Visiting Patriots fan here. I largely agree with the original post. The analysis is pretty much right.
Shorten the game, and take the pocket from Brady because that is where he is strongest. He can't really do anything once you collapse the pocket. This is easy to say, but very hard to do for 60 minutes. Very few teams can do it. I think Jacksonville has the potential to pull it off. It should be a great fight. Caughlin is Belichick's achilles heel!
On the other side of the ball, Belichick will funnel his energy into taking away your best offensive weapon, and force you to win with your second best weapon. I frankly don't know what that means in your particular case, so am curious what you guys think. We play bend but don't break: giving up yards like they are free beer, but very stingy with points.
(01-16-2018, 02:05 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 02:00 PM)Tailgater Wrote: [ -> ]As a 25yr Pats STH, I can't stand most of our fans, at least those under 40. They are so spoiled and have never even experienced a season with a losing record. Is that nuts or what? Add in the success the other teams in town have had (Sox, Celts, & Bruins) and it's hard to have a decent conversation with them.
I stopped going to home games 3 years ago because of that crowd. If the Pats go 3 and out twice, they boo them off the field! In the rare instances where they are behind at home, these fans leave in droves in the 3rd qtr.
When those same fans post of rivals boards, they present the same attitude. I don't bother reading them. No worries - they'll disappear when the inevitable happens (Brady & BB gone).
Jags are a talented, well coached team. They earned the right to play this weekend. Here's hoping the game comes down to the final minutes and the winner goes to SB 52 healthy.
Thank you for the decency, sir.
I always wondered why those old Grogan/Francis/Hannah/Fox/Clayborn/Nelson teams didn't have more success.
What is your take on those teams, and what do you think the keys to this game will be?
Ah, the good old days, when, for the most part, the Pats were the laughingstock of the NFL, mostly because of their ownership and their lousy choices for head coaches (for the most part. When they did nab a good one like Fairbanks, they lost them.
Loved the teams they put together in the mid-70's. Grogan was indestructible. Still see him walking about in town (I work in Foxboro). Surly [BLEEP], but his connection with Russ Francis & Stanley Morgan was a thing to behold! Sam Bam Cunningham, John Hannah, Tim Fox, Mike Haynes...damn they had talent. Should have had at least one SB trophy, but no such luck.
This weekends game? It'll be tight until the 4th qtr. If Brady is still standing, I expect the Pats will win. If he's been beaten down enough to get happy feet? jags have a good chance. I don't expect the horrific coaching decisions, horrible clock management, etc, we've seen from other teams in the past. That's worth 7pts right there, if not more.
I do expect the Pats to win. Hard to beat them at home in the playoffs. I just hope there are no injuries and that the refs keep the flags in their pocket. Those two calls last week helped take the Titans out of the game. Both were bogus calls.
(01-16-2018, 02:57 PM)neuronet Wrote: [ -> ]Visiting Patriots fan here. I largely agree with the original post. The analysis is pretty much right.
Shorten the game, and take the pocket from Brady because that is where he is strongest. He can't really do anything once you collapse the pocket. This is easy to say, but very hard to do for 60 minutes. Very few teams can do it. I think Jacksonville has the potential to pull it off. It should be a great fight. Caughlin is Belichick's achilles heel!
On the other side of the ball, Belichick will funnel his energy into taking away your best offensive weapon, and force you to win with your second best weapon. I frankly don't know what that means in your particular case, so am curious what you guys think. We play bend but don't break: giving up yards like they are free beer, but very stingy with points.
I think playing bend defense against this offense is a mistake. You don't want this team anywhere near the redzone
(01-16-2018, 01:29 PM)Boston_Prince Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 01:18 PM)Kane Wrote: [ -> ]Right, just letting us know how much better your team is. Bringing up the tack game. Countering what we've done well with remarks about the teams we beat being not that good or not as good as the Pats....
We get it... Tom Turrific and co are perfect.
It's OK though...
we're the red headed step child of the league. And apparently the team wears it like a badge of honor.
