Quote:No GM is without flaw. Everyone will have their hits and their misses. The plus side is that Dave appears to have hit on the most difficult (and most important) position to hit on: quarterback. He also appears to have hit on some later round picks. However, he's definitely gotten a pass from a lot of people especially on this board (who has targeted Gus as PE#1). For me, the most crucial mistake that Dave has is he appears (to me) to overestimate his own evaluation of the team.
He gutted this team completely and ran with essentially rookies as starters, then supplemented them not with veterans, but bargain waiver free-agents and even undrafted free-agents. The roster that this team fielded, the first two seasons, quite frankly...was a joke from a competitive level. I would venture to guess, that Bradley's roster this season, is comparable to what most Head Coaches get on *their* first seasons.
Even he admitted that starting out that low in talent and experience was a bad combination, and would change things if he had a do over. Keep in mind that along with a young team, he coupled this with a first time HC and a relatively young staff along with it. Just a bad combination overall for immediate success.
This season, IMO, he overestimated on the defense with the belief that just the addition of Fowler along with the return of Clem/Branch was enough. It wasn't. He overestimated that getting Marks back was enough, that Hood/Bennett can fill that role. It wasn't. He was content in just adding one veteran LB in Skuta, and that his "waiver" LB guys from last season was enough. They weren't...and it became evident when we had injuries at the LB spot.
You can say maybe you can't fill every position on a team in 3 years. I argue, if that is the case, then he shouldn't have created additional holes by getting rid of productive, if not unspectacular veterans, on the roster.
As for those arguing that Dave hasn't made a move that we couldn't get out of...what's your point? Gone are the days of GMs not paying attention to the cap. Even Harris and Gene, as bad as they were, were more than aware and built contracts to protect the team should the investment fail. Even to this day, from a cap perspective, we haven't been "hurt" by Blackmon's off-field issues due to how his contract was worded.
Overall, Dave has done a good enough job and especially with the QB that he's likely earned enough good grace to outlast Bradley (barring some miraculous improvement). But I don't think he's without criticism in his start so far.
I think he has done admirably so far in his first GM job. Picking a rookie HC to lead the rebuilding process is the only move I'd hold against him so far. Caldwell is definitely a shrewd operator with an eye for talent.
Quote:And I'm not so sure he's gotten rid of a lot of our needs. Sure, there are new guys playing those positions, but how effective are they? Would they start on many other teams?
Just looking at the defense, the Jags weak link:
Considering Prosinski and Britton are starting on other teams, I'd say yes. There are only a few teams that have a 2nd CB good enough that House or Colvin wouldn't start (and I still wonder about McCray). Any of our three LBs would start for most teams, as would Odrick and Miller.
That's seven of our eleven starters (a
nd that's not including Marks and Fowler) who would start for "most" other teams, and the other four, while pretty bad, are still not the worst in the league and would start for at least a couple of teams. Other than Marks, there hasn't been notable improvement from defensive players after they arrived here. Even Telvin already looked like a tackling machine in his first preseason game as a rookie and still hasn't improved in pass coverage. Who knows how good Gratz, Cyprien, and Evans would have turned out with better coaching.
Caldwell's biggest failure by far was choosing Bradley as head coach.
Quote:Just looking at the defense, the Jags weak link:
Considering Prosinski and Britton are starting on other teams, I'd say yes. There are only a few teams that have a 2nd CB good enough that House or Colvin wouldn't start (and I still wonder about McCray). Any of our three LBs would start for most teams, as would Odrick and Miller.
That's seven of our eleven starters (a
nd that's not including Marks and Fowler) who would start for "most" other teams, and the other four, while pretty bad, are still not the worst in the league and would start for at least a couple of teams. Other than Marks, there hasn't been notable improvement from defensive players after they arrived here. Even Telvin already looked like a tackling machine in his first preseason game as a rookie and still hasn't improved in pass coverage. Who knows how good Gratz, Cyprien, and Evans would have turned out with better coaching.
Caldwell's biggest failure by far was choosing Bradley as head coach.
That being said, Alualu, Evans, Clemons/Branch would not start on other teams. Those are pretty critical positions. Who's your say with a healthy Marks/Fowler this Defense wouldn't have made this Defense significantly better?
Quote:Just about any GM would have come in in'13 and improved this stinking roster
I do like this debate and think you make a good point.
The man will speak at 1pm today.
Quote:That being said, Alualu, Evans, Clemons/Branch would not start on other teams. Those are pretty critical positions. Who's your say with a healthy Marks/Fowler this Defense wouldn't have made this Defense significantly better?
