I might because I have Doug Pederson.

Carter is arguably the best player in this draft. If he's there at 20, I might make the trade for him and trust that Doug and his culture will make sure this doesn't happen. I would stick his locker right next to Josh Allen and Foye.

Obviously there's more information out there as well and things could change.

The further in you get to that story the murkier it seems to get. We were all young once (and if you still are, many congratulations)   ...  But the behaviour of some of these lads with that cash on the line is sometimes utterly mind boggling. 

I think Cleatwood's probably nailed it. The culture of the club he goes to could determine how long he's in the league for. A strong locker room could do a huge amount for him... Somewhere like Arizona where you'd be looking for him to set the tempo in a questionable locker room and personally I wouldn't touch him with a ten foot pole!

It's just horrible decisions after horrible decision.

1. Drove 98 in a 45.
2. Then, months later, decides to race his teammate and ultimately it gets a teammate killed.
3. Then he lies to the police about where he was when the race took place.

He clearly needs some strong mentoring right from the jump and I think the Jags locker room is trending in that direction. Other good places would be Baltimore, Pittsburgh, KC... Teams like that.

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Question is, if he’s there at around 20, would you move up and take him?

I might because I have Doug Pederson.

Carter is arguably the best player in this draft. If he's there at 20, I might make the trade for him and trust that Doug and his culture will make sure this doesn't happen. I would stick his locker right next to Josh Allen and Foye.

Obviously there's more information out there as well and things could change.

I’m inclined to agree with you. He’s what we’re screaming for in the middle but I also think we have the locker room presence now to control him.

He would instantly make this D massively better and he has a bunch of young talent to look around and think ‘if I focus like them I could be a star’ but also a fair bit of vet experience and a top head coach.

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I might because I have Doug Pederson.

Carter is arguably the best player in this draft. If he's there at 20, I might make the trade for him and trust that Doug and his culture will make sure this doesn't happen. I would stick his locker right next to Josh Allen and Foye.

Obviously there's more information out there as well and things could change.

I’m inclined to agree with you. He’s what we’re screaming for in the middle but I also think we have the locker room presence now to control him.

He would instantly make this D massively better and he has a bunch of young talent to look around and think ‘if I focus like them I could be a star’ but also a fair bit of vet experience and a top head coach.

It’s been said in another post and I know a lot of talk there was about not having players coach, but if we could somehow grab him and then find the cap to get Campbell back, that would be ideal for all parties.

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Again I'd agree with you on Kincaid ... He has the feeling of a guy who is going to fall into the wrong area of the draft for us! Very possibly other priorities in round 1 ... Unlikely to be there come round 2.... Sadly Caldrac's probably right ... Could drop lovely for a KC or a Bengals to build a monster!

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Those teams who were strongly considering Carter now have nearly 2 months to do their due diligence on him. We all know how certain media figures will exaggerate to get attention. Teams that passed on Pickens last season are likely regretting it now as I'm not aware of any character transgressions he had with the Steelers. If Carter turns out to be a similar situation, some team will be getting a steal. Maybe I'm naive, but it doesn't seem like it would be too difficult to find out what type of character issues a player may have. The Jaguars have messed up twice in this area; Coughlin selecting Soward still boggles my mind and drafting Justin Blackmon was also totally avoidable had they done more research on him.

There's a difference between character concerns and someone who was racing at 2am which led to a teammates death. This also isn't his first time speeding like that. He was caught going 98 in a 45 I think before as well. He also lied to the cops about where he was during the race. He said he was over a mile away.

Carter may very well turn out to be a great player but this will certainly ding him and he might drop out of the top 15 because of it.

That's true. Carter is definitely guilty of stupidity (in this instance), immaturity and terrible judgement. He will have to live with the consequences of his actions. I'd still take him, however, if he hasn't had any other incidences related to alcohol, abusive behavior, etc. I'd also want to see what kind of teammate he was and whether he is a leader or follower. The guy made a terrible mistake, but that doesn't mean he is necessarily a bad guy.

