Do you guys keep lotion and paper towels handy when you talk about guns?

What's the recoil of an AR-15 vs. 30-06?

Can a 30-06 be fitted with multi-round magazines with a capacity matching an AR-15?

Does 30-06 ammunition "tumble" like .223 bullets, thus causing more widespread damage to human flesh?

Can a 30-06 be as easily fired braced against the hip as an AR-15, and thus easier to stabilize when shooting multiple targets, especially when considering the recoil (see question 2)?

Can a 30-06 be easily customized with a forward hand grip or a carry handle?

Does the pistol grip on an AR-15 actually give it an advantage beyond looking cool?

Could the Parkland shooter have killed as many as easily with a 30-06 as he did with an AR-15?

My nephew, a Naval officer and certainly no snowflake, cited these feature when explaining why AR-15s are a more effective and efficient weapon to use by relatively untrained mass shooters than weapons like a 30-06.

No, but I have a rather nice Franchi o/u that I only polish with a diaper.

First of all, AR-15 is a model of gun, only available in .223 caliber.  30-06 is a caliber available in numerous models (though most commonly in a bolt action 'hunting rifle" design).
Recoil is Newton's Third Law of Motion coming into play.  Muzzle energy of a .223 is about 1,300 ft/lbs., whereas a 30-06 is more than double that, at 2,800.  "Felt" recoil is a product of muzzle energy acting on the mass of the gun.  A semi-automatic action absorbs some of this energy in cycling the reloading process, which a bolt action does not, thus reducing relative recoil in any caliber.

Yes, though they're not widely available for most models.

All ammo "tumbles" at some point.  Muzzle velocity, bullet configuration and barrel twist are the variables.  By the way, increased tumble = decreased accuracy.  At the range we're talking here, it's a non factor.  Beyond that, any knowledgeable shooter uses ammo designed for the job at hand, soft point, hollow point, etc.

Yes, but good luck trying to hit anything smaller than a minivan.  That's strictly TV stuff.

Sure.  I even have a suitcase customized with such a handle.

The grip on any gun is an advantage over no grip.  That being said, some shotguns have a straight stock, without a grip, which is known as an English stock.  I have an SKB 280 in such a configuration and I find it to be extremely quick-pointing.  

Caliber versus gun again, but a 30-06 is a far more deadly round, so yes.

Your nephew may know torpedoes, but firearms..............not so much.

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When you get into the endzone, act like you've been there before.

Do you guys keep lotion and paper towels handy when you talk about guns?

What's the recoil of an AR-15 vs. 30-06?

Can a 30-06 be fitted with multi-round magazines with a capacity matching an AR-15?

Does 30-06 ammunition "tumble" like .223 bullets, thus causing more widespread damage to human flesh?

Can a 30-06 be as easily fired braced against the hip as an AR-15, and thus easier to stabilize when shooting multiple targets, especially when considering the recoil (see question 2)?

Can a 30-06 be easily customized with a forward hand grip or a carry handle?

Does the pistol grip on an AR-15 actually give it an advantage beyond looking cool?

Could the Parkland shooter have killed as many as easily with a 30-06 as he did with an AR-15?

My nephew, a Naval officer and certainly no snowflake, cited these feature when explaining why AR-15s are a more effective and efficient weapon to use by relatively untrained mass shooters than weapons like a 30-06.

First of all, AR-15 is a model of gun, only available in .223 caliber.  30-06 is a caliber available in numerous models (though most commonly in a bolt action 'hunting rifle" design).

The AR-15 is available in a lot of different calibers.  They go as low as .22lr and up to the .50 Beowolf.  The AR-10 which is the big brother accepts longer rounds then the AR-15 and is also available in multiple calibers.  They go from .220 Swift to .500 Auto Max.

There are a few specialty platform AR's and one of them (BN36) is available in the 30-06 Springfield round.  I could only find it in a 20 round magazine.  I did however find a different 30-06 magazine but am not sure what gun it fits.  Looks older though judging by the design and was probably military.

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First of all, AR-15 is a model of gun, only available in .223 caliber.  30-06 is a caliber available in numerous models (though most commonly in a bolt action 'hunting rifle" design).

