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it wont matter who we sign in free agency if Bortles is a bust.  this whole thing rises or falls with him.  I think that is a flawed plan.  we need a plan B.

Quote:it wont matter who we sign in free agency if Bortles is a bust. this whole thing rises or falls with him. I think that is a flawed plan. we need a plan B.

No way Bortles is a bust. He's showing that he has both the tangibles and intangibles to be a quality QB in this league. The dude's already shown some pretty nice flashes, he's just having a rough rookie year.


That being said, whether or not he lives up to the position he was drafted at, that's another story.

Quote:No way Bortles is a bust. He's showing that he has both the tangibles and intangibles to be a quality QB in this league. The dude's already shown some pretty nice flashes, he's just having a rough rookie year.


That being said, whether or not he lives up to the position he was drafted at, that's another story.

There is a way. I mean, we've already seen this movie twice now. (Leftwich, Gabbert)

Quote:No way Bortles is a bust. He's showing that he has both the tangibles and intangibles to be a quality QB in this league. The dude's already shown some pretty nice flashes, he's just having a rough rookie year.


That being said, whether or not he lives up to the position he was drafted at, that's another story.

 

I agree.

 

He's already the best thing we've had in Jax since Garrard  - and with only moderate improvement in his game and from those protecting him - we should be able to say  "the best QB in Jax since Brunell."  

 

I'm confident we don't need to place any great emphasis on a plan B quarterback.  

Quote:How can you win when your GM surrounds you with crap? The first orders of business by the new GM were to get rid of a few guys.

 

Rashad Jennings (starting RB for Giants)

Darryl Smith (starting LB for Ravens)

Brandon Marshall (starting LB for Broncos)

Terrance Knighton (starting DT for Broncos)

Rashean Mathis (starting CB for Lions)

Eugene Monroe (starting OT for Ravens)

Dawan Landry (starting SS for Jets)

 

Who did he replace most of those guys with? Rookies and cheap signings even when the Jags had the most cap space in the league. Gus cannot win with a second rate team. The fact that this team is still playing hard speaks volumes of how they feel about Gus. The Raiders have basically given up after getting their one W to get them out of the 0-16 discussion. The Titans have basically given up as well. The Jags were down big early and could have given up, but they didn't. Gus deserves another year and hopefully Caldwell decides to use some of the cap space to give Gus a chance to succeed.

 

The first thing a new GM did was get rid of players on the roster? Stunned.

Quote:There is a way. I mean, we've already seen this movie twice now. (Leftwich, Gabbert)

 

You are only fooling yourself if you think Bortles at this point anything like Gabbert

The Leftwich and Gabbert eras were entirely different. Leftwich left here with a winning record... Where our franchise has been since then (minus 07) make me hope Bortles can be at least as good as lefty. He certainly has the potential.

Quote:You are only fooling yourself if you think Bortles at this point anything like Gabbert

All three guys are really different. I was just comparing them as the "franchise" guys we have drafted early and hoped to be good.

Bortles looks legit and has potential.  He has to prove he can cut down on the ints.

 

The oline has been horrendous with receivers making terrible mistakes.  I think he will be a good player with more talent around him. 


Will caldwell sign the talent or continue to be a cheapskate in free agency?  We will see

I don't think Caldwell is necessarily cheap in the free agent market, I just think his plan is to build through the draft and fill holes in free agency. The problem is it's hard to find stellar talent in free agency. Most of the stellar guys are franchised or resigned with their old teams.

 

He went after Mack which would have made him the highest paid center in the league but Cleveland matched. That's not an indication of being cheap.

 

Regards......................the Chiefjag

Quote:I agree.

 

He's already the best thing we've had in Jax since Garrard  - and with only moderate improvement in his game and from those protecting him - we should be able to say  "the best QB in Jax since Brunell."  

 

I'm confident we don't need to place any great emphasis on a plan B quarterback.  

 

 

I disagree with that last sentence. 

 

Injuries are too frequent in this league. I'm equally confident in Bortles going forward as you are, but I think we need to get another quality developmental QB in here as insurance. Nothing is guaranteed for either Bortles health or even panning out, despite the confidence we both have in him. 

