Quote:I'm starting to think he's right about turning the corner quickly. I put 90% of our struggles on our offensive line. If we can fix that, and thus run the ball effectively, and protect Bortles effectively, we can win a lot of games. In my opinion.
Agree with this. The team has said they are going to spend in free agency. My guess is they go out and target a free safety like McCourty and then add two or three veteran offensive linemen.
Quote:Agree with this. The team has said they are going to spend in free agency. My guess is they go out and target a free safety like McCourty and then add two or three veteran offensive linemen.
Yeah, I agree with this... I re-watched the 1st half offense on my DVR... The O-Line rarely protects on pass plays. One time, they only rushed 3 and BB5 didn't even have time to plant his back foot before the entire pocket collapse on him for the sack. On a 3 man rush!
With that said, BB5 is still really raw at figuring out where the blitz is coming and where the single coverage is going to be. His pre-snap recognition is really lacking... Hopefully he figures it out. I wonder if the coaches are helping him enough. He seems to be making the same mistakes pre-snap now as he has at the beginning of the season.
Quote:What else is Caldwell going to say? "I sucked really bad in the last draft, this team's record is partially my fault, but I am learning on the fly here folks, so cut me some slack"
I don't think he would ever say that even if it was the truth.
Of course he is going to say "these struggles were expected, but boy when that corner is turned, it's happening quick" (buy those tickets NOW!)
Exactly. That FBT dude just eats up whatever these front office Jags people are serving. I'm still trying to find who is comparing The Joke to Tony Boselli. That appears to be a lie but I'll wait on the proof.
Boselli pro-bowl LT from day 1. Joeckel bust from day 1.
Quote:1. Beadles failures do not excuse Joeckel's failures.
2. Both holding calls were legit, and he had at least one other I saw that wasn't called.
3. He was beat more than once in pass blocking. His run support amounted to grabbing the DE's jersey as he ran away from Joeckel's block.
4. He's NOT a rookie. He played five games last year, and has had two preseasons and two years to learn the playbook, two years worth of minicamps and training camps.
A good argument can be made that his injury limited his ability to improve this year, and he should be given more time. But to claim that his play yesterday was in any way OK is flat out clueless.
No one has been saying his play was OK last Sunday. You people are ridiculous. The entire line is and with a rookie QB has been inconsistent. What do we do? Blow it all up? That is a rhetorical question, please don't answer that. I've had enough with the whining.
Quote:Boselli pro-bowl LT from day 1. Joeckel bust from day 1.
I give you credit for persistence
Quote:No one has been saying his play was OK last Sunday. You people are ridiculous. The entire line is and with a rookie QB has been inconsistent. What do we do? Blow it all up? That is a rhetorical question, please don't answer that. I've had enough with the whining.
If you rewatch the game, Joeckel stunk, a lot...he stands out quite a bit. He had more bad plays then the sack and 2 holding calls Oehser references. Heck, on the 1st or 2nd play of the game he doesn't block anyone, looks lost, and JPP blows DRob up in the backfield for a 3 yard loss. JPP comes right around Joeckel while Joke starts right (doesn't even attempt a block), has no one to block then runs toward a LB to the left and still doesn't block anyone while JPP blows up the running play that was going away fro him. If that is how the play was designed then it was one of the dumbest ever. I think Joke just missed his assignment.
There really is no defending Joeckel at this point. All fingers should be crossed that he can be a decent starter.
Quote:The person I was responding to gave a rundown on how well Joeckel played last Saturday. Did you even read the post I replied to?
To answer your question, no, we don't blow it up. We really don't know what we have with two rookies and Pasztor who played well last year but has struggled this season.
Joeckel, who is in his second year and was a very high draft pick, should be the best player on the line right now. He's a solid 4th out of five, and that only because Pasztor has slumped badly from his level last season (possibly due to injury). As you point out, the entire line has been inconsistent. This thread is about Joeckel. Joeckel has been even more 'inconsistent' than Linder, Bowanko, and Beadles.
Maybe that's Joeckel's problem.. He's playing his game on Saturday when he needs to show up on Sunday.. No wonder he stinks, he's playin 2 games a weekend, dude's wore the hell out..
Quote:If you rewatch the game, Joeckel stunk, a lot...he stands out quite a bit. He had more bad plays then the sack and 2 holding calls Oehser references. Heck, on the 1st or 2nd play of the game he doesn't block anyone, looks lost, and JPP blows DRob up in the backfield for a 3 yard loss. JPP comes right around Joeckel while Joke starts right (doesn't even attempt a block), has no one to block then runs toward a LB to the left and still doesn't block anyone while JPP blows up the running play that was going away fro him. If that is how the play was designed then it was one of the dumbest ever. I think Joke just missed his assignment.
There really is no defending Joeckel at this point. All fingers should be crossed that he can be a decent starter.
"I think I did underestimate how this is such a fast and physical game, and if you’re not full-strength it’s difficult,” [<span><span>Joeckel</span></span>] said. “Getting back to that was definitely a transition, and I still feel like I’m fighting for that.” per Bleacherreport.com.
