Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Quote:How is LG a need? That's Cann's job. Leo was addressed last draft, though that still remains to be seen if it was addressed properly.


Clemons was fine last year, fell off this year.


What about his good FAs?


Thomas

Marks

House

Parnell

Skuta

Odrick

Ball (until injury and upgraded)

Hurns (technically)

I wouldn't call Skuta a success just yet.

Quote:Just about any GM would have come in in'13 and improved this stinking roster

It's not about "just improving this roster", he has gotten some steals in the latter part of drafts and got us a franchise QB with a #1 WR along with plenty of other key pieces that I have named above. It's honestly a dumb argument. Caldwell has brought in a hell of a lot of talent. Our top pick in last years draft was hurt all year, so that doesn't help, especially considering our biggest need happens to be the place he plays and he expected to have considering FA options were long gone since the draft is after FA.

Quote:I wouldn't call Skuta a success just yet.

Well, he certainly isn't a bust. He had some injury problems but that's out of Caldwell's control. When he was out there, he played solid.

 

It's annoying because all I feel like I'm doing is defending, but Caldwell is not the guy we should be getting the pitchforks out for. Gus and the defensive staff is the current problem, along with the talent on defense, although losing two of our top picks in Fowler and Sample in last years draft doesn't help the situation obviously.

Quote:Well, he certainly isn't a bust. He had some injury problems but that's out of Caldwell's control. When he was out there, he played solid.

This. By "good fa" I meant doing what was expected of them. Which is what Skuta has done while on the field

Quote:Well, he certainly isn't a bust. He had some injury problems but that's out of Caldwell's control. When he was out there, he played solid.

 

It's annoying because all I feel like I'm doing is defending, but Caldwell is not the guy we should be getting the pitchforks out for. Gus and the defensive staff is the current problem, along with the talent on defense, although losing two of our top picks in Fowler and Sample in last years draft doesn't help the situation obviously.

 

newsflash:  Gus was hired by Dave.

Dave is responsible for the talent on the team (like the defense).

 

He isn't and shouldn't be immune to criticism.  Now, if we're talking about job approval by percentage - I'd give dave a 50%.  He to me has earned the right to stay simply for finding Bortles, AROB, and Telvin Smith.  

 

Gus' approval rating is about less than 10% in my book.  He needs to be shown the door like yesterday.

Quote:This. By "good fa" I meant doing what was expected of them. Which is what Skuta has done while on the field

 

dude, Skuta is just a guy.  

 

He's not the answer at "OTTO" (whatever made-up position that is in Gus' head)

Quote:newsflash:  Gus was hired by Dave.

Dave is responsible for the talent on the team (like the defense).

 

He isn't and shouldn't be immune to criticism.  Now, if we're talking about job approval by percentage - I'd give dave a 50%.  He to me has earned the right to stay simply for finding Bortles, AROB, and Telvin Smith.  

 

Gus' approval rating is about less than 10% in my book.  He needs to be shown the door like yesterday.

Never said he should be immune to criticism, but firing? Yes, he should be immune to that. He has brought in a lot of talent, more talen than this has franchise has had at any point in a long [BLEEP] time. As for the hiring of Gus, that has been piss poor, I'll agree with that, but he was a hot commodity at the time and we weren't the only team trying to get him. He was coming from a great HC, and was well regarded around the league as a great defensive mind. It doesn't look to me like it's Dave's decision to let go of Gus even if he wanted to right now either with Shad always being the one saying whether he'll return or not.

 

Also, he's gotten plenty more than just that. I'm assuming you're just highlighting his top 3 acquisitions which is fair, but he's brought in a lot of talent, and that's excluding our top pick in last years draft and Sample who most draftheads thought had nice upside and was a great pick at the time last year...we devoted most of FA to offense and the previous draft was all about offense. So you have to expect the opposite this offseaosn, and you just have to hope that this ship finally gets turned around.

Quote:dude, Skuta is just a guy.  

 

He's not the answer at "OTTO" (whatever made-up position that is in Gus' head)

Skuta is a solid player. We didn't pay him like he was some defensive centerpiece or guy we expect to be a key piece. We paid him like a starting caliber OTTO, which he is. You aren't going to have a stud at every position.

