https://twitter.com/theherd/status/15465...Lc_ibbA2cQ

Might be the most professional 21 year old in the league. Just carries himself so well.

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Yeah ight, we'll see in a few months.

My arguments against Lawrence play on this board is meaningless. You have all looked at horrible play and basically said he was good, so if he even shows minor improvement you guys will be comparing him to Brady by october.

see, here's the difference. We looked at his play and SAW the good even though it was interspersed with some bad. That gives us hope that we didn't end up with the next Blaine Gabbert. The way you dump on / expect the worst out of TLaw makes me wonder if you saw any Jaguar gameplay prior to Minshew's brief run.

The difference is the perspective - you see glimpses of good peeking out through the bad, and attribute the bad nearly exclusively to his own limitations. Most everyone else here recognizes that there is bad, but that the good we did get to see gives us hope that we've got something better than the recent string of flops we've had under center, and that circumstance played a whole heckuva lot into the performance (or lack thereof) we saw on the field.

If anyone is comparing him to Brady in three months' time, I think we'll all be dismissing that analogy, but good luck with that prediction, too.

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Lawrence could literally take a dump on the field and some of the homers here would call it a great play.   I believe he will be much better under pederson.

If Jeff Fisher or the corpse of Art Modell just happened to be on that very spot of the field at that moment, I'd be calling for a bronze statue commemorating the event. I guess I'm just a blind homer, though.

The reason that I point out HIS flaws, are because the things I saw and disliked from his rookie season are the same things that had me skeptical prior to us having the #1 pick. While fans on this board point to his WRs/OL/Coaching for things I watched him do at Clemson when he had Tee Higgins/Amari Rogers/Justyn Ross etc. 

It's not that I can't see his upside, I'm not completely stupid like some on here seem to think. I know he has a big arm, I know he has good mobility I know he has the capability to make the plays he needs to make and has the tools to do it at a high level. 

My issue particularly with the people on this board is that it seems nobody here thought he had any issues coming out of college and was just this perfect prospect when he never was that. If you (and btw, any of you could still do this) go back and watch all of his Clemson plays, and then go back and watch all of his rookie season plays you will see that he himself makes mistakes that have absolutely nothing to do with the WRs, the play calling or his offensive line. Just to name a few, extremely inaccurate while throwing on the run, inconsistent accuracy in the pocket, sailing passes on deep/intermediate throws, throwing short passes extremely hard with no touch, tendency to escape a clean pocket.. theres a lot more too it if you really look into his tape, he struggled heavily against bluff blitzes (showing blitz and then dropping out and rushing 4) etc etc etc

Any of these things could and possibly will be fixed, but when I watch a guy do something in a jaguar uniform, that he also did in a clemson uniform and then see 20 people on the board blame somebody else for his mistake.. it gets annoying. It's more annoying because 99% of the time, the people doing that did absolutely 0 research on the guy prior to us drafting him and don't have a single ounce of a clue what their talking about. 


With that being said, yes he is talented, yes he could and should improve on this past season.. no I never saw generation talent, no I don't believe he is going to be an elite QB based on what I've seen (dosen't mean he can't become that, but it just isn't what I've seen) (Elite QB being in the Rodgers/Mahomes/Brady category btw)


Nothing would make me happier than to log into this message board and see people roasting me for a bad take, because ultimately I want this team to win a damn game, but I'm not a blind homer who can't give an honest take based on what i've seen.

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see, here's the difference. We looked at his play and SAW the good even though it was interspersed with some bad. That gives us hope that we didn't end up with the next Blaine Gabbert. The way you dump on / expect the worst out of TLaw makes me wonder if you saw any Jaguar gameplay prior to Minshew's brief run.

The difference is the perspective - you see glimpses of good peeking out through the bad, and attribute the bad nearly exclusively to his own limitations. Most everyone else here recognizes that there is bad, but that the good we did get to see gives us hope that we've got something better than the recent string of flops we've had under center, and that circumstance played a whole heckuva lot into the performance (or lack thereof) we saw on the field.

If anyone is comparing him to Brady in three months' time, I think we'll all be dismissing that analogy, but good luck with that prediction, too.

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If Jeff Fisher or the corpse of Art Modell just happened to be on that very spot of the field at that moment, I'd be calling for a bronze statue commemorating the event. I guess I'm just a blind homer, though.