We can see he's not playing well. I don't think anyone here is defending him in the way you guys think. He will have another season left to turn it around and see if he really hasn't been playing at full physical and mental strength.
Quote:The person I was responding to gave a rundown on how well Joeckel played last Saturday. Did you even read the post I replied to?
To answer your question, no, we don't blow it up. We really don't know what we have with two rookies and Pasztor who played well last year but has struggled this season.
Joeckel, who is in his second year and was a very high draft pick, should be the best player on the line right now. He's a solid 4th out of five, and that only because Pasztor has slumped badly from his level last season (possibly due to injury). As you point out, the entire line has been inconsistent. This thread is about Joeckel. Joeckel has been even more 'inconsistent' than Linder, Bowanko, and Beadles.
He was responding to me so I understood his point. He wasn't giving you a run down of good play, he was essentially saying that he sees enough in him to not just write him off, which you guys are already to do. Everyone is so quick to call someone a bust on this team. Just let things play out without having an aneurism when something doesn't seem right.
Man, I just watched the
Mic'd Up video of J.J. Watt from last week. There is no way that Joeckel is going to compete with this man on Sunday.
Quote:Monroe hasn't been 'terrible' for the Ravens. They chose to sign him to a long-term contract, so they must have found his play at least acceptable. He was slow changing to a zone blocking scheme, he was much better in the traditional scheme JDR and Mularkey used. BTW, the Ravens also use zone blocking, so he did eventually reach 'acceptable' as a zone blocker.
We had a known quantity in Monroe. We still don't know what we'll eventually have in Joeckel, but the results are not promising at this point.
No seriously though he has been bad lol. He was not worth the money. It was either pay him or play Oher who has been terrible.
Quote:For his draft position, he needs to be a reliable starter or future Pro-Bowler who doesn't allow sacks (or extremely rare) and can run block well. He needs to be a leader on the offensive line and make those around him better. BB should not have to worry about the rush coming from his blind side. That's why you draft a guy as high as Joeckel.
This is wrong. You draft a LT that high because A player with that skill set doesn't exist past the top of the second round if you are lucky. If he develops into a starter after three years then it was a great pick. Anything above decent play from that is gravy on top.
I think the issue with a lot of people here is the expectations for players. I'm curious to find out who the masses think is the best LT in the league right now. Even that best LT gets beat occasionally. To think a second year player is to not give up sacks and play mistake free is asking to much.
Quote:This is wrong. You draft a LT that high because A player with that skill set doesn't exist past the top of the second round if you are lucky. If he develops into a starter after three years then it was a great pick. Anything above decent play from that is gravy on top.
I think the issue with a lot of people here is the expectations for players. I'm curious to find out who the masses think is the best LT in the league right now. Even that best LT gets beat occasionally. To think a second year player is to not give up sacks and play mistake free is asking to much.
If you're OK picking a player at #2 overall in any draft and calling it success if they can simply start on a team then I don't know what to tell you.
Is it an utter failure if they are at least a starter? No... But when you draft someone that high the intent and expectation is Pro-Bowl caliber. You only get so many high draft picks and you've got to hit on more than you miss, especially in the early rounds.
I also think you haven't watched Joeckel enough. It's not just that he's not perfect, it's that he's not playing well. As much as Oehser downplays Joeckel's struggles he doesn't portray a fair depiction of his play. Go rewatch the film and see how many plays you'd consider good versus bad plays by Joeckel.
I will tell you that I was even surprised at how many times he gets rushed over, whiffs or ends up on the ground as he lunges at a guy trying to block and completely misses. I think most people agree that he may develop in another year or 2, BUT, at this point, you cannot make a case that the arrow is pointing up for him. He has "youth" and "possibility" going for him but that's it right now.
Quote:This is wrong. You draft a LT that high because A player with that skill set doesn't exist past the top of the second round if you are lucky. If he develops into a starter after three years then it was a great pick. Anything above decent play from that is gravy on top.
I think the issue with a lot of people here is the expectations for players. I'm curious to find out who the masses think is the best LT in the league right now. Even that best LT gets beat occasionally. To think a second year player is to not give up sacks and play mistake free is asking to much.
Joe Thomas, Tyron Smith and Jason Peters
Quote:Joe Thomas, Tyron Smith and Jason Peters
Joe staley not bad either
Jake Long is ok
Brandon Albert was good
Trent williams
I re-watched the game this afternoon. As I expected, Joeckel didn't have one of his better games. I think the holding call before the half was just a really bad call by the ref. With that said, he looked a little tentative at times, he gave up a couple of sacks that I saw and got knocked off the blocks on two running plays. While I have to laugh at the people who think he's garbage, I have to agree that he's not close to playing up to his draft position. A game like this makes you understand the hyperbole of the less objective fans, but he's hardly the worst lineman ever. I think his worst sin for some people is that he's not Boselli. I am starting to agree that he may *never* live up to his draft position though which is unfortunate but that's how it goes sometimes.