Quote:Let's be honest here, guys.....let's look at our needs as it stands

 

LT

RB (backup)

C

LG

LEO

FS

SS

CB

 

 

come on, fellas. Three drafts in and that many needs. We could draft any position with the 5th pick and it's be perfect. Why are you giving this guy excuses?

Correct me if I am wrong, but weren't we like a 2-14 team when he took over?

 

What were our needs then?

 

QB

RB

WR

TE

LG

C

RG

RT

DE X 2

DT x1 (don't hand me Aluau, either)

Sam

Will

CB x 2

SS

FS

 

When you compare my list of needs at the time he took over to your needs now, he's cut the needs on this team in half.

He's done so without a heavy emphasis on free agency.

 

Considering the standard draft haul is 7 picks, and mid to late round picks typically are not expected to make any sort of impact-if they make the team at all, I'd say he's done well.

Quote:dude, Skuta is just a guy.


He's not the answer at "OTTO" (whatever made-up position that is in Gus' head)

Never said he was "the answer" like a Bruce Irvin. But he certainly hasn't been bad. He was never expected to be a world beater.

Quote:What are you shaking your head for?


He's literally picked bortles, Robinson, and telvin smith in 3 years that I give him props for. And those picks may just save his job.


Everything else has been incomplete, average or below average. His free agents have been well below average.

He picked Bortles, Robinson, Linder and Telvin Smith all in ONE draft...which should also include Hurns because he was part of that rookie class.

 

Think about that production from one draft class.  A second year QB that finished 2nd in the league in TDs, a second year WR that led the league in TD receptions and had over 1400 yards, another WR that had 10 TDs receiving and over 1000 yards, a LB who has twice won AFC defensive player of the week, and a stud RG. Just imagine if Lee ever puts it all together!  What would Colvin do if he ever had a good pass rush in front of him?

 

This draft class alone is enough to justify keeping him.  Gene Smith couldn't produce a draft class like this if he picked for a million years.

 

But then he got us Cann-who is looking like a quality longer term starter-a decent RB in Yeldon, an outstanding punt returner in Greene.  We don't know what Fowler will do.

 

As others have pointed out, until 2015, his free agents were, as a general rule, designed to be stop gaps.  They didn't throw a lot of money at a lot of guys.  Gerhart was a bust.  Skuta is a guy, Odrick is okay.  Marks has been a stud for us, and the only thing keeping down Thomas' grade is injury.

 

I expect, like last offseason, the Jaguars will go after a better quality of player in free agency.

 

He is not exempt from criticism.  The 2013 draft was not so good.  Joeckel is average at best, as is Cyprien.  Both qualify as disappointments.    But again, that was a weak draft overall.  I would say that even though there may not be a star caliber QB at the top of this draft, and even with the Smith injury, there is a lot of star caliber defensive talent in this draft.

 

I trust Caldwell to find it.

Quote:Just about any GM would have come in in'13 and improved this stinking roster

Okay, I'll give you that.

 

But name a GM that could produce Bortles, Robinson, Linder, Lee, Colvin, Telvin Smith, and Hurns in ONE rookie class.    A second year QB that finished 2nd in the league in TDs, a second year WR that led the league in TD receptions and had over 1400 yards, another WR that had 10 TDs receiving and over 1000 yards, a LB who has twice won AFC defensive player of the week, and a stud RG. Just imagine if Lee ever puts it all together!  What would Colvin do if he ever had a good pass rush in front of him?  Even if Lee and Colvin become average at best players, the productivity of the guys outside of those two would make this one of the best drafts in recent league memory.

Quote:I wouldn't call Skuta a success just yet.

Okay.  I agree here.  I think Skuta is more of a role player/rotational player.

 

What about the rest of that list?

Caldwell does not get credit for Allen Hurns. He wasn't drafted. We lucked into getting him because we had Jedd Fish.


And I'm not so sure he's gotten rid of a lot of our needs. Sure, there are new guys playing those positions, but how effective are they? Would they start on many other teams?


Look, I'm not saying Caldwell should be on the hot seat. He's done good enough simply because of the 2014 draft class.


But let's not pretend that he's been wonderful. Let's not pretend he's not responsible for our record.

Quote:Caldwell does not get credit for Allen Hurns. He wasn't drafted. We lucked into getting him because we had Jedd Fish.

 

Gotta give the GM partial credit. He still makes the call and offer to UDFA's. Hurns most likely chose Jax because of Fisch and being in the state of Florida but Caldwell still makes the offer.