Alualu and Clemons/Branch are back-ups starting in place of Marks and Fowler, but every team has injuries and is forced to play backups. Giving the Jags eleven Pro Bowlers would made the defense much better, but that's not what we should expect. The coaches need to make the most out of the players they have. Just rushing four game after game when it never works is stuck on stupid.
I bet Evans would start over Prosinski. In spite of that, and not exactly a roster filled with guys who would start on most teams, the Bears defense was not 31st like ours was (they were 20th), and the did that in spite of not playing against mostly back-ups, rookies, and journeymen at QB.
We all need to keep in mind that we don't know what we don't know. There were probably free agents that Dave reached out to that did not want to come to Jacksonville, or others that stayed with their current team. There were a couple names in the news last year that we knew about but there could have been others that we didn't. Dave can only sign those who want to be a Jaguar and after the roster gutting some players may not have wanted to "wait out" a re build.
Quote:Alualu and Clemons/Branch are back-ups starting in place of Marks and Fowler, but every team has injuries and is forced to play backups. Giving the Jags eleven Pro Bowlers would made the defense much better, but that's not what we should expect. The coaches need to make the most out of the players they have. Just rushing four game after game when it never works is stuck on stupid.
I bet Evans would start over Prosinski. In spite of that, and not exactly a roster filled with guys who would start on most teams, the Bears defense was not 31st like ours was (they were 20th), and the did that in spite of not playing against mostly back-ups, rookies, and journeymen at QB.
I'm not fully disagreeing. I'm putting most of my defensive blame on Babich more than Gus.
Quote:I do like this debate and think you make a good point.
That being said I'm too happy with the post key.
I would say a good gm should hit on 3 starters a year to be considered a success ie the first 3 rounds. Late round gems are a bonus.
Looking at Dave's first 3 rounds
2013 was rubbish
2014 bortles Lee Robinson Linder -excellent year and we still haven't seen the best of Lee
2015 yeldon cann fowler looks promising to me
So excluding 2013 which was a pretty poor class Caldwell has been a good gm and at the very least shown dramatic improvement
Not to mention late round hits like telvin Smith Aaron Colvin and rashaad greene
His fa classes have been dissapointing but his mistakes have not plunged us into cap crisis
Beatles and Gerhart will be cut this year to minimal cap hit whilst the majority of his signings until this year were bring them in and see guys and their contracts were made accordingly.
Sergio Brown even Miller and marks were brought in as trials. Resign the good cut the bad.
The big money signings
Oldrick and Thomas have both been effective
As for letting guys go. Forsett was let go a lot before tearing it up with the ravens and that o line was pretty good in 2014
Smith and Monroe can be criticised but Smith was 30 coming off a severe injury so for a team looking long term I can understand.
Monroe I can see why people dislike it and I can see why people like it. All hinges on if he would have resigned which we will never know
Quote:We all need to keep in mind that we don't know what we don't know. There were probably free agents that Dave reached out to that did not want to come to Jacksonville, or others that stayed with their current team. There were a couple names in the news last year that we knew about but there could have been others that we didn't. Dave can only sign those who want to be a Jaguar and after the roster gutting some players may not have wanted to "wait out" a re build.
One of those was Devin McCourty, one of the top FS's in the game that continues to be a glaring weakness this year that we know about. Hell, reports came out Jacksonville gave him the highest offer, he just wanted to stay in NE.
Quote:I'm not fully disagreeing. I'm putting most of my defensive blame on Babich more than Gus.
Which I'd agree with.
99.9% sure Gus took over playcalling on defense late last season and our defense started to play much better. IDK why the hell he gave it back to Babich this year, but either get a competent d-coord or take the reigns Gus. I still think Gus is a good defensive mind, him as a HC though leaves a lot to be desired and it's obvious he is way to loyal to his staff/some players. Take the playcalling or give it to someone more competent, that's all I can say.
Quote:That being said I'm too happy with the post key.
I would say a good gm should hit on 3 starters a year to be considered a success ie the first 3 rounds. Late round gems are a bonus.
Looking at Dave's first 3 rounds
2013 was rubbish
2014 bortles Lee Robinson Linder -excellent year and we still haven't seen the best of Lee
2015 yeldon cann fowler looks promising to me
So excluding 2013 which was a pretty poor class Caldwell has been a good gm and at the very least shown dramatic improvement
Not to mention late round hits like telvin Smith Aaron Colvin and rashaad greene
His fa classes have been dissapointing but his mistakes have not plunged us into cap crisis
Beatles and Gerhart will be cut this year to minimal cap hit whilst the majority of his signings until this year were bring them in and see guys and their contracts were made accordingly.
