Quote:This mirrors my thoughts, the Waif essentially committed the same offense for which Arya received a death sentence. She let it get personal.
Last night's episode was gold for me based on the tongue lashing Olenna Tyrell gave Sersei Lannister alone.
Olenna Tyrell has some of the best dialogue in the entire series and that's pretty consistent throughout her appearances. On a related note, I'm suddenly very intrigued by what Margery has up her sleeve for the High Sparrow now and this whole thing makes me slightly sad that Varys had to abandon King's Landing.
Who do we think Sansa wrote that correspondence to? My guess is it was a "my bad" letter to Littlefinger...which very well turn out to be a horrible mistake given his duplicitous nature. Lady Mormont had me in stitches. That little girl killed it...but the reference really made me miss old Jeor.
I can't think of a literary character I've loved to hate as much as Cersei (I keep misspelling her name). Her character is so well developed in the novels and Lena Heady nails it. Am I a bad person that I want her flayed alive?
I think the raven is headed to Littlefinger. Maybe she thinks she can charm her Sweetrobin out of Littlefinger's control.
A girl is an idiot. I'm sure this will be used as a means to reunite her with Gendry however. I agree with the above. We are not done with Waif or Jagan (sp?) Something else is going on here.... Would not be surprised to find out this was all a setup as a test for the waif or something.
I was very pleased with how they handled the Hound return. They could have done it in a very cheesy drawn out manner. Instead, here is your sweet reveal, followed by a small recap of what he's been up to and how he's thinking, maybe I can change too? Followed by it's clobbering time. All aboard the Cleganebowl hype train fellas!!!!
Winner of the week goes to a Lady Mormont only slightly over Ollena (but dang did she roast Cersei but good).
Quote:I can't think of a literary character I've loved to hate as much as Cersei (I keep misspelling her name). Her character is so well developed in the novels and Lena Heady nails it. Am I a bad person that I want her flayed alive?
I think the raven is headed to Littlefinger. Maybe she thinks she can charm her Sweetrobin out of Littlefinger's control.
I too love Cersei. I don't want her to be successful, but the character is a perfect villain. Bad, but with enough humanness that a person can relate to her. Heady does a great job.
I was supremely happy to see The Hound.
Oleanna rocks and Margery is so playing High Sparrow.
A girl was a failed test for the Waif as was already said. I think Jaqen will show up again for the reckoning unless HBO drops the ball on that.
Overall a good episode. Especially the verbal smackdown Cersei got.
Quote:I was supremely happy to see The Hound.
Oleanna rocks and Margery is so playing High Sparrow.
A girl was a failed test for the Waif as was already said. I think Jaqen will show up again for the reckoning unless HBO drops the ball on that.
Overall a good episode. Especially the verbal smackdown Cersei got.
The whole Faceless Men plot confuses me. When Jaqen recruited Arya his offer went something like if you want to kill everyone you hate, come with me and I'll teach you how. When she got there it became, you can't kill for revenge, we are servants to the many faced god and we don't get to choose who we offer up.
So presumably if we roll with the latter, she will have to split from the Faceless Men to take her revenge. If that's the case, I don't see her reconciling with Jaqen and then splitting off on her own again down the line. On the other hand, we know she wasn't nearly trained enough to be truly deadly just yet, so how does that happen? How does she escape the greatest assassins in the whole world?
Unless... she's been playing possum with the waif this whole time?
I think Jaqen will spare Arya and let her go once the Waif gets to her again. He specifically told her before she left to get Arya not to make her suffer. Don't allow her to suffer. Stabbing her in the stomach several times instead of making her death quick is essentially making someone suffer. So I think he's going to make the Waif pay for that with her own life. And Arya will be on her way to Westeros by the end of this season. I think once the battle of Winterfell is complete the season will end with Jon and Sansa restoring order and fortifying the North. Cersei and the Lannister's will work on regaining King's Landing and restoring order there and preparing to march on the North. And then it'll cut to Daenerys either sailing for Westeros or at least meeting the Greyjoy kids. Arya I think makes it back to see Jon. Melisandre already told her once that they would meet again. I think that's a good sign she'll make it back at some point to be reunited with Jon and Sansa. I think Rickon dies this year though. Ramsay will flay him and put him on the battlefield as a burnt offering to entice and enrage Jon.
What I don't get about the whole Arya scene, is that she seriously can't be that naive, or just flat out stupid to be walking around Braavos all nonchalant like there isn't a group of the deadliest assassins in the known world after her.
You're basically talking about super ninjas that can use practically any persons face at a given moment, so you would think she would be walking around bug eyed trying to find the first ticket out of there, not just strolling around on a sunday walk at the harbour and taking a stop to see all the sights.
