(12-18-2018, 02:57 PM)old_man Wrote: [ -> ] (12-18-2018, 12:52 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Lol just like the last 2 Super Bowls came down to the best running team or best defense?
LOL. Maybe you should try living in reality once in a while.
Eagles 2017
-----------------------
Offense:
Number 3 in Rushing
Number 13 in Passing
Defense:
Number 4 in Yards and Points
New England 2016
-----------------------
Offense:
Number 7 in Rushing (With the GOAT)
Defense:
Number 1 in points allowed per game, number 8 overall
Denver 2015
-----------------------
All Defense
(12-18-2018, 01:22 PM)MoJagFan Wrote: [ -> ]And why we were made fun of for being conservative with our play calling in the AFCCG by the eventual superbowl champs. The rams are loaded to bear on defense and they can't stop everything. The league wants high score basketball on grass. You get a power running game and they want to flag you for holding, blocks in the back and contact personal fouls (aka lowering the head).
Have you watched the Rams offense lately?
They have been horrible.
They started to reel that bogus game in for no holding and blocking down field.
The Football gods are making up for the crap calls all year.
Reality.
878 passing yards combined in the Super Bowl last year.
So.....I guess we can ignore your comment....
"(3 hours ago)Cleatwood Wrote:
Lol just like the last 2 Super Bowls came down to the best running team or best defense?"
It is ok that you cant respond, since the majority of your come backs are something along the line of "Blake is gone get over it"....
Doesn't really apply in this context....
(12-18-2018, 04:16 PM)old_man Wrote: [ -> ]So.....I guess we can ignore your comment....
"(3 hours ago)Cleatwood Wrote:
Lol just like the last 2 Super Bowls came down to the best running team or best defense?"
It is ok that you cant respond, since the majority of your come backs are something along the line of "Blake is gone get over it"....
Doesn't really apply in this context....
You're missing the point he's making about the game itself (superbowl 52).
Not the season team stats. Though that factors in too.
The eagles won the SB last year on 374 passing yards and 4 passing TDs. And despite being ranked highly in the defensive categories you listed, they had to produce at least 34 points and a needed a dynamic passing game to get the win.
Building a team around a run game and defense just won't work anymore
if you don't have a productive passing counterpart. The league wants the pass, they are very proactive about proliferating it, and that isn't going away. If anything it is a trend that is only gathering steam moving forward.
(12-18-2018, 04:36 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (12-18-2018, 04:16 PM)old_man Wrote: [ -> ]So.....I guess we can ignore your comment....
"(3 hours ago)Cleatwood Wrote:
Lol just like the last 2 Super Bowls came down to the best running team or best defense?"
It is ok that you cant respond, since the majority of your come backs are something along the line of "Blake is gone get over it"....
Doesn't really apply in this context....
You're missing the point he's making about the game itself (superbowl 52).
Not the season team stats. Though that factors in too.
The eagles won the SB last year on 374 passing yards and 4 passing TDs. And despite being ranked highly in the defensive categories you listed, they had to produce at least 34 points and a needed a dynamic passing game to get the win.
Building a team around a run game and defense just won't work anymore if you can't have a productive passing counterpart. The league wants the pass, they are very proactive about proliferating it, and that isn't going away. If anything it is a trend that is only gathering steam moving forward.
It's ok. He's old lol
(12-18-2018, 04:16 PM)old_man Wrote: [ -> ]So.....I guess we can ignore your comment....
"(3 hours ago)Cleatwood Wrote:
Lol just like the last 2 Super Bowls came down to the best running team or best defense?"
It is ok that you cant respond, since the majority of your come backs are something along the line of "Blake is gone get over it"....
Doesn't really apply in this context....
I'm not shocked you missed the point.
(12-18-2018, 04:36 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Building a team around a run game and defense just won't work anymore if you don't have a productive passing counterpart. The league wants the pass, they are very proactive about proliferating it, and that isn't going away. If anything it is a trend that is only gathering steam moving forward.
I think the part in bold is where the disconnect is with many fans. A productive passing game doesn't mean a bunch of deep passes down the field or putting up a bunch of points. Being able to make 10-20 yard passes, especially in say a 3rd and 8 situation is important.
Look at many of the best passers in the league. Sure there are deep passes occasionally that happen and put up points, but the vast majority are shorter passes that move the chains. That's what QB's like Aaron Rogers, Tom Brady, etc. do for the most part. Essentially their passing game
is their run game. It's what Payton Manning did his whole career.
I think the key is having an accurate passer and decent-to-good receivers that can run good routes and exploit zone coverages. A good receiving tight end helps with the mis-matches against LB's and safetys. It's not all QB.
I just don't think that either QB on the 53 man roster has that ability and I don't think that the receivers on the roster are good enough to do what needs to be done with the exception of maybe Westbrook and possibly Chark. The addition of Lee next season will give another option. The rest of the receivers are just filling position slots (IMO). As far as tight ends, ASJ was supposed to fill the spot at TE and basically missed the season. I don't think that any of the other TE's can produce the mis-matches required while still being able to block occasionally.