Believe it or not, the Patriots can also be called the red headed step child. Goodell hates Bill and the world hates the Patriots.
(01-16-2018, 01:43 PM)BostonBlackie Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 01:39 PM)Kane Wrote: [ -> ]All year long we've been not good enough to most pundits. Only recently have more jumped on board.
It was the D is good, but the run D.......
Then it was But Blake Bortles is still their QB
then it was the end of the season skid....
then only putting up 10 VS Bills
then its "oh but you let one of the best offenses score 42"
Now we're hearing you guys will just do what the sorry tacks did...
or... our offense won't be able to move the ball like we did vs the steelers to your D.
That's OK though really. I wouldn't expect a Pats fan to give the Jags a chance in Hell. And I wouldn't expect most media types to change their tune going into a game facing the previous SB winner.
But when you guys come on here and tell us all the things going great with your team, you're going to be met with relative disdain and be treated as hostile.
You aren't trolling though, which is nice.
Just have your head shoved up Tom's turrific anus so you can't see the [BLEEP] storm heading to Bawstun
Clean up your act. Playing the victim card is out of date.
You might want to think about taking your own advice...
(01-16-2018, 01:59 PM)Kane Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 01:49 PM)Boston_Prince Wrote: [ -> ]Well, please show me where I showed any kind of smugness? All I did was follow his post crapping on our defense with a true statement. If I'm banned for that then so what. I havent said one bad thing about your team since I've been here. i'm having a good discussion with fans from another team. Thats all
And that's fine and dandy dude.
I really couldn't give two flips less.
There's more of one of you posters.
And like I said before, I won't be playing nice......so kudos to you for not being another troll.
But you're still just a Cheatriots fan to me
And since you're one of a few Pats fans that came to our board... you draw the ire for all the [BLEEP] Pats fans out there. You draw the ire of all the years Brady has straight owned us. You draw the heat that any other Pats fan, poster, player, or coach ever caused.
And I think Blackie was the one who spoke with smugness.
Only 5 days left though... and I imagine you'll disappear like the bills, squealers, and tack fans that made their way to the danger zone.
Good comeback. We've been making the Steelers and Bills fans disappear, better than anyone else has. Again, welcome to the NFL.
After reading this thread, I’ve determined that Patriots fans think their 29th ranked defense is good and our 6th ranked offense is just OK. They also seem to believe that Gronk is indefensible, and our defense isn’t physical enough to stand toe to toe with him.
I hope the Patriots are this arrogant when gameplanning the Jags.
(01-16-2018, 03:19 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]After reading this thread, I’ve determined that Patriots fans think their 29th ranked defense is good and our 6th ranked offense is just OK. They also seem to believe that Gronk is indefensible, and our defense isn’t physical enough to stand toe to toe with him.
I hope the Patriots are this arrogant when gameplanning the Jags.
Most important defensive stat is points allowed, not yards. As a matter of fact, been the BEST defense with regards to points the last few months. But honestly, you really don't need a GREAT defense to stop Blake Bortles. Alot of your team's points came from defensive scoring. Our offense can actually score points with legit drives.
And its a good thing that we are ALL just fans and nothing we say has nothing to do with how a team gameplans.
(01-16-2018, 03:02 PM)jagshype Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 02:57 PM)neuronet Wrote: [ -> ]Visiting Patriots fan here. I largely agree with the original post. The analysis is pretty much right.
Shorten the game, and take the pocket from Brady because that is where he is strongest. He can't really do anything once you collapse the pocket. This is easy to say, but very hard to do for 60 minutes. Very few teams can do it. I think Jacksonville has the potential to pull it off. It should be a great fight. Caughlin is Belichick's achilles heel!
On the other side of the ball, Belichick will funnel his energy into taking away your best offensive weapon, and force you to win with your second best weapon. I frankly don't know what that means in your particular case, so am curious what you guys think. We play bend but don't break: giving up yards like they are free beer, but very stingy with points.