The reason that I point out HIS flaws, are because the things I saw and disliked from his rookie season are the same things that had me skeptical prior to us having the #1 pick. While fans on this board point to his WRs/OL/Coaching for things I watched him do at Clemson when he had Tee Higgins/Amari Rogers/Justyn Ross etc. 

It's not that I can't see his upside, I'm not completely stupid like some on here seem to think. I know he has a big arm, I know he has good mobility I know he has the capability to make the plays he needs to make and has the tools to do it at a high level. 

My issue particularly with the people on this board is that it seems nobody here thought he had any issues coming out of college and was just this perfect prospect when he never was that. If you (and btw, any of you could still do this) go back and watch all of his Clemson plays, and then go back and watch all of his rookie season plays you will see that he himself makes mistakes that have absolutely nothing to do with the WRs, the play calling or his offensive line. Just to name a few, extremely inaccurate while throwing on the run, inconsistent accuracy in the pocket, sailing passes on deep/intermediate throws, throwing short passes extremely hard with no touch, tendency to escape a clean pocket.. theres a lot more too it if you really look into his tape, he struggled heavily against bluff blitzes (showing blitz and then dropping out and rushing 4) etc etc etc

Any of these things could and possibly will be fixed, but when I watch a guy do something in a jaguar uniform, that he also did in a clemson uniform and then see 20 people on the board blame somebody else for his mistake.. it gets annoying. It's more annoying because 99% of the time, the people doing that did absolutely 0 research on the guy prior to us drafting him and don't have a single ounce of a clue what their talking about. 


With that being said, yes he is talented, yes he could and should improve on this past season.. no I never saw generation talent, no I don't believe he is going to be an elite QB based on what I've seen (dosen't mean he can't become that, but it just isn't what I've seen) (Elite QB being in the Rodgers/Mahomes/Brady category btw)


Nothing would make me happier than to log into this message board and see people roasting me for a bad take, because ultimately I want this team to win a damn game, but I'm not a blind homer who can't give an honest take based on what i've seen.

So genuine question.

With all those flaws you mentioned that he had in college, why did just about every single scout and NFL personnel rank him so highly as an NFL QB prospect of all time? For many it was Elway, Manning, Trevor and Jim Kelly (in some order). Are you smarter and better at watching tape than them?

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see, here's the difference. We looked at his play and SAW the good even though it was interspersed with some bad. That gives us hope that we didn't end up with the next Blaine Gabbert. The way you dump on / expect the worst out of TLaw makes me wonder if you saw any Jaguar gameplay prior to Minshew's brief run.

The difference is the perspective - you see glimpses of good peeking out through the bad, and attribute the bad nearly exclusively to his own limitations. Most everyone else here recognizes that there is bad, but that the good we did get to see gives us hope that we've got something better than the recent string of flops we've had under center, and that circumstance played a whole heckuva lot into the performance (or lack thereof) we saw on the field.

If anyone is comparing him to Brady in three months' time, I think we'll all be dismissing that analogy, but good luck with that prediction, too.

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If Jeff Fisher or the corpse of Art Modell just happened to be on that very spot of the field at that moment, I'd be calling for a bronze statue commemorating the event. I guess I'm just a blind homer, though.

The reason that I point out HIS flaws, are because the things I saw and disliked from his rookie season are the same things that had me skeptical prior to us having the #1 pick. While fans on this board point to his WRs/OL/Coaching for things I watched him do at Clemson when he had Tee Higgins/Amari Rogers/Justyn Ross etc. Screw college. You have a year of NFL tape to evaluate now. That [BLEEP] is over and meaningless now. Let it go. Not that you knew how to evaluate it anyway. 

It's not that I can't see his upside, I'm not completely stupid like some on here seem to think. I know he has a big arm, I know he has good mobility I know he has the capability to make the plays he needs to make and has the tools to do it at a high level. Then why did you say you saw "no reason for hope" from his rookie year? 

My issue particularly with the people on this board is that it seems nobody here thought he had any issues coming out of college and was just this perfect prospect when he never was that. If you (and btw, any of you could still do this) go back and watch all of his Clemson plays, and then go back and watch all of his rookie season plays you will see that he himself makes mistakes that have absolutely nothing to do with the WRs, the play calling or his offensive line. Just to name a few, extremely inaccurate while throwing on the run, inconsistent accuracy in the pocket, sailing passes on deep/intermediate throws, throwing short passes extremely hard with no touch, tendency to escape a clean pocket.. theres a lot more too it if you really look into his tape, he struggled heavily against bluff blitzes (showing blitz and then dropping out and rushing 4) etc etc etc
Analyst after analyst after analyst this summer have been tripping over each other to comment on how good his rookie tape looks compared to the awful statistics. I see what they see. I saw it before they saw it. I don't see whatever it is you think you're seeing. You're just clinging to your own bad take from his college tape that you were wrong on from the get-go. 

