Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

2 for 10 on 3rd down conversions. That's sloppy right there.

Time to bounce back after the week 1 jitters.

(09-10-2024, 11:02 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-10-2024, 10:48 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Lageman just said on the radio what most don't want to hear. If we're going to point fingers for this loss you need to use all four of them and the thumb because everyone had a part in that defeat.

Pretty sure most people on here having been doing that. Again, it's common sense. So far it's been a lot of critical call out's on the following:

1. Not enough pass attempts from Lawrence.
2. Inconsistent offensive line play. 
3. Third down conversions being dropped from three key players on offense. 
4. Etienne's fumble. 
5. Pederson's gambling habit. 
6. Mystery Man play caller trying to force the running game that worked in the 1st half that clearly didn't work in Q4. 
7. Baalke.
8. Khan.
9. Other.
10. Blank.
11. Corn. 
12. The cop for not detaining Hill longer on Sunday. 
13. Lawrence holding onto the football too long on one play that resulted in a sack. 
14. Antonio Johnson whiffing on tackles. 
15. Nielsen's mustache not shielding the secondary from Hill's 80 yard TD play. 
16. Sasquatch. 
17. Loch Ness.
18. Calvin Ridley.
19. Steak-knife.
20. Card shark.
21. Con job.
22. Boot cut.
23. Dog town.
24. Blood bath.
25. Rib cage.
26. Soft tail.
27. Standing in line to see the show tonight and there's a light on, heavy glow, by the way I tried to say I'd be there, waiting for...

It's football, there will always be multiple reasons why a team loses a game.  Like you said, that's common sense.

(09-10-2024, 11:42 AM)TheSkipWillis Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-10-2024, 11:26 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]This is what I'm saying. I feel like all last year, on this board, we talked about the lack of execution. It's only week 1 but I'm seeing it again.

I struggle with understanding how a team could look so dominate the first half of the game (they did have a few mistakes) but turn around and the offense look worse than the Panthers in the 3rd/4th quarter. 


Everyone is pointing at the play calling because thats the biggest noticeable difference between the two halves. It's a resemblance of how the whole season went last year. Good in the first half, garbage in the second. Add in some goofy questionable calls like when we went for it on 4th. I think everyone making a big deal about the play calling is warranted because it looked the same last year as we crumbled.

It's 50/50 for me with both the players and the coaching. And, for the most part, that's going to be the tune 9 times out of 10.

I think being 2/10 on 3rd down is a problem. However, that's a two way problem that needs to be resolved by both parties. Kirk cannot drop two passes that were in his hands, especially when he was uncontested. One of them was a little harder than the other to track and catch, but, that early one? That was an easy one. 

Engram absolutely cannot drop his pass in a one-on-one situation isolated with a DB out there when split out wide. He's supposed to be able to out muscle the defender in those exact situations. When it comes to the coaching staff, again, look, the first 42:00 minutes of offense was good, we were running the football well, the lanes were opening up, things were relatively humming along.

Again, ETN's fumble really changed the momentum. I get that. We've beat that topic into the ground since Sunday. What bothered me, was, the 4th quarter conservativism. They kept trying to run it, and they kept failing. ETN went 2 for 9 and Bigsby went 3 for 5. At some point, on one of those last four possessions, the direction needed to change. Somebody needed to admit defeat and change the direction in which the offense was going to get after this defense. 

They didn't. So, coulda, woulda, shoulda. But, they didn't.

11 plays after the fumble. With 11 plays from the mid third on it was absolutely gonna look ugly. We did a lot well for 2.5 quarters. Miami did a lot well for 1.5 quarters. Ultimately their 1 big play out did our lack of explosive plays. They then kept the ball away from us most of the fourth quarter.

Hat tip is warranted. Two good football teams playing a good football game.

(09-10-2024, 01:14 PM)HardcoreMoJagFan Wrote: [ -> ]11 plays after the fumble.  With 11 plays from the mid third on it was absolutely gonna look ugly.  We did a lot well for 2.5 quarters.  Miami did a lot well for 1.5 quarters.  Ultimately their 1 big play out did our lack of explosive plays.  They then kept the ball away from us most of the fourth quarter. 

Hat tip is warranted.  Two good football teams playing a good football game.

Meh. Feels like the team [BLEEP] the bed after a fumble and two offensive masterminds got out coached in crunch time by a rookie DC. No mercy from me. LOL. I am sorry, and, then again, I am not sorry. Not at all. They had this [BLEEP] game in the bag. They had it!

I know man. Emotions are tough. We feel how we feel.

(09-10-2024, 11:42 AM)TheSkipWillis Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-10-2024, 11:26 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]This is what I'm saying. I feel like all last year, on this board, we talked about the lack of execution. It's only week 1 but I'm seeing it again.

I struggle with understanding how a team could look so dominate the first half of the game (they did have a few mistakes) but turn around and the offense look worse than the Panthers in the 3rd/4th quarter. 


