Quote:I can't see it any other way. Dude has his hands in the air, three shots were fired, apparently, and he was laying on his back.
are you saying that there isn't some bias that came into play based on the poor guy being black?
Do you know for certain that 3 shots were fired? Just because that's what CNN reported doesn't make it so. I tend to believe the local report from the Miami news station more. I happen to think that it had nothing to do with race. It was probably a cop that was too jumpy and nervous given the recent attacks on law enforcement. He had his finger on the trigger when he shouldn't have.
However, I do understand that your ilk has to jump to conclusions and immediately call it a racial incident. Based on what we know there is nothing that indicates or proves that it was a racial incident.
Quote:I don't know what happened. That's why I'm confused. I've seen nothing clear cut that says he pulled the trigger three times. All I've seen is that he was holding a rifle (many police rifles are full automatic), three shots were fired and a man was hit in the leg. There's no video showing him aiming the rifle or intentionally pulling the trigger. There are legitimate hard questions to be answered, and those answers will lead to more questions that may eventually indicate that this was a blatant abuse of power/attempted murder by a pig in a blue shirt, but it's just so weird and so little is known at this point that I'm genuinely confused. I'm really feeling like this was a completely preventable accident on the part of a miserable excuse for a cop.
Wait a second... TJ is actually thinking and waiting for the actual facts to come out? There might be hope for you yet. :thumbsup:
By the way, many police rifles are not full automatic. In fact, very few are used and only used by members of their special units (SWAT).
Alright so my opinion is the cop was trigger happy. He should be terminated, and charged with either attempted murder, or felony assault with a deadly weapon.
The victim should also sue the Miami PD for 10 million for medical losses plus pain and suffering.
Quote:Using a rifle isn't baffling at all. They're far more accurate to work with in situations where you have a standoff.
Amazing he couldn't use rubber bullets though.
Quote:Didn't you just say a day or two earlier, police officers have a tendency to be more alert or have higher precautions when dealing with black subjects?
In some cases yes. In this case I tend to believe that the cops that responded were probably on edge and unsure about the situation. It's different when you're dealing with someone dressed "normally" vs. someone with their pants sagging and their drawers showing.
You and TAM can try as much as you want to turn this issue into a race thing. The fact of the matter is that what we know right now doesn't seem to indicate that's the case.
Is the race of the cop known?
Wow I just read about this. That cop needs to be fired and prob sent to jail who shot that guy. That was totally inappropriate. Way to make a bad situation in America worse jerk.
Quote:Is the race of the cop known?
Since its not mentioned and he is in Miami, I would guess hispanic. But it doesnt matter at all. What he did was not excusable and he needs to be relieved of duty.
Quote:In some cases yes. In this case I tend to believe that the cops that responded were probably on edge and unsure about the situation. It's different when you're dealing with someone dressed "normally" vs. someone with their pants sagging and their drawers showing.
You and TAM can try as much as you want to turn this issue into a race thing. The fact of the matter is that what we know right now doesn't seem to indicate that's the case.
Your response is very hypocritical.
If you hate reality then you can continue to be naive.
If the person was another race he wouldn't have been shot.
Go look at the various videos on YouTube comparing how police handle minorities vs non minorities during standoffs.
Quote:Alright so my opinion is the cop was trigger happy. He should be terminated, and charged with either attempted murder, or felony assault with a deadly weapon.
The victim should also sue the Miami PD for 10 million for medical losses plus pain and suffering.
You can't charge him with attempted murder because you would have to prove intent. I don't think that he intended to discharge his weapon. Felony assault with a deadly weapon would also be hard to prosecute because again, you have to prove intent.
You can't just make a knee jerk reaction and conclusion without knowing all of the facts.
By the way, the article did say that the victim's attorney is already negotiating a settlement with the City of Miami regarding the incident. To me that points more towards this being an unfortunate accident.
However, you do have the likes of TAM that have to automatically assume that it's racially motivated... even though we don't even know the race of the cop that pulled the trigger.
Quote:Your response is very hypocritical.
If you hate reality then you can continue to be naive.
If the person was another race he wouldn't have been shot.
Go look at the various videos on YouTube comparing how police handle minorities vs non minorities during standoffs.
Whatever. I don't see how I'm being hypocritical at all.
Once again, people are trying to make this incident about race. There is nothing to indicate or prove that it's a fact.
Quote:You can't charge him with attempted murder because you would have to prove intent. I don't think that he intended to discharge his weapon. Felony assault with a deadly weapon would also be hard to prosecute because again, you have to prove intent.
You can't just make a knee jerk reaction and conclusion without knowing all of the facts.