Any of these things could and possibly will be fixed, but when I watch a guy do something in a jaguar uniform, that he also did in a clemson uniform and then see 20 people on the board blame somebody else for his mistake.. it gets annoying. It's more annoying because 99% of the time, the people doing that did absolutely 0 research on the guy prior to us drafting him and don't have a single ounce of a clue what their talking about. You're annoyed because you're just wrong. 


With that being said, yes he is talented, yes he could and should improve on this past season.. no I never saw generation talent, no I don't believe he is going to be an elite QB based on what I've seen (dosen't mean he can't become that, but it just isn't what I've seen) (Elite QB being in the Rodgers/Mahomes/Brady category btw)


Nothing would make me happier than to log into this message board and see people roasting me for a bad take, Doesn't this already happen every time you log on? 
because ultimately I want this team to win a damn game, but I'm not a blind homer who can't give an honest take based on what i've seen.

red comments

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Truthbomb strikes.

ChrisJagsBoy and MVP hardest hit.

Yeah ight, we'll see in a few months.

My arguments against Lawrence play on this board is meaningless. You have all looked at horrible play and basically said he was good, so if he even shows minor improvement you guys will be comparing him to Brady by october.

Sorry I forget. Did you want the Jags to draft a different QB at No. 1 in 2021 or trade down?

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This ChrisJagKid likely wont even be posting here anymore in 5 months so y'all are really just wasting your time lol

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Yeah ight, we'll see in a few months.

My arguments against Lawrence play on this board is meaningless. You have all looked at horrible play and basically said he was good, so if he even shows minor improvement you guys will be comparing him to Brady by october.

Sorry I forget. Did you want the Jags to draft a different QB at No. 1 in 2021 or trade down?

It was not a matter of me not wanting to draft Trevor, I do think he has the most upside of that class and we desperately needed to at least try because Minshew was never going to be that guy. My issue was the general concensus was that he was this can't miss prospect is insanity to me. I felt coming out, him and Herbert were more similar prospects than to view him in the same light as Andrew Luck or Peyton Manning. Herbert is a shinning example of what happens when you take a raw player with physical gifts who pans out. Trevor might do that, but he wasn't the sure thing everyone seems to think he is.

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Sorry I forget. Did you want the Jags to draft a different QB at No. 1 in 2021 or trade down?

It was not a matter of me not wanting to draft Trevor, I do think he has the most upside of that class and we desperately needed to at least try because Minshew was never going to be that guy. My issue was the general concensus was that he was this can't miss prospect is insanity to me. I felt coming out, him and Herbert were more similar prospects than to view him in the same light as Andrew Luck or Peyton Manning. Herbert is a shinning example of what happens when you take a raw player with physical gifts who pans out. Trevor might do that, but he wasn't the sure thing everyone seems to think he is.

So, tremendous prospect or can't miss prospect?  Is that the argument?

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The reason that I point out HIS flaws, are because the things I saw and disliked from his rookie season are the same things that had me skeptical prior to us having the #1 pick. While fans on this board point to his WRs/OL/Coaching for things I watched him do at Clemson when he had Tee Higgins/Amari Rogers/Justyn Ross etc. Screw college. You have a year of NFL tape to evaluate now. That [BLEEP] is over and meaningless now. Let it go. Not that you knew how to evaluate it anyway. 

It's not that I can't see his upside, I'm not completely stupid like some on here seem to think. I know he has a big arm, I know he has good mobility I know he has the capability to make the plays he needs to make and has the tools to do it at a high level. Then why did you say you saw "no reason for hope" from his rookie year? 