I think playing bend defense against this offense is a mistake. You don't want this team anywhere near the redzone
Stop Fournette and honestly, thats it. Bortles may make a few scrambling plays here and there but your offense isn't the issue here. When people hear the jaguars, they immediately see that defense, not the offense. But to your obvious point, no team plays a defense willingly giving up yards for red-zone attempts, just happens to be one of our team's strong points. We are second, right under your team in the redzone.
(01-16-2018, 03:29 PM)Boston_Prince Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 03:02 PM)jagshype Wrote: [ -> ]I think playing bend defense against this offense is a mistake. You don't want this team anywhere near the redzone
Stop Fournette and honestly, thats it. Bortles may make a few scrambling plays here and there but your offense isn't the issue here. When people hear the jaguars, they immediately see that defense, not the offense. But to your obvious point, no team plays a defense willingly giving up yards for red-zone attempts, just happens to be one of our team's strong points. We are second, right under your team in the redzone.
Mike Tomlin, is that you?
(01-16-2018, 03:29 PM)Boston_Prince Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 03:02 PM)jagshype Wrote: [ -> ]I think playing bend defense against this offense is a mistake. You don't want this team anywhere near the redzone
Stop Fournette and honestly, thats it. Bortles may make a few scrambling plays here and there but your offense isn't the issue here. When people hear the jaguars, they immediately see that defense, not the offense. But to your obvious point, no team plays a defense willingly giving up yards for red-zone attempts, just happens to be one of our team's strong points. We are second, right under your team in the redzone.
Jaguars without Fournette, 3-0.
Gosh, I wonder how that happened since "that's it".
(01-16-2018, 03:32 PM)Rico Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 03:29 PM)Boston_Prince Wrote: [ -> ]Stop Fournette and honestly, thats it. Bortles may make a few scrambling plays here and there but your offense isn't the issue here. When people hear the jaguars, they immediately see that defense, not the offense. But to your obvious point, no team plays a defense willingly giving up yards for red-zone attempts, just happens to be one of our team's strong points. We are second, right under your team in the redzone.
Jaguars without Fournette, 3-0.
Gosh, I wonder how that happened since "that's it".
i stand by my comment. Who else really scares you on that offense? Not being funny, but seriously. There is no one else who truly stands out on your offense. I will say Yeldon (spell) is decent as well but you really can't be surprised by that comment.
(01-16-2018, 03:30 PM)JNev Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 03:29 PM)Boston_Prince Wrote: [ -> ]Stop Fournette and honestly, thats it. Bortles may make a few scrambling plays here and there but your offense isn't the issue here. When people hear the jaguars, they immediately see that defense, not the offense. But to your obvious point, no team plays a defense willingly giving up yards for red-zone attempts, just happens to be one of our team's strong points. We are second, right under your team in the redzone.
Mike Tomlin, is that you?
Nah, however, we own him.
But you can't be mad at that, stop Fournette and the run and force Bortles to throw. We aren't the Steelers, I promise and our run defense is better than theirs. Steelers got behind fast via turnovers, Big Ben is know for those but not Brady. No disrespect but your offense doesn't scare anyone and is the weakness of your team. Thats a fact.
(01-16-2018, 03:42 PM)Boston_Prince Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 03:32 PM)Rico Wrote: [ -> ]Jaguars without Fournette, 3-0.
Gosh, I wonder how that happened since "that's it".
i stand by my comment. Who else really scares you on that offense? Not being funny, but seriously. There is no one else who truly stands out on your offense. I will say Yeldon (spell) is decent as well but you really can't be surprised by that comment.
(01-16-2018, 03:30 PM)JNev Wrote: [ -> ]Mike Tomlin, is that you?
Nah, however, we own him.
But you can't be mad at that, stop Fournette and the run and force Bortles to throw. We aren't the Steelers, I promise and our run defense is better than theirs. Steelers got behind fast via turnovers, Big Ben is know for those but not Brady. No disrespect but your offense doesn't scare anyone and is the weakness of your team. Thats a fact.
