Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Quote:If you stop and think for a minute you would realize that sitting him is the right thing long term. That hungry to win games right now is strong but for the long term if sitting him a few games and missing the playoffs this year to go on to win superbowls in the future is the trade off then I'm all in. The take your lumps thing is for guys who are ready and need experience. When you need to hone your craft you can only do it on the bench. Sitting him gives him an extended off season. Think back to Blaine and ask yourself how much a shortened season hurt him? Let Bortles work his way up the depth chart through competition  and let the process play out.  

 

The whole "start him over the incumbent because the incumbent sucks" thing is what destroys qbs. I don't want to repeat that process. I want to build this thing right. We've waited this long for a winner and we are close because we have been patient. Lets stay the course  

 

You can practice all you want.  The only way for him to get the experience he needs is to play.  I'm convinced that once he's proven to be the better option at QB and is comfortable running the offense, he'll start.  

 

Green Bay sat Discount Doublecheck because they had one of the all-time greats still playing well.  Palmer sat behind Kitna who was an above average QB who knew the offense and still had a chance to take them to the playoffs.

 

People here are sooooo worried about Bortles being ruined "like Gabbert".  What you fail to realize is that Gabbert was never good from the start.  He wasn't ruined.  He just sucked.

Quote:Problem is, if you don't start him the minute he's better than henne, you risk losing locker room credibility as a coaching staff.

I need a minion gif but I'm on my phone.


All I can say is....


Whaaat?

Quote:Steve McNair-3rd overall 1995

Phillip Rivers-4th overall 2004

Aaron Rodgers-2005

Carson Palmer-2003



These are the most recent examples.

Thank you. I somehow completely forgot about Rivers.

Quote:Steve McNair-3rd overall 1995

Phillip Rivers-4th overall 2004

Aaron Rodgers-2005

Carson Palmer-2003

 

 

These are the most recent examples.

 

Rivers - Behind Brees

McNair - Behind Chris Chandler who was at the time one of the top QB's in the AFC.

Aaron Rodgers - Sat behind Bret Favre

Carson Palmer - Behind Kitna

 

All of those guys have one thing in common that is not the case on our team: they had a good starter when the rookie was drafted.  

 

 

Here's another list:

 

Eli Manning started 9 games his rookie year

Jay Cutler started 5 games his rookie year

Andy Dalton started every game since being drafted

Joe Flacco started every game since being drafted

John Kitna started a couple of games for Seattle his rookie year

Andrew Luck started every game

Peyton Manning started every game his rookie year

Eli Manning started 7 games his rookie year

Cam Newton started every game his rookie year

Kyle Orton started 15 games his rookie year

Ben Roethlisberger started 14 games his rookie year

Matt Ryan started every game his rookie year

Alex Smith started 7 games his rookie year

Matt Stafford started 10 games his rookie year

Ryan Tannehill started every game his rookie year

Michael Vick started 2 games and played extensivly in 8 games his rookie year

Russell Wilson started every game since being drafted

Vince Young started 13 games his rookie year

 

If you don't think that Bortles is going to start some games this year, you're dreaming.

Quote:You can practice all you want.  The only way for him to get the experience he needs is to play.  I'm convinced that once he's proven to be the better option at QB and is comfortable running the offense, he'll start.  

 

Green Bay sat Discount Doublecheck because they had one of the all-time greats still playing well.  Palmer sat behind Kitna who was an above average QB who knew the offense and still had a chance to take them to the playoffs.

 

People here are sooooo worried about Bortles being ruined "like Gabbert".  What you fail to realize is that Gabbert was never good from the start.  He wasn't ruined.  He just sucked.

I agree, that once the JAGS believe that Blake is ready, he will start.

It all depends on the definition of ready and that belongs to the coaching staff.

 

It will be an intresting year.

 

HeadSlap

Quote:There's no definitive way to develop a qb. Manning threw a ton of interceptions his rookie year and he turned out just fine. Aikman was horrible as a rookie as was Eli.


I truly don't know this but what first round qbs sat behind a starter and went on to have success?


If a qb is going to be good starting him year 1 isn't going to make a difference. I don't think it's fair to say starting a qb early ruins them because there are examples of players overcoming their rookie year. Blaine Gabbert was always going to bad because he lacked the pocket presence to be successful.


If a rookie year "ruins" a qb it's probably just because he was a bad qb in the first place.


