Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Quote:You just did though.

No I didn't.

Quote:No kidding. Where's our parade?

 

It's scheduled during white history month.

Quote:A few celebrities decided to come out and declare they were proud to be straight.  They got hammered by the same crowd that will holler intolerance if you don't embrace Sam as a hero.

I didn't say that, and if true, doesn't surprise me.

Quote:No I didn't.

 

Sure you did.  You just told everyone here you liked women.

I think it's cute how posters on this board that are usually at odds on everything else like TMD and FBT can come together in ignorance on a non-issue such as someone kissing their boyfriend on TV.


If coming out is such a boon to Michael Sam's career, then why didn't any of the other gay players rush to be the first player to announce their sexual orientation?


There's no agenda here. You're reaching, hard.

Quote:It's scheduled during white history month.

 

I chuckled....

 

but you have a point. 

 

If gays want to merely be accepted as "the rest of the world", then don't act as if you're superior or try to force everything into being universally applauded. Again, I blame the media for exploiting/ agenda pushing. The media are a big reason I have some of the feelings I do. The more they try to force this mindthink down our collective throats, the more I dig my heels in the sand. If they were less aggressive with the agenda pushing, I think it would actually be more beneficial to their cause with the average person. 

Quote:I think it's cute how posters on this board that are usually at odds on everything else like TMD and FBT can come together in ignorance on a non-issue such as someone kissing their boyfriend on TV.


If coming out is such a boon to Michael Sam's career, then why didn't any of the other gay players rush to be the first player to announce their sexual orientation?


There's no agenda here. You're reaching, hard.

 

Nobody said it was a "boon" for his career.  I know my point was that HE made a STRATEGICAL decision to come out thinking it might help his draft stock.  Never said anything about a career boon. 

 

Based on draft analysis, the odds were he wasn't going to get drafted.  They don't put television cameras in the homes of guys waiting on calls to pick a team after going un-drafted.  The networks were going to do everything they could to get him drafted, including running multiple packages on draft day, and constantly referencing him throughout the final day of the draft.

 

To say there is no agenda here is about the same as shoving your head in the sand.  There are multiple agendas at play here, both for Sam, and for the networks.  To deny that is the real ignorance here.

Quote:Serious inquiry here. Why is there a need to "come out" publicly? I don't understand it. I never felt the need to come out and say I was attracted to women at a certain point.

 

Let me take a shot. Being attracted to a woman is a given; it's expected.

 

By coming out as gay he's trying to show that such a situation can be looked at as ok, as not bizarre and heinous. Despite all the laws against gays, all the religious condemnation (and persecution), all the jokes, all the "get out of my house and never come back!", all the crap, that being gay is just the way some people are - not a choice any more than you chose to have brown eyes.

 

And he's a football player! If people can accept football players as being gay, perhaps they can accept them as being ok. Different, but ok. 

 

You know, like being Jewish, lol. The ignorance of us non-Jews about what being Jewish is all about is, to me at least, similar to what we heterosexuals know about being homosexual. 

Quote:Let me take a shot. Being attracted to a woman is a given; it's expected.

 

By coming out as gay he's trying to show that such a situation can be looked at as ok, as not bizarre and heinous. Despite all the laws against gays, all the religious condemnation (and persecution), all the jokes, all the "get out of my house and never come back!", all the crap, that being gay is just the way some people are - not a choice any more than you chose to have brown eyes.

 

And he's a football player! If people can accept football players as being gay, perhaps they can accept them as being ok. Different, but ok. 

 

You know, like being Jewish, lol. The ignorance of us non-Jews about what being Jewish is all about is, to me at least, similar to what we heterosexuals know about being homosexual. 

 

 

 

Did he need to make a spectacle of himself in order to show how ordinary it is to be a gay football player? 

Quote:Did he need to make a spectacle of himself in order to show how ordinary it is to be a gay football player? 

 

b i n g o

 

 

I think he would have furthered his cause better (with the average person) had he simply took a lower profile and acted like it was no big deal himself. 

Quote:Did he need to make a spectacle of himself in order to show how ordinary it is to be a gay football player? 

 

ESPN made a spectacle of him.  Not himself.  He's stayed out of the media until draft day for the most part.  

Quote:The league has issued a mandate that there is a zero tolerance policy being employed for those who present a tone of intolerance over this issue.  If players have an opinion, they'd better learn to keep it to themselves.

 

You act surprised. You buying into TMD's victimology?