By the same token, who's scary on the Pats? Gronk & Brady. Yet, add up all the pieces and it makes for a productive, hard to stop offense. Lots of talent, but only 2 stars on offense.
I'm tot familiar enough with the Jags O to even guess who will step up...Ivory, Hilton?
(01-16-2018, 03:42 PM)Boston_Prince Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 03:32 PM)Rico Wrote: [ -> ]Jaguars without Fournette, 3-0.
Gosh, I wonder how that happened since "that's it".
i stand by my comment. Who else really scares you on that offense? Not being funny, but seriously. There is no one else who truly stands out on your offense. I will say Yeldon (spell) is decent as well but you really can't be surprised by that comment.
(01-16-2018, 03:30 PM)JNev Wrote: [ -> ]Mike Tomlin, is that you?
Nah, however, we own him.
But you can't be mad at that, stop Fournette and the run and force Bortles to throw. We aren't the Steelers, I promise and our run defense is better than theirs. Steelers got behind fast via turnovers, Big Ben is know for those but not Brady. No disrespect but your offense doesn't scare anyone and is the weakness of your team. Thats a fact.
The offensive line has been great, allowing the team to lead the league in rushing and control flow of games, even in Fournette's absence. I see you like big name offensive specialists and undervalue the trenches where football is really played. The Jags O line just shut out a league best Steeler D line in sacks, while paving the way to 45 points for their 'weak' O, in tough Heinz Field. The weak O, as a unit were 6th or so in points this year, scoring 30+ points routinely. For a team saturated with no-names you sure display depth in reasoning. And it's lovely how your D is not a 'weakness' relative to your amazing one-man O, while expecting opposing fans to highlight their perceived weaknesses. #CharminglyDenseWithoutRealizingIt
(01-16-2018, 03:24 PM)Boston_Prince Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 03:19 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]After reading this thread, I’ve determined that Patriots fans think their 29th ranked defense is good and our 6th ranked offense is just OK. They also seem to believe that Gronk is indefensible, and our defense isn’t physical enough to stand toe to toe with him.
I hope the Patriots are this arrogant when gameplanning the Jags.
Most important defensive stat is points allowed, not yards. As a matter of fact, been the BEST defense with regards to points the last few months. But honestly, you really don't need a GREAT defense to stop Blake Bortles. Alot of your team's points came from defensive scoring. Our offense can actually score points with legit drives.
And its a good thing that we are ALL just fans and nothing we say has nothing to do with how a team gameplans.
This is a strange critique.
We scored 417 points total (5th overall). Our defense scored seven (7) TDs or 49 points. I'm no math major, but that's not even 12 percent of our points, if my math done in my head is correct.
How does that equate to "alot?"
But assuming arguendo it does equal "alot," are we to somehow apologize for our defense scoring points?
Are these points somehow less valuable than TDs scored by the offense, or do they otherwise not count?
Do the Patriots not benefit from defensive scores? I remember Ty Law returning an INT for a TD in the Pats first SB win. Does that not count?
If you subtracted defensive TDs and their extra points from our point total, we'd still be eleventh in scoring, which means our offense can still actually score points
"legitimately."
(Anyone else find it interesting that a Pats fan would question the
legitimacy of any other team's production?)
(01-16-2018, 03:42 PM)Boston_Prince Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 03:32 PM)Rico Wrote: [ -> ]Jaguars without Fournette, 3-0.
Gosh, I wonder how that happened since "that's it".
i stand by my comment. Who else really scares you on that offense? Not being funny, but seriously. There is no one else who truly stands out on your offense. I will say Yeldon (spell) is decent as well but you really can't be surprised by that comment.
(01-16-2018, 03:30 PM)JNev Wrote: [ -> ]Mike Tomlin, is that you?
Nah, however, we own him.