The AR-15 is available in a lot of different calibers.  They go as low as .22lr and up to the .50 Beowolf.  The AR-10 which is the big brother accepts longer rounds then the AR-15 and is also available in multiple calibers.  They go from .220 Swift to .500 Auto Max.

There are a few specialty platform AR's and one of them (BN36) is available in the 30-06 Springfield round.  I could only find it in a 20 round magazine.  I did however find a different 30-06 magazine but am not sure what gun it fits.  Looks older though judging by the design and was probably military.

I think you are speaking in semantics. There are other models built on the AR style platform but are designated differently such as AR-10 that you stated, an M&P-22, the Noreen BN36, 7.62, 6.8, 6.5, etc. It is this same semantics that leaves the left believing they are a military weapon that is identical to a modern M-16 or M4. Would be kind of like designating all half-ton pickups as a Ford F150. Same could be said for the AK platform. I had a shotgun based on the said platform that I lost in a boating accident that could cycle through a drum or extended mag fairly efficiently.

As far as 30-06 magazine boxes, they are limited in size except for the old M1 styles. Just not a popular round for anything outside bolt action hunting rifles and actually slowing falling out of favor even for hunting.

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It's not semantics, the AR-15 can be configured in multiple calibers. That's one reason it is so popular with hobbyist, it is very versatile. For example I can take any one of my AR-15 lowers (bottom half of the assemble and add an upper in a different caliber and its still an AR-15 shooting a different round. The lower which is technically the gun and contains the serial number and the upper receiver are standard parts across all AR-15s. Depending on what caliber your running you put on a different barrel, and possibly a different bolt carrier group, and magazine. A lot of people will buy one lower and several uppers in different calibers. For example I could have a .223, .223 Wylde, and a .300 Blackout upper and only one lower and change it in seconds with the takeout pins.

There are legal limits however on how you can configure your AR. For example if you build a AR pistol with a 10 inch barrel you cannot put a shoulder stock on it. If you build a rifle you cannot have a barrel under 16 inches unless you have a Federal Tax Stamp for owning it. It is truly the swiss army knife of guns, there are so many combinations to suit the needs of a wide spectrum of shooters.

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You're gonna shoot your eye out, kid.

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It's not semantics, the AR-15 can be configured in multiple calibers.  That's one reason it is so popular with hobbyist, it is very versatile.  For example I can take any one of my AR-15 lowers (bottom half of the assemble and add an upper in a different caliber and its still an AR-15 shooting a different round.  The lower which is technically the gun and contains the serial number and the upper receiver are standard parts across all AR-15s.     Depending on what caliber your running you put on a different barrel, and possibly a different bolt carrier group, and magazine.  A lot of people will buy one lower and several uppers in different calibers.  For example I could have a .223, .223 Wylde, and a .300 Blackout upper and only one lower and change it in seconds with the takeout pins.

There are legal limits however on how you can configure your AR.  For example if you build a AR pistol with a 10 inch barrel you cannot put a shoulder stock on it.  If you build a rifle you cannot have a barrel under 16 inches unless you have a Federal Tax Stamp for owning it.   It is truly the swiss army knife of guns, there are so many combinations to suit the needs of a wide spectrum of shooters.

Yes, the AR platform...not AR-15 model. Same could be said about the AK platform or Remington 700 platform.

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The only part that is designated a gun is the lower receiver. That is what counts as the gun for the purpose of the background check. changing the parts that bolt to it does not change the model number of the gun (lower receiver). It's not a difficult concept, the lower receiver is the gun, the rest are parts that DO NOT change the model of the gun. Nothing about the lower receiver changes when building different variations of the AR-15, AR-15 does not designate that it is .223 caliber, or that its a rifle vs a pistol, or an SBR with a tax stamp. I custom build them, I have a little knowledge in this department.

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It's not semantics, the AR-15 can be configured in multiple calibers.  That's one reason it is so popular with hobbyist, it is very versatile.  For example I can take any one of my AR-15 lowers (bottom half of the assemble and add an upper in a different caliber and its still an AR-15 shooting a different round.  The lower which is technically the gun and contains the serial number and the upper receiver are standard parts across all AR-15s.     Depending on what caliber your running you put on a different barrel, and possibly a different bolt carrier group, and magazine.  A lot of people will buy one lower and several uppers in different calibers.  For example I could have a .223, .223 Wylde, and a .300 Blackout upper and only one lower and change it in seconds with the takeout pins.

