(05-10-2020, 10:11 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]I don't know the answer to these questions, so maybe someone can answer:
Is it legal to make a citizen's arrest by force?
Is it legal for a private citizen to pull a gun on someone and forcibly detain them?
If one makes a citizen's arrest at gunpoint, and the suspect resists, is it legal to shoot them?
Is "I was making a citizen's arrest" a valid defense if there is a conflict and someone gets shot and killed?
They didn't pull a gun on him. Open carry allows you to walk around with one almost anywhere.
It is legal to defend yourself, so both were right if you view both being threatened.
He also wasn't gunned down, he was struggling over a gun, trying to take it away, and he got shot.
That is completely different than murdering someone.
(05-10-2020, 12:36 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (05-09-2020, 03:21 PM)Byron LeftTown Wrote: [ -> ]![[Image: cPPB0oq.jpg]](https://i.imgur.com/cPPB0oq.jpg)
All the usual race hustlers are in on this one, so you know the MSM got their marching orders.
The mythical tale is already being spun.
He was unarmed. He was out jogging. He was killed in cold blood. It was racially-motivated.
None of this is true. The video shows clearly enough.
Arbery attacked the man holding the shotgun, punched him several times, and tried to take the shotgun away.
Arbery had both hands on the shotgun when the first round went off. Abrery was not unarmed.
It is likely that Arbery shot himself by trying to wrench the shotgun away from a man who had his finger inside the trigger guard.
Curious.
You assert he was armed and that he iniitiated the attack on two armed men.
Why didn't he, I dunno, use the weapon he had?!?
You say the murder was not racist in nature.
What of these photos?
![[Image: 95902154_10220669892730150_5807114341916...e=5EDDF6F6]](https://scontent-mia3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/95902154_10220669892730150_5807114341916344320_n.jpg?_nc_cat=104&_nc_sid=8024bb&_nc_oc=AQkLmhYScytwF7n9GGHoipNiElZ_v2C2z0m500BImacJ0y34_iyNBnD-qO9YSAoS8efXQUhXa8B3PVoj7RMhpJSY&_nc_ht=scontent-mia3-1.xx&oh=b5282a0ca66920ce8b4c62193c69a43b&oe=5EDDF6F6)
More to come...
Naaaahhhhhh man. Say it ain't so....
Wheres the pic from? That's a side view not front on.i wanna know before we pull out the electric chair.
(05-10-2020, 12:36 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (05-09-2020, 03:21 PM)Byron LeftTown Wrote: [ -> ]
All the usual race hustlers are in on this one, so you know the MSM got their marching orders.
The mythical tale is already being spun.
He was unarmed. He was out jogging. He was killed in cold blood. It was racially-motivated.
None of this is true. The video shows clearly enough.
Arbery attacked the man holding the shotgun, punched him several times, and tried to take the shotgun away.
Arbery had both hands on the shotgun when the first round went off. Abrery was not unarmed.
It is likely that Arbery shot himself by trying to wrench the shotgun away from a man who had his finger inside the trigger guard.
Curious.
You assert he was armed and that he iniitiated the attack on two armed men.
2 hands on a shotgun = armed
(05-10-2020, 12:54 PM)Byron LeftTown Wrote: [ -> ] (05-10-2020, 12:36 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]Curious.
You assert he was armed and that he iniitiated the attack on two armed men.
2 hands on a shotgun = armed
So tell me, how did he come to have two hands on a shotgun?
Was it Arbery's shotgun?
I can't believe people are really defending these two yahoos loading up and jumping in a truck and chasing down some guy running down the road. Call the cops, that's their job.
I also can't believe people who really think a black guy being told by two armed white dudes they "wan't to talk to you" in mother [BLEEP] Georgia would do anything but fight for his life have any realistic clue what hell they are talking about.
Those two were out of line, no other scenario is acceptable, it's just defending the indefensible. They had no business doing what they did and it's entirely their fault, criminal culpability, that the guy is dead.
(05-10-2020, 12:21 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (05-10-2020, 11:55 AM)B2hibry Wrote: [ -> ]Yep, a statement against faux Government overreach and faux hate crimes are the same things.
One faux deserves another.
Also, "sow into the wind, reap the whirlwind."
If you want to be in a place where every orderly part is marked off by a private guard holding a machine gun, move to Nicaragua or Haiti or El Salvador.
