Quote:We will see I guess, I'd be shocked if he posted anything near 4.4s and 40+. I was talking about functional athleticism, though. If he really does have that athleticism it doesn't translate to the field well, except for that first step.
I agree with this. Love Shane Ray and think he would be a really good pick, but he's not a 'freak' athlete. He's a good athlete with 'freak' relentlessness attacking the QB.
A freak athlete is Odell Beckham.
I wouldn't call Beckham a freak athlete. He's not tall, he's fast, but so are all receivers. What makes him so good is the phenomenal skillset he has. You can't teach someone to catch better than he does.
Quote:You can't draft scared. He's worth the risk.
Not scared, smart. Gregory is a classic boom or bust prospect. Nice measurables but has not had the production to back it up. Not worth it, IMO.
Quote:I agree with this. Love Shane Ray and think he would be a really good pick, but he's not a 'freak' athlete. He's a good athlete with 'freak' relentlessness attacking the QB.
A freak athlete is Odell Beckham.
Did anybody say Ray was a "freak" athlete?
Quote:Did anybody say Ray was a "freak" athlete?
I did but I shouldn't of said that. He is a good athlete, and one of the better athletes in this draft class if he can put up numbers close to the ones rumored. A freak athlete is LeBron James, Clowney, Megatron......There are none of those in this class
Quote:I did but I shouldn't of said that. He is a good athlete, and one of the better athletes in this draft class if he can put up numbers close to the ones rumored. A freak athlete is LeBron James, Clowney, Megatron......There are none of those in this class
I actually think some of Ray's numbers at the combine (broad jump, vertical, 40) will be close to Clowney. But he does not have Clowney's size.
Quote:Not scared, smart. Gregory is a classic boom or bust prospect. Nice measurables but has not had the production to back it up. Not worth it, IMO.
The draft is all about projection and not about past production imo. Just look as far back as last year with Michael Sam. Great college player but can't transition into an nfl setting.
Gregory in the right system (our system I believe) would be an absolute terror. As our Leo he will have no run stopping responsibility and just needs to sack and pressure the qb. I'm not going to say he doesn't need work but he does have everything you can't teach. Height, length, speed, above average motor and he also has the frame to easily pack on 15-20 lbs.
Quote:I agree with this. Love Shane Ray and think he would be a really good pick, but he's not a 'freak' athlete. He's a good athlete with 'freak' relentlessness attacking the QB.
A freak athlete is Odell Beckham.
I think people are using "freak athlete" in different ways.
Its normal usage is when a guy has a crazy combination of size/speed/power.
Quote:The draft is all about projection and not about past production imo. Just look as far back as last year with Michael Sam. Great college player but can't transition into an nfl setting.
Gregory in the right system (our system I believe) would be an absolute terror. As our Leo he will have no run stopping responsibility and just needs to sack and pressure the qb. I'm not going to say he doesn't need work but he does have everything you can't teach. Height, length, speed, above average motor and he also has the frame to easily pack on 15-20 lbs.
Sam did not have the measurables you look for. Ray does. That is why Sam was a 7th round pick and Ray will be a top 10 pick.
Really warming up to this guy the more I see him and read about him. Incredible timing off the snap and a really quick first step. He overwhelms offensive linemen. But in the pros he'll be matched up against OT's who can handle that kind of speed. A bit raw in his pass rush repertoire (what college pass rusher isn't?), but I've seen some nice inside counters and use of the hands so I think he can eventually become technically proficient. I still prefer Leonard Williams, but I'm liking Ray more than Gregory right now. Sounds like he's quietly putting his name in the top 5 mix. Definitely a viable candidate at 3. It would be awesome if we managed to trade back (with the Jets taking a QB at 3) and still manage to snag him. He may not get past Washington though.
Quote:Sam did not have the measurables you look for. Ray does. That is why Sam was a 7th round pick and Ray will be a top 10 pick.
Listed at 6'3 but rumor is he's a lot closer to 6'1. He also weighs around 240 and does not have the frame to pick up more lbs and still stay in top shape. Those are definitely not the measurables you look for in a top 3 def end selection. Don't get me wrong though, I do like Ray for his tenacity and high motor. Gregory is just a better prospect imo.
Quote:I wouldn't call Beckham a freak athlete. He's not tall, he's fast, but so are all receivers. What makes him so good is the phenomenal skillset he has. You can't teach someone to catch better than he does.
