(02-27-2024, 02:43 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (02-27-2024, 02:34 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]This, Cam was our best lineman. I like our tackles, that wasn't the problem
Yeah, it's great to have $16 million bucks tied up in a guy who is the definition of Average.
I kinda believe if they stick with Cam they restructure his deal to push some money out. It's a numbers game, we got like 3 vulnerabilities at minimum on the OL, we can't patch every one of em in one darft.
Little hasn't shown that he can stand head and shoulders above Cam when it comes to LT, and I certainly prefer our efforts to be spent on fixing the interior before we go rebuilding the LT position.
(02-27-2024, 05:17 PM)MoJagFan Wrote: [ -> ]Disappointing draft incoming
....sounds like you are new to Duval
(02-27-2024, 02:43 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (02-27-2024, 02:08 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Clueless as always, doesnt surprise me lol. They can tag him and trade him if they want. Baalkes problem isn't that he goes silent, Baalkes problem is he don't know how to draft and his board has sucked in the past, that's his problem. Not to mention he has built this team and hasn't provided enough protection for Trevor, on top of saying the trenches need to bigger and stronger when it's been built by him, that's his problem. At the end of the day it doesn't matter what he says it matters what he does, the draft and FA last year sucks and this team took a step, that's not going to get it done.
Yep you are and continue to be clueless. It's clear you have absolutely no understanding of what it means to be a negotiator. Maybe he should get up there at the presser and tell everyone exactly what he intends to do in excruciating detail so you'll be happy with what you find out.
(02-27-2024, 02:34 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]This, Cam was our best lineman. I like our tackles, that wasn't the problem
Yeah, it's great to have $16 million bucks tied up in a guy who is the definition of Average.
The only way I keep Cam is if they restructure his deal to save some money in order to upgrade more pieces on the Oline.
If Cam prevents them from upgrading the interior, then you absolutely roll with Little.
(02-28-2024, 10:01 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (02-27-2024, 02:43 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Yep you are and continue to be clueless. It's clear you have absolutely no understanding of what it means to be a negotiator. Maybe he should get up there at the presser and tell everyone exactly what he intends to do in excruciating detail so you'll be happy with what you find out.
Yeah, it's great to have $16 million bucks tied up in a guy who is the definition of Average.
The only way I keep Cam is if they restructure his deal to save some money in order to upgrade more pieces on the Oline.
If Cam prevents them from upgrading the interior, then you absolutely roll with Little.
I don't think there is anything preventing them from upgrading the interior of the offensive line. They just have to face facts and not be in denial about the obvious deficiencies of the players that are there now.
(02-28-2024, 10:01 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (02-27-2024, 02:43 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Yep you are and continue to be clueless. It's clear you have absolutely no understanding of what it means to be a negotiator. Maybe he should get up there at the presser and tell everyone exactly what he intends to do in excruciating detail so you'll be happy with what you find out.
Yeah, it's great to have $16 million bucks tied up in a guy who is the definition of Average.
The only way I keep Cam is if they restructure his deal to save some money in order to upgrade more pieces on the Oline.
If Cam prevents them from upgrading the interior, then you absolutely roll with Little.
This is what I want, I'd add a year and restructure and we will be good next year at tackle as well.
(02-28-2024, 10:59 AM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ] (02-28-2024, 10:01 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]The only way I keep Cam is if they restructure his deal to save some money in order to upgrade more pieces on the Oline.
If Cam prevents them from upgrading the interior, then you absolutely roll with Little.
This is what I want, I'd add a year and restructure and we will be good next year at tackle as well.
Robinson would be a fool to do that, he'll make more in the open market than to restructure and add time here.
(02-28-2024, 08:57 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ] (02-27-2024, 02:43 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah, it's great to have $16 million bucks tied up in a guy who is the definition of Average.
I kinda believe if they stick with Cam they restructure his deal to push some money out. It's a numbers game, we got like 3 vulnerabilities at minimum on the OL, we can't patch every one of em in one darft.
Little hasn't shown that he can stand head and shoulders above Cam when it comes to LT, and I certainly prefer our efforts to be spent on fixing the interior before we go rebuilding the LT position.