Edit: this isn't even about win now. I truly believe letting a rookie play is the best way to develop them.

Like I stated every qb is different. Some said that Manning was born in an NFL qbs home and was groomed from the day he was able to walk. He learned the subtle nuances of the game in high school. Eli was the same way, from daddy and brother. Aikman had a hall of fame roster built around him. Aikman is not truly seen as one of the all time great qbs because it was apparent that the level of talent around him was extremely great. Not a poo poo his leagacy but was guy who was really along for the ride. He had one year where he threw for more than 22 touchdowns. 

 

You are completely correct to stay there is no definitive way to develop a qb. But the point I will stand by is that this is the way to develop Blake Bortle5. Isn't that who we are talking about?

Quote:You can practice all you want.  The only way for him to get the experience he needs is to play.  I'm convinced that once he's proven to be the better option at QB and is comfortable running the offense, he'll start.  

 

Green Bay sat Discount Doublecheck because they had one of the all-time greats still playing well.  Palmer sat behind Kitna who was an above average QB who knew the offense and still had a chance to take them to the playoffs.

 

People here are sooooo worried about Bortles being ruined "like Gabbert".  What you fail to realize is that Gabbert was never good from the start.  He wasn't ruined.  He just sucked.

Not arguing with the fact that Blaine sucked but I still think what happened to him should be a lesson to all. To think a rookie qb will come to a roster void of talent and elevate that roster to elite status is not realistic. Gabbert was horrible, but to say he did not suffer from a shortened off-season is off base. To say that he did not suffer from a poorly built roster is off base as well. To say he was him starting early did not hurt him, well.... you get the point. The guy was bad, but the situation did not help either. There is still new parts to the o-line and rookie wideouts and a rebuilt defense. Let's at least let Henne work out the kinks first then move him in. 

 

To the point of experience; I'm not certain Blake is in that phase of development. He has mechanical issues that need to be fixed. He needs to learn those things first and make that his nature then move to the experience phase. Now maybe he can reach that level by the first game but I will let the team decide that. They have gained my confidence that they know what they are doing. When they feel he is ready to step in, that's when he will play.  

Quote:You are completely correct to stay there is no definitive way to develop a qb. But the point I will stand by is that this is the way to develop Blake Bortle5. Isn't that who we are talking about?

It is. I think he will be fine if he starts this year or sits this year. I prefer him to start this year though.

Debating this is somewhat silly, as the coaches will ultimately make the decision. They already indicate that they want to sit him and improve some of his weak areas before asking him to play. Nothing wrong with that. Also, getting an intimate knowledge of the playbook will also be a huge factor in Bortles being ready to go. If he has to stop and think about anything, he's already behind, and it will work against him and his development.

 

The Jags are prepared as a team to wait on Bortles. We as fans should be realistic about it and follow suit.

Quote:Debating this is somewhat silly, as the coaches will ultimately make the decision. They already indicate that they want to sit him and improve some of his weak areas before asking him to play. Nothing wrong with that. Also, getting an intimate knowledge of the playbook will also be a huge factor in Bortles being ready to go. If he has to stop and think about anything, he's already behind, and it will work against him and his development.

 

The Jags are prepared as a team to wait on Bortles. We as fans should be realistic about it and follow suit.

Agreed

Quote:Rivers - Behind Brees

McNair - Behind Chris Chandler who was at the time one of the top QB's in the AFC.

Aaron Rodgers - Sat behind Bret Favre

Carson Palmer - Behind Kitna

 

All of those guys have one thing in common that is not the case on our team: they had a good starter when the rookie was drafted.  

 

 

Here's another list:

 

Eli Manning started 9 games his rookie year

Jay Cutler started 5 games his rookie year

Andy Dalton started every game since being drafted

Joe Flacco started every game since being drafted

John Kitna started a couple of games for Seattle his rookie year

Andrew Luck started every game

Peyton Manning started every game his rookie year

Eli Manning started 7 games his rookie year

Cam Newton started every game his rookie year

Kyle Orton started 15 games his rookie year

Ben Roethlisberger started 14 games his rookie year

Matt Ryan started every game his rookie year

Alex Smith started 7 games his rookie year

Matt Stafford started 10 games his rookie year

Ryan Tannehill started every game his rookie year

Michael Vick started 2 games and played extensivly in 8 games his rookie year

Russell Wilson started every game since being drafted

Vince Young started 13 games his rookie year

 

If you don't think that Bortles is going to start some games this year, you're dreaming.

