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Full Version: Devil's Advocate: Why Firing Bradley May not be the best thing
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This from today's MMQB on Washington:

 

Quote: 

Washington eats its young. Lather, rinse, repeat. Nothing changes in Washington under owner Daniel Snyder. Despair is followed by hope, which is followed by a ton of spending, which is followed by losing, which is followed by coach-firing, which is followed by more spending, which is followed by more losing, which is followed by coach-firing … and that’s the way it flows inside the Beltway. And you thought partisan politics was awful. Washington has finished in last place in the NFC East in five of the last six years, and is on track to do it a seventh time in eight years. The team has had eight coaches this decade; that’s exactly how many coaches the other three teams in the division have had, combined, in this century. Yet the Washington Post reported over the weekend that Jay Gruden, handed a five-year guaranteed contract 11 months ago, would be “one and done,” or fired after one season, in the wake of the disaster that Robert Griffin III’s tenure has become. “We’ve been fighting uphill forever now,’’ veteran wideout Santana Moss told the Post. After the latest debacle, the 24-0 loss to St. Louis, Gruden told Washington’s NBC affiliate that he’d been told by GM Bruce Allen that the story was false. Maybe. But coaches are never told a bad reality with three weeks left in a lost season. All possibilities (Griffin and Gruden returning together, Griffin and Gruden both departing, or anything in between) are on the table. My guess is Gruden returns, and Griffin does only if he turns over a studious leaf and works harder in the classroom.
 

 

Does any of this sound familiar?

 

Yes...2-11 this year and 6-23 the past two years sucks mightily.

 

But not only does the above show changing coaches may not work, it may actually make matters worse.

 

In Jacksonville's case, the entire passing offense -which represents the bulk of the team's issues-is being run on the field primarily by rookies, including at QB, 3 WR spots, C, and RG.

 

Many of the struggles the personnel have had has come from playing while learning the offense (e.g. Marqise Lee).

 

If you keep the same schemes, Bortles, Lee, and Robinson will have the benefit of doing everything next year with the benefit of experience.  There should be a lot less wondering whether people are lined up properly, what receivers should run when coverages show this vs. that, what the protections should be.  Players should be making more plays next year based on instinct.  That alone should mean improvement.  Bortles, now a year into the playbook, can devote more time in honing his fundamentals.  Lee and Robinson can work on getting off the jam.   Bowanko and Linder can focus on getting stronger.  If the team adds a tackle or two to improve the OL, Bowanko and Linder could help get them up to speed with authority, knowing the league a year and knowing the offense.

 

If you fire the coaches now, if you change schemes now, what will that do to the rookies on the offensive side of the ball?

 

Instead of Bortles, Lee, and A Robinson becoming less tentative and more decisive and more confident, all three will have to unlearn the scheme here and learn new schemes, prolonging the transition to becoming successful players.

 

While Linder and Bowanko seem to have played well this year, new schemes would mean them-and the rest of the new OL-learning new protections and possibly becoming more tentative, which leads to miss blocks, miss blitzes, missed assignments, and hits on the QB and RB for lost yards.  They may be only slightly more knowledgeable initially on the protections in the new scheme than any tackles they bring in.

 

Compounding things further, let's assume Blackmon manages to return.  He played in the offense briefly in 2013.  If you assume some rust from the suspension, keeping  the scheme with which he is already familiar will aid in his return.  Conversely, changing schemes now may only make things more difficult for him and Bortles to get on the same page.

 

On top of that, whatever strength the defense represents may be lost with a change in coaching and scheme.

 

In a nutshell, you risk throwing the baby out with the bathwater on both sides of the ball short term, with no assurances of long term success if you change coaches.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I am almost certain Bradley gets one more year.
If Bradley stays, Fisch is almost certainly going to get fired.

 

The rookies you spoke of will likely have to learn a new system either way.

I agree with you, Bullseye.  

 

I would also add, players are drafted to fit a particular offensive or defensive scheme.   Bringing in a new coaching staff will lead to a lot of players that fit the current scheme being jettisoned or marginalized because they won't fit the new schemes.   And that would set the team back further personnel-wise.   