(02-27-2024, 05:17 PM)MoJagFan Wrote: [ -> ]Disappointing draft incoming
....sounds like you are new to Duval
Little's number at LT last year were consistent with Cam's, he stands head and shoulders above him in that he costs $18 million dollars less. If you wanna fix the interior line then that extra money goes a long way towards a combination of Hunt, Dotson, Cushenberry, Williams, and James.
I just don't trust Walker Little at all. Whether he's at LT, RT or G. Something seems off about him because it's taking him way too long to find himself a full time job on this football team and I cannot get over the fact that because of his lack of durability, he was knocked back onto Lawrence and that was the catalyst for the rest of the year falling apart with Lawrence's injuries.
That ankle was the beginning of the end. Durability concerns is not exclusive to Little as well. That's always been my biggest knack on Cam Robinson as well. I think he's played maybe one full season here in seven years. He lost me when he cost this team wins potentially by getting suspended. It's rather sad, but, the most durable lineman that we have is the weakest starter out there in Fortner.
I do think, though, that, at some point, you're going to have to try something with Walker Little with him entering year four. It's time to see if he's worth resigning or not or potentially replacing him sooner rather than later.
Byron Murphy is also impressing folks at the combine. 25 scheduled visits or interviews already. Looks physically impressive per Tony Pauline just now on X. Good chance Baalke is one of the guys talking to him. So, real possibility that Murphy stands the most to gain this week.
He could be pushing for a strong case to be the first DT taken off the board. Which is impressive because just a month or two ago he was barely a 2nd RD pick. Same for T'Vondre Sweat, his teammate. I still think guys like Newton and Robinson will get plenty of looks as well from this front office.
(02-28-2024, 12:57 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]I just don't trust Walker Little at all. Whether he's at LT, RT or G. Something seems off about him because it's taking him way too long to find himself a full time job on this football team and I cannot get over the fact that because of his lack of durability, he was knocked back onto Lawrence and that was the catalyst for the rest of the year falling apart with Lawrence's injuries.
That ankle was the beginning of the end. Durability concerns is not exclusive to Little as well. That's always been my biggest knack on Cam Robinson as well. I think he's played maybe one full season here in seven years. He lost me when he cost this team wins potentially by getting suspended. It's rather sad, but, the most durable lineman that we have is the weakest starter out there in Fortner.
I do think, though, that, at some point, you're going to have to try something with Walker Little with him entering year four. It's time to see if he's worth resigning or not or potentially replacing him sooner rather than later.
Byron Murphy is also impressing folks at the combine. 25 scheduled visits or interviews already. Looks physically impressive per Tony Pauline just now on X. Good chance Baalke is one of the guys talking to him. So, real possibility that Murphy stands the most to gain this week.
He could be pushing for a strong case to be the first DT taken off the board. Which is impressive because just a month or two ago he was barely a 2nd RD pick. Same for T'Vondre Sweat, his teammate. I still think guys like Newton and Robinson will get plenty of looks as well from this front office.
Little looked very comfortable at LT the first 4 games. It's when they keep flip flopping him to guard and RT that he looks out of place.
(02-28-2024, 01:22 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (02-28-2024, 12:57 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]I just don't trust Walker Little at all. Whether he's at LT, RT or G. Something seems off about him because it's taking him way too long to find himself a full time job on this football team and I cannot get over the fact that because of his lack of durability, he was knocked back onto Lawrence and that was the catalyst for the rest of the year falling apart with Lawrence's injuries.
That ankle was the beginning of the end. Durability concerns is not exclusive to Little as well. That's always been my biggest knack on Cam Robinson as well. I think he's played maybe one full season here in seven years. He lost me when he cost this team wins potentially by getting suspended. It's rather sad, but, the most durable lineman that we have is the weakest starter out there in Fortner.
I do think, though, that, at some point, you're going to have to try something with Walker Little with him entering year four. It's time to see if he's worth resigning or not or potentially replacing him sooner rather than later.
Byron Murphy is also impressing folks at the combine. 25 scheduled visits or interviews already. Looks physically impressive per Tony Pauline just now on X. Good chance Baalke is one of the guys talking to him. So, real possibility that Murphy stands the most to gain this week.
He could be pushing for a strong case to be the first DT taken off the board. Which is impressive because just a month or two ago he was barely a 2nd RD pick. Same for T'Vondre Sweat, his teammate. I still think guys like Newton and Robinson will get plenty of looks as well from this front office.