There are legal limits however on how you can configure your AR.  For example if you build a AR pistol with a 10 inch barrel you cannot put a shoulder stock on it.  If you build a rifle you cannot have a barrel under 16 inches unless you have a Federal Tax Stamp for owning it.   It is truly the swiss army knife of guns, there are so many combinations to suit the needs of a wide spectrum of shooters.

Yes, the AR platform...not AR-15 model. Same could be said about the AK platform or Remington 700 platform.

You actually made my point here The Remington 700 comes in several calibers, but they are all still Remington 700s. 

If you don't believe me please go search the web for a .300 blackout AR lower that is not designated AR-15.

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The only part that is designated a gun is the lower receiver.  That is what counts as the gun for the purpose of the background check.  changing the parts that bolt to it does not change the model number of the gun (lower receiver).  It's not a difficult concept, the lower receiver is the gun, the rest are parts that DO NOT change the model of the gun.  Nothing about the lower receiver changes when building different variations of the AR-15,  AR-15 does not designate that it is .223 caliber, or that its a rifle vs a pistol, or an SBR with a tax stamp.  I custom build them, I have a little knowledge in this department.

Look, as someone with decades of hands on, I get it. May not be a difficult concept but it is one that people commonly confuse. Even some lower end manufacturers throw the designator in their descriptions for those consumers that don't understand. As someone who custom builds them in your garage or for a company, you should know that the lower can in fact change in serialization registration and markings. You also understand that going with modification outside that of similar sized cartridges (.223, 5.56, .300, etc.) not only require lower modifications but sometimes upper modifications that the ATF deems requiring a Form 1, Form 4, and possibly even another 4473 depending on said modifications. This is contrary to what you state "The only part that is designated a gun is the lower receiver. That is what counts as the gun for the purpose of the background check." In addition, any modification to a purchased AR-15 rifle, pistol, SBR, fall under the ATF designation of "AR type firearm". Therefore, AR-15 is a specific model designed to fire a standard configuration of .223/5.56 as previously stated and anything beyond that purchased in kit form or manufactured (80% lower) falls under the "AR type firearm" designation. Platform (style) versus model...  

- Do you describe your .300 a AR-15 .300 or AR .300 blackout?
- Would you describe an AR styled rifle in .308 an AR-15 .308 or AR-10?

I appreciate you trying to add some personal thoughts on different AR type configurations but it is getting off topic and only feeds into the narrative that all black rifles are AR-15s, military equivalents, scary, and my personal favorite...really dangerous because they fire fully semi-automatic . With that said, guns have now been deemed so offensive that magazines are relegated to the old school porn sensorship. This picture was taken at Orlando International at Hudson News...

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The only part that is designated a gun is the lower receiver.  That is what counts as the gun for the purpose of the background check.  changing the parts that bolt to it does not change the model number of the gun (lower receiver).  It's not a difficult concept, the lower receiver is the gun, the rest are parts that DO NOT change the model of the gun.  Nothing about the lower receiver changes when building different variations of the AR-15,  AR-15 does not designate that it is .223 caliber, or that its a rifle vs a pistol, or an SBR with a tax stamp.  I custom build them, I have a little knowledge in this department.

Look, as someone with decades of hands on, I get it. May not be a difficult concept but it is one that people commonly confuse. Even some lower end manufacturers throw the designator in their descriptions for those consumers that don't understand. As someone who custom builds them in your garage or for a company, you should know that the lower can in fact change in serialization registration and markings. You also understand that going with modification outside that of similar sized cartridges (.223, 5.56, .300, etc.) not only require lower modifications but sometimes upper modifications that the ATF deems requiring a Form 1, Form 4, and possibly even another 4473 depending on said modifications. This is contrary to what you state "The only part that is designated a gun is the lower receiver. That is what counts as the gun for the purpose of the background check." In addition, any modification to a purchased AR-15 rifle, pistol, SBR, fall under the ATF designation of "AR type firearm". Therefore, AR-15 is a specific model designed to fire a standard configuration of .223/5.56 as previously stated and anything beyond that purchased in kit form or manufactured (80% lower) falls under the "AR type firearm" designation. Platform (style) versus model...  