Quote:I agree with you, Bullseye.  

 

I would also add, players are drafted to fit a particular offensive or defensive scheme.   Bringing in a new coaching staff will lead to a lot of players that fit the current scheme being jettisoned or marginalized because they won't fit the new schemes.   And that would set the team back further personnel-wise.   
Exactly!
Quote:If Bradley stays, Fisch is almost certainly going to get fired.

 

The rookies you spoke of will likely have to learn a new system either way.
 

I disagree.   I don't thing Fisch will get fired.   I give him a pass this year for working with so many rookies, and he needs more talent on the offensive line.   Besides, firing Fisch would mean that all those young players on offense have to start over learning an entirely new scheme and playbook.   Improve the offensive line and Fisch will look like a genius.  

Quote:I disagree.   I don't thing Fisch will get fired.   I give him a pass this year for working with so many rookies, and he needs more talent on the offensive line.   Besides, firing Fisch would mean that all those young players on offense have to start over learning an entirely new scheme and playbook.   Improve the offensive line and Fisch will look like a genius.  
 

Does anybody get fired in this scenario or just stay the course?
Quote:Does anybody get fired in this scenario or just stay the course?
 

Honestly, the only position coach I would see being changed is Oline coach if Yarno can't come back next year.  Butkis has been doing it this year but he was supposed to be Yarno's assistant.  Just doesn't have the experience.

 

So I don't think the coaches should be fired.  The record doesn't show it, but I've seen what I expected to see this year.  Flashes thrown in with rookie mistakes.
I know we got a lot of rookies starting on offense but we keep making the same mistakes every week. Which means there is no progress on offense. We need some veteran leadership on offense. Look at what Mike Zimmer did in Minnesota. He went out and got Norv Turner to help groom Teddy.

 

Who did Bradley get? A college guy who underachieved at Miami. Young guys shouldn't be groomed by rookie/young HC's and OC's. We can't have coaches learning on the fly teaching rookies.

Quote:I know we got a lot of rookies starting on offense but we keep making the same mistakes every week. Which means there is no progress on offense. We need some veteran leadership on offense. Look at what Mike Zimmer did in Minnesota. He went out and got Norv Turner to help groom Teddy.

 

Who did Bradley get? A college guy who underachieved at Miami. Young guys shouldn't be groomed by rookie/young HC's and OC's. We can't have coaches learning on the fly teaching rookies.
 

You do realize that the coaches that these HC's bring in actually need to want to be there, right?  Do you actually think there was a snowball's chance in hell that Norv Turner would have come to Jacksonville as a coordinator under Bradley?
Quote: 

 

In a nutshell, you risk throwing the baby out with the bathwater on both sides of the ball short term, with no assurances of long term success if you change coaches.
 

You make some good points. However, I didn't see any "system" on either side of the ball. Again, what we "know" as fans is not very important or relevant to the direction of the Jacksonville Jaguars. But Bradley would have to convince Kahn that he has a plan, that they are on track, & that there will be tangible proof, soon. 

 

I can see Bradley staying, but I can't imagine Fisch staying & you'd be in the same position you'd have been by firing the HC... starting all over on offense, but hopefully Bradley can get that defense to a point where it can carry you, which won't be easy with Indy averaging 30+ points a game, Tennessee going more vertical, & hopefully the Texans adopting the Patriots penchant for running up the score. But we'll see.

 

Before the season started, & the Jags said Bortles would ride the pine all year, I thought that made sense. Let Fisch prove that he can game plan & win with Henne... not a franchise QB, but more prepared to start than a rookie from UCF, Henne worked with Fish in 2013, he should be adept in his "system". & he couldn't even produce a competitive offense. That tells me he has no idea how to game plan to the strengths & weaknesses of a rookie QB, I don't understand the decision to throw Blake in to the wolves... but he looks mentally tough & appears to not be damaged, yet. 

 

Nah... I don't see how you go into another season with Jed Fisch & expect to compete in the AFC South.

