Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Quote:Telvin is a leading tackler on this team. He makes more plays than he doesn't. Same with Ramsey. No one can ever say they give up on plays.

They gave up Thursday night. Along with 90% of the team.

Lol, i was calling for Dave to sign a pass rushing DE all offseason and he struck out and all i heard and got bashed saying our pass rush will suffer but most were saying we will be fine with Fowler and Jackson etc.


Now these same people are saying what did you expect from Fowler he's a rookie lol. Typical on this board. Pathetic

Quote:Telvin is a leading tackler on this team. He makes more plays than he doesn't. Same with Ramsey. No one can ever say they give up on plays.

Everyone who watched last week can say they gave up cause they did.


Telvin is also in his 3rd year and I remember a certain board saying he should be benched for Jack because he was overrated at the start of the season. (which he's not to be clear)


Fowler hasn't been great but he deserves more then 7 games before he's a bust.

Quote:Lol, i was calling for Dave to sign a pass rushing DE all offseason and he struck out and all i heard and got bashed saying our pass rush will suffer but most were saying we will be fine with Fowler and Jackson etc.


Now these same people are saying what did you expect from Fowler he's a rookie lol. Typical on this board. Pathetic

Yup it's pathetic that we had reasonable expectations for Fowler.


Very few thought we should go into the season with just Fowler and Yanick.

Quote:Everyone who watched last week can say they gave up cause they did.


Telvin is also in his 3rd year and I remember a certain board saying he should be benched for Jack because he was overrated at the start of the season. (which he's not to be clear)


Fowler hasn't been great but he deserves more then 7 games before he's a bust.

You can go back and look I was one of the people defending Telvin. Saying it was preseason and people were acting stupid. I know Dante is in his first real year. I think it's a cause of concern that he hasn't flashed more.

Why wouldnt we play Fowler at strong side LB in base and either rush him or drop him in coverage? And then move him to LEO in nickel and even kick him inside on obvious passing downs? Isn't that how he excelled at UF?

Quote:Yea, and  a year from now when you are saying Fowler was a bust we will pretend like you didn't make this post.

They did the same with Gus after two years in and you could clearly see he couldn't coach worth a damn. Saying oh the roster is garbage he needs more time and every other excuse in the book. Two years later they're on board saying he can't coach when it was really already determined years before.

Quote:Why wouldnt we play Fowler at strong side LB in base and either rush him or drop him in coverage? And then move him to LEO in nickel and even kick him inside on obvious passing downs? Isn't that how he excelled at UF?

 

That's one of the big points being made is he's not being used right. He was never a sack master at UF but in his final year there he was literally causing disruption nonstop and was never quitting on a play. 

Quote:You can go back and look I was one of the people defending Telvin. Saying it was preseason and people were acting stupid. I know Dante is in his first real year. I think it's a cause of concern that he hasn't flashed more.

I didn't mean to imply you were one of them though I understand the confusion. I was just continuing to make the point that this board and to a lesser extent this fan base flip flop on players far to much.


I'm not saying there shouldn't be concerns but calling him a flat out bust is stupid which many have done on this post.


If next year he's still struggling then yes he's a bust but 7 games is not enough for anyone in there first year much less a player that is dealing with what Fowler is.

Too early to tell

Quote:Why wouldnt we play Fowler at strong side LB in base and either rush him or drop him in coverage? And then move him to LEO in nickel and even kick him inside on obvious passing downs? Isn't that how he excelled at UF?

Because Gus and Wash don't know how to do that, which is why Yanick is starting because using Yanick doesn't take imagination to use

Quote:That's one of the big points being made is he's not being used right. He was never a sack master at UF but in his final year there he was literally causing disruption nonstop and was never quitting on a play.

Yes, exactly. I really wanted Leonard Williams in that draft but I could see what Dave saw in Fowler. He's fast, strong, violent and plays with passion and intensity. He isn't a pure pass rusher though. I thought for sure we would move him around and play him in space and let him make plays, but what the hell do I know? A defensive guru like Gus knows best hahahaha

Quote:So if the other team always has good field position that would mean less yards to get a TD? Wouldn't that mean our 4 rank in yards in an over inflated stat?


We're 27th in scoring last time I check that's what decided wins and losses.

You clearly missed the PER PLAY part of my quote.

Quote:Yes, exactly. I really wanted Leonard Williams in that draft but I could see what Dave saw in Fowler. He's fast, strong, violent and plays with passion and intensity. He isn't a pure pass rusher though. I thought for sure we would move him around and play him in space and let him make plays, but what the hell do I know? A defensive guru like Gus knows best hahahaha

 

That's why I'm not even close to the "he's a bust" mentality like so many others. I will reserve all judgement until we get a new coaching staff because it's basically flaming each other for no reason right now on this message board because we really don't know what we have at this point other than Bortles looks like poop. 

Im way off the gus bus. I got off in week 3, but ugh the mb ppl sometimes...literally have the same patience as a 5 year old... 

Quote:You clearly missed the PER PLAY part of my quote.

Who cares were still 27th in scoring defense avg around 29 points a game.

Alright folks I gotta call it a night wife's giving me looks. I've enjoyed the debate look forward to more in the future. Have a goodnight everyone.

He wasn't the best player at the third spot that year and you should always take the best player when you're in the position that high in the draft. Need drafting sucks.

Quote:They did the same with Gus after two years in and you could clearly see he couldn't coach worth a damn. Saying oh the roster is garbage he needs more time and every other excuse in the book. Two years later they're on board saying he can't coach when it was really already determined years before.

 

It's different. Gus creates the team direction, scheme, and mentality. He has the ability to change if he wants, but never has.

 

Fowler has to play the scheme as his coaches tell him to. He doesn't have the job title to change on the fly and say "hey maybe we should run a different defense and I should be a Leo". Also, this is his first season. Most DL don't make huge impacts their first year, and yet he has already been pretty good at setting the edge against the run. Yannick has been an exception to rookie DL and even he has inconsistent and poor against the run. 

 

If under a different coach/scheme Fowler is horrible in 2 years, them dump him. But you have to wait. Plus it is not like he was overdrafted, you have to take the chance on those athletic gifts. As good as Amare looked, it would have been crazy to draft him after the prior draft stock in Lee/Robinson.

 

Quote:He wasn't the best player at the third spot that year and you should always take the best player when you're in the position that high in the draft. Need drafting sucks.

 
In the NFL, you HAVE to need draft. You only get 7 draft picks of good talent on cheap deals which is important with the cap. Also, if the best player every season at your pick is at the same position, at some point you have you have start to cutting them because of roster size. Plus, trading in the NFL doesn't net much value because teams know they can wait and you will still need to cut the player.
 
The argument is more that they could have drafted L. Williams, also at DL, who have probably been a sure starter instead of Fowler. But that also means instead of paying Malik this spring, they would have given that to O. Vernon who has underwhelmed. 

Quote: Plus it is not like he was overdrafted, you have to take the chance on those athletic gifts. 

You're right, we should have taken the chance on the athletically gifted DE. Unfortunately that would have been the freak Beasley, not the subpar athlete Fowler.