Little looked very comfortable at LT the first 4 games. It's when they keep flip flopping him to guard and RT that he looks out of place.
Yeah. Looked real comfortable getting pushed back onto Lawrence's ankle and toppling any hopes we had left in 2023.
(02-28-2024, 01:23 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ] (02-28-2024, 01:22 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Little looked very comfortable at LT the first 4 games. It's when they keep flip flopping him to guard and RT that he looks out of place.
Yeah. Looked real comfortable getting pushed back onto Lawrence's ankle and toppling any hopes we had left in 2023.
That wasn't in the first 4 weeks of the season....
That was when he was injured and (like I just said) it was his first game back at LT after flipping around the line. It's also been talked about that it was Parker Washingtons fault for running the wrong route.
(02-28-2024, 01:23 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ] (02-28-2024, 01:22 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Little looked very comfortable at LT the first 4 games. It's when they keep flip flopping him to guard and RT that he looks out of place.
Yeah. Looked real comfortable getting pushed back onto Lawrence's ankle and toppling any hopes we had left in 2023.
Yeah, he didn't look good last year even in the first 4 games compared to his 2022 year where he looked very good. Everyone couldn't wait for Cam to get back from his suspension
Little allowed 1 sack and 4 hurries on 167 pass blocking attempts in the first 4 games of the season. He also had a 67.5 run blocking grades those first 4 games which was the best on the team (and better than Cam). Then they moved in to LG (where he's not good), then back to LT after an injury. Not to mention Little had the luxury of playing next to pro bowl players like Ben Bartch and Tyler Shatley.
And the overall question here is if you believe Cam is like 18 million dollars better than Little which we all know isn't the case.
And then (as FSG) has mentioned often, what if he's caught using PEDs again? All of you who want Cam back will back pedal and say "They should have just went with Little".
(02-28-2024, 01:32 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ] (02-28-2024, 01:23 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah. Looked real comfortable getting pushed back onto Lawrence's ankle and toppling any hopes we had left in 2023.
Yeah, he didn't look good last year even in the first 4 games compared to his 2022 year where he looked very good. Everyone couldn't wait for Cam to get back from his suspension
Lol, then everyone misunderstood how the issue was the left guard who ended up cut a month later. Usually "everyone" is just dumb. Walker Little graded out just fine at left tackle, he only moved because he's better at guard than the guards we had and PEDSRob couldn't play guard at all. That's more on how bad the guard situation was than how Little plays.
Well, we'll see soon enough I guess. Either the front office is confident they have the right players (they don't) and they'll make minimal upgrades to the current situation (they won't), or, they'll initiate actions that indicate an admission of failure and get it corrected.
If Walker Little is the solution to LT. Great. I hope they feel that way and they save a boat load of money for the 2024 season. If not, I hope they have a back-up plan or two. Which could involve moving Harrison to LT in year two and drafting a new RT again for the 2nd year in a row because that's a realistic possibility there with the 17th pick matching up correctly value wise.
(02-28-2024, 02:24 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Little allowed 1 sack and 4 hurries on 167 pass blocking attempts in the first 4 games of the season. He also had a 67.5 run blocking grades those first 4 games which was the best on the team (and better than Cam). Then they moved in to LG (where he's not good), then back to LT after an injury. Not to mention Little had the luxury of playing next to pro bowl players like Ben Bartch and Tyler Shatley.
And the overall question here is if you believe Cam is like 18 million dollars better than Little which we all know isn't the case.
And then (as FSG) has mentioned often, what if he's caught using PEDs again? All of you who want Cam back will back pedal and say "They should have just went with Little".
I don't want Robinson back unless his services can be rendered for significantly reduced costs with his contract. I also don't trust Little in the long run. I honestly think there's a good chance this team is drafting another RT for the 2nd year in a row with the intent of moving Harrison over to LT.
Wouldn't put it past Baalke to take Tyler Guyton and really piss everybody off throughout the fanbase.
(02-28-2024, 02:07 PM)Marcos25067 Wrote: [ -> ] (02-28-2024, 12:29 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]https://twitter.com/AlbertBreer/status/1...9fFqQ&s=19
Sent from my SM-S906U using Tapatalk
What a difference two years can make lol. I guess turnarounds do happen fast in the NFL, is a great job by everybody, from players to coaches to Mr Khan
Yeah. The most notable thing on that list that stood out to me was Kansas City rounding out the bottom five. Go figure.