Also, why didn't she have her sword needle with her? Once again, you are being tracked down by the greatest assassins in the world and you are walking around totally unarmed, I just really don't understand it.
I have read some theories that maybe it wasn't actually Arya, that it was Jaqen using her face somehow to see if the Waif would do as she was told, but I really can't see the show doing all that, it would probably confuse quite a bit of people.
I mean, whats going to happen? Is Gendry going to pop up and save Arya from the greatest assassins in the world? Is she going to be magically healed after being gut sliced, stabbed and knife twisted? That wound right there is practically fatal in todays day and age even with modern medicine/technology and the like, in medieval times you might as well go lie down in a grave cause you are done.
I'm going to be a slightly dissenting voice as things pertain to Cersei.
I generally don't want her to be successful either, except when she's legitimately acting as a parent and/or strictly in the best interest of her children. Otherwise, it's highly rewarding as a viewer/reader to see her constantly get outmaneuvered by superior schemers. That is her fatal flaw, as I see it. She's nowhere near the manipulator she thinks she is, that was her father. I think GRRM uses her, and to a lesser extent Theon, in an attempt to balance the galaxy's worth of excrement that gets dumped on the Starks throughout the series.
As for Arya, I'm pretty sure she's safe if my logic is correct. Since she failed to assassinate Lady Crane, the life-debt shifted to Arya. Jaqen sent the Waif to collect with specific instructions which she did not abide in addition to seemingly failing since Arya still lives. The debt now shifts to the Waif...the remaining question is who collects? Arya, Jaqen, someone else?
I didn't comment on it before but I, too, am glad the Hound is back. His character has always had this subtle spark of humanity going back to his interactions with Sansa surrounding her father's death, substantiated by his time with Arya. Dare I say it, he very well may be the first character in the series to come full circle and actually get some retribution and hopefully closure although it will likely end up costing him his life...who cares?
I am rooting for Cersei. I long the moment when she had enough and gives Mountain "the nod".
Speaking of, I wonder if they got a cheaper stand in to play him.
Quote:
I have read some theories that maybe it wasn't actually Arya, that it was Jaqen using her face somehow to see if the Waif would do as she was told, but I really can't see the show doing all that, it would probably confuse quite a bit of people.
This was something that came to my mind. Jaqen told the Waif she could kill Arya but not make her suffer. So Jaqen puts on Arya's face and strolls around like there's nothing wrong and the Waif finds her and stabs her. It a test for the Waif, not Arya. Arya wouldn't be that clueless and as you said, where was Needle? Jaqen didn't know about Needle so he wouldn't have been able to somehow have a similar sword or at least the illusion of one.
In the end the Waif failed the test. It will be interesting to see what the punishment will be and what all of this means for Arya.
I'd like to add someone on reddit broke down the images of Sansa's letter which required zooming, piecing together, flipping around the picture and some guesswork. What came of it is she wrote to the Vale.
Quote:I think Jaqen will spare Arya and let her go once the Waif gets to her again. He specifically told her before she left to get Arya not to make her suffer. Don't allow her to suffer. Stabbing her in the stomach several times instead of making her death quick is essentially making someone suffer. So I think he's going to make the Waif pay for that with her own life. And Arya will be on her way to Westeros by the end of this season. I think once the battle of Winterfell is complete the season will end with Jon and Sansa restoring order and fortifying the North. Cersei and the Lannister's will work on regaining King's Landing and restoring order there and preparing to march on the North. And then it'll cut to Daenerys either sailing for Westeros or at least meeting the Greyjoy kids. Arya I think makes it back to see Jon. Melisandre already told her once that they would meet again. I think that's a good sign she'll make it back at some point to be reunited with Jon and Sansa. I think Rickon dies this year though. Ramsay will flay him and put him on the battlefield as a burnt offering to entice and enrage Jon.
Jaqen said something along the lines of someone's face will end up on our wall. He never said who's. I think it's pretty clear that face will be the waif's especially after she has so clearly made this personal which is the reason they didn't think Aria was ready.
I also think Rickon dies. He's never been of any importance and other than being a stark provides nothing special to the group. In the end I think Sansa legitimizes Jon and he will be lord of Winterfell. Or does the king have to do that? I can't recall.
Quote:What I don't get about the whole Arya scene, is that she seriously can't be that naive, or just flat out stupid to be walking around Braavos all nonchalant like there isn't a group of the deadliest assassins in the known world after her.
You're basically talking about super ninjas that can use practically any persons face at a given moment, so you would think she would be walking around bug eyed trying to find the first ticket out of there, not just strolling around on a sunday walk at the harbour and taking a stop to see all the sights.