I'm also not arguing against Bortles playing any games this year. I just don't see him starting from day one. 

Quote:Rivers - Behind Brees

McNair - Behind Chris Chandler who was at the time one of the top QB's in the AFC.

Aaron Rodgers - Sat behind Bret Favre

Carson Palmer - Behind Kitna

 

All of those guys have one thing in common that is not the case on our team: they had a good starter when the rookie was drafted.  

 

 

Here's another list:

 

Eli Manning started 9 games his rookie year

Jay Cutler started 5 games his rookie year

Andy Dalton started every game since being drafted

Joe Flacco started every game since being drafted

John Kitna started a couple of games for Seattle his rookie year

Andrew Luck started every game

Peyton Manning started every game his rookie year

Eli Manning started 7 games his rookie year

Cam Newton started every game his rookie year

Kyle Orton started 15 games his rookie year

Ben Roethlisberger started 14 games his rookie year

Matt Ryan started every game his rookie year

Alex Smith started 7 games his rookie year

Matt Stafford started 10 games his rookie year

Ryan Tannehill started every game his rookie year

Michael Vick started 2 games and played extensivly in 8 games his rookie year

Russell Wilson started every game since being drafted

Vince Young started 13 games his rookie year

 

If you don't think that Bortles is going to start some games this year, you're dreaming.

 

Chandler was always a journeyman QB at best.

 

Kitna was horrible.

 

However, your list of rookie QBs to get PT in their rookie years is impressive.

 

That said, I believe Bortles will play some this year.

He needs to sit for like 3 years because Gabbert

I just think they're trying to reduce distractions for Blake. I don't think anyone understands it better than he does.

Quote:I need a minion gif but I'm on my phone.


All I can say is....


Whaaat?

 

Imagine you are Cecil Shorts.

 

The jags are 1-4. You lead the team with 18 catches for 200 yards and 1TD. Chad Henne has been playing like hot garbage and there is a rookie on the bench who is playing much better in practice than the starter.

 

How do you feel when Gus announces that Chad is the starter of this football team going into week 6?

Besides Blake's much needed development, another reason to keep him on the bench, at least for half of the season is the fact that our offensive line will be featuring 4 new starters. They need time to gel. A new, untested O-Line + a rookie QB does not equal success. Then you factor in a new RB, new WRs, who in their right mind would throw their shiny new QB in that mess?

Quote:Imagine you are Cecil Shorts.


The jags are 1-4. You lead the team with 18 catches for 200 yards and 1TD. Chad Henne has been playing like hot garbage and there is a rookie on the bench who is playing much better in practice than the starter.


How do you feel when Gus announces that Chad is the starter of this football team going into week 6?

Imagine you are Cecil Shorts and Henne is playing meh. In practice, Bortles is playing slightly better than meh. That would be 'the minute Bortles is playing better', would it not?


Has he then lost control of the locker room? Or been really smart?

Quote:People here are sooooo worried about Bortles being ruined "like Gabbert".  What you fail to realize is that Gabbert was never good from the start.  He wasn't ruined.  He just sucked.

 

Self-fulfilling prophecy, and a strawman.  Nothing more, nothing less.

Quote:Imagine you are Cecil Shorts.

 

The jags are 1-4. You lead the team with 18 catches for 200 yards and 1TD. Chad Henne has been playing like hot garbage and there is a rookie on the bench who is playing much better in practice than the starter.

 

How do you feel when Gus announces that Chad is the starter of this football team going into week 6?

 

You feel like Chad's your starter and you do your best to win ballgames.  Nothing changes.

 

If you're that soft of mind and spirit that you quit on your team, then you don't belong on any team.  That's not the attitude championships are built on.  Like Gus says, you go out and compete all the time.  You're the only person you can control.

Quote:You feel like Chad's your starter and you do your best to win ballgames.  Nothing changes.

 

If you're that soft of mind and spirit that you quit on your team, then you don't belong on any team.  That's not the attitude championships are built on.  Like Gus says, you go out and compete all the time.  You're the only person you can control.

 

I didn't say he is going to quit, but he isn't going to be happy.

 

Neither is any other player who is trying to catch passes thrown into the dirt or 10ft over their heads, or any linemen who is busting his butt blocking just for a QB to run into a sack, or any defender gassing by the 3rd QTR because they have been on the field so much.