02-01-2017, 02:49 PM
02-01-2017, 02:50 PM
02-01-2017, 03:36 PM
Quote:So. Muslim Ban=No credibility.
People are being detained and some were denied lawyers.
02-01-2017, 03:38 PM
Quote:People are being detained and some were denied lawyers.
Doubtful. ACLU would be broadcasted on at least 12 networks RIGHT NOW representing these individuals as we speak if this were true. Keep in mind, being questioned for an hour != detained.
02-01-2017, 04:21 PM
Quote:I'm sure, I struggle with the idea that the government has a right to know where you as a citizen are traveling and why.
The thing is for some people, they MUST inform the government if they leave the country for any reason. What I'm talking about specifically is anyone that holds a security clearance.
Quote:Actually you'll end up in a county lock up indefinitely on a Contempt charge until you comply.
Not true. They cannot detain you unless they charge you with a crime (yet). You may not get your device back, but they can't keep you locked up.
02-01-2017, 04:29 PM
Quote:If you are speaking about CBP, they can, in fact, detain you without charges for however long their investigation takes. The next step depends on whether there are charges and you are a natural citizen. Fines, jail, denied entry, permanent ban, etc. are all possibilities, once again depending on status.
The thing is for some people, they MUST inform the government if they leave the country for any reason. What I'm talking about specifically is anyone that holds a security clearance.
Not true. They cannot detain you unless they charge you with a crime (yet). You may not get your device back, but they can't keep you locked up.
02-01-2017, 04:30 PM
Quote:I mean.... you ever heard of this guy named Snowden? An agency called the NSA?
The Patriot Act?
PRISM?
You got a smart phone? They can get it.
You driving down the street? They can see you.
Your information is no longer safe... unless you keep it off the phone, cpu, etc.
They'll tell you you can block this or do that...take out your battery, turn off GPS....
but once it's electronic it is never safe and never gone.
Unless you guys get some of that bleachbit that worked so well for Killary :teehee: :woot:
Actually it's quite easy to avoid having data taken without the right credentials. Google PGP or more specifically OpenPGP and learn how it works.
02-01-2017, 04:39 PM
Quote:If you are speaking about CBP, they can, in fact, detain you without charges for however long their investigation takes. The next step depends on whether there are charges and you are a natural citizen. Fines, jail, denied entry, permanent ban, etc. are all possibilities, once again depending on status.
CBP? Are you talking about Customs or Border Patrol? If you are a citizen then they cannot detain you without charging you with a crime. They can hold your device while they investigate, but if the right encryption is used, they will never be able to get to your data. That might mean that you will never get your device back, but they can not detain you.
02-01-2017, 04:39 PM
Quote:People are being detained and some were denied lawyers.
0.0003633
02-01-2017, 04:43 PM
Quote:CBP? Are you talking about Customs or Border Patrol? If you are a citizen then they cannot detain you without charging you with a crime. They can hold your device while they investigate, but if the right encryption is used, they will never be able to get to your data. That might mean that you will never get your device back, but they can not detain you.Customs and Border Patrol, yes.
https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail/...-authority
http://www.acluaz.org/sites/default/file...NGLISH.pdf
02-01-2017, 04:56 PM
Quote:Actually it's quite easy to avoid having data taken without the right credentials. Google PGP or more specifically OpenPGP and learn how it works.PGP protects some data on your device and throughout say a company e-mail account.
But does not protect the things that MOST people use..
G-mail, AIM, Facebook, Skype...
Apps on your phones that you allow "access" too also.
While there are encryption programs out there. I would doubt any of them are 100% safeguarding you from your government.
That also doesn't mention the "mercury rising, eagle eye" stuff if you like diving into those rabbit holes.
02-01-2017, 05:49 PM
Quote:PGP protects some data on your device and throughout say a company e-mail account.
But does not protect the things that MOST people use..
G-mail, AIM, Facebook, Skype...
Apps on your phones that you allow "access" too also.
While there are encryption programs out there. I would doubt any of them are 100% safeguarding you from your government.
That also doesn't mention the "mercury rising, eagle eye" stuff if you like diving into those rabbit holes.
Let's do some profiling for a bit.
First of all, someone that uses PGP to encrypt something probably doesn't use AIM, Facebook or Skype... at least not for malicious activity (though those programs or "apps" are probably a common target). I personally am not a fan of "whole disk encryption" where your whole hard drive is encrypted. I mainly just encrypt sensitive data that I don't want anyone to see.
Now getting to having a device "searched" by law enforcement or anyone else, even if I gave them the password to access the device, they would be able to see files, but wouldn't be able to do anything with them without the right "key".
If you're going to use encryption, just use it on the right files. It's not useful to encrypt an operating system executable, but it is useful to encrypt sensitive documents such as a spreadsheet or database file.
Most people are dumb enough to use web browsers that "remember" passwords or login credentials. Where that browser stores those files should also be encrypted.
I realize that I'm taking this thread way off topic, but the bottom line is, there is really no reason to be afraid of the government "inspecting" devices as long as you protect your own personal data.
02-01-2017, 06:06 PM
Quote:
The thing is for some people, they MUST inform the government if they leave the country for any reason. What I'm talking about specifically is anyone that holds a security clearance.
Not true. They cannot detain you unless they charge you with a crime (yet). You may not get your device back, but they can't keep you locked up.
Very true, it's happened already: http://www.abajournal.com/news/article/e...s_fifth_am
"The former officer, Francis Rawls, has not been charged with a crime. He has been held in jail for seven months after the magistrate found him in contempt of court. The magistrate said Rawls will have to remain incarcerated until he reveals the passwords. Ars Technica, Gizmodo and the Washington Post have stories."
02-01-2017, 06:19 PM
Quote:yes they can...there is a difference between being detained and arrested...they can detain you without arresting you or charging you with a crime, but you can not be arrested without being charged with a crime
The thing is for some people, they MUST inform the government if they leave the country for any reason. What I'm talking about specifically is anyone that holds a security clearance.
Not true. They cannot detain you unless they charge you with a crime (yet). You may not get your device back, but they can't keep you locked up.
"But in order to stop or “detain” someone, the police must have “reasonable suspicion”—an objectively reasonable basis to suspect that the detainee is or was involved in a crime. This isn’t a full blown arrest, such as when an officer employs handcuffs and takes the suspect to the station. Rather, it’s an interaction in which the citizen isn’t necessarily accused of a crime but also isn’t free to leave, at least until the officer indicates otherwise."
http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/w...frisk.html
02-01-2017, 06:28 PM
Quote:Very true, it's happened already: http://www.abajournal.com/news/article/e...s_fifth_am
"The former officer, Francis Rawls, has not been charged with a crime. He has been held in jail for seven months after the magistrate found him in contempt of court. The magistrate said Rawls will have to remain incarcerated until he reveals the passwords. Ars Technica, Gizmodo and the Washington Post have stories."
The difference here is that there is "probable cause" that a crime has been committed. That's a whole other issue.
02-01-2017, 06:31 PM
Quote:The difference here is that there is "probable cause" that a crime has been committed. That's a whole other issue.
Short countdown until we have magistrates sitting at airports to rubber stamp writs just like they are already doing at DUI check points. The 4th and 5th will be gone before too much longer.
02-02-2017, 10:57 AM
Quote:Fair point. BUT most Americans don't know, or just don't.
I realize that I'm taking this thread way off topic, but the bottom line is, there is really no reason to be afraid of the government "inspecting" devices as long as you protect your own personal data.
But my point is that only protects one angle.
The government is a dangerous entity and I would never feel completely safe with the NSA still being around.