My issue particularly with the people on this board is that it seems nobody here thought he had any issues coming out of college and was just this perfect prospect when he never was that. If you (and btw, any of you could still do this) go back and watch all of his Clemson plays, and then go back and watch all of his rookie season plays you will see that he himself makes mistakes that have absolutely nothing to do with the WRs, the play calling or his offensive line. Just to name a few, extremely inaccurate while throwing on the run, inconsistent accuracy in the pocket, sailing passes on deep/intermediate throws, throwing short passes extremely hard with no touch, tendency to escape a clean pocket.. theres a lot more too it if you really look into his tape, he struggled heavily against bluff blitzes (showing blitz and then dropping out and rushing 4) etc etc etc
Analyst after analyst after analyst this summer have been tripping over each other to comment on how good his rookie tape looks compared to the awful statistics. I see what they see. I saw it before they saw it. I don't see whatever it is you think you're seeing. You're just clinging to your own bad take from his college tape that you were wrong on from the get-go. 

Any of these things could and possibly will be fixed, but when I watch a guy do something in a jaguar uniform, that he also did in a clemson uniform and then see 20 people on the board blame somebody else for his mistake.. it gets annoying. It's more annoying because 99% of the time, the people doing that did absolutely 0 research on the guy prior to us drafting him and don't have a single ounce of a clue what their talking about. You're annoyed because you're just wrong. 


With that being said, yes he is talented, yes he could and should improve on this past season.. no I never saw generation talent, no I don't believe he is going to be an elite QB based on what I've seen (dosen't mean he can't become that, but it just isn't what I've seen) (Elite QB being in the Rodgers/Mahomes/Brady category btw)


Nothing would make me happier than to log into this message board and see people roasting me for a bad take, Doesn't this already happen every time you log on? 
because ultimately I want this team to win a damn game, but I'm not a blind homer who can't give an honest take based on what i've seen.

red comments

1. The reason I mention college, is because I was skeptical of his extremely over the top ratings by the so called "experts" because I saw many flaws in his game, that the guys he was being compared to (luck/manning/elway) did not have. While evaluating his play from his rookie season I'm seeing a lot of the same mistakes I saw in college, which in turn the fans on this board like to point out and blame the supporting cast for. My counter argument is, if it's the supporting cast in Jacksonville causing his faults.. was it also his star studded teammates faults in college too?

2. I said I saw no reason for hope based on his rookie year because his play was flat out abysmal, again you see the same mistakes being made that he made in college and very few of his strengths from college showed up on game day in the NFL. 

3. These analyst that are now boasting about his "good play over stats" have only come out to say this after realizing what an absolute dumpster fire of a coach Meyer was, combined with the lack of talent surrounding him. Of course he had a few moments, but he had 5 bad plays/missed throws/poor reads for every one "good" play. 

4. I'm not annoyed because i'm wrong, prior to him being a Jaguar I expressed my skepticism for just how good of a prospect he was, and his rookie season not only completely defended my opinion but made him look worse than I even expected. 

5. Not really, roasting would imply that I'm getting owned because I was wrong and I've not been wrong about Lawrence. Trolling however, does occur most times I post here. 



At the end of the day, rookies can improve theres no denying that and it's what I think we all want. But the simple fact is I have my opinion that I put hours of my own time into forming. The people arguing with me have no evidence to support their claims outside of what they hear on ESPN. And people seem to get very upset when they hear anything negative regarding our team and I don't blame them.. it sucks. But I'd just remind you that on my old account I made a post, a few days after our Blake Bortles selection.. saying much of the same.. minus the little bit of hope I do have because this guy is talented. And on that very thread, I was rediculed and mocked the same way. Would you agree my opinion that Bortles was not going to be good panned out? I'd say so.

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This ChrisJagKid likely wont even be posting here anymore in 5 months so y'all are really just wasting your time lol

If Trevor Lawrence leads us to the playoffs this year and has a Justin Herbert type season, I will be on here apologizing to everyone for my horrible opinion. I promise. I love this team and want the best, but this is a FORUM which are typically for discussion on whatever topic the site is based around. If you can't handle someone having a different opinion than yours, maybe try blocking me or moving away from a social website.

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It was not a matter of me not wanting to draft Trevor, I do think he has the most upside of that class and we desperately needed to at least try because Minshew was never going to be that guy. My issue was the general concensus was that he was this can't miss prospect is insanity to me. I felt coming out, him and Herbert were more similar prospects than to view him in the same light as Andrew Luck or Peyton Manning. Herbert is a shinning example of what happens when you take a raw player with physical gifts who pans out. Trevor might do that, but he wasn't the sure thing everyone seems to think he is.

So, tremendous prospect or can't miss prospect?  Is that the argument?

Trevor Lawrence to me is what Travon Walker was in this draft. Extremely gifted physically, imensely mature, but has yet to show me he has what it takes to put all that talent to good use. 