Quote:You do realize that the coaches that these HC's bring in actually need to want to be there, right?  Do you actually think there was a snowball's chance in hell that Norv Turner would have come to Jacksonville as a coordinator under Bradley?
Money... People follow the money. Throw enough money at him and he might have come here.

 

I think having a veteran HC as the OC would have helped Bradley a lot.
Quote:I disagree.   I don't thing Fisch will get fired.   I give him a pass this year for working with so many rookies, and he needs more talent on the offensive line.   Besides, firing Fisch would mean that all those young players on offense have to start over learning an entirely new scheme and playbook.   Improve the offensive line and Fisch will look like a genius.  
Agreed.  I think you'll see very little change with the coaching staff next year.  They're going to let this play out for another year. 
Quote:Agreed.  I think you'll see very little change with the coaching staff next year.  They're going to let this play out for another year. 
[Image: pic9b28bc3f8422e82b8bc89d3a3d0a0bb2.png]
Quote:You make some good points. However, I didn't see any "system" on either side of the ball. Again, what we "know" as fans is not very important or relevant to the direction of the Jacksonville Jaguars. But Bradley would have to convince Kahn that he has a plan, that they are on track, & that there will be tangible proof, soon. 

 

I can see Bradley staying, but I can't imagine Fisch staying & you'd be in the same position you'd have been by firing the HC... starting all over on offense, but hopefully Bradley can get that defense to a point where it can carry you, which won't be easy with Indy averaging 30+ points a game, Tennessee going more vertical, & hopefully the Texans adopting the Patriots penchant for running up the score. But we'll see.

 

Before the season started, & the Jags said Bortles would ride the pine all year, I thought that made sense. Let Fisch prove that he can game plan & win with Henne... not a franchise QB, but more prepared to start than a rookie from UCF, Henne worked with Fish in 2013, he should be adept in his "system". & he couldn't even produce a competitive offense. That tells me he has no idea how to game plan to the strengths & weaknesses of a rookie QB, I don't understand the decision to throw Blake in to the wolves... but he looks mentally tough & appears to not be damaged, yet. 

 

Nah... I don't see how you go into another season with Jed Fisch & expect to compete in the AFC South.
 

Do you think Bradley will fire Fisch?   Because I don't think Khan or Caldwell will override Bradley on the choice of his assistants.   So if Fisch gets fired, it will be Bradley who will fire him.    I don't think Bradley will fire Fisch.  
Quote:[Image: pic9b28bc3f8422e82b8bc89d3a3d0a0bb2.png]
 

Right, because having a whole offseason, free agency, draft, Bortles having a whole offseason of not needing to learn a new playbook, rookies getting more mature, etc is doing the same thing over again.  smh
Quote:I know we got a lot of rookies starting on offense but we keep making the same mistakes every week. Which means there is no progress on offense. We need some veteran leadership on offense. Look at what Mike Zimmer did in Minnesota. He went out and got Norv Turner to help groom Teddy.

 

Who did Bradley get? A college guy who underachieved at Miami. Young guys shouldn't be groomed by rookie/young HC's and OC's. We can't have coaches learning on the fly teaching rookies.
Turner has taken Minnesota all the way to the 28th best offense in the NFL, and that's for total offense.  They're actually rated BEHIND the Jaguars in passing offense where Minnesota has the 31st rated passing attack vs. the Jags at #28. 
Quote:[Image: pic9b28bc3f8422e82b8bc89d3a3d0a0bb2.png]
 

Maybe Einstein was talking about hiring and firing coaches every 2 years and expecting different results.  

 

See: Washington Redskins and Oakland Raiders. 

Quote:[Image: pic9b28bc3f8422e82b8bc89d3a3d0a0bb2.png]
You're absolutely right.  Firing coaches every other year doesn't give teams who practice this behavior much success. 
Quote:Do you think Bradley will fire Fisch?   Because I don't think Khan or Caldwell will override Bradley on the choice of his assistants.   So if Fisch gets fired, it will be Bradley who will fire him.    I don't think Bradley will fire Fisch.  
Agreed. 
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