that Foles was throwing against a defense who had been practicing and was trying, vs week 1, when a lot of the QBs were doing well out there with their 6/6 performances.

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So pay, at best, vet minimum for production you could get from a 6th round rookie. Brilliant!

...

I'd be mostly worried about the fact that the first 4 drives were almost entirely 1) the new, expensive and presumably good new QB 2) the top first round RB who has had at least 1 very good year and 3) the leading WR from last year who most would argue is the Jaguars best WR.  4 drives, almost all plays were either Foles to Fournette or Foles to Westbrook.  3 and out, then 3 and out,  then TD w/ big assist from 28 yard pass interference to Conley (only pass not to Fournette or Westbrook in the first 4 drives) and interception.

Westbrook was 4.1 yards per target.  29 yards,  4 catches, 7 targets.  Not great.  Fournette was 3.9 yards per carry.  Not great, not terrible, but not great.  2/3 for 19 yards receiving was a little better for Fournette.   But these 3, these are the stars, right?  These are not the stats of stars who win you games.  You can watch each of Foles, Fournette and Westbrook and take out the highlights, and ignore the low points and say "well we're good if there are just the highlights".  Ok, maybe.  And, it's preseason, and that doesn't matter.  
...

Overanalyzing preseason offensive stats isn't going to give you an accurate outlook for week one of the regular season.

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• Taven Bryan has no nose for the football. The physical ability is there. Good push in the pass game and good penetration against the run. Just poor awareness of where the ball is/where the play is going. Needs time in the film room with a mentor that can teach him how to diagnose formations and spot tendencies. He needs to learn to have an educated pre-snap plan of attack other than just getting past the guy in front of him.
  
• Fournette will break some big plays catching the ball this year if he stays healthy. That's going to be fun to watch. I see some nice chunks of yardage coming from that aspect of Flip's offense.
  
• Minshew looks like he's got the #2 spot locked down. I still can't gush over the guy like some people like to do, but he's a smart player.  I like seeing him go through his progressions, even when it ends in a check down. He doesn't force many throws into trouble or stare down an intended target often. 
   

- Interesting thought here on Taven Bryan
- Totally agree on Fournette. Get him moving then get him the ball
- Minshew, Minshew, Minshew. IMO, he has grown remarkably since Game 1. He was the proverbial deer in the headlights against the Ravens and got knocked all over the place; last night- quick drops, quick reads, good release and accuracy. He may develop into an adequate backup.

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Season Ticket holder since 2004.

 

        

Firesky's musings from the "Dress Rehearsal":

1) Josh Allen looks like a generational talent and the front runner for DROY; I hope they employ more of those 3-4 looks to get him on the field with Yan and Calais.
2) Our Defense is good enough to carry us to the playoffs regardless of how the Offense plays.
3) Fournette looks primed for a big year;  Rock Armstead needs to be more patient, we need Blue back for depth at that spot and we need to add a pass catching RB off waivers
4) Taven Bryan is still raw but showed some good things despite the boneheaded penalty; he'll be a solid rotational guy at the 3-tech but should not be starting.
5) Our passing game will be the Dede Westbrook show, we also desperately miss Marqise Lee
6) Foles is the real deal, i could care less about the pick since they put in a lot of 2nd unit guys after the TD drive.
7) Wester needs to be cut TODAY; he's god awful
8) Minshew is a lock for the backup job and i feel comfortable with that
9) Ronnie Harrison is a star at the safety spot and i'm more confident with him, Wilson and Reavis than I was with Church and Gipson last year.
10) We need to make a trade for a TE or an additional WR ... they need to add an additional playmaker if we're going to get serious about winning this year
11) Did I mention that our Defense looks terrifying??
12) Keep Terrelle Pryor over Keelan Cole if we don't go with 6 WR's
13) Our Offense hasn't been unveiled yet ... it seemed like they ran the same basic play concepts over and over and are trying to avoid tipping their hand
14) Foles is really good at the RPO, there was one big run by Fournette where he was like 6 yards upfield and I still thought Foles had the ball
15) I don't think I can mention enough just how impressed I was by the Defense including their 2nd unit