But you can't be mad at that, stop Fournette and the run and force Bortles to throw. We aren't the Steelers, I promise and our run defense is better than theirs. Steelers got behind fast via turnovers, Big Ben is know for those but not Brady. No disrespect but your offense doesn't scare anyone and is the weakness of your team. Thats a fact.
You’re acting like the Jags don’t own the Steelers too.
Man. Bills fans were bad but some of these Pats fans are so arrogant. Try humbling yourself for a second.
“NFL disrespects the Pats.” I Mean.... what?! All you ever hear is how great Brady and Belicheck are. Keep underestimating Blake. Every time someone thinks it’s all about Fournette (Texans, Seahawks, Steelers twice) he goes out and gets the job done.
(01-16-2018, 04:17 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Man. Bills fans were bad but some of these Pats fans are so arrogant. Try humbling yourself for a second.
“NFL disrespects the Pats.” I Mean.... what?! All you ever hear is how great Brady and Belicheck are. Keep underestimating Blake. Every time someone thinks it’s all about Fournette (Texans, Seahawks, Steelers twice) he goes out and gets the job done.
Don't forget the Bengals game where Burfict said that Bortles couldn't beat them.
(01-16-2018, 04:08 PM)Bchbunnie4 Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 03:42 PM)Boston_Prince Wrote: [ -> ]i stand by my comment. Who else really scares you on that offense? Not being funny, but seriously. There is no one else who truly stands out on your offense. I will say Yeldon (spell) is decent as well but you really can't be surprised by that comment.
Nah, however, we own him.
But you can't be mad at that, stop Fournette and the run and force Bortles to throw. We aren't the Steelers, I promise and our run defense is better than theirs. Steelers got behind fast via turnovers, Big Ben is know for those but not Brady. No disrespect but your offense doesn't scare anyone and is the weakness of your team. Thats a fact.
You’re acting like the Jags don’t own the Steelers too.
This year, yes. We've been doing this for over a decade... when they used to even have an elite defense. But like I said, the Steelers were too focused on us to even care about playing your team, you're welcome. Not your fault, just shows how dumb that team is and mentally weak. Kudos to any team that can own the Steelers, I love it.
(01-16-2018, 04:07 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2018, 03:24 PM)Boston_Prince Wrote: [ -> ]Most important defensive stat is points allowed, not yards. As a matter of fact, been the BEST defense with regards to points the last few months. But honestly, you really don't need a GREAT defense to stop Blake Bortles. Alot of your team's points came from defensive scoring. Our offense can actually score points with legit drives.
And its a good thing that we are ALL just fans and nothing we say has nothing to do with how a team gameplans.
This is a strange critique.
We scored 417 points total (5th overall). Our defense scored seven (7) TDs or 49 points. I'm no math major, but that's not even 12 percent of our points, if my math done in my head is correct.
How does that equate to "alot?"
But assuming arguendo it does equal "alot," are we to somehow apologize for our defense scoring points?
Are these points somehow less valuable than TDs scored by the offense, or do they otherwise not count?
Do the Patriots not benefit from defensive scores? I remember Ty Law returning an INT for a TD in the Pats first SB win. Does that not count?
If you subtracted defensive TDs and their extra points from our point total, we'd still be eleventh in scoring, which means our offense can still actually score points "legitimately."
(Anyone else find it interesting that a Pats fan would question the legitimacy of any other team's production?)
Another strange critique was basing the strength of a defense off of yards given up. Points is what matters, I'm sure you agree. I don't care if we give up 8,000 yards a game, as long as we hold teams to less than 17 points on average, I'll take that each time. Teams, since week 3 I think, could barely put 20 points up on this defense but that gets overshadowed by having Brady and the offense.
Additionally, your team's schedule was ranked what, 30, 31st in the league? I wouldn't find that legitimacy questionable. Your team had a VERY easy schedule and lost to some of the worst teams. Your team in ranked #1 in scoring defense, so yes your team gets a ton of points through its defense. Not a bad thing, just a fact. We were second in points scored, don't even have to go into details regarding this.