Everyone is pointing at the play calling because thats the biggest noticeable difference between the two halves. It's a resemblance of how the whole season went last year. Good in the first half, garbage in the second. Add in some goofy questionable calls like when we went for it on 4th. I think everyone making a big deal about the play calling is warranted because it looked the same last year as we crumbled.

Halftime adjustments by the Dolphins D would be my first guess. They're a pretty talented team with good coaching, coming back in the 2nd half and not making any adjustments (or at least a secondary plan) and moving forward with the exact same scheme/plays isn't good enough against good coaching.

Should we have made halftime adjustments? We were up 17-7. Seems like we were doing what we wanted. To adjust then would have been silly I think.

(09-10-2024, 01:27 PM)HardcoreMoJagFan Wrote: [ -> ]Should we have made halftime adjustments?  We were up 17-7.  Seems like we were doing what we wanted.  To adjust then would have been silly I think.

They were doing what they wanted up until near the end of Q3. Right up until the fumble really. They were finding chunk play after chunk play and they were humming along to a potential 24 - 7 lead with a lot of pressure on Miami to score three times in Q4 to win the game. 

The adjustments really needed to happen after that fumble. When they got one of their final three possessions on offense, it was at the 2:08 mark in Q3. Where they went four and out and then the defense bailed Doug out for gambling there and he then got further lucky when Sanders missed his FG. 

That's what should bother people, on that last series of events. So, you have ETN fumble the football, alright? The Dolphins immediately responded by chucking it for 80 yards and scoring within 11 seconds. When they got the football back, they decided to run it four straight times in a row, which led to that turnover on downs and missed FG attempt. 

RIGHT THERE. That was your chance. RIGHT THERE. You got the football back at your 32 yard line. What did they do? They continued to [BLEEP] the bed. They had 1 pass attempt, 3 rushing attempts and then 2 penalties with 4 total plays. That's really where they lost the game. They also punted it there. 

To walk out of that game with no points in that second half really bothers me. And it should really bother everybody. Again, Miami has a rookie DC, that's his first game. When you look at their starting line-up, there's really nobody out there that jumps off the page and scares you. They had a hobbled Ramsey (Who got toasted by the way, twice, and we should have kept exploiting that), they have Campbell, Sieler, Long, Ogbah, Phillips, Brooks, Fuller, Kohou, Holland and Poyer. 

It's mostly an over-the-hill in age defense. There was no reason why our coaching staff and offensive personnel shouldn't have been able to regain it's composure and regain control of the football game. None. At all.

(09-10-2024, 01:21 PM)cland Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-10-2024, 11:42 AM)TheSkipWillis Wrote: [ -> ]I struggle with understanding how a team could look so dominate the first half of the game (they did have a few mistakes) but turn around and the offense look worse than the Panthers in the 3rd/4th quarter. 


Everyone is pointing at the play calling because thats the biggest noticeable difference between the two halves. It's a resemblance of how the whole season went last year. Good in the first half, garbage in the second. Add in some goofy questionable calls like when we went for it on 4th. I think everyone making a big deal about the play calling is warranted because it looked the same last year as we crumbled.

Halftime adjustments by the Dolphins D would be my first guess. They're a pretty talented team with good coaching, coming back in the 2nd half and not making any adjustments (or at least a secondary plan) and moving forward with the exact same scheme/plays isn't good enough against good coaching.

Looking over the play list this grousing about play calls seems even more foolish to me.

After Hill scored the Jags went 4 n Out: Bigsby for 3, ETN for 7, failed to convert 3rd and 1. End of quarter. ETN fails to convert 4 and 1. (valid complaint here to not punt, but damn, gain the yard). 

Next possession: Penalty on the fish. Etn for 11, Bigsby for for 4, Bigsby for 1, Kirk drops 3rd and 5. Punt. (drive killer)

Last possession: Bigsby no gain, Sack, Sack, Punt 

They were in fact sill moving the ball on the ground after the fumble but they simply didn't convert the critical plays.

**the above comments answer your question better, but here's what I was writing.

Yes or at least have that built into your offensive scheme beforehand. This is hypothetical and an extremely simplified case, but imagine your running through your C gap on the right side with amazing success in the first half. To not expect the opposing teams defense to adjust, whether that is defensive line adjustment or a LBer lining up for that particular gap, you have to have an alternate playcall. Continuing to run through that C gap with no change will certainly result in less success.

Agreed. Maybe not throwing on the first drive after is interesting but it was 3rd and 1 and 4th and 1.

Dropped pass on third down on the second.

Two of three plays were passes on the last drive.

11 plays. That's the problem. Dropped pass and sacks.

