Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

(08-25-2020, 06:35 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]

(08-25-2020, 05:53 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ]LOL.  So please tell us.  If a suspect is in a physical confrontation on the ground with 2 police officers (as shown in the video) (1) why does he all of the sudden get up? (2) Does he really just "casually" walk by a police officer "casually" holding his firearm? (3) Was he going to his vehicle to retrieve his identification to completely comply with the officers' instructions?

(4) what "tactically" would you do if you and a fellow officer were attempting to detain a subject (on the ground) and he somehow got away from you? (5) Do you KNOW without a doubt that he is unarmed? (6) What if he ignores your instructions and is walking away?  What if he reaches (doesn't appear to be getting into) a vehicle?  What "tactically" should the police officer(s) have done? (7) Both officers had their firearms drawn, why is that?  Was that a bad thing to do "tactically"?

(1) The two officers failed to hold him down. More officers were available and more should have joined.
(2) he's not causal at all.  He's obviously agitated.
(3) no way for them to know at the time, from what we know now.
(4) stand up, run after him, unless I've seen him with a knife.
(5) I just fought him hand to hand, so, most likely, I've either already seen his weapon (if the knife story was true) or I'm pretty sure he has no weapon.

But at this point the perspective shifts.  First questions were from the perspective of the two officers fighting on the ground.  The next questions are from the perspective of the officer who fired the shot.
(6) presumably, I drew my weapon to give cover to the two officers fighting on the ground. I had a decent position, about 15 feet away from the fight. At this point I have two responsibilities. One is to fire my weapon, if I perceive an immediate threat to anyone's life. But the other is to make sure I and only I maintain control of this loaded, unholstered, and unlocked weapon. I can't risk hand to hand combat anymore.  A suspect in his right mind will act the same with a pistol pointed at him from 15 feet away, as he acts when a pistol is up against his skull. Tactically, I gain nothing, and lose everything, if I close distance with him with my weapon still drawn.
(7) this is a tactical error stemming from either a lack of coordination or lack of training, or bad training.  There was no need for a second person to draw a gun. It should have been 3 with fists, tazers, and batons, and one with a gun.  It's very off-putting when we see the man get up and just walk past two officers who are holding weapons. Our instinct is to think that the one who stood his ground was lazy.  But that was the one who had good training, and knows that he cannot close with a weapon drawn. But the other officer thinks he can close with his weapon drawn, and you see what happens.

(08-25-2020, 06:35 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]

(08-25-2020, 05:53 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ]LOL.  So please tell us.  If a suspect is in a physical confrontation on the ground with 2 police officers (as shown in the video) (1) why does he all of the sudden get up? (2) Does he really just "casually" walk by a police officer "casually" holding his firearm? (3) Was he going to his vehicle to retrieve his identification to completely comply with the officers' instructions?

(4) what "tactically" would you do if you and a fellow officer were attempting to detain a subject (on the ground) and he somehow got away from you? (5) Do you KNOW without a doubt that he is unarmed? (6) What if he ignores your instructions and is walking away?  What if he reaches (doesn't appear to be getting into) a vehicle?  What "tactically" should the police officer(s) have done? (7) Both officers had their firearms drawn, why is that?  Was that a bad thing to do "tactically"?

(1) The two officers failed to hold him down. More officers were available and more should have joined.
(2) he's not causal at all.  He's obviously agitated.
(3) no way for them to know at the time, from what we know now.
(4) stand up, run after him, unless I've seen him with a knife.
(5) I just fought him hand to hand, so, most likely, I've either already seen his weapon (if the knife story was true) or I'm pretty sure he has no weapon.

But at this point the perspective shifts.  First questions were from the perspective of the two officers fighting on the ground.  The next questions are from the perspective of the officer who fired the shot.
(6) presumably, I drew my weapon to give cover to the two officers fighting on the ground. I had a decent position, about 15 feet away from the fight. At this point I have two responsibilities. One is to fire my weapon, if I perceive an immediate threat to anyone's life. But the other is to make sure I and only I maintain control of this loaded, unholstered, and unlocked weapon. I can't risk hand to hand combat anymore.  A suspect in his right mind will act the same with a pistol pointed at him from 15 feet away, as he acts when a pistol is up against his skull. Tactically, I gain nothing, and lose everything, if I close distance with him with my weapon still drawn.
(7) this is a tactical error stemming from either a lack of coordination or lack of training, or bad training.  There was no need for a second person to draw a gun. It should have been 3 with fists, tazers, and batons, and one with a gun.  It's very off-putting when we see the man get up and just walk past two officers who are holding weapons. Our instinct is to think that the one who stood his ground was lazy.  But that was the one who had good training, and knows that he cannot close with a weapon drawn. But the other officer thinks he can close with his weapon drawn, and you see what happens.