(02-28-2024, 01:23 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ] (02-28-2024, 01:22 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Little looked very comfortable at LT the first 4 games. It's when they keep flip flopping him to guard and RT that he looks out of place.
Yeah. Looked real comfortable getting pushed back onto Lawrence's ankle and toppling any hopes we had left in 2023.
You keep citing that one play. It was reported that he had just gotten hurt the play before.
(02-28-2024, 01:32 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ] (02-28-2024, 01:23 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah. Looked real comfortable getting pushed back onto Lawrence's ankle and toppling any hopes we had left in 2023.
Yeah, he didn't look good last year even in the first 4 games compared to his 2022 year where he looked very good. Everyone couldn't wait for Cam to get back from his suspension
Everyone?
(02-28-2024, 02:46 PM)RicoTx Wrote: [ -> ] (02-28-2024, 01:23 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah. Looked real comfortable getting pushed back onto Lawrence's ankle and toppling any hopes we had left in 2023.
You keep citing that one play. It was reported that he had just gotten hurt the play before.
(02-28-2024, 01:32 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah, he didn't look good last year even in the first 4 games compared to his 2022 year where he looked very good. Everyone couldn't wait for Cam to get back from his suspension
Everyone?
I am aware of his hamstring. It still doesn't erase the fact that he's had three years to compete for a starting job and he's failed in outright taking one. After being given three positions to try and win a job at.
I am just not as hopeful or high on this kid as some of you on here I guess. Again, this is not an endorsement of keeping Cam Robinson as well unless the contract can be heavily cut down on price tag wise.
I am not mad at the players. I am disappointed in this team's inability to properly scout, evaluate, draft and develop players in general, but, offensive lineman in particular. It's been going on now for roughly four years or longer and the fact that they continue to trade for mid tier players or draft RB's and ILB's in earlier rounds is probably a big reason as to why they can't get it done.
(02-27-2024, 05:05 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (02-27-2024, 04:14 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]I disagree with Walker Little. I think you have to try and maximize him somewhere at some point. He's a former 2nd RD investment now entering year four. He's been kicked around at tackle and guard. If this team is dead set on bringing back Cam Robinson at LT, and, you're invested with a quality 1st RD pick used in Anton Harrison at RT?
Where does that leave Walker Little? A bust of a 2nd RD investment sitting on the bench as a swing tackle? I just can't see it. I can see them trying to make him play LG or maybe even RG while adding a key free agent or draft pick to hold the opposite position down or at least push him, hence, the Javion Cohen selection in RD4 for me out of Miami, FL.
That is an interesting tidbit though with the play calling. It's at least put out there now and it shows that there's now a true sense of urgency with it being year three for this staff on offense, and, year four for Lawrence. They're going to have to make sure they leave no stones unturned out there or it could very well cost multiple people, if not, the entire staff their jobs in 2024.
Seems like a lot of walking back now though with today's comments. Especially with Pederson. All of a sudden they went from "Press was fine, the offensive line was fine, just needed to stay healthier" as soon as the season ended and the press was in their face in January to, "Press maybe isn't fine, maybe I do need to take the play calling duties back over and maybe the offensive line needs to be looked at more carefully".
Playing Walker Little out of positon does not make the line better.
I know they're bringing back Cam but I would cut him asap. Move Little to LT since he's cheaper and give him a full year to show he is the LT of the future (he played well the first 4 games of the season at LT). They need a new LG, new center and RG (although looks like they may bring Scherff back too).
Anton Harrison is the LT of the future.
(02-28-2024, 01:23 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ] (02-28-2024, 01:22 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Little looked very comfortable at LT the first 4 games. It's when they keep flip flopping him to guard and RT that he looks out of place.
Yeah. Looked real comfortable getting pushed back onto Lawrence's ankle and toppling any hopes we had left in 2023.
...playing hurt, @which seems to be a recurring theme among our linemen@.
It's a real catch 22. moving on from Cam gives you lots of cap to play with to fix other positions, but leaves you with yet another hole to fill. Keep Cam you get security, but again are left scrambling to try and repair everything on a dollar store budget.