Quote:Ha ha! So now having a memory is defined as stalking? You are too much!!
I appreciate the attempt at looking at the trade with hope, my question to you is simply one of sincerity... if you really see the positive, I applaud your ability to change your mind... if you are hedging you bets, then yeah, I'm calling you on it...
Like I said, for me it's still a head scratcher of a trade, wish e held on to Monroe longer, but I'm hoping we can parlay this into strong contributors... but I have my concerns about it.
Um, no one is "changing their mind".....lets try this again....I am merely trying to see the most positive as I can regarding the deal. I have said in numerous occasions now that I still feel the trade was mismanaged. Points were left on the field, to use a football term.
While I still think we botched it, I can still at least hope we get the "max" out of the deal which would be the Ravens finishing as low as possible, which would make the picks we got as high as possible in each round.
Now, of course, somehow read your own language out of what I just said, and interpret it as flopping, like you and AngryDakota already have done....
Quote:The pro bowl's a joke and I've never referred to the Bleacher report to back up anything I've EVER said. I just can't believe people put real value on pro bowl selections, I guess to each his own.
What makes me laugh is so many people on this site bashed the pro bowl as a means of player validation when it was brought up in the past in arguments against Shack that he didn't draft many pro bowlers, now - probably some of the same people will use the pro bowl here to benefit their arguments.Selective, isn't it??
Quote:What makes me laugh is so many people on this site bashed the pro bowl as a means of player validation when it was brought up in the past in arguments against Shack that he didn't draft many pro bowlers, now - probably some of the same people will use the pro bowl here to benefit their arguments.Selective, isn't it??
yea real selective, using the pro bowl to justify a players worth is like using the homecoming kind and queen to justify a students academic achievements.
I could have sworn Pro Football Focus, who's site is dedicated to grading players also had Monroe as a top 10 LT heading into this season, just like that Bleacher report grade. Bleacher report is another one of those sites that people will bash all the time unless it happens to have something that supports their argument, then they'll use it.
#becausejagsmessageboard
Quote:Baltimore's line has played horribly lately culminating in possibly their worst game of the season yesterday (as far as line play goes). Rice was held to a ridiculously low yardage total and it was because there was simply nowhere to run.
With Baltimore losing, they now sit at 3-5, which makes those 4th & 5th round picks that we received reside in the upper half of those particular rounds. Even if Balt finishes the rest of the season at a reasonable 4-4 record, those picks would still be in the upper half of those rounds.
Tah Dah....
We aren't bailing out the left tackle as much as we were before. RBs and TEs should be available pass options now as we develop closer to routine five-man pass protection.
The Jaguars still don't have maneuverability at guard. If you notice...we don't screen pass at all. We don't have any success at the power sweep. Why? Because we have two slugs at offensive guard and Old Yeller at center.
How Gus failed to detect we have no pulling guard is a tribute to a horrible scouting staff obfuscating their own personnel mess then complicating it by selecting a horrible offensive coordinator from the U. The Hurricanes' offense is much better coordinated than last season. Undoubtedly, losing a schlump OC to the Jaguars was the best thing that happened to them.
When you can't coordinate the offense to run a power sweep what you get with this is Maurice Jones-Drew running parallel to the line of scrimmage for a few steps and falling down just like James Stewart did for the first two years he was here. Forget about details of play execution such as "ya gotta have a belly"...Simple facets of the power sweep are much too much for this team to comprehend.
Uche needs to have a flamethrower set to his coochie, and the scrub playing left guard has the agility of a keystone set in mud. Old Yeller at center looks like a guy on stilts having a tough time moving forward in a tropical storm on most plays. Until we figure out what a guard looks like I guess as some point in this disastrous season, we could switch Tyson Alualu to offensive guard. He has the perfect body type, linear agility and just enough girth for pro guard. Why not switch him to OG for the rest of the season?
