(03-15-2022, 11:45 AM)rufftime Wrote: [ -> ]Way to take care of your own Jacksonville…
As much as I like the new additions, I would really like to build a reputation as a team that keeps their home grown talent.
What you mentioned relates to what I believe is part of the reason why D.J. Chark agreed to a contract with the Lions. As of a few minutes ago, Chark is the only FA from another team in 2021 who agreed to a contract with the Lions in the last few days.
The Lions have re-signed many UFAs and RFAs in the last few weeks. At least 3 of the 4 RFAs are players (C Evan Brown, FB Jason Cabinda, and LB Josh Woods ) likely had enough leverage to test the open market and likely get at least comparable contracts to what they received from the Lions. These were cases in which new contracts made more sense than Tendering them.
Last week, the Lions re-signed WR Josh Reynolds to a 2 year contract. Reynolds was a huge key in the Lions winning 3 games in December and January, combined. The addition of Reynolds as a waiver claim last November contributed greatly to the vast improvement of Jared Goff, compared to the first half of the season. In the last two days, S Tracy Walker ( 3 years) and DE/ OLB Charles Harris ( 2 years ) re-signed with the Lions. Dan Campbell, DC Aaron Glenn, and position coaches played huge roles in the improvement of these players and them wanting to remain with the Lions.
Even though beating Green Bay in the season finale became the difference in the Jaguars being ahead of the Lions in the 2022 Draft, I was thrilled with the win over the Packers. In part because I saw how hard players were battling. The dividends of many players with expiring contracts wanting to remain with Lions and D.J. Chark seeing the Lions as a good opportunity to get in position for a long term lucrative contract, is a reflection of the culture that Dan Campbell has emphasized.
If Doug Pederson succeeds in 2022 in winning over the Jaguars Locker Room, I think the Jaguars and many players with expiring contracts in next winter will want to continue their relationships.
So Kirk is completely unable to runs routes from X or Z? Nothing like binary catastrophic thinking.
(03-15-2022, 02:28 PM)Kane Wrote: [ -> ]Couple thoughts. First one of two things is true, Chark didn't want to be here or we had no intention of re-signing him. I think it's the latter. Based on the contract he signed and where he signed I'm wondering how many franchises did want him.
I mean if multiple offers are out there are you really going to pick Detroit and Goff over just about anywhere else? I liked Chark. Wanted to keep him and believe he has the talent to be a #1 guy. That being said he's gone and I'm not gonna cry about it, especially if we draft a very good WR and have a room of Jones Jr, Kirk, Tay, Viska (still a weapon imo) and the rookie.
There's no question that Trevor Lawrence has much more physical ability than Jared Goff. Yet, for D.J. Chark, who is looking to have a prove it season in order to get a lucrative long term contract, it's very realistically possible that he wanted to play with a veteran starting QB ( who improved greatly once a greater vertical presence --Josh Reynolds-- was added). As accomplished as Doug Pederson is with QBs, Chark easily could have been concerned about the learning curve for Lawrence and the Jaguars overall Offense.
While the Jaguars are looking to build a long term program with Lawrence as the foundation, Chark is at the point of his career in which he's entering his greatest financial earnings potential as a player. The timeline for the Jaguars / Lawrence is different than what it is for Chark.
(03-16-2022, 12:25 PM)I am Yoda Wrote: [ -> ]So Kirk is completely unable to runs routes from X or Z? Nothing like binary catastrophic thinking.
One need not look further than the pats in 2015-2017 at how a team can get production from 3 receivers - none of which are a true X.
A little creativity and a smart QB is all that's required.
Slot guys can run routes from the Z spot with two TEs on the field, you either suit the route to the player, or use your Y turned Z receiver to clear out an area and get a TE or RB there.
(03-16-2022, 06:43 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]DJ may end up being a good fit up there in Detroit. That's a tough division to play in though. Traveling around up there during the winter months can be taxing physically between Chicago and Green Bay. Hopefully he holds up physically. It's just a one year deal so he may just be looking to dip his toes in 2022 to potentially deepen his pockets in 2023 as a viable deep threat on a potentially up and coming Lions team.
Maybe he just didn't want to be here anymore as well. Until anything is reported we really have no idea what was being said or conducted behind the scenes. I would have personally rather seen that contract that was placed on Zay Jones placed on DJ instead though. I think this now puts Baalke and Pederson in a position to where they have to invest a draft pick in a receiver like Christian Watson or Alec Pierce. Need that receiver with some length to him who can go up and get it on the outside for sure.
While I do believe there's still a good chance the Lions are going to draft a WR with one of the 5 picks the team has in the first 3 Round of the draft, the urgency has lessened because of the FA addition of D.J. Chark and re-signing of Josh Reynolds last week.
There have been rumors that the Lions are very high on WR Christian Watson. The Lions have picks # 32 and # 34. It's realistically possible that the addition of Chark (even factoring in a 1 year contract) could be the difference in the Jaguars being able to draft Watson with pick # 33.
(03-16-2022, 12:25 PM)I am Yoda Wrote: [ -> ]So Kirk is completely unable to runs routes from X or Z? Nothing like binary catastrophic thinking.