(08-25-2020, 07:04 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ]

(08-25-2020, 06:35 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ](1) The two officers failed to hold him down. More officers were available and more should have joined.
(2) he's not causal at all.  He's obviously agitated.
(3) no way for them to know at the time, from what we know now.
(4) stand up, run after him, unless I've seen him with a knife.
(5) I just fought him hand to hand, so, most likely, I've either already seen his weapon (if the knife story was true) or I'm pretty sure he has no weapon.

But at this point the perspective shifts.  First questions were from the perspective of the two officers fighting on the ground.  The next questions are from the perspective of the officer who fired the shot.
(6) presumably, I drew my weapon to give cover to the two officers fighting on the ground. I had a decent position, about 15 feet away from the fight. At this point I have two responsibilities. One is to fire my weapon, if I perceive an immediate threat to anyone's life. But the other is to make sure I and only I maintain control of this loaded, unholstered, and unlocked weapon. I can't risk hand to hand combat anymore.  A suspect in his right mind will act the same with a pistol pointed at him from 15 feet away, as he acts when a pistol is up against his skull. Tactically, I gain nothing, and lose everything, if I close distance with him with my weapon still drawn.
(7) this is a tactical error stemming from either a lack of coordination or lack of training, or bad training.  There was no need for a second person to draw a gun. It should have been 3 with fists, tazers, and batons, and one with a gun.  It's very off-putting when we see the man get up and just walk past two officers who are holding weapons. Our instinct is to think that the one who stood his ground was lazy.  But that was the one who had good training, and knows that he cannot close with a weapon drawn. But the other officer thinks he can close with his weapon drawn, and you see what happens.

Mikesez and his "tactical knowledge"... the gift that keeps on giving.  

(08-25-2020, 07:15 PM)MojoKing Wrote: [ -> ]Look I’ll drop that y’all a little racist , as long as you guys acknowledge you’re supporting a racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic president.

(08-25-2020, 07:30 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]

(08-25-2020, 07:15 PM)MojoKing Wrote: [ -> ]Look I’ll drop that y’all a little racist , as long as you guys acknowledge you’re supporting a racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic president.

As long as you admit you support a racist, dementia-ridden pedophile.

But you go ahead and tell Herschel Walker Trump's a racist... he's only personally known the man for 37 years.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2020...ll-vpx.rnc

You won't watch it though... it hurts your narrative that's been spoon-fed to you from the media. Question Everything, man.

(08-25-2020, 09:24 PM)MojoKing Wrote: [ -> ]

(08-25-2020, 07:30 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]As long as you admit you support a racist, dementia-ridden pedophile.

But you go ahead and tell Herschel Walker Trump's a racist... he's only personally known the man for 37 years.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2020...ll-vpx.rnc

You won't watch it though... it hurts your narrative that's been spoon-fed to you from the media. Question Everything, man.

Man you’re a QAnon right? Man we all have loads of evidence of your president being a bigoted racist , grab them by the ... , making fun of the handicapped. Plus, I don’t need to tell you that your president wished Epstein’s disgusting confidant “well” in prison. Oh not to mention the pictures of them together. 

This lie of pedophilia among prominent democrats is disgusting , and shame on you for promoting dangerously false accusations against Biden.

plus I’m an independent, but at least I know the difference between a party ran on fear and a party running on at least a shred of decency. 

(08-25-2020, 09:24 PM)MojoKing Wrote: [ -> ]

(08-25-2020, 07:30 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]As long as you admit you support a racist, dementia-ridden pedophile.

But you go ahead and tell Herschel Walker Trump's a racist... he's only personally known the man for 37 years.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2020...ll-vpx.rnc

You won't watch it though... it hurts your narrative that's been spoon-fed to you from the media. Question Everything, man.