 

These are public companies relying on the goodwill of it's customers. How would your company feel about you stating your dislike for a fellow employee for no reason than his sexual orientation? Should it be ok to profess support for a fellow neo-Nazi? A company shouldn't have the right to discipline it's members for conduct detrimental to it's image or it's employees?

 

It's not a constitutional right to have a job in the NFL. Or to own an NBA team. 

Quote:Did he need to make a spectacle of himself in order to show how ordinary it is to be a gay football player? 

 

I find it quite sad that the Jaguars are condoning this sort of bigoted outlook by maintaining you as a moderator of the message board.

 

Does it bother you when they show the other prospects embrace and kiss their female partner?

Quote:b i n g o

 

 

I think he would have furthered his cause better had he simply took a lower profile and acted like it was no big deal himself. 

 

Yeah, stay in the closet. Is that how you live your life - turn away from what doesn't fit into "how things should be"?

Quote:I love that!!!!! Soooooooooo true. 

Yes it is reasonable to be interolerant of other people's lifestyle and views. I don't have a problem with different people's views. I also think it's ok for employers not accept intollerence and take action against it.

Quote:You act surprised. You buying into TMD's victimology?

 

These are public companies relying on the goodwill of it's customers. How would your company feel about you stating your dislike for a fellow employee for no reason than his sexual orientation? Should it be ok to profess support for a fellow neo-Nazi? A company shouldn't have the right to discipline it's members for conduct detrimental to it's image or it's employees?

 

It's not a constitutional right to have a job in the NFL. Or to own an NBA team. 

 

No, but free speech is a constitutional right.  And what you say and do outside of your job, your employer should not be able to hold you accountable for.  

 

One should be free, without fear of reprisal, to have their own beliefs and freedom of speech. A business shouldn't be able to fire someone for something legal that they did on their own time.  If it was something illegal, then absolutely.  

Quote:I agree that employers shouldn't be allowed to punish employees for things they say on their own time.  It's why my wife doesn't have a facebook account (and why I don't have one either).  Anything you say or post could get you in trouble.  But it's not just a problem with the NFL.  And unfortunately what he said reflected on the NFL more than most of these cases reflect on their employers.  

And this is the jist of my issue.

 

Whether we post our beliefs publicly, or privately, the NFL at some point must realize there is going to be a political backlash from censoring people with respectful different POV's.

 

I get the fact the NFL is paranoid about this issue right now.

 

Quote:The league has issued a mandate that there is a zero tolerance policy being employed for those who present a tone of intolerance over this issue.  If players have an opinion, they'd better learn to keep it to themselves.

 

If the NFL is comfortable going this route, they must understand the potential interest they lose from the average paying customer/fan who is just interested in the game action, not the TMZ-like social agenda being pushed in the league.

 

For the record, im supportive of Sam being allowed to be open and practice his sexuality, but there should also be a player ie Sam Bradford, etc who should be given equal opportunity to practice his beliefs and views on sexuality.

 

Quote:It's scheduled during white history month.

This.

 

Im invited right?

Quote:I find it quite sad that the Jaguars are condoning this sort of bigoted outlook by maintaining you as a moderator of the message board.

 

 

Bigoted outlook?? 

 

I'm guessing FBT is pro-traditional relationships....

 

AGAIN., One can have that view WITHOUT HATING the other side. I am SO TIRED of the assertion otherwise. To label all those who simply have a different view as HATERS is a trick eaten up by the sheep. 

Quote:ESPN made a spectacle of him.  Not himself.  He's stayed out of the media until draft day for the most part.  

In my oppinion this is about the kiss. I think this is the "sepctacle" they are refering to. Or, at least, it sure seems that wya.

Quote:No, but free speech is a constitutional right.  And what you say and do outside of your job, your employer should not be able to hold you accountable for.  

 

One should be free, without fear of reprisal, to have their own beliefs and freedom of speech. A business shouldn't be able to fire someone for something legal that they did on their own time.  If it was something illegal, then absolutely.  

 

Come on, I already know you're smarter than this. You know what the first amendment protects and what it doesn't.

 

Quote:Bigoted outlook?? 

 

I'm guessing FBT is pro-traditional relationships....

 

AGAIN., One can have that view WITHOUT HATING the other side. I am SO TIRED of the assertion otherwise. To label all those who simply have a different view as HATERS is a trick eaten up by the sheep. 

 


<b>bigot</b> (ˈbɪɡət)

 

—<b><i>n</i></b>

 

a person who is intolerant of any ideas other than his or her own, esp on religion, politics, or race