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Those teams who were strongly considering Carter now have nearly 2 months to do their due diligence on him. We all know how certain media figures will exaggerate to get attention. Teams that passed on Pickens last season are likely regretting it now as I'm not aware of any character transgressions he had with the Steelers. If Carter turns out to be a similar situation, some team will be getting a steal. Maybe I'm naive, but it doesn't seem like it would be too difficult to find out what type of character issues a player may have. The Jaguars have messed up twice in this area; Coughlin selecting Soward still boggles my mind and drafting Justin Blackmon was also totally avoidable had they done more research on him.

There's a difference between character concerns and someone who was racing at 2am which led to a teammates death. This also isn't his first time speeding like that. He was caught going 98 in a 45 I think before as well. He also lied to the cops about where he was during the race. He said he was over a mile away.

Carter may very well turn out to be a great player but this will certainly ding him and he might drop out of the top 15 because of it.

I don't know. If he's still there at 11, the tacks will most likely take him. They took Simmons in the 1st round in 2019.

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"Remember Red, Hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies."  - Andy Dufresne, The Shawshank Redemption

https://twitter.com/BenjaminSolak/status...01501?s=20

Sooooo not Aaron Donald lol

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https://twitter.com/BenjaminSolak/status...01501?s=20

Sooooo not Aaron Donald lol

4.67 tho

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https://twitter.com/BenjaminSolak/status...01501?s=20

Sooooo not Aaron Donald lol

4.67 tho

He’s still a good prospect but length actually is important. Likely not a 1st rounder anymore.

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https://twitter.com/BenjaminSolak/status...01501?s=20

Sooooo not Aaron Donald lol

So he's not the best DT of All Time?  Damn

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Arm length isn't important for a DT. Edge it's much more important.

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https://twitter.com/BenjaminSolak/status...01501?s=20

Sooooo not Aaron Donald lol

4.67 tho

That's insane

https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/...57280?s=20

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https://twitter.com/BenjaminSolak/status...01501?s=20

Sooooo not Aaron Donald lol

So he's not the best DT of All Time?  Damn

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Arm length isn't important for a DT.  Edge it's much more important.

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4.67 tho

That's insane

https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/...57280?s=20

Arm length is important for anyone who plays on the DLine. You wanna be the first one to put your hands on someone.

And yes, people compared him to Donald because he’s a small DT and went to Pitt. It was clearly an unfair comparison even before the combine.

He’s running well but I’m not sure if he will be taken in round 1. It’s not just because of the combine. The combine is just one tool used in an overall evaluation. There are some drills that certain positions need to hit (shuttle for Oline) in order to garner attention.

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So he's not the best DT of All Time?  Damn

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Arm length isn't important for a DT.  Edge it's much more important.

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That's insane

https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/...57280?s=20

Arm length is important for anyone who plays on the DLine. You wanna be the first one to put your hands on someone.

And yes, people compared him to Donald because he’s a small DT and went to Pitt. It was clearly an unfair comparison even before the combine.

He’s running well but I’m not sure if he will be taken in round 1. It’s not just because of the combine. The combine is just one tool used in an overall evaluation. There are some drills that certain positions need to hit (shuttle for Oline) in order to garner attention.

When teams are scouting DTs they aren't looking at arm length.  Yes he is a smaller DT and went to Pitt but I haven't  seen the first person to compare the 2 or say he is the next AD lol.  If a team had a first round grade on him they aren't dropping him out of the first because of his arm length.

Broke ADs record while you bring up AD lol

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20...google.com

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https://twitter.com/MoveTheSticks/status...62309?s=20

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https://twitter.com/NFL_DovKleiman/statu...26146?s=20

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https://sports.yahoo.com/adetomiwa-adeba...Type=VIDEO

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Arm length is important for anyone who plays on the DLine. You wanna be the first one to put your hands on someone.

And yes, people compared him to Donald because he’s a small DT and went to Pitt. It was clearly an unfair comparison even before the combine.

He’s running well but I’m not sure if he will be taken in round 1. It’s not just because of the combine. The combine is just one tool used in an overall evaluation. There are some drills that certain positions need to hit (shuttle for Oline) in order to garner attention.

When teams are scouting DTs they aren't looking at arm length.  Yes he is a smaller DT and went to Pitt but I haven't  seen the first person to compare the 2 or say he is the next AD lol.  If a team had a first round grade on him they aren't dropping him out of the first because of his arm length.