Like I said. Everyone else compared Lawrence to the greatest prospects we've ever seen. Coming out, he was a Justin Herbert type guy for me. I prefered herbert as a prospect if i'm being honest. Was completely unsure if Herbert was going to be as good as he has been but he had some traits you can't teach with an absolute rocket of an arm. 


Let's just hope T law works out, it's what I want. I just personally don't see him being the special player everyone imagines. He could very well be a top 15 QB just because of his talent physically.. I just don't see him being in the Mahomes/Brady/Manning role.

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red comments

1. The reason I mention college, is because I was skeptical of his extremely over the top ratings by the so called "experts" because I saw many flaws in his game, that the guys he was being compared to (luck/manning/elway) did not have. While evaluating his play from his rookie season I'm seeing a lot of the same mistakes I saw in college, which in turn the fans on this board like to point out and blame the supporting cast for. My counter argument is, if it's the supporting cast in Jacksonville causing his faults.. was it also his star studded teammates faults in college too?

2. I said I saw no reason for hope based on his rookie year because his play was flat out abysmal, again you see the same mistakes being made that he made in college and very few of his strengths from college showed up on game day in the NFL. 

3. These analyst that are now boasting about his "good play over stats" have only come out to say this after realizing what an absolute dumpster fire of a coach Meyer was, combined with the lack of talent surrounding him. Of course he had a few moments, but he had 5 bad plays/missed throws/poor reads for every one "good" play. 

4. I'm not annoyed because i'm wrong, prior to him being a Jaguar I expressed my skepticism for just how good of a prospect he was, and his rookie season not only completely defended my opinion but made him look worse than I even expected. 

5. Not really, roasting would imply that I'm getting owned because I was wrong and I've not been wrong about Lawrence. Trolling however, does occur most times I post here. 



At the end of the day, rookies can improve theres no denying that and it's what I think we all want. But the simple fact is I have my opinion that I put hours of my own time into forming. The people arguing with me have no evidence to support their claims outside of what they hear on ESPN. And people seem to get very upset when they hear anything negative regarding our team and I don't blame them.. it sucks. But I'd just remind you that on my old account I made a post, a few days after our Blake Bortles selection.. saying much of the same.. minus the little bit of hope I do have because this guy is talented. And on that very thread, I was rediculed and mocked the same way. Would you agree my opinion that Bortles was not going to be good panned out? I'd say so.

What name did you use on your old account?

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red comments

read comments.
rec'd comments.

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see, here's the difference. We looked at his play and SAW the good even though it was interspersed with some bad. That gives us hope that we didn't end up with the next Blaine Gabbert. The way you dump on / expect the worst out of TLaw makes me wonder if you saw any Jaguar gameplay prior to Minshew's brief run.

The difference is the perspective - you see glimpses of good peeking out through the bad, and attribute the bad nearly exclusively to his own limitations. Most everyone else here recognizes that there is bad, but that the good we did get to see gives us hope that we've got something better than the recent string of flops we've had under center, and that circumstance played a whole heckuva lot into the performance (or lack thereof) we saw on the field.

If anyone is comparing him to Brady in three months' time, I think we'll all be dismissing that analogy, but good luck with that prediction, too.

The reason that I point out HIS flaws, are because the things I saw and disliked from his rookie season are the same things that had me skeptical prior to us having the #1 pick. While fans on this board point to his WRs/OL/Coaching for things I watched him do at Clemson when he had Tee Higgins/Amari Rogers/Justyn Ross etc. 

It's not that I can't see his upside, I'm not completely stupid like some on here seem to think. I know he has a big arm, I know he has good mobility I know he has the capability to make the plays he needs to make and has the tools to do it at a high level. 

My issue particularly with the people on this board is that it seems nobody here thought he had any issues coming out of college and was just this perfect prospect when he never was that. If you (and btw, any of you could still do this) go back and watch all of his Clemson plays, and then go back and watch all of his rookie season plays you will see that he himself makes mistakes that have absolutely nothing to do with the WRs, the play calling or his offensive line. Just to name a few, extremely inaccurate while throwing on the run, inconsistent accuracy in the pocket, sailing passes on deep/intermediate throws, throwing short passes extremely hard with no touch, tendency to escape a clean pocket.. theres a lot more too it if you really look into his tape, he struggled heavily against bluff blitzes (showing blitz and then dropping out and rushing 4) etc etc etc

Any of these things could and possibly will be fixed, but when I watch a guy do something in a jaguar uniform, that he also did in a clemson uniform and then see 20 people on the board blame somebody else for his mistake.. it gets annoying. It's more annoying because 99% of the time, the people doing that did absolutely 0 research on the guy prior to us drafting him and don't have a single ounce of a clue what their talking about.