Until we draft agility and power for the offensive line we can forget about the screen pass. Tom Coughlin drilled this play into the heads of his offense. He was such a great coach he frequently ran two screens pass plays (RB and HB or center screen) on the same snap....and almost always looked to throw deep out of it.
We had the best looking screen pass in the NFL. Now we have nothing more than a college football version of a screen pass thrown naked to a WR. Wasting a WR on a short WR naked screen is dubiously lazy. It lacks conceptualization, effort, and total involvement of the offense.
You wonder why our offense is so slack...
Quote:
Until we draft agility and power for the offensive line we can forget about the screen pass. Tom Coughlin drilled this play into the heads of his offense. He was such a great coach he frequently ran two screens pass plays (RB and HB or center screen) on the same snap....and could even throw deep out of it.
We had the best looking screen pass in the NFL. Now we have nothing more than a college football version of a screen pass thrown naked to a WR. We never really get to see even that most of the time because our QB throws the ball directly into the pass rusher's out-stretched hands for a batted down ball.
Yup, I miss those days when we actually had a legitimate quality NFL head coach....too bad thats now over a decade ago since.
Quote:Yup, I miss those days when we actually had a legitimate quality NFL head coach....too bad thats now over a decade ago since.
So the head coach you liked before the team showed interest is now not a legitimate NFL head coach?
We should add ballerina to your arsenal of weapons the way you spin.
This thread is a perfect example of how your shtick operates. You whined like a jilted school girl about this trade and how we didn't get enough value. Now suddenly you're trying to find a way to change your tune as it starts to look like the team actually did well in the trade. By the time the draft rolls around you'll be telling the board you drafted the deal the team wound up with a week before the trade.
Quote:So the head coach you liked before the team showed interest is now not a legitimate NFL head coach?
We should add ballerina to your arsenal of weapons the way you spin.
This thread is a perfect example of how your shtick operates. You whined like a jilted school girl about this trade and how we didn't get enough value. Now suddenly you're trying to find a way to change your tune as it starts to look like the team actually did well in the trade. By the time the draft rolls around you'll be telling the board you drafted the deal the team wound up with a week before the trade.
Tune's not changing, trade still was botched. I said that then, and still said it in this very post. You need to actually comprehend what you are reading. Too bad I couldn't type in crayon so perhaps you'd get it quicker....I am merely just trying to look at the deal from as positive an angle as can be given the circumstances.
Quote:I think you're reaching a bit here. If anything Monroe elevated his game against elite tackles. I distinctly remember him stonewalling Jared Allen last year and JJ Watt never had a above average game going against him (Guy Whimper is another story). He year in and year out held his own against the Mathis/Freeney combo with Freeney schooling him only in his rookie year.
This is So So Very true let alone accurate. Monroe was more than just an Above Average LT. He sincerely held his own on more front than others...
NH3...
Quote:Um, no one is "changing their mind".....lets try this again....I am merely trying to see the most positive as I can regarding the deal. I have said in numerous occasions now that I still feel the trade was mismanaged. Points were left on the field, to use a football term.
While I still think we botched it, I can still at least hope we get the "max" out of the deal which would be the Ravens finishing as low as possible, which would make the picks we got as high as possible in each round.
Now, of course, somehow read your own language out of what I just said, and interpret it as flopping, like you and AngryDakota already have done....
OK, understood. But if I may...
Not to get all logical here... But...
If poster A said during the time of the trade, this was a bad move
Then poster A posts a few weeks later that the trade looks to possibly be a good move considering the changing circumstances of the season as it has unfolded.
Would that not be considered "Changing one's mind"
Also, if poster A went from seeing the negative in a trade, then subsiquently chooses to point out some positives, would that not also be considered a change in mind set?
Look dude, you need to stop being so sensitive about what people say to you when discussing this team. Perhaps I was a bit snarky with my original comment, so I apologize about that. But I'm not here trying to lynch you or anything. Again, I was pointing out that you switched positions. Not a big deal. I change my mind constantly with this team. Usually happens onces every minute for 60 minutes on Sundays... Its all good. We're friends here.