Lol, that upper guy will have you thinking this is the case.
Here's the deal...
If a slot guy has the physical stature and the mentality, they can play outside. Kirk is a solid 200 lbs (bigger than Chark) and just as tall as O'Dell and Antonio Brown.
It's harder for a outside guy to play inside, than a inside guy play outside. In a 2 receiver set...one of them is slot any way.
That upper guy just doing to much with the pocket watching and declaring to Kirk what he can't do. And he's probably going run grab some chart saying "seeeee look what the analytics sayyyy" lol.
(03-16-2022, 12:25 PM)I am Yoda Wrote: [ -> ]So Kirk is completely unable to runs routes from X or Z? Nothing like binary catastrophic thinking.
Last year was the first year he ran more slot routes than outside routes. We have a large sample of Kirk's outside capabilities. He had a very poor 11 routes run per reception and 1.11 yards per route run from the outside, and a very good 5.6 routes per reception and 1.8 yards per route run from the slot.
So no, he is not incapable...he is just very bad.
This is why Kirk can't play outside. He is just completely outmatched physically by NFL cornerbacks.
![[Image: FN7y8B4XEAESen6?format=jpg&name=medium]](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FN7y8B4XEAESen6?format=jpg&name=medium)
(03-16-2022, 01:12 PM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ] (03-16-2022, 12:25 PM)I am Yoda Wrote: [ -> ]So Kirk is completely unable to runs routes from X or Z? Nothing like binary catastrophic thinking.
Last year was the first year he ran more slot routes than outside routes. We have a large sample of Kirk's outside capabilities. He had a very poor 11 routes run per reception and 1.11 yards per route run from the outside, and a very good 5.6 routes per reception and 1.8 yards per route run from the slot.
So no, he is not incapable...he is just very bad.
This is why Kirk can't play outside. He is just completely outmatched physically by NFL cornerbacks.
This chart tells me he's just fine. He's stronger, a lil faster, and has great hand size for catching.
(03-16-2022, 01:12 PM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ] (03-16-2022, 12:25 PM)I am Yoda Wrote: [ -> ]So Kirk is completely unable to runs routes from X or Z? Nothing like binary catastrophic thinking.
Last year was the first year he ran more slot routes than outside routes. We have a large sample of Kirk's outside capabilities. He had a very poor 11 routes run per reception and 1.11 yards per route run from the outside, and a very good 5.6 routes per reception and 1.8 yards per route run from the slot.
So no, he is not incapable...he is just very bad.
This is why Kirk can't play outside. He is just completely outmatched physically by NFL cornerbacks.
Not the freaking spider charts again.
This just proves how little your understanding of football actually is.
(03-16-2022, 04:35 PM)Predator Wrote: [ -> ]Not the freaking spider charts again.
This just proves how little your understanding of football actually is.
Stop telling on yourself.
(03-16-2022, 04:41 PM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ] (03-16-2022, 04:35 PM)Predator Wrote: [ -> ]Not the freaking spider charts again.
This just proves how little your understanding of football actually is.
Stop telling on yourself.
That's a really good comeback from the guy who made such a fool out of himself by having to rely on spider charts for all his football discussions that he had to change his username so people wouldn't just laugh at him when he tried to act knowledgeable.
(03-16-2022, 01:12 PM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ] (03-16-2022, 12:25 PM)I am Yoda Wrote: [ -> ]So Kirk is completely unable to runs routes from X or Z? Nothing like binary catastrophic thinking.
Last year was the first year he ran more slot routes than outside routes. We have a large sample of Kirk's outside capabilities. He had a very poor 11 routes run per reception and 1.11 yards per route run from the outside, and a very good 5.6 routes per reception and 1.8 yards per route run from the slot.
So no, he is not incapable...he is just very bad.
This is why Kirk can't play outside. He is just completely outmatched physically by NFL cornerbacks.
What's funny is you and Cleatwood were talking Kirk before we signed him and you said you think that he is more than just a slot guy. No we signed him and he can't be more than a slot guy lol
Move this thread to where it belongs. Chark is No Longer A Jaguar.
NH3...
(03-16-2022, 05:08 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]What's funny is you and Cleatwood were talking Kirk before we signed him and you said you think that he is more than just a slot guy. No we signed him and he can't be more than a slot guy lol
I said he had a lot of experience playing outside, then I saw the stats about how bad he was outside vs how good he is in the slot and it made sense why the Cardinals shifted him to primarily slot.
(03-16-2022, 01:12 PM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ] (03-16-2022, 12:25 PM)I am Yoda Wrote: [ -> ]So Kirk is completely unable to runs routes from X or Z? Nothing like binary catastrophic thinking.
Last year was the first year he ran more slot routes than outside routes. We have a large sample of Kirk's outside capabilities. He had a very poor 11 routes run per reception and 1.11 yards per route run from the outside, and a very good 5.6 routes per reception and 1.8 yards per route run from the slot.
So no, he is not incapable...he is just very bad.
This is why Kirk can't play outside. He is just completely outmatched physically by NFL cornerbacks.
Just when I was trying to think positive.