Man you’re a QAnon right? Man we all have loads of evidence of your president being a bigoted racist , grab them by the ... , making fun of the handicapped. Plus, I don’t need to tell you that your president wished Epstein’s disgusting confidant “well” in prison. Oh not to mention the pictures of them together. 

This lie of pedophilia among prominent democrats is disgusting , and shame on you for promoting dangerously false accusations against Biden.

plus I’m an independent, but at least I know the difference between a party ran on fear and a party running on at least a shred

---

(08-25-2020, 07:15 PM)MojoKing Wrote: [ -> ]Look I’ll drop that y’all a little racist , as long as you guys acknowledge you’re supporting a racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic president.

(08-25-2020, 09:24 PM)MojoKing Wrote: [ -> ]

(08-25-2020, 07:30 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]As long as you admit you support a racist, dementia-ridden pedophile.

But you go ahead and tell Herschel Walker Trump's a racist... he's only personally known the man for 37 years.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2020...ll-vpx.rnc

You won't watch it though... it hurts your narrative that's been spoon-fed to you from the media. Question Everything, man.

Man you’re a QAnon right? Man we all have loads of evidence of your president being a bigoted racist , grab them by the ... , making fun of the handicapped. Plus, I don’t need to tell you that your president wished Epstein’s disgusting confident “well” in prison. Oh not to mention the pictures of them together. 

This [BLEEP] of pedophilia is disgusting , and shame on you for promoting dangerously false accusations against Biden.

---

(08-25-2020, 09:24 PM)MojoKing Wrote: [ -> ]Man you’re a QAnon right? Man we all have loads of evidence of your president being a bigoted racist , grab them by the ... , making fun of the handicapped. Plus, I don’t need to tell you that your president wished Epstein’s disgusting confidant “well” in prison. Oh not to mention the pictures of them together. 

This lie of pedophilia among prominent democrats is disgusting , and shame on you for promoting dangerously false accusations against Biden.

plus I’m an independent, but at least I know the difference between a party ran on fear and a party running on at least a shred of decency. 

(08-25-2020, 06:15 PM)MyBloodIsTeal Wrote: [ -> ]

(08-25-2020, 05:16 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]We have video yes, but there's not yet any unified story about why or when a taser was used, or who got the idea he had a knife. cops are known to come up with those kinds of justifications after the fact, even planting weapons or drugs at crime scenes.

There was a warrant for his arrest, but it's not clear if the cops knew about that at the time. Obviously, that fact would not be relevant, if none of the officers knew.

so you're adding tidbits of information that muddy the conversation

Man you will try every angle you can to defend a criminal and put the blame on the cops.  The evidence is right in front of your face but your to jaded to accept it.  You speak of empathy like it belongs only to the person who ended up shot.  As soon as I read sex abuse and domestic violence, he lost any chance at empathy from me.  Do you have empathy for his victims, how about the cop that got a brick to the head during a protest over this crap?  Any empathy for the local business owners whos means of supporting their family is going up in flames? 

You know I read a story one about a father who beat to death a man who was molesting his little daughter.  I would love to hear your opinion on that case.  I'm guessing it would make most of our stomachs churn hearing you defend that criminal.

(08-25-2020, 09:58 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]

(08-25-2020, 09:24 PM)MojoKing Wrote: [ -> ]Man you’re a QAnon right? Man we all have loads of evidence of your president being a bigoted racist , grab them by the ... , making fun of the handicapped. Plus, I don’t need to tell you that your president wished Epstein’s disgusting confident “well” in prison. Oh not to mention the pictures of them together. 

This [BLEEP] of pedophilia is disgusting , and shame on you for promoting dangerously false accusations against Biden.

---

So you're just an idiot.. gotcha.

All you gotta do is look at Biden touch kids and watch them recoil immediately.

And by the way.. its your party that's running on fear.. the fear of the mob. Pathetic and weak.

(08-26-2020, 08:20 AM)StroudCrowd1 Wrote: [ -> ]Love these cowards turning into the basement dwelling, unemployed, detriment to society,  momma's boys they are when someone finally stands up to their anarchy.

It sounds like my 7 year old telling on her sister for not brushing her teeth.

And Democrats want to take away your guns, lol...

Finally, anyone else see the irony in the "defund the police" crowd running to the police? LMAO.