With that being said, yes he is talented, yes he could and should improve on this past season.. no I never saw generation talent, no I don't believe he is going to be an elite QB based on what I've seen (dosen't mean he can't become that, but it just isn't what I've seen) (Elite QB being in the Rodgers/Mahomes/Brady category btw)

Nothing would make me happier than to log into this message board and see people roasting me for a bad take, because ultimately I want this team to win a damn game, but I'm not a blind homer who can't give an honest take based on what i've seen.

bold 1: While there may have been the random delusional poster who figured one guy would take us from R1 P1 to 20-0, this is a gross misrepresentation of the board. We had need at QB, and hit a year where a very good (NOT PERFECT) QB was at the top of the board. When the others vying for the top spot were Mac Jones, Trey Lance, Zach Wilson, or Justin Fields, TLaw was absolutely the front runner in nearly every consideration of what a team looks for in a franchise QB. While there were absolutely people dead set on TLaw and no consideration of any others, most everyone on the board formed their opinion on more than "Chris Simms tole me this guy is gud" or "dur Hur next Andy Luck book it". And yes, the vast majority of advocates for TLaw knew that there would be wrinkles, and that some ironing would be needed before any hope of long term success was realized. Which brings me to....

bold 2: EXACTLY! The vast majority of the board have been saying this all along! I don't know how you could look at the train wreck of team management that every damn player on our roster faced last year and expect them to magically discover the secret to playing better football. It's safe to say that most here are happy with the new staff and are encouraged that they should foster growth and development across the team, especially at QB. Let's give that a spell to see if it works before we start patting ourselves on the back for premature forecasts of falling skies.

bold 3: again, this is overexaggerating the so-called ignorance you perceive across the rest of the fanbase here. You don't know how much research anyone here did, nor do we of you, but to say that just because others either choose to hold out hope or differ in opinion or emphasis of one character flaw over the other means they are uninformed not only insults those who actually did put in much time and effort into review, but it also discounts any argument you state to counter the prevailing opinion.

As you've seen, it's just as easy to characterize you as either a nay-sayer, someone stuck in the past, or so committed to a bit that the bar to change your opinion is unattainable. Every darn one of us is concerned that there's the possibility that yet again the team we love swung and missed at the most important position on the field. But, unlike the last few tries, we've seen things that lead us to believe that this guy MIGHT be different. That if the light switch does go on, holy moly, this could be real good. Pat Mahomes has some dud throws. TB12 is not immune to a pick-six, or even forgets what down it is on occasion. For all his MVPs, A. A. Ron has been a spectator far more times at the SB than a participant.

We're not blindly screaming "FRANCHISE QB!" or "BCS CHAMPION!" when it doesn't work out. We've seen the same failure. But, at least for me, I want to see him with competent leadership around him to see if last year was a symptom of the chaos around him or not. If it stilll doesn't work, then yeah, we're in bad shape. All that said, in year two, I still want TLaw as my QB over any of the other rookies in his class. They're all flawed in some way or being dragged down by mismanagement around them, and their prospect of being the next big QB is equally as nebulous, if not moreso. I guess we coulda rolled with Minshew or Glennon, that was working well, right?

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Sorry I forget. Did you want the Jags to draft a different QB at No. 1 in 2021 or trade down?

It was not a matter of me not wanting to draft Trevor, I do think he has the most upside of that class and we desperately needed to at least try because Minshew was never going to be that guy. My issue was the general concensus was that he was this can't miss prospect is insanity to me. I felt coming out, him and Herbert were more similar prospects than to view him in the same light as Andrew Luck or Peyton Manning. Herbert is a shinning example of what happens when you take a raw player with physical gifts who pans out. Trevor might do that, but he wasn't the sure thing everyone seems to think he is.

The only ones saying "can't miss" were the media pundits searching for click-throughs, eyes, and comments on their sites/networks.

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The reason that I point out HIS flaws, are because the things I saw and disliked from his rookie season are the same things that had me skeptical prior to us having the #1 pick. While fans on this board point to his WRs/OL/Coaching for things I watched him do at Clemson when he had Tee Higgins/Amari Rogers/Justyn Ross etc. 