 

I don't want to have Henne as the backup and only tangible other QB on this roster in 2015. Cut bait after this year. 

I'm with Chiefjag.  Caldwell has been "smart" in FA.  Not "cheap." 

 

That said - both Caldwell and Khan have made public statements about being more aggressive in free agency in the coming offseason. 

Have some of you just missed this?  I'm surprised by the number od posts over the past month questioning DC being "cheap again?"

 

They are going to aggressively go after some free agent starters in a few months, people.  There's no reason to doubt that. 

Quote:I don't think Caldwell is necessarily cheap in the free agent market, I just think his plan is to build through the draft and fill holes in free agency. The problem is it's hard to find stellar talent in free agency. Most of the stellar guys are franchised or resigned with their old teams.

 

He went after Mack which would have made him the highest paid center in the league but Cleveland matched. That's not an indication of being cheap.

 

Regards......................the Chiefjag

Looking at Caldwells record it's hard for him to find talent in the draft as well.  I understand he wants to build through the draft but the Jaguars are a unique situation.  This team is so far from being a good team the draft is not enough.  Right now this team looks atleast 3 drafts away from being a playoff team.  I don't know if Khan or the fans will continue to be patient.  Thie team needs help while I do agree it's hard to find studs in Free Agency there are often times good players on the market.  This team has passed on some chances to improve this team.

Quote:I disagree with that last sentence. 

 

Injuries are too frequent in this league. I'm equally confident in Bortles going forward as you are, but I think we need to get another quality developmental QB in here as insurance. Nothing is guaranteed for either Bortles health or even panning out, despite the confidence we both have in him. 

 

I don't want to have Henne as the backup and only tangible other QB on this roster in 2015. Cut bait after this year. 

 

I expect they'll have a late round or UDFA coming in to camp at QB if they don't feel good about Henne and/or Morris being that guy.  That's what I meant by  "don't need to place great emphasis."   I'm not saying "don't have a developmental back-up you believe in."  I'm saying don't waste an early or mid-round pick on it. 

 

They do have the money to sign a vet back-up with more upside than Henne if they can find one as well.  Signing such a guy to a deal similar to Henne's would be fine as well, IMO. 

Quote:Looking at Caldwells record it's hard for him to find talent in the draft as well.  I understand he wants to build through the draft but the Jaguars are a unique situation.  This team is so far from being a good team the draft is not enough.  Right now this team looks atleast 3 drafts away from being a playoff team.  I don't know if Khan or the fans will continue to be patient.  Thie team needs help while I do agree it's hard to find studs in Free Agency there are often times good players on the market.  This team has passed on some chances to improve this team.

 

I think Caldwell has done well in the draft overall. Not perfect, but who is? 

 

He's found a pair of good starting CB in McCray and Colvin (or soon to be starter). 

 

He's brought in a solid rookie WR entire starting 3. (again, or soon to be) 

 

He's found a really good rookie RG and I think what will prove to be good Center. 

 

He found one of the 3 future LB in Telvin. 

 

Gratz and Cyprien at the very least will be good depth even if this is the best they are. 

 

Bortles to me looks like he could be a really good QB in this league matched up with an OC that actually plays to the big armed QB's strengths. 

 

Ryan Davis and Branch aren't Caldwell picks, but are definitely part of the future in some fashion, I'd think. Sen Derrick Marks has been outstanding. 

 

I don't see Caldwell as an issue really much at all, to be honest. 

 

He even did the questionable FA of Beadles and Gerhart right - as they both can be cut after one season with minimal impact capwise. 

Quote:I think Caldwell has done well in the draft overall. Not perfect, but who is? 

 

He's found a pair of good starting CB in McCray and Colvin (or soon to be starter). 

 

He's brought in a solid rookie WR entire starting 3. (again, or soon to be) 

 

He's found a really good rookie RG and I think what will prove to be good Center. 

 

He found one of the 3 future LB in Telvin. 