(09-10-2024, 02:00 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-10-2024, 01:21 PM)cland Wrote: [ -> ]Halftime adjustments by the Dolphins D would be my first guess. They're a pretty talented team with good coaching, coming back in the 2nd half and not making any adjustments (or at least a secondary plan) and moving forward with the exact same scheme/plays isn't good enough against good coaching.

Looking over the play list this grousing about play calls seems even more foolish to me.

After Hill scored the Jags went 4 n Out: Bigsby for 3, ETN for 7, failed to convert 3rd and 1. End of quarter. ETN fails to convert 4 and 1. (valid complaint here to not punt, but damn, gain the yard). 

Next possession: Penalty on the fish. Etn for 11, Bigsby for for 4, Bigsby for 1, Kirk drops 3rd and 5. Punt. (drive killer)

Last possession: Bigsby no gain, Sack, Sack, Punt 

They were in fact sill moving the ball on the ground after the fumble but they simply didn't convert the critical plays.

In regards to the running game. The splits on Pro Football Reference are helpful with painting the picture clearly:

Bigsby:
By Down
1st downs - 9 carries, 73 yards
2nd downs - 2 carries, 0 yards
3rd downs - 1 carry, 0 yards
4th downs - 0 attempts

By Yards to Go
1-3 yards - 2 carries, -1 yards
4-6 yards - 1 carry, 1 yard
10+ yards - 9 carries, 73 yards

4th quarter - 3 carries for 5 yards
His best quarters were 1st and 3rd where he had 2 carries for 24 yards and then 5 carries for 37 yards respectively.

By play type:
Under center - 10 carries for 67 yards
Shotgun - 2 carries for 6 yards

Etienne:
By Down
1st downs - 7 carries, 32 yards
2nd downs - 4 carries, 14 yards
3rd downs - 0 attempts
4th downs - 1 carry, -2 yards

By Yards to Go
1-3 yards - 3 carries, 0 yards
4-6 yards - 1 carry, 11 yards
7-9 yards - 1 carry, 7 yards
10+ yards - 7 carries, 26 yards

4th quarter - 2 carries, 9 yards
His best quarter was the 3rd, where he had 3 carries for 24 yards. The other quarters? Very much forgettable. Was a non factor really. Averaging 1.6 in Q1, 1.5 in Q2. 

By play type:
Under center - 6 carries, 19 yards
Shotgun - 6 carries, 25 yards

In conclusion. This team still sucks [BLEEP] at running the football in short yardage situations, and, from the looks of it, Bigsby is better from under center formations and Etienne is better from Shotgun formations. They like to run the football to open up the offense first. It's not a bad approach. But, for the sake of something different. Maybe they should open up the next game by throwing it more and then setting up the run game.

(09-10-2024, 04:08 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]https://www.reddit.com/r/nfl/s/RMg1TWq8vl

Yeah, it's almost like the players fumbled away a win or something.

Positives: This team has legit talent in almost every "skill" position.

Negatives: We still haven't gelled as to what we are on offense. We have a $50+ million QB that we treat as a game manager.

(09-10-2024, 04:30 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-10-2024, 04:08 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]https://www.reddit.com/r/nfl/s/RMg1TWq8vl

Yeah, it's almost like the players fumbled away a win or something.

No, that chart indicates that when the fumble happened, the offense went into self pussification mode and clammed up instead of staying aggressive and getting after it. It's almost like, the coaching staff doesn't trust it's players to win or something.

(09-10-2024, 04:08 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]https://www.reddit.com/r/nfl/s/RMg1TWq8vl

That's an interesting chart.  I said it in another thread, but taking your foot off the gas with a 10 point lead at halftime doesn't work, especially against an explosive team like Miami.  The defense played really well, but Tyreek Hill streaking down the field for 80 yards is almost predictable at this point.

(09-10-2024, 04:38 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ]Positives:  This team has legit talent in almost every "skill" position. 

Negatives:  We still haven't gelled as to what we are on offense.  We have a $50+ million QB that we treat as a game manager.

I think we're a run first offense on first down that wants to push the football downfield in chunks with the play action game while sprinkling in some easy, underneath lay-up's to keep the chains moving. 

The problem is, you had three [BLEEP] wits yesterday stall the engine out three times when the play caller was staying aggressive and we needed to convert the coveted third down. 

We also had peanut head fumble the football after having flashbacks of 2021 when he saw himself as the better back replacing the back in front of him on the depth chart. Bigsby's first half success must have convinced him to run a little harder and not put two hands on the football inside the redzone. 

The offensive coaching staff, the mystery man at play caller and your core skill position players let the team down. That's all it boils down to. Catch the football. Hold onto the football. Stay aggressive, ESPECIALLY stay aggressive, when your QB looked good in one half airing it out, and, good things will probably happen.

I know there likely won't be an answer without the bias of knowing the outcome. I can only imagine thigh if after Tyreek scored if we had immediately come out and throw a pick six how that would have been received. Especially with how well we had been running the ball up to that point.