Sergio Brown even Miller and marks were brought in as trials. Resign the good cut the bad.
The big money signings
Oldrick and Thomas have both been effective
As for letting guys go. Forsett was let go a lot before tearing it up with the ravens and that o line was pretty good in 2014
Smith and Monroe can be criticised but Smith was 30 coming off a severe injury so for a team looking long term I can understand.
Monroe I can see why people dislike it and I can see why people like it. All hinges on if he would have resigned which we will never know
Monroe trade got us the picks we would use one guys like Telvin...
Big win there.
Also, Dave got picks for Scobee and Gabbert.
Big win there.
Also, Marks and Miller can be seen as good enough FA p/u to negate the couple BAD f/a pickups.
2013 draft class is looking rather sad....
But....when looking at the draft over all... there weren't a lot of home run hits in it.
Ansah and Le'Veon Bell would have been pretty nice pick ups... but hindsight...
PS (Here's hoping we never get a LT from a spread offense again)
Quote:Letting go of:
Forsett (and replacing him with Gerhart and DRob SMH)
Smith
both guys are ballin with their current team
The Ravens will be cutting both this off season, so if we really want them back we can have them.
Caldwell is nothing special when it comes to GM's. I'd say at best he's average. If he were a great GM we'd have a good team, regardless of how cruddy we were when he inherited it. He has hit on some decisions, but has missed on some as well.
Quote:Caldwell is nothing special when it comes to GM's. I'd say at best he's average. If he were a great GM we'd have a good team, regardless of how cruddy we were when he inherited it. He has hit on some decisions, but has missed on some as well.
How can you disregard how bad a roster he had when he inherited it? Surely that's absolutely key in the process of judging Caldwell so far?
Caldwell is 50/50.
I love the cherry-picking to prove that he is great
Quote:Caldwell is nothing special when it comes to GM's. I'd say at best he's average. If he were a great GM we'd have a good team, regardless of how cruddy we were when he inherited it. He has hit on some decisions, but has missed on some as well.
Yup, starting out with Henne and Gabbert at QB, an over the hill RB in MJD, literally nothing to speak of at WR, no pass rush to think of, an over old and [BLEEP] team....why the heck aren't you competing with that? How does it take more than a couple years to not build a juggernaut?
Just fire Caldwell already Khan. This guys has it all figured out!!!
Quote:Caldwell is nothing special when it comes to GM's. I'd say at best he's average. If he were a great GM we'd have a good team, regardless of how cruddy we were when he inherited it. He has hit on some decisions, but has missed on some as well.
I believe he didn't have a great first year but has been very solid since (not perfect of course, find me a GM who is) as a GM and I'd stick with him.
Bortles
Cann
Colvin
Greene
House
Hurns
Linder
Marks
Miller
Parnell
A Rob
T Smith
J Thomas
Walters
Yeldon
These guys are decent or better IMO and Caldwell guys. Pure talent and potential wise, we have an above average roster in the NFL.
Quote:Caldwell is 50/50.
I love the cherry-picking to prove that he is great
The cherry picking?
The 2014 draft was one of the strongest in team history, if not the strongest, kind of tbd. Last year, we got Greene late who looks like an elite punt returner. We got Yeldon who has the looks of an RB1 who made a lot of things out of nothing behind a terrible run blocking OL. We also drafted a guard in Cann who has the looks of a fixtrue at G for the long haul. That is without our top pick playing at all.
He found an elite DT in Sen for pennies in FA and locked him up on a cheap extension. He landed a good #2 corner in House that played pretty damn well this year, and that was with a non-existent pass rush. He signed Skuta on a deal that is 4-5M per who was solid at OTTO when he was out there playing. He signed Julius who was huge for the development of Blake and took a lot of pressure off of ARob and Hurnsy.
It's no cherry picking. He got a bunch of cheap FA's like Hood, Gerhart, etc. that were good gambles that didn't work out and cost next to nothing nor hurt our cap at all. You aren't going to hit on everyone you sign/pick. If you want to play the [BAD WORD REMOVED] 2013 draft class card, go check out the Ravens draft headed by Newsome, who is considered a top 5 GM in the league...that draft class was pure junk. They got Matt Elam and Arthur Brown with their top two picks, who have both been [BAD WORD REMOVED]. To be fair, Brandon Williams is working out pretty well though.