 

Gratz and Cyprien at the very least will be good depth even if this is the best they are. 

 

Bortles to me looks like he could be a really good QB in this league matched up with an OC that actually plays to the big armed QB's strengths. 

 

Ryan Davis and Branch aren't Caldwell picks, but are definitely part of the future in some fashion, I'd think. Sen Derrick Marks has been outstanding. 

 

I don't see Caldwell as an issue really much at all, to be honest. 

 

He even did the questionable FA of Beadles and Gerhart right - as they both can be cut after one season with minimal impact capwise. 

There is potential but until proven it's just that.  I would call Caldwells drafts inconclusive right now.  We have seen players like Leftwich, Reggie Nelson/Williams, Gabbert, etc that showed promise in the rookie seasons and bombed.  The Simple fact is the Jags have maybe one pro bowl type of player and that is Marks.  This team is seriously still void of talent after 2 offseasons.

Quote:There is potential but until proven it's just that.  I would call Caldwells drafts inconclusive right now.  We have seen players like Leftwich, Reggie Nelson/Williams, Gabbert, etc that showed promise in the rookie seasons and bombed.  The Simple fact is the Jags have maybe one pro bowl type of player and that is Marks.  This team is seriously still void of talent after 2 offseasons.

 

Well, I don't see how if I can't label those players for the positive side because of you citing it being to early to call, then how come you can make the definitive sort of comment in the other direction regarding same players? If its too early to call, its too early to call. Both ways. 

Quote:I think Caldwell has done well in the draft overall. Not perfect, but who is? 

 

He's found a pair of good starting CB in McCray and Colvin (or soon to be starter). 

 

He's brought in a solid rookie WR entire starting 3. (again, or soon to be) 

 

He's found a really good rookie RG and I think what will prove to be good Center. 

 

He found one of the 3 future LB in Telvin. 

 

Gratz and Cyprien at the very least will be good depth even if this is the best they are. 

 

Bortles to me looks like he could be a really good QB in this league matched up with an OC that actually plays to the big armed QB's strengths. 

 

Ryan Davis and Branch aren't Caldwell picks, but are definitely part of the future in some fashion, I'd think. Sen Derrick Marks has been outstanding. 

 

I don't see Caldwell as an issue really much at all, to be honest. 

 

He even did the questionable FA of Beadles and Gerhart right - as they both can be cut after one season with minimal impact capwise. 

 

Caldwell is a huge upgrade over our last GM, and you shouldn't get an argument from any Jags fan around.

 

He has brought in some decent talent and some of the rookies that were drafted are actually making plays and putting up better rookie numbers then past rookies under the last GM.

 

You're right, no GM is perfect and no one can expect him to be, but he has definitely brought in talent in the 2 years he has been here.

 

It's up to the coaches to get the maximum out of the talent he has brought to the Jags and if the current coaching staff is unable to do that, well then, at some point it will be time to give another coaching staff an opportunity to do just that.

 

Caldwell/Khan will just have to decide when that time will be.

Quote:Well, I don't see how if I can't label those players for the positive side because of you citing it being to early to call, then how come you can make the definitive sort of comment in the other direction regarding same players? If its too early to call, its too early to call. Both ways. 

The difference is I am judging the current team while you are looking at a possible future team.  This team is dead last in so many offensive categories.  The current team stinks

Quote:Looking at Caldwells record it's hard for him to find talent in the draft as well.

 

 

 

Yawn.  I respect a dissenting opinion, but you are just bashing for the hell of it now.  

 

2013's draft has a few question marks, but if Cyprien and Joeckel get on track, it's a very good draft. 

2014 is looking like a flippin' grand slam.  

 

Looking at this list, I don't remember the last time I saw a Jags GM bring in that much young talent in a two year span.  Even if three or four of these guys don't become starters or important contributors. 

 

Luke Joeckel

Jonathan Cyprien 

Denard Robinson

Demetrius McCray

Abry Jones

Blake Bortles

Marqise Lee

Allen Robinson

Brandon Linder

Aaron Colvin

Telvin Smith

Allen Hurns