- Do you describe your .300 a AR-15 .300 or AR .300 blackout?
- Would you describe an AR styled rifle in .308 an AR-15 .308 or AR-10?

I appreciate you trying to add some personal thoughts on different AR type configurations but it is getting off topic and only feeds into the narrative that all black rifles are AR-15s, military equivalents, scary, and my personal favorite...really dangerous because they fire fully semi-automatic . With that said, guns have now been deemed so offensive that magazines are relegated to the old school porn sensorship. This picture was taken at Orlando International at Hudson News...

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Dick's Sporting Goods just announced that they will stop selling firearms to anyone under 21, and will cease sales of high-powered assault style rifles.

Another shoe drops

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So what are your thoughts on Hobby Lobby politicizing commerce?

Dick's has been irrelevant for years even after Sports Authority filed for bankruptcy. That shoe you heard drop was another business will go bankrupt for playing politics. This move is mere grandstanding and if anyone cares, will get them sued for civil rights infringement unless they chose to not sell guns at all. You are now discriminating 18-20 year olds that can legally own a rifle under federal and current state law.

And the first age discrimination lawsuit has been filed...

https://americanmilitarynews.com/2018/03...r-old-sues-[BLEEP]-and-walmart-for-not-selling-him-a-gun/?utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=alt&utm_source=goa

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Do you guys keep lotion and paper towels handy when you talk about guns?

What's the recoil of an AR-15 vs. 30-06?

Can a 30-06 be fitted with multi-round magazines with a capacity matching an AR-15?

Does 30-06 ammunition "tumble" like .223 bullets, thus causing more widespread damage to human flesh?

Can a 30-06 be as easily fired braced against the hip as an AR-15, and thus easier to stabilize when shooting multiple targets, especially when considering the recoil (see question 2)?

Can a 30-06 be easily customized with a forward hand grip or a carry handle?

Does the pistol grip on an AR-15 actually give it an advantage beyond looking cool?

Could the Parkland shooter have killed as many as easily with a 30-06 as he did with an AR-15?

My nephew, a Naval officer and certainly no snowflake, cited these feature when explaining why AR-15s are a more effective and efficient weapon to use by relatively untrained mass shooters than weapons like a 30-06.

No, but I have a rather nice Franchi o/u that I only polish with a diaper.

First of all, AR-15 is a model of gun, only available in .223 caliber.  30-06 is a caliber available in numerous models (though most commonly in a bolt action 'hunting rifle" design).
Recoil is Newton's Third Law of Motion coming into play.  Muzzle energy of a .223 is about 1,300 ft/lbs., whereas a 30-06 is more than double that, at 2,800.  "Felt" recoil is a product of muzzle energy acting on the mass of the gun.  A semi-automatic action absorbs some of this energy in cycling the reloading process, which a bolt action does not, thus reducing relative recoil in any caliber.

Yes, though they're not widely available for most models.

All ammo "tumbles" at some point.  Muzzle velocity, bullet configuration and barrel twist are the variables.  By the way, increased tumble = decreased accuracy.  At the range we're talking here, it's a non factor.  Beyond that, any knowledgeable shooter uses ammo designed for the job at hand, soft point, hollow point, etc.

Yes, but good luck trying to hit anything smaller than a minivan.  That's strictly TV stuff.

Sure.  I even have a suitcase customized with such a handle.

The grip on any gun is an advantage over no grip.  That being said, some shotguns have a straight stock, without a grip, which is known as an English stock.  I have an SKB 280 in such a configuration and I find it to be extremely quick-pointing.  

Caliber versus gun again, but a 30-06 is a far more deadly round, so yes.

Your nephew may know torpedoes, but firearms..............not so much.

My nephew's job in the Navy was security, he absolutely knows guns, and he wasn't the only source for the points I made. Feel free to insult me, my nephew has done heroic things you'll never hear about.

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If something can corrupt you, you're corrupted already.
- Bob Marley


 

Dick's Sporting Goods just announced that they will stop selling firearms to anyone under 21, and will cease sales of high-powered assault style rifles.

Another shoe drops

Liberals and Tide pod eating snowflakes like you

And I get accused of name-calling, jesus

For what it's worth, I prefer the stuff from the dishwasher aisle. It has a lovely orange flavor.