Quote:Caldwell does not get credit for Allen Hurns. He wasn't drafted. We lucked into getting him because we had Jedd Fish.


 

 

Quote:Gotta give the GM partial credit. He still makes the call and offer to UDFA's. Hurns most likely chose Jax because of Fisch and being in the state of Florida but Caldwell still makes the offer.

I'm with BritishJag here.

 

Caldwell could have made that contract offer to any number of players instead of Hurns.

Quote: 

And I'm not so sure he's gotten rid of a lot of our needs. Sure, there are new guys playing those positions, but how effective are they? Would they start on many other teams?

Look, I'm not saying Caldwell should be on the hot seat. He's done good enough simply because of the 2014 draft class.


But let's not pretend that he's been wonderful. Let's not pretend he's not responsible for our record.

Okay...this clarifies things.

Quote:Let's be honest here, guys.....let's look at our needs as it stands

 

LT

RB (backup)

C

LG

LEO

FS

SS

CB

 

 

come on, fellas. Three drafts in and that many needs. We could draft any position with the 5th pick and it's be perfect. Why are you giving this guy excuses?

Aaaactually, our RB position is probably pretty good with Yeldon, Gray, and a 3rd body that won't see the field much.

LG??? Do you even Jaguar? Beadles is gone, Cann and Linder are in, G is set.

SS is serviceable if we have a good FS.

CB? I guess we still need a solid nickle corner.

The biggest critics are the ones who know very little about the GM job.

Couldn't do it on their best day.....

 

Caldwell doesn't have any real busts.

Especially in FA. Because every contract he has given out has kept the team safe in case the player didn't work out. The ones that did work out (Miller and Marks) got extensions.

When you sign guys to be stop gaps, Beadles, Gerhart, etc. They aren't supposed to be roster savers.

 

They've done their part.

 

Joker might be the worst decision of Caldwell's career so far. His first pick ever.

Geez...

 

 

Once again... people on here, never satisfied. Intent on running every player, coach, and GM out of town 

every

single

season

Quote:You guys act like his 3 year plan should have been without flaw. Sometimes things don't work and or go according to plan. Caldwell is likely going to be the GM for sometime and Bradley is the head coach next year so quit complaining. Their is a lot of positives to this team and with a another good draft and free agency we should be much better next year.

 

No GM is without flaw. Everyone will have their hits and their misses. The plus side is that Dave appears to have hit on the most difficult (and most important) position to hit on: quarterback. He also appears to have hit on some later round picks. However, he's definitely gotten a pass from a lot of people especially on this board (who has targeted Gus as PE#1). For me, the most crucial mistake that Dave has is he appears (to me) to overestimate his own evaluation of the team.

 

He gutted this team completely and ran with essentially rookies as starters, then supplemented them not with veterans, but bargain waiver free-agents and even undrafted free-agents. The roster that this team fielded, the first two seasons, quite frankly...was a joke from a competitive level. I would venture to guess, that Bradley's roster this season, is comparable to what most Head Coaches get on *their* first seasons.

 

Even he admitted that starting out that low in talent and experience was a bad combination, and would change things if he had a do over. Keep in mind that along with a young team, he coupled this with a first time HC and a relatively young staff along with it. Just a bad combination overall for immediate success.

 

This season, IMO, he overestimated on the defense with the belief that just the addition of Fowler along with the return of Clem/Branch was enough. It wasn't. He overestimated that getting Marks back was enough, that Hood/Bennett can fill that role. It wasn't. He was content in just adding one veteran LB in Skuta, and that his "waiver" LB guys from last season was enough. They weren't...and it became evident when we had injuries at the LB spot.

 

You can say maybe you can't fill every position on a team in 3 years. I argue, if that is the case, then he shouldn't have created additional holes by getting rid of productive, if not unspectacular veterans, on the roster.

 

As for those arguing that Dave hasn't made a move that we couldn't get out of...what's your point? Gone are the days of GMs not paying attention to the cap. Even Harris and Gene, as bad as they were, were more than aware and built contracts to protect the team should the investment fail. Even to this day, from a cap perspective, we haven't been "hurt" by Blackmon's off-field issues due to how his contract was worded.

 

Overall, Dave has done a good enough job and especially with the QB that he's likely earned enough good grace to outlast Bradley (barring some miraculous improvement). But I don't think he's without criticism in his start so far.