"12) Keep Terrelle Pryor over Keelan Cole if we don't go with 6 WR's."    Agree with this (huge Pryor fan) but a larger issue might be what about Cole vs names like McBride and CJ Board.
I think they keep 6 WRs,  maybe even 7 if that works at all.   There are Jaguar receivers who are all assumed to be good,  be improving,  be unquestioned core members of the WR group,  players like Conley, Chark and Cole.   And these guys might all be great, maybe.  But in this preseason,  they really haven't played much, and they really haven't performed all that well on the field.   Cole was targeted once, penalty removed that play,  Conley had a big pass interference,  Chark wasn't targeted.  In the first 2 preseason games,  Cole and Chark got targets, and in games 1 and 2,  they combined for 2 catches, 9 targets, 7 passing yards.    So, you've got those 3 players who are all presumed to be good, but don't really look that good.

And then you have 2 other guys,   Tre McBride and CJ Board.   Both McBride and Board have been playing all along, and if you look at their stats,  it looks like they're doing pretty well.  And both of those 2 guys are top 10% sparq guys. 

Board
week 3   4/5  56
week 2   5/6  54
week 1   1/2   5
total 10/13 115

McBride
week 3   3/6  31
week 2   4/5  47
week 1  3/5 42
total  10/16  120

Those numbers look pretty good.  Is there going to be any consideration of keeping Board and/or McBride instead of Cole?

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...

I'd be mostly worried about the fact that the first 4 drives were almost entirely 1) the new, expensive and presumably good new QB 2) the top first round RB who has had at least 1 very good year and 3) the leading WR from last year who most would argue is the Jaguars best WR.  4 drives, almost all plays were either Foles to Fournette or Foles to Westbrook.  3 and out, then 3 and out,  then TD w/ big assist from 28 yard pass interference to Conley (only pass not to Fournette or Westbrook in the first 4 drives) and interception.

Westbrook was 4.1 yards per target.  29 yards,  4 catches, 7 targets.  Not great.  Fournette was 3.9 yards per carry.  Not great, not terrible, but not great.  2/3 for 19 yards receiving was a little better for Fournette.   But these 3, these are the stars, right?  These are not the stats of stars who win you games.  You can watch each of Foles, Fournette and Westbrook and take out the highlights, and ignore the low points and say "well we're good if there are just the highlights".  Ok, maybe.  And, it's preseason, and that doesn't matter.  
...

Overanalyzing preseason offensive stats isn't going to give you an accurate outlook for week one of the regular season.

Yeah, probably not.

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...

And then you have 2 other guys,   Tre McBride and CJ Board.   Both McBride and Board have been playing all along, and if you look at their stats,  it looks like they're doing pretty well.  And both of those 2 guys are top 10% sparq guys. 

[stats]

Those numbers look pretty good.  Is there going to be any consideration of keeping Board and/or McBride instead of Cole?

Barring something horrible happening in game 4, I see Board making the roster. If McBride has eligibility, he'll be on the PS. I think Cole and Pryor are fighting for the last (6th) spot. If Pryor wins out, Cole may end up with one of those nagging hangnails that keeps him on the IR this year.

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...

And then you have 2 other guys,   Tre McBride and CJ Board.   Both McBride and Board have been playing all along, and if you look at their stats,  it looks like they're doing pretty well.  And both of those 2 guys are top 10% sparq guys. 

[stats]

Those numbers look pretty good.  Is there going to be any consideration of keeping Board and/or McBride instead of Cole?

Barring something horrible happening in game 4, I see Board making the roster. If McBride has eligibility, he'll be on the PS. I think Cole and Pryor are fighting for the last (6th) spot. If Pryor wins out, Cole may end up with one of those nagging hangnails that keeps him on the IR this year.

I think CJ Board is making a strong case for consideration and McBride is close behind him. 
Pryor could throw a wrench into the gears of that machine though if he is healthy enough to have a statement game in pre-week 4. 