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No, but I have a rather nice Franchi o/u that I only polish with a diaper.

First of all, AR-15 is a model of gun, only available in .223 caliber.  30-06 is a caliber available in numerous models (though most commonly in a bolt action 'hunting rifle" design).
Recoil is Newton's Third Law of Motion coming into play.  Muzzle energy of a .223 is about 1,300 ft/lbs., whereas a 30-06 is more than double that, at 2,800.  "Felt" recoil is a product of muzzle energy acting on the mass of the gun.  A semi-automatic action absorbs some of this energy in cycling the reloading process, which a bolt action does not, thus reducing relative recoil in any caliber.

Yes, though they're not widely available for most models.

All ammo "tumbles" at some point.  Muzzle velocity, bullet configuration and barrel twist are the variables.  By the way, increased tumble = decreased accuracy.  At the range we're talking here, it's a non factor.  Beyond that, any knowledgeable shooter uses ammo designed for the job at hand, soft point, hollow point, etc.

Yes, but good luck trying to hit anything smaller than a minivan.  That's strictly TV stuff.

Sure.  I even have a suitcase customized with such a handle.

The grip on any gun is an advantage over no grip.  That being said, some shotguns have a straight stock, without a grip, which is known as an English stock.  I have an SKB 280 in such a configuration and I find it to be extremely quick-pointing.  

Caliber versus gun again, but a 30-06 is a far more deadly round, so yes.

Your nephew may know torpedoes, but firearms..............not so much.

My nephew's job in the Navy was security, he absolutely knows guns, and he wasn't the only source for the points I made. Feel free to insult me, my nephew has done heroic things you'll never hear about.

1)  Tell your nephew I said thanks for his military service.
2)  Source doesn't really matter if the information is wrong.  
3)  What points?  You asked questions.  I answered them.  
4)  What answer did you find so insulting?
5)  Speaking of insults, what technical "point" of an AR-15's performance was the lotion and paper towels question intended to address?

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When you get into the endzone, act like you've been there before.

Mods, not gonna lock NRA thread?

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Mods, not gonna lock NRA thread?

Are you triggered? Need a campfire to sit around and talk about it? I hear JIB plays a mean ukulele.

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My nephew's job in the Navy was security, he absolutely knows guns, and he wasn't the only source for the points I made. Feel free to insult me, my nephew has done heroic things you'll never hear about.

1)  Tell your nephew I said thanks for his military service.
2)  Source doesn't really matter if the information is wrong.  
3)  What points?  You asked questions.  I answered them.  
4)  What answer did you find so insulting?
5)  Speaking of insults, what technical "point" of an AR-15's performance was the lotion and paper towels question intended to address?

The lotion and paper towel comment was a comment outside the AR-15 discussion, and at no point did I say my entire post was technical. The poetic ways some of you gun enthusiasts describe your guns does sound like an almost erotic attraction. Not an insult, I don't judge, just asking about details. It's remarkable.

I'm not really sure how all your points are in rebuttal to mine. Heck, some confirmed it, such as the recoil comparison. Are you telling me you can get several shots off without re-aiming with a 30-06 as you can an AR-15. You can tell me my nephew is clueless all you want, but that is a common sense comparison I've seen made in several articles. So were the points he made to me about the foregrip.

I freely admit I don't know much about guns, but it seems to me this would be much easier to shoot a lot of kids in a crowded hallway with this...



...than this...


...especially if the shooter is inexperienced.

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If something can corrupt you, you're corrupted already.
- Bob Marley


 

Apparently, the "March for Our Lives but Not Yours" had one huge effect. The NRA nearly tripled it's donations in March 2018 compared to March 2017.

NRA record donations

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"Why should I give information to you when all you want to do is find something wrong with it?"

Apparently, the "March for Our Lives but Not Yours" had one huge effect. The NRA nearly tripled it's donations in March 2018 compared to March 2017.

NRA record donations

Clearly they were owned by the Camera Hogg.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Apparently, the "March for Our Lives but Not Yours" had one huge effect. The NRA nearly tripled it's donations in March 2018 compared to March 2017.

NRA record donations

Clearly they were owned by the Camera Hogg.

A middle school student died during a walkout after getting hit by a car.

More people have died during his walkouts than were murdered by NRA members this year.

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