By the way, the article did say that the victim's attorney is already negotiating a settlement with the City of Miami regarding the incident. To me that points more towards this being an unfortunate accident.
However, you do have the likes of TAM that have to automatically assume that it's racially motivated... even though we don't even know the race of the cop that pulled the trigger.
The intent was the officer disregarded the victim when he clearly identified himself and had his hands raised in the air. I know you don't agree with him facing criminal charges because shooting someone 3 times is a "accident". But he needs to be held accountable besides being terminated.!
I know it's hard for you to believe some cops are unfit for their jobs, so I understand you not going to have a reasonable response.
Quote:Whatever. I don't see how I'm being hypocritical at all.
Once again, people are trying to make this incident about race. There is nothing to indicate or prove that it's a fact.
Wow I'm actually speechless at you being serious regarding what issues you cherry pick that involves race.
Quote:The intent was the officer disregarded the victim when he clearly identified himself and had his hands raised in the air. I know you don't agree with him facing criminal charges because shooting someone 3 times is a "accident". But he needs to be held accountable besides being terminated.!
I know it's hard for you to believe some cops are unfit for their jobs, so I understand you not going to have a reasonable response.
You're wrong again. The officer did not shoot the victim 3 times.
I never said that the officer was not unfit for the job. In fact, I pointed out that he screwed up. However, based on what we know, and it's certainly not the whole story the officer should and probably will be fired.
Based on what we know, there is no evidence of criminal intent.
Quote:You're wrong again. The officer did not shoot the victim 3 times.
I never said that the officer was not unfit for the job. In fact, I pointed out that he screwed up. However, based on what we know, and it's certainly not the whole story the officer should and probably will be fired.
Based on what we know, there is no evidence of criminal intent.
Kinsey was hit in his right leg after two or three shots were fired, according to his attorney.
<a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.cnn.com/2016/07/21/us/miami-officer-involved-shooting/index.html'>http://www.cnn.com/2016/07/21/us/miami-officer-involved-shooting/index.html</a>
He was shot at multiple times is my point.
You arguing semantics appear you are trying to justify the officers actions in the slightest bit.
Quote:Kinsey was hit in his right leg after two or three shots were fired, according to his attorney.
<a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.cnn.com/2016/07/21/us/miami-officer-involved-shooting/index.html'>http://www.cnn.com/2016/07/21/us/miami-officer-involved-shooting/index.html</a>
He was shot at multiple times is my point.
You arguing semantics appear you are trying to justify the officers actions in the slightest bit.
So because CNN reports that "two or three shots" were fired it must be true right?
Let me ask you this. Have you ever fired a rifle? Someone who is trained to fire a rifle is usually pretty proficient, especially at short distances. If the supposed "3 shots were fired" according to CNN and only one shot hit his leg which in the victim's own words "felt like a mosquito bite" doesn't that raise a flag?
Based on what we know right now is it not out of the question that it was only one shot because an officer was jumpy?
I'll tell you right now that a police officer shooting at someone does not intend to shoot them in the leg. The way that I was taught was 3 shots... two to the chest and one to the head. A police officer shoots to "stop the action" not to injure or disable.
A police officer with a rifle in close range isn't going to miss, and isn't going to be off target so much that it hit's the target in the leg. There was clearly no intent.
The problem is that people like you and others are so quick to jump on the racism bandwagon and run with it without knowing the facts.
I still stand by my theory based on what we know right now that it was a jumpy police officer that shouldn't have had his finger on the trigger. I don't think that it was intentional or malicious at all.
Could said cop be charged under gross negligence?
Quote:Could said cop be charged under gross negligence?
That's probably what he will be fired for if it turns out that this was the case (likely). However, it's not a crime.
Quote:That's probably what he will be fired for if it turns out that this was the case (likely). However, it's not a crime.
Can gross negligence be moved into manslaughter with certain cases or is it just clean up and cut you can't be charged with gross negligence?
Quote:Can gross negligence be moved into manslaughter with certain cases or is it just clean up and cut you can't be charged with gross negligence?
You would have to prove "gross negligence". In this case, from what is known I'll speculate. I'm guessing that the officer didn't mean to fire his weapon and didn't have the intent to injure and/or kill the subject in the matter. The way that it looks to me, based on what we know it appears to be an accidental shooting.
The victim of the shooting didn't die, so there is no manslaughter case there at all. If there were any charges brought up in the case, the most that I can come up with is simple assault which is a misdemeanor. A case could be made for felony assault, but again
intent has to be proven.
It's not the media in this case making this story more than what it is, it's social media.