Westbrook
Lee
Conley
Chark

These ^ guys are locks obviously. I think they'll keep six. 
That means -

Cole 
Board
McBride
Pryor
Walker
Brady

These ^ guys are all fighting for the two remaining spots.  Likely Cole and Pryor end up with the spots and Board, Brady and maybe Walker end up on the PS. I don't think McBride is eligible but I'm not certain.

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https://twitter.com/PFF_Jaguars/status/1...11840?s=20

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Taylor did start btw

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Taylor did start btw

All five of the presumed "ones" started.   (unless Cann ends up beating Richardson, which I doubt)

Robinson and Taylor had the fewest snaps as Marrone seems wisely hellbent on keeping the healthy. 
I'd assume Robinson didn't meet the minimum 25 snap requirement to be in that PFF grade mentioned a few posts ago.

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Only two impressions from last night. 


First is Josh Allen looks like Khalil Mack, he's going to be an all pro player for years if doesn't suffer some kind of major injury.

Second is Foles is just a middle of the road QB and will need to be carried by the defense and running game, so the Jaguars didn't gain much by moving on to him.

Bonus take: the sloppy kisses Minshew gets around here puzzle me, he looks like just another backup level QB, could have signed someone if his quality in free agency instead of needing to use a draft pick.

So you're saying Bortles could make that TD throw Foles made? That would've been a wobbly over throw or thrown out of bounds because Bortles knew u couldn't make that pass. If you really can't see that Foles is better than Bortles than there is no hope for you...

Bortles has many similar and better TD throws. I don't know why you need to make things up. His issue was consistency not ability.

Now Gabbert there was a guy who possibly never had a game at a high level as a Jag.

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Tonight's preseason game is a dichotomy.  On the one hand, since this is our first look this year at the starters in game action, it has elements like a first preseason game of the year.  Like kids at Christmas, we got to see our new QB in our new offensive scheme.  We got to see our offensive line-at least one that bears some semblance to the one we'll see opening day.  We got to see the starting defense for the first time this year.  The new car smell that usually comes with the first preseason game was still there.    On the other hand, since it was week three, which is usually known as the dress rehearsal before opening day, and this was the first look at the starters, it was like a preseason week 3 on steroids.  There is interest in how the starters look against the other team's starters.  There is some game planning happening, to say nothing of the game three nail biting hoping no major injuries happen to any starters.  Anyway, here are my thoughts on the game.

1.  It was an uneven performance by the offense as a whole and the passing game in particular.  One of the fears I have always harbored about a WCO is the over dependence it can have on underneath passes.  That's how it looked tonight, as there was little to no attacking downfield.  There was an abundance of passes in the flat and short hook routes.  There was also a heavy reliance on Westbrook over the middle.  Perhaps this is reflective of Flip not wanting to tip his hand.  Perhaps it's reflective of a very real lack of viable of receiving threats.  But while the team should understandably be averse to turnovers, we'll need more offensive diversity, to say nothing of effectiveness to compete with KC week 1.

2.  Continuing on this, Foles was so so.  The first 2-3 drives were stunningly ineffective, resulting in 3 and outs.  The scoring drive was nice, and his TD pass to Westbrook checked a major box I had about the offense and Foles attacking the red zone.  But I don't understand what happened on the INT.  Yes, Foles was pressured, but it seems like he had enough room to get the receiver the ball away from the defender.  The receiver looked like he could have shielded the defender from the ball.  It is just preseason, and there were some things to like, but considering how little we've seen of the starters and how little the offense has scored this preseason, a sense of restlessness-bordering on alarm-from Jaguars fans will not be a surprise after this game.