We don't have that kind of ish here, and we don't need to start now.
You get what you get with inaction. Hence why they are there. Not everyone is capable of the dirty work needed to gain freedom and remain free.
(05-10-2020, 12:50 PM)jj82284 Wrote: [ -> ] (05-10-2020, 12:36 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]Curious.
You assert he was armed and that he iniitiated the attack on two armed men.
Why didn't he, I dunno, use the weapon he had?!?
You say the murder was not racist in nature.
What of these photos?
More to come...
Naaaahhhhhh man. Say it ain't so....
Wheres the pic from? That's a side view not front on.i wanna know before we pull out the electric chair.
Ahh...an excellent observation! It IS possible it's the same person. It's also possible the person highlighted in the picture at the top is different from the father who is alleged to have participated in the killing of Arbery.
Two still photos, both in color, both closer and clearer than the video that purports to show Arbery walking into the construction site...right?
If it's possible that the two highlighted individuals could look similar but be two different people, isn't it possible the person in the video shot by the neighbor (not the video of the murder) was someone other than Arbery?
(This is largely an aside to the main point. I will get there)
(05-10-2020, 01:22 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (05-10-2020, 01:17 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]I can't believe people are really defending these two yahoos loading up and jumping in a truck and chasing down some guy running down the road. Call the cops, that's their job.
I also can't believe people who really think a black guy being told by two armed white dudes they "wan't to talk to you" in mother [BLEEP] Georgia would do anything but fight for his life have any realistic clue what hell they are talking about.
Those two were out of line, no other scenario is acceptable, it's just defending the indefensible. They had no business doing what they did and it's entirely their fault, criminal culpability, that the guy is dead.
I can.
It happens all the time.
What happens all the time?
(05-10-2020, 01:33 PM)B2hibry Wrote: [ -> ] (05-10-2020, 12:36 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]Curious.
You assert he was armed and that he iniitiated the attack on two armed men.
Why didn't he, I dunno, use the weapon he had?!?
You say the murder was not racist in nature.
What of these photos?
More to come...
If you are going to reach an opinion on motive because of photos, don't you have to be fair and weigh this photo as well?
![[Image: Screen-Shot-2020-05-06-at-1.31.04-PM-1068x573.png]](http://theredelephants.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/Screen-Shot-2020-05-06-at-1.31.04-PM-1068x573.png)
If we assume the pic on the right is one of Arbery, and the pic on the left is a still of the incident where he is murdered, then all we have is a pic of the murder victim. There is no mistake of the victim here. It is commonly accepted fact Arbery is dead,
If we are to surmise that Arbery had been previously arrested for a crime, so what? A prior arrest for a crime does not trigger Georgia's citizen's arrest statute, nor does it override the requirements of Georgia's self defense law.
(05-10-2020, 01:42 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ] (05-10-2020, 01:22 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]I can.
It happens all the time.
What happens all the time?
My posts in this thread have been short.
Keep up.
(05-10-2020, 01:42 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (05-10-2020, 01:33 PM)B2hibry Wrote: [ -> ]If you are going to reach an opinion on motive because of photos, don't you have to be fair and weigh this photo as well?
If we assume the pic on the right is one of Arbery, and the pic on the left is a still of the incident where he is murdered, then all we have is a pic of the murder victim. There is no mistake of the victim here. It is commonly accepted fact Arbery is dead,
If we are to surmise that Arbery had been previously arrested for a crime, so what? A prior arrest for a crime does not trigger Georgia's citizen's arrest statute, nor does it override the requirements of Georgia's self defense law.
(05-10-2020, 01:42 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]What happens all the time?
My posts in this thread have been short.
Keep up.
If your implication is that he’s a racist and this is the motive for his encounter with Arbery then the mugshot would show that Arbery is a criminal and then fully capable of being the person on video burglarizing the home. You posted that picture to establish motive and nothing else. Pictures alone don’t explain what happened any more than his mugshot proves he’s a burglar.
How about you stop making vague implications and be clear with your posts instead?
You said you can believe it to a posts that addressed multiple points. If you didn’t want someone asking what you can believe, then you should’ve said it clearly.
(05-10-2020, 01:17 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]I can't believe people are really defending these two yahoos loading up and jumping in a truck and chasing down some guy running down the road. Call the cops, that's their job.