Quote:David Garrard was a pro bowler....
In his defense, he should have been a pro-bowler in '07, and he was like 2nd alternate when he did go, so I would say that was fairly appropriate.
Quote:In his defense, he should have been a pro-bowler in '07, and he was like 2nd alternate when he did go, so I would say that was fairly appropriate.
He went in 2009.
Garrard completed 60.9 percent of his passes for 3,597 yards, with 15 touchdowns and 10 interceptions in 2009.
Pro bowl numbers?
Quote:The pro bowl's a joke and I've never referred to the Bleacher report to back up anything I've EVER said. I just can't believe people put real value on pro bowl selections, I guess to each his own.
So you're saying you don't have anything to indicate Monroe was a top 10 LT?
Quote:So you're saying you don't have anything to indicate Monroe was a top 10 LT?
Basically.
And lets stop with this top 10 LT? Even if it IS true, then he's like the 9th or 10th best LT in the league. (I would rank him anywehere between 9 and 20, depending on form) He's nowhere near the elite tackles in the league.
Quote:So you're saying you don't have anything to indicate Monroe was a top 10 LT?
1 minute Google search:
Quote:Despite those bad numbers, Monroe was one of the NFL's best left tackles. He ranked fifth, allowing five sacks over the course of the season, and his seven QB hits allowed ranked eighth in the league. Pro Football Focus tabbed Monroe as the tenth-best player at his position last season, giving him a +21 grade
<a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.sbnation.com/2013/4/9/4205748/eugene-monroe-no-extension-expectations-jaguars'>http://www.sbnation.com/2013/4/9/4205748/eugene-monroe-no-extension-expectations-jaguars</a>
Quote:He went in 2009.
Garrard completed 60.9 percent of his passes for 3,597 yards, with 15 touchdowns and 10 interceptions in 2009.
Pro bowl numbers?
I thought it was 10, but either way, he was way down the list when he went, and it was a weak year for the AFC.
Quote:I thought it was 10, but either way, he was way down the list when he went, and it was a weak year for the AFC.
Point is the pro bowl is a weak measurement.
Period.
Quote:Point is the pro bowl is a weak measurement.
Period.
I think a better argument would have been someone like Derek Anderson, who got the pro bowl in '07 that should have been Garrards. Garrard getting in the pro bowl isn't a good argument, cause Garrard was a good QB versus someone like Derek Anderson, who was never that good, and had a fluke year.
Quote:I think a better argument would have been someone like Derek Anderson, who got the pro bowl in '07 that should have been Garrards. Garrard getting in the pro bowl isn't a good argument, cause Garrard was a good QB versus someone like Derek Anderson, who was never that good, and had a fluke year.
Look at Garrard's 2009 stats again. Does that scream top 6 QB in the league?
Also to the bolded, what would you call Garrard's 2007 season?
Quote:So you're saying you don't have anything to indicate Monroe was a top 10 LT?
Quote:Basically.
And lets stop with this top 10 LT? Even if it IS true, then he's like the 9th or 10th best LT in the league. (I would rank him anywehere between 9 and 20, depending on form) He's nowhere near the elite tackles in the league.
Typical hyperbole, the minute a players no longer a Jag they where never that good anyways
Numerous times the AP has singled out Monroe as a top tier LT through out his career, numerous times PFF had him in the top 10 LT in the league, heck up until he was traded this same message board included him in the few players we SHOULD build around.
What do you want an official list of top 10 LT approved by the NFL? Well sense that doesn't exist and the consensus has been Monroe was a top 10 LT and your ONLY argument against that is his lack of Pro Bowl selections
.gif "Laughing")
give me a break.
Caldwell made a call to spend the 2nd overall pick to replace a player at a position of strength, fine lets see how it plays out. When he made the selection people only bought it because he sold the line of needing 2 top tier OT to build the roster, now we're asking if it's ok to have an average online! You can't make this stuff up!