3.  The top two players from the 2018 draft-DL Taven Bryan and WR D.J. Chark-have a lot to show.  Not only has Bryan done very little of note that's good this offseason, he had two (2) roughing the passer penalties.  IIRC, on the first one , he fell for a play fake, stopping mid rush to find the ball, resumed pursuing the passer, only to get a penalty.  This two plays demonstrated the lack of awareness scouts asserted Bryan has.  He needed a big game, and he got the opposite.  I expect him to make the team, but he has to be firmly on the bench.  I was high on Chark coming out, and was not overly concerned about his lack of production last year.  In training camp, he had some moments, including some nice end zone grabs.  But thus far in the preseason games, he has been, at best a non factor in the passing game.  While he excels in kick coverageHe certainly doesn't need to return kicks.   But we didn't spend a 2nd round pick on him to be a special teamer.  We need him to take the top off of defenses, and so far he's doing nothing of the sort.  Him getting hrt tonight didn't help, and hopefully he will be 100% on opening day, but he needs production.

4.  The right guard battle was interesting.  Based on him getting the start tonight, I'd say Richardson has the edge over Cann.  I don't think tonight's game changed anything.  Richardson wound up with two false start penalties, and by my count, Cann had one.  Aside from that, neither stood out to me in a bad way.  I think Richardson and Taylor looked pretty good on the right side and seemed to provide good protection for most of the time they were in there.  To me, most of the pressure came from the left side after Cam left the game.

5.  Man did the defense look good, even without much of an appearance from Yannick Ngakoue.  The secondary was providing good coverage most of the night, even though Ramsey got beat deep that one play (no catch).

6.  Didn't like the miss from Lambo.

7.  Rookie watch-

• Josh Allen-WOW!  In the two other games, Allen has made some splash plays early against the run.  He also got a couple of pressures in those games, but it didn't seem like he was moving very fast.  Not so tonight.  I'm not sure if he's getting more comfortable in the scheme.  I don't know if he just matched up well against the Miami RT.  I don't know if the thought of playing on national television is a motivator.  I don't know if it's something else, or some combination of the above, but he was all over the place tonight.  He had at least two TFL tonight and by my count has at least 6 for the preseason.  But he showed burst on the pass rush...the same burst I saw while he was at Kentucky.  Now I can't really speak to the quality of Miami's RT, so I am trying to temper my enthusiasm.  But if tonight is an indicia of how this guy can play we're going to really enjoy watching this defense.
  
• Jawaan Taylor-Did not start the game, but got his first playing time of the preseason.  He had a holding penalty, but he looked pretty good in pass protection, especially next to Richardson.
  
• Josh Oliver-DNP
  
• Quincy Williams-DNP
  
• Ryquell Armstead-Played, but really didn't impress because he didn't get much room.  Had a 6-7 yard loss.  Still seems to struggle catching the ball.
  
• Gardner Minshew-showed some decent stuff and mediocre stuff.
  
• Dontavious Russell-I did not notice him
  

8.  I am still not sure what Pass Interference is.  On the play Marrone challenged, the defender had his hands all over Westbrook, only for no penalty flag to be called either before or after the review.

9.  Good to see Fournette get going.  I really like the trucking of the LB in the flat.  There should be more plays like that and the safety summoning run against the Steelers.

10.  Marrone was really bummed about the injury to Ogbuehi, and was lamenting the team was already down to its 3rd LT.

11.  Bottom line:  Put the starters in bubble wrap and don't let Allen play next week.

I think you are right with how awkward it felt seeing starters for the first time but 2 weeks from real football. They had drives where players were giving 70% then drives at 100%. Weird to see.

1- I agree we played the underneath way too much. Few plays Foles was just looking at Fournette to get in the flat. I also hope this was just pre season, not giving too much away but we played the check down too much. Teams will just keep stacking the box.

2- I dont know what happened. I thought Westbrook could have done a better job blocking off the corner from being able to come back and make the play. Get your body in the way and he has to foul you. Hoping it's just the connection and chemistry being forged.

3- I really hoped Chark and Cole were going to come out swinging this pre season. They haven't been bad and the O's not been great but thought theyd have made a few more plays. We are going to need both this season but we've heard a lot of good about Conley so far and with Lee and Pryor, they cant afford to slip back down the depth chart.

That's the only criticism of the WR group I have. Since A-Rob and Hurns, we've never had a clear 1 and 2 and I couldn't tell you what the current chart would be.