I also can't believe people who really think a black guy being told by two armed white dudes they "wan't to talk to you" in mother [BLEEP] Georgia would do anything but fight for his life have any realistic clue what hell they are talking about.
Those two were out of line, no other scenario is acceptable, it's just defending the indefensible. They had no business doing what they did and it's entirely their fault, criminal culpability, that the guy is dead.
I haven't seen anyone defending the clowns. What I do see are some folks attempting to cool the typical flames of racism you get any time a white person kills a black person. Not a peep from anyone when a black person guns down one of their own. Like the 3-year old boy in Dekalb or the 7-year old girl in Atlanta. For some reason, we get the scream from the rooftops and media interference before a thorough investigation can be done and that alone creates even more divide and potential danger. We're seeing the drastic left and right opinions on the matter without the logical and calm down the middle. Furthermore, questions on the why and how should be allowed/wanted without the chastizing of individuals on this forum. It is possible this Ahmuad scenario has two "rights" or two "wrongs" at once and not just an either-or. Look logically and remove any one factor from either side and this dude is still alive! This place has been getting ridiculous with all the chest-beating and [BLEEP] measuring.
(05-10-2020, 01:17 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]I can't believe people are really defending these two yahoos loading up and jumping in a truck and chasing down some guy running down the road. Call the cops, that's their job.
I also can't believe people who really think a black guy being told by two armed white dudes they "wan't to talk to you" in mother [BLEEP] Georgia would do anything but fight for his life have any realistic clue what hell they are talking about.
Those two were out of line, no other scenario is acceptable, it's just defending the indefensible. They had no business doing what they did and it's entirely their fault, criminal culpability, that the guy is dead.
But dude.... why was he wearing basketball shoes?!
I 100% agree with you. These guys had zero business with this man running. It’s irrelevant if the kid committed robbery (in basketball shoes!) or not. The kid is dead because two rednecks tried to be the police. I’m sure they would have taken the exact same approach had the kid been white.
(05-10-2020, 01:51 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ] (05-10-2020, 01:42 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]If we assume the pic on the right is one of Arbery, and the pic on the left is a still of the incident where he is murdered, then all we have is a pic of the murder victim. There is no mistake of the victim here. It is commonly accepted fact Arbery is dead,
If we are to surmise that Arbery had been previously arrested for a crime, so what? A prior arrest for a crime does not trigger Georgia's citizen's arrest statute, nor does it override the requirements of Georgia's self defense law.
My posts in this thread have been short.
Keep up.
If your implication is that he’s a racist and this is the motive for his encounter with Arbery then the mugshot would show that Arbery is a criminal and then fully capable of being the person on video burglarizing the home. You posted that picture to establish motive and nothing else. Pictures alone don’t explain what happened any more than his mugshot proves he’s a burglar.
How about you stop making vague implications and be clear with your posts instead?
You said you can believe it to a posts that addressed multiple points. If you didn’t want someone asking what you can believe, then you should’ve said it clearly.
He was killed by people who had no business following him, talking to him, detaining him, or brandishing at him. That's what the video and pictures clearly show.
(05-10-2020, 01:56 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (05-10-2020, 01:51 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]If your implication is that he’s a racist and this is the motive for his encounter with Arbery then the mugshot would show that Arbery is a criminal and then fully capable of being the person on video burglarizing the home. You posted that picture to establish motive and nothing else. Pictures alone don’t explain what happened any more than his mugshot proves he’s a burglar.
How about you stop making vague implications and be clear with your posts instead?
You said you can believe it to a posts that addressed multiple points. If you didn’t want someone asking what you can believe, then you should’ve said it clearly.
He was killed by people who had no business following him, talking to him, detaining him, or brandishing at him. That's what the video and pictures clearly show.
I’ve been clear from the beginning that I didn’t agree with it. I’ve only said what Georgia law allows, and the video isn’t obvious since it doesn’t include what happened before or what they knew.
(05-10-2020, 01:42 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (05-10-2020, 01:33 PM)B2hibry Wrote: [ -> ]If you are going to reach an opinion on motive because of photos, don't you have to be fair and weigh this photo as well?
If we assume the pic on the right is one of Arbery, and the pic on the left is a still of the incident where he is murdered, then all we have is a pic of the murder victim. There is no mistake of the victim here. It is commonly accepted fact Arbery is dead,
If we are to surmise that Arbery had been previously arrested for a crime, so what? A prior arrest for a crime does not trigger Georgia's citizen's arrest statute, nor does it override the requirements of Georgia's self defense law.