Broke ADs record while you bring up AD lol

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20...google.com

Someone actually did post a side by side comparison of the two on Twitter.
I'd think about this guy at our pick in round one. Explosive interior pass rush is what we need.

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https://twitter.com/BenjaminSolak/status...01501?s=20

Sooooo not Aaron Donald lol

So he's not the best DT of All Time?  Damn

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Arm length isn't important for a DT.  Edge it's much more important.

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I'd bet you $5000 right now that there are at least 10 general managers in the NFL that would tell you that's horse [BLEEP]. 

Especially in a 3-4 when he sometimes has more ground to cover laterally.

It's OK to fall in love with a prospect that happens to have a sub-par measurable, that's OK. We're fans. 
But let's not try to reinvent the wheel making excuses for it. 

His arms are short and plenty of front offices aren't going to like that. Period. 

Luckily for him, it just takes one GM to believe in him and see him as a fit.

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So he's not the best DT of All Time?  Damn

---

Arm length isn't important for a DT.  Edge it's much more important.

---

I'd bet you $5000 right now that there are at least 10 general managers in the NFL that would tell you that's horse [BLEEP]. 

Especially in a 3-4 when he sometimes has more ground to cover laterally.

It's OK to fall in love with a prospect that happens to have a sub-par measurable, that's OK. We're fans. 
But let's not try to reinvent the wheel making excuses for it. 

His arms are short and plenty of front offices aren't going to like that. Period. 

Luckily for him, it just takes one GM to believe in him and see him as a fit.

And you know which GM doesn’t like short arms? Baalke. Just look at his DT and DE draft record.

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So he's not the best DT of All Time?  Damn

---

Arm length isn't important for a DT.  Edge it's much more important.

---

I'd bet you $5000 right now that there are at least 10 general managers in the NFL that would tell you that's horse [BLEEP]. 

Especially in a 3-4 when he sometimes has more ground to cover laterally.

It's OK to fall in love with a prospect that happens to have a sub-par measurable, that's OK. We're fans. 
But let's not try to reinvent the wheel making excuses for it. 

His arms are short and plenty of front offices aren't going to like that. Period. 

Luckily for him, it just takes one GM to believe in him and see him as a fit.

Meh, I don't think anyone is going to move him up or down the board where they previously had him because of his arm length. Or any of the DTs because of their arm length

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I'd bet you $5000 right now that there are at least 10 general managers in the NFL that would tell you that's horse [BLEEP]. 

Especially in a 3-4 when he sometimes has more ground to cover laterally.

It's OK to fall in love with a prospect that happens to have a sub-par measurable, that's OK. We're fans. 
But let's not try to reinvent the wheel making excuses for it. 

His arms are short and plenty of front offices aren't going to like that. Period. 

Luckily for him, it just takes one GM to believe in him and see him as a fit.

Meh, I don't think anyone is going to move him up or down the board where they previously had him because of his arm length.  Or any of the DTs because of their arm length

LOL



They probably shouldn't even measure their arms, huh? Why bother? No one cares.

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Meh, I don't think anyone is going to move him up or down the board where they previously had him because of his arm length.  Or any of the DTs because of their arm length

LOL



They probably shouldn't even measure their arms, huh? Why bother? No one cares.

How many rounds do you think he got bumped down because of his arm length?

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It's actually very simple to explain to you why arm length matters to DTs.

Think of a reach advantage in boxing. Longer arms are a big advantage, right?

Well, a guard or tackle vs a DT has a great advantage if his reach is longer in the same way.
If that OT or OG gets his longer arms inside and grabs some pad and jersey, a DT with shorter arms is now at a disadvantage trying to shed the block and make a tackle or move past the offensive lineman.

Simple.

Conversely - a DT with longer arms than a guard or tackle has an advantage shedding or rejecting a block.

Pat Kirwin explained it in his book like this:

In his book Take Your Eye Off the Ball, Pat Kirwan likens the clash between the offensive and defensive lines on each play to “a series of adjacent bar fights.” If you control the chest, you control the man; if you control the man, you control the gap.

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