It's not that I can't see his upside, I'm not completely stupid like some on here seem to think. I know he has a big arm, I know he has good mobility I know he has the capability to make the plays he needs to make and has the tools to do it at a high level. 

My issue particularly with the people on this board is that it seems nobody here thought he had any issues coming out of college and was just this perfect prospect when he never was that. If you (and btw, any of you could still do this) go back and watch all of his Clemson plays, and then go back and watch all of his rookie season plays you will see that he himself makes mistakes that have absolutely nothing to do with the WRs, the play calling or his offensive line. Just to name a few, extremely inaccurate while throwing on the run, inconsistent accuracy in the pocket, sailing passes on deep/intermediate throws, throwing short passes extremely hard with no touch, tendency to escape a clean pocket.. theres a lot more too it if you really look into his tape, he struggled heavily against bluff blitzes (showing blitz and then dropping out and rushing 4) etc etc etc

Any of these things could and possibly will be fixed, but when I watch a guy do something in a jaguar uniform, that he also did in a clemson uniform and then see 20 people on the board blame somebody else for his mistake.. it gets annoying. It's more annoying because 99% of the time, the people doing that did absolutely 0 research on the guy prior to us drafting him and don't have a single ounce of a clue what their talking about.

With that being said, yes he is talented, yes he could and should improve on this past season.. no I never saw generation talent, no I don't believe he is going to be an elite QB based on what I've seen (dosen't mean he can't become that, but it just isn't what I've seen) (Elite QB being in the Rodgers/Mahomes/Brady category btw)

Nothing would make me happier than to log into this message board and see people roasting me for a bad take, because ultimately I want this team to win a damn game, but I'm not a blind homer who can't give an honest take based on what i've seen.

bold 1: While there may have been the random delusional poster who figured one guy would take us from R1 P1 to 20-0, this is a gross misrepresentation of the board. We had need at QB, and hit a year where a very good (NOT PERFECT) QB was at the top of the board. When the others vying for the top spot were Mac Jones, Trey Lance, Zach Wilson, or Justin Fields, TLaw was absolutely the front runner in nearly every consideration of what a team looks for in a franchise QB. While there were absolutely people dead set on TLaw and no consideration of any others, most everyone on the board formed their opinion on more than "Chris Simms tole me this guy is gud" or "dur Hur next Andy Luck book it". And yes, the vast majority of advocates for TLaw knew that there would be wrinkles, and that some ironing would be needed before any hope of long term success was realized. Which brings me to....

bold 2: EXACTLY! The vast majority of the board have been saying this all along! I don't know how you could look at the train wreck of team management that every damn player on our roster faced last year and expect them to magically discover the secret to playing better football. It's safe to say that most here are happy with the new staff and are encouraged that they should foster growth and development across the team, especially at QB. Let's give that a spell to see if it works before we start patting ourselves on the back for premature forecasts of falling skies.

bold 3: again, this is overexaggerating the so-called ignorance you perceive across the rest of the fanbase here. You don't know how much research anyone here did, nor do we of you, but to say that just because others either choose to hold out hope or differ in opinion or emphasis of one character flaw over the other means they are uninformed not only insults those who actually did put in much time and effort into review, but it also discounts any argument you state to counter the prevailing opinion.

As you've seen, it's just as easy to characterize you as either a nay-sayer, someone stuck in the past, or so committed to a bit that the bar to change your opinion is unattainable. Every darn one of us is concerned that there's the possibility that yet again the team we love swung and missed at the most important position on the field. But, unlike the last few tries, we've seen things that lead us to believe that this guy MIGHT be different. That if the light switch does go on, holy moly, this could be real good. Pat Mahomes has some dud throws. TB12 is not immune to a pick-six, or even forgets what down it is on occasion. For all his MVPs, A. A. Ron has been a spectator far more times at the SB than a participant.

We're not blindly screaming "FRANCHISE QB!" or "BCS CHAMPION!" when it doesn't work out. We've seen the same failure. But, at least for me, I want to see him with competent leadership around him to see if last year was a symptom of the chaos around him or not. If it stilll doesn't work, then yeah, we're in bad shape. All that said, in year two, I still want TLaw as my QB over any of the other rookies in his class. They're all flawed in some way or being dragged down by mismanagement around them, and their prospect of being the next big QB is equally as nebulous, if not moreso. I guess we coulda rolled with Minshew or Glennon, that was working well, right?