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https://twitter.com/PFF_Jaguars/status/1...11840?s=20

Excellent. 

As for Taylor starting, I could have sworn when Robinson started at LT, Ogbuehi started at RT.  When Robinson left, Ogbuehi moved to LTand Taylor went in at RT.

If not, measure  mea culpa.

Nevertheless,  I thought Taylor played well....although if I got that wrong the rest of the analysis comes into question.

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Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

I think the thing that bothered me most about Foles is it didn't look like he could read defense and was just going to Dede every time it wasn't a checkdown or designed pass to 2.4nette.

Can't just throw it to Dede no matter what, dude needs to read the defense and throw to the guy that's going to come open. If he can't do that then it was one of the worst free agent signings the team's ever made.

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https://twitter.com/PFF_Jaguars/status/1...11840?s=20

Excellent. 

As for Taylor starting, I could have sworn when Robinson started at LT, Ogbuehi started at RT.  When Robinson left, Ogbuehi moved to LTand Taylor went in at RT.

If not, measure culpa.

Nevertheless,  I thought Taylor played well....although if I got that wrong the rest of the analysis comes into question.

Taylor started, then Ogbuehi came in and got hurt, then they put Taylor back in after Ogbuehi got hurt being Foles was still out there.

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I think the thing that bothered me most about Foles is it didn't look like he could read defense and was just going to Dede every time it wasn't a checkdown or designed pass to 2.4nette.

Can't just throw it to Dede no matter what, dude needs to read the defense and throw to the guy that's going to come open. If he can't do that then it was one of the worst free agent signings the team's ever made.

Reading a defense post snap Is extremely hard, and only a very few can do it. Most QB’s have a predetermined 2 reads that they make and that’s it. Foles isn’t Manning or Brady. He’s only gonna be as good as our gameplan and playmakers are. As long as he can get the ball out of his hands quickly and efficiently with minimal mistakes, and can move the ball downfield, I’m happy with him; scripted plays and all.

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I’m sure Foles felt pretty damn nervous. Big difference from being the back up guy who has to cover for the franchise guy and now becoming the franchise guy. Ima go with nerves for Foles. Time with tell if he can be the franchise guy now that all expectations are on him, as opposed to basically none in Philly. His expectations were to be a decent back up who could spell for Wentz hopefully keeping the team in games, but wouldn’t be leaned on to be the guy. Maybe he thrived on that? Well now he is THE guy. Let’s see, I’m optimistic.

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I think the thing that bothered me most about Foles is it didn't look like he could read defense and was just going to Dede every time it wasn't a checkdown or designed pass to 2.4nette.

Can't just throw it to Dede no matter what, dude needs to read the defense and throw to the guy that's going to come open. If he can't do that then it was one of the worst free agent signings the team's ever made.

Yeah you're right, the Super Bowl MVP two years ago probably can't read a defense.

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https://twitter.com/PFF_Jaguars/status/1...11840?s=20

Excellent. 

As for Taylor starting, I could have sworn when Robinson started at LT, Ogbuehi started at RT.  When Robinson left, Ogbuehi moved to LTand Taylor went in at RT.

If not, measure culpa.

Nevertheless,  I thought Taylor played well....although if I got that wrong the rest of the analysis comes into question.

Just double checked on gamepass. Taylor played RT on the first series. 

Cam came out on the third possession.  Taylor stayed in.

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I think the thing that bothered me most about Foles is it didn't look like he could read defense and was just going to Dede every time it wasn't a checkdown or designed pass to 2.4nette.

Can't just throw it to Dede no matter what, dude needs to read the defense and throw to the guy that's going to come open. If he can't do that then it was one of the worst free agent signings the team's ever made.

Yeah you're right, the Super Bowl MVP two years ago probably can't read a defense.

Well, he did throw 10 whole passes last night out of a limited playbook. 
Clearly he's established a bad habit of forcing the ball to Dede Westbrook. I'm certain we have all the evidence we need of this. 

#worstfreeagentsigningevaR

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I think Bryan would have made a good OL, but it's probably too late to change.

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