(12-18-2018, 04:36 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (12-18-2018, 04:16 PM)old_man Wrote: [ -> ]So.....I guess we can ignore your comment....
"(3 hours ago)Cleatwood Wrote:
Lol just like the last 2 Super Bowls came down to the best running team or best defense?"
It is ok that you cant respond, since the majority of your come backs are something along the line of "Blake is gone get over it"....
Doesn't really apply in this context....
You're missing the point he's making about the game itself (superbowl 52).
Not the season team stats. Though that factors in too.
The eagles won the SB last year on 374 passing yards and 4 passing TDs. And despite being ranked highly in the defensive categories you listed, they had to produce at least 34 points and a needed a dynamic passing game to get the win.
Building a team around a run game and defense just won't work anymore if you don't have a productive passing counterpart. The league wants the pass, they are very proactive about proliferating it, and that isn't going away. If anything it is a trend that is only gathering steam moving forward.
I wasn't missing the point. They got there on a running game and defense.
You missed the point since it fits the agenda.
(12-18-2018, 04:40 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (12-18-2018, 04:36 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]You're missing the point he's making about the game itself (superbowl 52).
Not the season team stats. Though that factors in too.
The eagles won the SB last year on 374 passing yards and 4 passing TDs. And despite being ranked highly in the defensive categories you listed, they had to produce at least 34 points and a needed a dynamic passing game to get the win.
Building a team around a run game and defense just won't work anymore if you can't have a productive passing counterpart. The league wants the pass, they are very proactive about proliferating it, and that isn't going away. If anything it is a trend that is only gathering steam moving forward.
It's ok. He's old lol
(12-18-2018, 04:16 PM)old_man Wrote: [ -> ]So.....I guess we can ignore your comment....
"(3 hours ago)Cleatwood Wrote:
Lol just like the last 2 Super Bowls came down to the best running team or best defense?"
It is ok that you cant respond, since the majority of your come backs are something along the line of "Blake is gone get over it"....
Doesn't really apply in this context....
I'm not shocked you missed the point.
No the facts do not support your claim....it is ok. you are always right.....Maybe you can apply for a FO job.
(12-18-2018, 11:22 AM)old_man Wrote: [ -> ] (12-18-2018, 11:08 AM)JAGFAN88 Wrote: [ -> ]If we dont address the oline what will it matter.
we will have a rookiee from a terrible QB draft class and a cheap FA who probably is as good or worst then Blake. We will be wasting our championship defense yet again for another year.
I agree with most of your points, except one.
"We will be wasting our championship defense..."
We do not have a championship defense.... championship defenses do not collapse and do not give up MUST stops.
Our defense is statistically good, but when the stops were needed the most, they have had several let downs.
Agreed. The defense cost us a couple of games this year alone when the stakes still mattered. We have a very good defense but it's not champion grade.
(12-18-2018, 07:51 PM)old_man Wrote: [ -> ] (12-18-2018, 04:36 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]You're missing the point he's making about the game itself (superbowl 52).
Not the season team stats. Though that factors in too.
The eagles won the SB last year on 374 passing yards and 4 passing TDs. And despite being ranked highly in the defensive categories you listed, they had to produce at least 34 points and a needed a dynamic passing game to get the win.
Building a team around a run game and defense just won't work anymore if you don't have a productive passing counterpart. The league wants the pass, they are very proactive about proliferating it, and that isn't going away. If anything it is a trend that is only gathering steam moving forward.
I wasn't missing the point. They got there on a running game and defense.
You missed the point since it fits the agenda.
(12-18-2018, 04:40 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]It's ok. He's old lol
I'm not shocked you missed the point.
No the facts do not support your claim....it is ok. you are always right.....Maybe you can apply for a FO job.
Let me know where to apply and I’ll certainly throw my name in the ring. I know for a fact I could have done a better job than Gene Smith. That’s not saying much but still.
(12-18-2018, 09:04 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (12-18-2018, 07:51 PM)old_man Wrote: [ -> ]I wasn't missing the point. They got there on a running game and defense.
You missed the point since it fits the agenda.
No the facts do not support your claim....it is ok. you are always right.....Maybe you can apply for a FO job.
Let me know where to apply and I’ll certainly throw my name in the ring. I know for a fact I could have done a better job than Gene Smith. That’s not saying much but still.
You could have turned up drunk clutching the College Football's Top 300 magazine you just purchased on the way in, crossed off the names as they were being called and pick the top guy upon your turn, and you would have greatly outdone Gene Smith.
(12-18-2018, 07:51 PM)old_man Wrote: [ -> ] (12-18-2018, 04:36 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]You're missing the point he's making about the game itself (superbowl 52).
Not the season team stats. Though that factors in too.