(03-16-2022, 05:05 PM)Predator Wrote: [ -> ]That's a really good comeback from the guy who made such a fool out of himself by having to rely on spider charts for all his football discussions that he had to change his username so people wouldn't just laugh at him when he tried to act knowledgeable.
I changed my name because the site had that email bug where I couldn't log in anymore. The entire football community loves spider charts because they show size and athletic capabilities in one tidy snapshot. It's just pure data it's not good or bad. It's the exact same thing as what mathbomb does now but in a different visual format, and pretty everyone loves mathbomb too.
Certain smooth brained people around here didn't like them because people would say idiotic stuff like Fowler was a freak athlete because he ran a fast 40 and then people who knew better would laugh and say no he's actually extremely unathletic in the drills that mattered. That rubbed those people the wrong way and they decided to hate the lifeless, raw tool instead of confront their own misconceptions and biases.
(03-16-2022, 05:50 PM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ] (03-16-2022, 05:05 PM)Predator Wrote: [ -> ]That's a really good comeback from the guy who made such a fool out of himself by having to rely on spider charts for all his football discussions that he had to change his username so people wouldn't just laugh at him when he tried to act knowledgeable.
I changed my name because the site had that email bug where I couldn't log in anymore. The entire football community loves spider charts because they show size and athletic capabilities in one tidy snapshot. It's just pure data it's not good or bad. It's the exact same thing as what mathbomb does now but in a different visual format, and pretty everyone loves mathbomb too.
Certain smooth brained people around here didn't like them because people would say idiotic stuff like Fowler was a freak athlete because he ran a fast 40 and then people who knew better would laugh and say no he's actually extremely unathletic in the drills that mattered. That rubbed those people the wrong way and they decided to hate the lifeless, raw tool instead of confront their own misconceptions and biases.
All those prospects with great Spyder charts that turned out to be total busts is why many of us "smooth-brained" ppl still watch football players play football in addition to digesting stats and analytics to form our opinions.
Despite your narrow perspective on what "pretty much everyone in the football community" loves or doesn't love.
You rely on statistical data more than most around here and by now should be accustomed to the aversion to that approach.
Also - Choosing a gatur player as an example is not going to show much objectivity given the rampant bias to that college program in this fanbase. Of course many illogically defended him.
(03-16-2022, 08:10 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]All those prospects with great Spyder charts that turned out to be total busts is why many of us "smooth-brained" ppl still watch football players play football in addition to digesting stats and analytics to form our opinions.
Despite your narrow perspective on what "pretty much everyone in the football community" loves or doesn't love.
You rely on statistical data more than most around here and by now should be accustomed to the aversion to that approach.
Also - Choosing a gatur player as an example is not going to show much objectivity given the rampant bias to that college program in this fanbase. Of course many illogically defended him.
1. Being a great athlete does not guarantee you will be a great player, but there are very few great players who are not great athletes. Good time to bring up that old 3 sigma quote.
2. You should have seen the excitement among the draft community last night when the charts were posted. I saw hundreds of people posting them with excitment showing how good or worriesome X guy was. I didn't see a single person stigmatizing them like so many do here. Probably because there is nothing to stigmatize it's just pure data in a nifty visual, as I said. This is the only place where you will see people tying their emotions to them.
3. I chose Fowler because he was the example that was the main litmus test for the charts on here, because he was a great example of how novices think 40 time for an EDGE means they are freak athletes when that's obviously not the case and also because he was the main name that we all knew the Jags were targeting.
(03-16-2022, 09:35 PM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ] (03-16-2022, 08:10 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]All those prospects with great Spyder charts that turned out to be total busts is why many of us "smooth-brained" ppl still watch football players play football in addition to digesting stats and analytics to form our opinions.
Despite your narrow perspective on what "pretty much everyone in the football community" loves or doesn't love.
You rely on statistical data more than most around here and by now should be accustomed to the aversion to that approach.
Also - Choosing a gatur player as an example is not going to show much objectivity given the rampant bias to that college program in this fanbase. Of course many illogically defended him.
1. Being a great athlete does not guarantee you will be a great player, but there are very few great players who are not great athletes. Good time to bring up that old 3 sigma quote.
2. You should have seen the excitement among the draft community last night when the charts were posted. I saw hundreds of people posting them with excitment showing how good or worriesome X guy was. I didn't see a single person stigmatizing them like so many do here. Probably because there is nothing to stigmatize it's just pure data in a nifty visual, as I said. This is the only place where you will see people tying their emotions to them.
3. I chose Fowler because he was the example that was the main litmus test for the charts on here, because he was a great example of how novices think 40 time for an EDGE means they are freak athletes when that's obviously not the case and also because he was the main name that we all knew the Jags were targeting.
1. no [BLEEP] - irrelevant to my point
2. ppl not weighing stat data the same way you do is not "stigmatizing"
And "tying emotions" to Spyder charts??? Really? You're reaching.
3. the bias for UF players here still skews your outcome regardless
(03-16-2022, 05:13 PM)NH3 Wrote: [ -> ]Move this thread to where it belongs. Chark is No Longer A Jaguar.
NH3...
You're not my supervisor!