Height really has nothing to do with being a freak athlete.
Quote:That post was just a preview of the next few months for that wannabe draft expert.
Nah, you don't have to worry about that. I am a DFS pro now so the majority of my research/evaluation/predictive talents go toward making lots of money doing that now.
I still watch some cutups just to relax and study up on guys that I think the Jags could/should target, and I might throw some tidbits in on guys that I think I know reasonably well such as Ray, but it definitely won't be as often or as in depth as the last few years.
Btw, I watched Arik Armstead last night cause I've heard he will be flying up draft boards and wow he has impressive traits. I saw Kiper had him to the Falcons at 8 overall and I would rather have him at 3 than probably anyone except Williams, Gregory, and Fowler as of right now, and it wouldn't take a whole lot of debate to convince me to take him over anyone except Leonard (but I'm not there yet).
Quote:remember that time that tom brady couldnt beat out drew henson?
the pats should have taken your logic under consideration...
Brady started almost all of the games his final two seasons....
I live in Big 10 country and didn't know that Gregory was a big time prospect until I started researching into the draft. When you can see a handful of games a team plays and not even notice a certain player that is not a good sign. I only saw one Florida game and knew Fowler was special. I've seen a handful of Gregory games and definitely doubt it. I can't say much on Ray. Just my takeaways from watching games.
Quote:I wouldn't call Beckham a freak athlete. He's not tall, he's fast, but so are all receivers. What makes him so good is the phenomenal skillset he has. You can't teach someone to catch better than he does.
I think that's why he's a freak athlete. He can do things that other people can't do, or he does them effortlessly when others struggle with them. I think the height / weight / speed combo = athleticism thing is too often used to categorize someone as a freak athlete.
Quote:I live in Big 10 country and didn't know that Gregory was a big time prospect until I started researching into the draft. When you can see a handful of games a team plays and not even notice a certain player that is not a good sign. I only saw one Florida game and knew Fowler was special. I've seen a handful of Gregory games and definitely doubt it. I can't say much on Ray. Just my takeaways from watching games.
I agree. I'm not impressed with him at all.
Double-teams are very successful against him; he can't fight through them. Runningbacks have success completely eliminating him with the simplest cut-blocks. For being the most physically talented DL on the Nebraska line, he's very often the last person off the snap. He seems to be pancaked a lot, too.
I like his effort and motor. He seems to be most successful when he's trying to predict the snap, but that's going to be countered at the next level. Because he's so talented, he shines on occassions, but those appear to be the exception to me. I certainly wouldn't take him top-3.
Quote:Not scared, smart. Gregory is a classic boom or bust prospect. Nice measurables but has not had the production to back it up. Not worth it, IMO.
A scout who criticized Dion Jordan before he was drafted is saying the same things about Randy Gregory.
Quote:He is said to run a 4.44 in the 40, has a vertical jump of 42 inches and bench-presses 430 pounds. Not bad IMO
http://www.nfl.com/photoessays/0ap2000000354297
Ray's unofficial 40 times at his pro day this morning were around 4.6, saw 4.56, 4.63, and 4.66. Compared to these official 40s: Fowler 4.60, Beasley 4.53, Gregory 4.64, and Dupree 4.56.
Will update when I see the more important 10 yard split, or any other numbers.
Wholly average.
<a class="" href='https://twitter.com/NDTScouting'>
Kyle Crabbs
@NDTScouting </a> <a class="" href='https://twitter.com/NDTScouting/status/578597606391164928'>2h2 hours ago</a>
<p class="" style="color:rgb(41,47,51);font-family:Arial, sans-serif;background-color:rgb(245,248,250);">Total tally of test results for Shane Ray: 4.63 40, 21 bench reps (Combine), 33.0" vertical and 10'0" broad jump.
Quote:Wholly average.
<div style="color:rgb(41,47,51);font-family:Arial, sans-serif;background-color:rgb(245,248,250);">Kyle Crabbs @NDTScouting 2h2 hours ago
<p style="color:rgb(41,47,51);font-family:Arial, sans-serif;background-color:rgb(245,248,250);">Total tally of test results for Shane Ray: 4.63 40, 21 bench reps (Combine), 33.0" vertical and 10'0" broad jump.
</div>
Did he not do any agility drills?