(05-10-2020, 01:42 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]What happens all the time?
My posts in this thread have been short.
Keep up.
You almost comprehended the point. You assumed a white guy is a racist using a picture but you aren't assuming Ahmaud can be criminally culpable based on a photo? White guy photo=no crime, Black guy photo=crime. No hypocrisy there? We should stick to what is a known entity and not build up some kind of obtuse narrative just for argument's sake. Especially a racially charged one. FYI, dead does not lawfully equal murder.
(05-10-2020, 02:00 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ] (05-10-2020, 01:56 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]He was killed by people who had no business following him, talking to him, detaining him, or brandishing at him. That's what the video and pictures clearly show.
I’ve been clear from the beginning that I didn’t agree with it. I’ve only said what Georgia law allows, and the video isn’t obvious since it doesn’t include what happened before or what they knew.
In your opinion, what would have happened before to warrant such a response?
(05-10-2020, 01:55 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (05-10-2020, 01:17 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]I can't believe people are really defending these two yahoos loading up and jumping in a truck and chasing down some guy running down the road. Call the cops, that's their job.
I also can't believe people who really think a black guy being told by two armed white dudes they "wan't to talk to you" in mother [BLEEP] Georgia would do anything but fight for his life have any realistic clue what hell they are talking about.
Those two were out of line, no other scenario is acceptable, it's just defending the indefensible. They had no business doing what they did and it's entirely their fault, criminal culpability, that the guy is dead.
But dude.... why was he wearing basketball shoes?!
I 100% agree with you. These guys had zero business with this man running. It’s irrelevant if the kid committed robbery (in basketball shoes!) or not. The kid is dead because two rednecks tried to be the police. I’m sure they would have taken the exact same approach had the kid been white.
Because he wasn't jogging! The kid is dead because he potentially committed a crime and then ran towards two idiots with firearms. Further escalated by trying to grab one of the firearms. There is enough stupidity to go around for both sides. The kid shouldn't be dead but both sides decided to swing their nuts around instead of using their heads. Justice will not be served in a situation such as this. Lives were unnecessarily crushed both physically and metaphorically.
Wonder how this would have gone down in Atlanta in and around MLK no matter the race? This is a stupidity issue, not race.
(05-10-2020, 01:51 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ] (05-10-2020, 01:42 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]If we assume the pic on the right is one of Arbery, and the pic on the left is a still of the incident where he is murdered, then all we have is a pic of the murder victim. There is no mistake of the victim here. It is commonly accepted fact Arbery is dead,
If we are to surmise that Arbery had been previously arrested for a crime, so what? A prior arrest for a crime does not trigger Georgia's citizen's arrest statute, nor does it override the requirements of Georgia's self defense law.
My posts in this thread have been short.
Keep up.
If your implication is that he’s a racist and this is the motive for his encounter with Arbery then the mugshot would show that Arbery is a criminal and then fully capable of being the person on video burglarizing the home. You posted that picture to establish motive and nothing else. Pictures alone don’t explain what happened any more than his mugshot proves he’s a burglar.
How about you stop making vague implications and be clear with your posts instead?
You said you can believe it to a posts that addressed multiple points. If you didn’t want someone asking what you can believe, then you should’ve said it clearly.
People in this thread, including the OP, have dismissed out of hand the possibility this is racially motivated. As for the mugshot, for my purposes in this point, or for the purposes of the applicable law, it doesn't matter if Arbery has a prior arrest for anything. Prior arrests do not trigger the citizens arrest statute, nor do the have any bearing on the self defense statute.
For the hard of reading, the author of the post to which I replied said he could not believe people would defend the two yahoos. Flsportsgod then expresses disbelief about people villifying the African American for defending himself. That's what I can believe.
Whenever a killing of an unarmed African American happens, there is always a rush to vilify them. Always. The mere possibility that an African American might have a reasonable apprehension or fear of imminent physical bodily harm or death is almost never considered.
Even in the Botham Jean case, idiots were saying he should not have reacted to someone uninvited trying to enter HIS apartment, and observing he ha marijuana.
Is that clear enough, or do I need to use stick figures and sock puppets?