Also, why didn't she have her sword needle with her? Once again, you are being tracked down by the greatest assassins in the world and you are walking around totally unarmed, I just really don't understand it.
I have read some theories that maybe it wasn't actually Arya, that it was Jaqen using her face somehow to see if the Waif would do as she was told, but I really can't see the show doing all that, it would probably confuse quite a bit of people.
I mean, whats going to happen? Is Gendry going to pop up and save Arya from the greatest assassins in the world? Is she going to be magically healed after being gut sliced, stabbed and knife twisted? That wound right there is practically fatal in todays day and age even with modern medicine/technology and the like, in medieval times you might as well go lie down in a grave cause you are done.
While it was happening I assumed that as well but they wouldn't have shown her walking around bleeding out if that was the case. I guess at this point Jaqen will save her as this is the waif's failed test? Only way I see out of that unless Gendry all of a sudden makes magic armor that heals wounds.
Quote:I'd like to add someone on reddit broke down the images of Sansa's letter which required zooming, piecing together, flipping around the picture and some guesswork. What came of it is she wrote to the Vale.
I think most people have assumed as much even without sleuthing. She screwed up and she knows it.
Quote:This was something that came to my mind. Jaqen told the Waif she could kill Arya but not make her suffer. So Jaqen puts on Arya's face and strolls around like there's nothing wrong and the Waif finds her and stabs her. It a test for the Waif, not Arya. Arya wouldn't be that clueless and as you said, where was Needle? Jaqen didn't know about Needle so he wouldn't have been able to somehow have a similar sword or at least the illusion of one.
In the end the Waif failed the test. It will be interesting to see what the punishment will be and what all of this means for Arya.
I actually think Jaqen does know about Needle. When Arya first visits the House of Black and White, he makes her throw it in the water as part of leaving her old life/self behind. He didn't know that she'd fished it out of the water though so that would explain "Arya" taking a brisk stroll through the mean streets of Braavos without her trusty rapier. Considering where we left off with Arya the week prior (holing up in what appears to be an underground sewer of some sort to hide out), it stands to reason that she would not be so foolish as to travel openly unarmed.
I'm pretty sure, based on this, that that wasn't Arya at all. Whether or not it was Jaqen remains to be seen...as there are undoubtedly other Faceless Men.
Quote:I'm going to be a slightly dissenting voice as things pertain to Cersei.
I generally don't want her to be successful either, except when she's legitimately acting as a parent and/or strictly in the best interest of her children. Otherwise, it's highly rewarding as a viewer/reader to see her constantly get outmaneuvered by superior schemers. That is her fatal flaw, as I see it. She's nowhere near the manipulator she thinks she is, that was her father. I think GRRM uses her, and to a lesser extent Theon, in an attempt to balance the galaxy's worth of excrement that gets dumped on the Starks throughout the series.
As for Arya, I'm pretty sure she's safe if my logic is correct. Since she failed to assassinate Lady Crane, the life-debt shifted to Arya. Jaqen sent the Waif to collect with specific instructions which she did not abide in addition to seemingly failing since Arya still lives. The debt now shifts to the Waif...the remaining question is who collects? Arya, Jaqen, someone else?
I didn't comment on it before but I, too, am glad the Hound is back. His character has always had this subtle spark of humanity going back to his interactions with Sansa surrounding her father's death, substantiated by his time with Arya. Dare I say it, he very well may be the first character in the series to come full circle and actually get some retribution and hopefully closure although it will likely end up costing him his life...who cares?
My disdain for Cersei is actually admiration for the character development and performance. I love hating her.
I liked the Hound's return, but couldn't help wondering why he strayed so far away from the group, knowing an attack was likely.
Quote:I think most people have assumed as much even without sleuthing. She screwed up and she knows it.
I don't think it's so much that she screwed up as she overestimated the North's support for her cause. She knows she can't trust Littlefinger and she knows Robin is his thrall. She hedged her bets on being able to garner enough support to retake Winterfell without the Knights of the Vale and lost. In the end, she and everyone else knows that Littlefinger doesn't do anything unless it directly benefits him (unlike my man Varys, to whom he's often compared, who balances his self interest with some greater albeit unspecified purpose...I don't completely buy his "for the good of the realm" angle although I think there's some truth in the statement). Neither she nor Jon are duplicitous enough to be able to spot his treachery...although I feel that task will fall to Davos.
Quote:My disdain for Cersei is actually admiration for the character development and performance. I love hating her.
I liked the Hound's return, but couldn't help wondering why he strayed so far away from the group, knowing an attack was likely.
I knew what you meant, RJ...I wasn't directing my commentary at you (or anyone else really). I was just stating how I feel about Cersei as a character.