The eagles won the SB last year on 374 passing yards and 4 passing TDs. And despite being ranked highly in the defensive categories you listed, they had to produce at least 34 points and a needed a dynamic passing game to get the win.
Building a team around a run game and defense just won't work anymore if you don't have a productive passing counterpart. The league wants the pass, they are very proactive about proliferating it, and that isn't going away. If anything it is a trend that is only gathering steam moving forward.
I wasn't missing the point. They got there on a running game and defense.
You missed the point since it fits the agenda.
Oh, I see, you aren't missing the point, you're just willfully ignoring it.
(it wasn't about how they got there, it was about what was required to win the damn championship. Hint:It required the pass.)
Bury that head of yours as deep in the sand as you'd like, but the number of teams that go deep in the NFL postseason averaging under 220 yards of passing offense per game is going to be a very, very low number in the coming years.
Missing the point....
How about you changing or missing the narrative.
The comment was:
Cleatwood Wrote:
Lol just like the last 2 Super Bowls came down to the best running team or best defense?"
I responded. Maybe you missed it or ignored it. I don't know.
I never said that you do not need to be capable of passing the ball, but go ahead and continue to disagree and say I have my head in the sand.
To get to the Super Bowl it take a top running game and top defense. When you get to the Super Bowl, you do what it takes to win the game... Last year we showed that we were capable of making the plays needed in the passing game to have a chance....
(12-18-2018, 11:13 AM)Rico Wrote: [ -> ] (12-18-2018, 11:08 AM)JAGFAN88 Wrote: [ -> ]If we dont address the oline what will it matter.
we will have a rookiee from a terrible QB draft class and a cheap FA who probably is as good or worst then Blake. We will be wasting our championship defense yet again for another year.
If you say so. After watching Kessler for a few weeks, I can't think of a worse QB tandem in the league.
Buttfumble and Josh Johns------nevermind.
(12-19-2018, 09:27 AM)old_man Wrote: [ -> ]Missing the point....
How about you changing or missing the narrative.
The comment was:
Cleatwood Wrote:
Lol just like the last 2 Super Bowls came down to the best running team or best defense?"
I responded. Maybe you missed it or ignored it. I don't know.
I never said that you do not need to be capable of passing the ball, but go ahead and continue to disagree and say I have my head in the sand.
To get to the Super Bowl it take a top running game and top defense. When you get to the Super Bowl, you do what it takes to win the game... Last year we showed that we were capable of making the plays needed in the passing game to have a chance....
And you're still missing it. You are the one changing the narrative from
the last two superbowls to
what it takes to get to the superbowl.
Whatever. I have no need to be right or wrong here. I was trying to point out that the eagles don't win that championship without a dynamic passing game and you wanted to talk about their season. The point being made to you was about the
one game. Not the season. You either missed that or ignored it to suit your argument.
I'd love to see the Jags get a scheme in place that features a balanced attack that leans on the run quite a bit. But not too much.
I also know that run game needs to be more diverse with it's formations than what we've been doing and it absolutely must be complimented with a pass game that won't allow defenses to sell out stopping the run and just wait for mistakes from the QB.
Ignoring the league's blatant encouragement of passing offense is almost like tying one hand behind your back. The rule changes and officiating trends should be taken advantage of. You don't have to throw it 40 times a game to make meaningful use of the trend.
The Jags could help themselves tremendously by literally just passing the ball about 7 to 8% more than they did in 2017.
If they are able to upgrade the OC and QB, I think it won't be a point of contention at all. It will just happen.
(12-17-2018, 09:53 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (12-17-2018, 09:51 AM)FBT Wrote: [ -> ]Toss in the OCs and QB coaches too. Bortles is a coach killer. I really wanted to see this guy succeed here, but he managed to undermine that every chance he got.
Get ready for people to come in here and say the coaches killed Blake. It's everyones fault except for Blake.
No doubt. Look, I like Blake. I just think the expectations we had for him were overly optimistic, and he provided us with some fools gold last year late in the season. He's not the worst QB this franchise has ever trotted out there as starter, and in the right environment he could probably be pretty effective. It's a shame it won't happen here because the guy had almost all of the intangibles you want from your QB (as long as you weren't expecting a tight spiral, pinpoint accuracy, and nerves of steel).
(12-17-2018, 09:58 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (12-17-2018, 09:51 AM)FBT Wrote: [ -> ]Toss in the OCs and QB coaches too. Bortles is a coach killer. I really wanted to see this guy succeed here, but he managed to undermine that every chance he got.
I do not dispute the premise about Bortles being a coach killer.
I am concerned, however, about the number of his victims. Three coaches?
Maybe I need coffee, but I count two head coaches (Bradley and possibly Marrone) and maybe three OCs (Fisch, Olsen, Hackett).
Am I missing a head coach?
Sorry, I actually intended to say possibly 2 head coaches there. I should really proofread this stuff before clicking Post Reply. Let's hope he's not here to victimize a third head coach. lol