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It was not a matter of me not wanting to draft Trevor, I do think he has the most upside of that class and we desperately needed to at least try because Minshew was never going to be that guy. My issue was the general concensus was that he was this can't miss prospect is insanity to me. I felt coming out, him and Herbert were more similar prospects than to view him in the same light as Andrew Luck or Peyton Manning. Herbert is a shinning example of what happens when you take a raw player with physical gifts who pans out. Trevor might do that, but he wasn't the sure thing everyone seems to think he is.

The only ones saying "can't miss" were the media pundits searching for click-throughs, eyes, and comments on their sites/networks.

Theres a large difference in "Holding out hope" and what has been said on this board. What I've seen is people trying to push a narrative that Trevor played good football last year, and did enough to inspire hope. He did not, stats aside the guy couldn't find the Endzone in, what 9 games? The guy was throwing interceptions directly to linebackers 5-10 yards down the field where no WR was in the vacinity. He was flat out missing throws, whilst standing in a clean pocket with no pressure in his face. Of course his stats were hurt a bit by some drops, and the poor play calling.. but this isn't a yes/no scenario. Just because he had some things go against him does not exempt the plays that went bad because of his own short commings.. and no one here seems to understand that. I think the most insane defense on this board came on an interception he threw, where he was throwing it to the RB in the flat, completely over shot him to the point that the guy would have needed to dive to catch a 2 yard pass and it got tipped up and intercepted.. and just about everyone here on the game day thread blamed the RB for the int. It was a terrible throw.

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Call me crazy, but if someone was ‘trying to get clicks’ wouldn’t it be more likely that they submit something contrary to what just about everyone else was saying?

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Call me crazy, but if someone was ‘trying to get clicks’ wouldn’t it be more likely that they submit something contrary to what just about everyone else was saying?

Outside of our fanbase, most fans think Lawrence is a bust. I disagree with that obviously but more people view him as a bust than being good.

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Call me crazy, but if someone was ‘trying to get clicks’ wouldn’t it be more likely that they submit something contrary to what just about everyone else was saying?

Outside of our fanbase, most fans think Lawrence is a bust. I disagree with that obviously but more people view him as a bust than being good.

That is absolutely not true.  Can you cite any evidence of that?

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Call me crazy, but if someone was ‘trying to get clicks’ wouldn’t it be more likely that they submit something contrary to what just about everyone else was saying?

Outside of our fanbase, most fans think Lawrence is a bust. I disagree with that obviously but more people view him as a bust than being good.

Yeeeesh. What a bad take.

You might find 1 or 2 articles (likely Jets fans) saying Lawrence is a bust but the majority of media outlets actually expect a big jump from Lawrence next season. 

So, per usual, you’re wrong.

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Call me crazy, but if someone was ‘trying to get clicks’ wouldn’t it be more likely that they submit something contrary to what just about everyone else was saying?

Outside of our fanbase, most fans think Lawrence is a bust. I disagree with that obviously but more people view him as a bust than being good.

Don’t take this the wrong way, but you’re full of [BLEEP].

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Outside of our fanbase, most fans think Lawrence is a bust. I disagree with that obviously but more people view him as a bust than being good.

Yeeeesh. What a bad take.

You might find 1 or 2 articles (likely Jets fans) saying Lawrence is a bust but the majority of media outlets actually expect a big jump from Lawrence next season. 

So, per usual, you’re wrong.

Exactly.  But they’re just going for clicks.  Wink-wink.

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Outside of our fanbase, most fans think Lawrence is a bust. I disagree with that obviously but more people view him as a bust than being good.

That is absolutely not true.  Can you cite any evidence of that?

Go to literally any youtube video speaking of Lawrence or his highlights, read the comments.

You will find more people talking down on him than you wont. And for the record, I do defend him as much as I can when it comes to people who sit and try to say he's the worst QB from this class because that, is ignorant.

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Outside of our fanbase, most fans think Lawrence is a bust. I disagree with that obviously but more people view him as a bust than being good.

Yeeeesh. What a bad take.

You might find 1 or 2 articles (likely Jets fans) saying Lawrence is a bust but the majority of media outlets actually expect a big jump from Lawrence next season. 

So, per usual, you’re wrong.

I'm speaking of people in general, not sports writers. And I do not agree with them at all. I do think he will turn out to be an okay QB. My take is that he isn't what he's been hyped up to be.

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