Quote:Monroe was out of the long term plans once Caldwell practiced redundant drafting. He basically netted the equivalent of swapping the number two overall pick for a 4th and a 5th rd pick, and that is only if Joekel develops into the same caliber of player as Monroe which has yet to be seen.
So far the best players in the top of the draft look like the DEs that he passed up on.
You don't get it. Monroe was out of the long terms
before the draft. Not after.
Quote:Sorry, it doesn't work in the examples you are trying to use.
He didn't buy high and sell low. Because he didn't "buy" Monroe. He inherited him. The team was not going to pay him 10 million a year and actually got picks for him instead of letting him leave for nothing.
He bought high on Joeckel because he used the second pick in the draft on him. That's his guy and a building block for this team.
He bought a LT high (2nd pick) and sold one low (4th and 5th rd picks). If you can't see that then I would love to do business with you sometime.
Monroe just finished his rookie contract. He is young enough to also have been a building block for this team, except if we had stayed committed to him, we could have added another building block with a DE.
Now we have just one building block for whom the jury is still out on whether or not he will even be as good as Monroe.
Quote:Link?
It doesn't take a genius to figure this out.
Quote:He bought a LT high (2nd pick) and sold one low (4th and 5th rd picks). If you can't see that then I would love to do business with you sometime.
You're not selling trucks here, these are people. Sentient people who have their own whims. You have no idea if Monroe was going to stick around, and if he did it's pretty clear from what's happening in Baltimore that he expects to get a top market deal. If you don't think he's
worth a top market deal, then letting him walk makes total sense.
It's more like refinancing your mortgage before the interest balloons to 10% at the 5 year mark.
Quote:He bought a LT high (2nd pick) and sold one low (4th and 5th rd picks). If you can't see that then I would love to do business with you sometime.
Monroe just finished his rookie contract. He is young enough to also have been a building block for this team, except if we had stayed committed to him, we could have added another building block with a DE.
Now we have just one building block for whom the jury is still out on whether or not he will even be as good as Monroe.
You inherit a car. Lets say a 2009 Ford F150. Nice vehicle but doesn't fit your style and it's not in your long term plans. So you trade it in for a 2013 model, say a Ford Edge. That seems like a better idea than driving a vehicle you don't want or leaving it idling in a parking lot and letting someone take it.
Quote:How about this link that begs to differ. http://www.bigcatcountry.com/2013/4/7/41...ree-agency
First you pretend to be some savvy business guy with "I'd love to do business with you if you can't figure this out", then you turn around and point to that link as your evidence.
Have you ever negotiated for anything? If you're looking to sell something, you typically don't start by saying "this isn't in my plans and I think it's not very valuable". You can think that, but you don't say that. Think on it for a few minutes and I'm sure you'll realize why.
Quote:You're not selling trucks here, these are people. Sentient people who have their own whims. You have no idea if Monroe was going to stick around, and if he did it's pretty clear from what's happening in Baltimore that he expects to get a top market deal. If you don't think he's worth a top market deal, then letting him walk makes total sense.
It's more like refinancing your mortgage before the interest balloons to 10% at the 5 year mark.
Markets are markets, labor markets included.
What happens in a few years if Joekel develops into the same caliber of player? He will command top market price too.
Trust me, this team will never be any good if we have the philosophy of dumping our talented players for pennies on the dollar for fear of not being able to re-sign them.
Quote:He bought a LT high (2nd pick) and sold one low (4th and 5th rd picks). If you can't see that then I would love to do business with you sometime.
Monroe just finished his rookie contract. He is young enough to also have been a building block for this team, except if we had stayed committed to him, we could have added another building block with a DE.
Now we have just one building block for whom the jury is still out on whether or not he will even be as good as Monroe.
You are assuming that the two models (Monroe/Joeckel) are exactly the same, which they are not.
It would be like saying you sold your house for 150k and bought a new one for 250k, so you bought high and sold low. That is too simple a way to look at it. You are not factoring in any variables like age and quality.
Quote:Markets are markets, labor markets included.
What happens in a few years if Joekel develops into the same caliber of player? He will command top market price too.
Trust me, this team will never be any good if we have the philosophy of dumping our talented players for pennies on the dollar for fear of not being able to re-sign them.
Fear? LOL...ok.
I'd also like to see what other examples you have of the "dumping our talented players for pennies on the dollar".
Quote:Markets are markets, labor markets included.
What happens in a few years if Joekel develops into the same caliber of player? He will command top market price too.
Trust me, this team will never be any good if we have the philosophy of dumping our talented players for pennies on the dollar for fear of not being able to re-sign them.
Really, is that so? Last I recall, trucks don't decide whether you're allowed to keep them, or whether they're going to a new owner. Trucks don't get to decide to raise their monthly payment because they now think they're more valuable than you do.
You again assume it will be the same with Luke, but you have no idea. If the franchise agrees that Luke is playing up to a top deal, then I expect he'll get one. They clearly didn't think Monroe would warrant what he'll demand.
Quote:Trust me, this team will never be any good if we have the philosophy of dumping our talented players for pennies on the dollar for fear of not being able to re-sign them.
If you are that upset about the team trading him in the middle of the contract year for two mid-round picks. Imagine how a Bills fan will feel if they lose Jaris Byrd for nothing.
Quote:Really, is that so? Last I recall, trucks don't decide whether you're allowed to keep them, or whether they're going to a new owner. Trucks don't get to decide to raise their monthly payment because they now think they're more valuable than you do.
You again assume it will be the same with Luke, but you have no idea. If the franchise agrees that Luke is playing up to a top deal, then I expect he'll get one. They clearly didn't think Monroe would warrant what he'll demand.
Also, Caldwell scouted and drafted Joeckel. He did not inherit him in a contract year like Monroe. Barring injury, Joeckel is the long term LT for this regime.
Quote:First you pretend to be some savvy business guy with "I'd love to do business with you if you can't figure this out", then you turn around and point to that link as your evidence.
Have you ever negotiated for anything? If you're looking to sell something, you typically don't start by saying "this isn't in my plans and I think it's not very valuable". You can think that, but you don't say that. Think on it for a few minutes and I'm sure you'll realize why.
I have a degree in finance and work in the industry and I'm quite positive I have a better grasp of how markets work than you do.
The link is in reference to the other poster making the claim that Monroe wasn't a part of their plans, and if that was a strategy for getting the most for Monroe then it filed miserably.
Quote:I have a degree in finance and work in the industry and I'm quite positive I have a better grasp of how markets work than you do.
The link is in reference to the other poster making the claim that Monroe wasn't a part of their plans, and if that was a strategy for getting the most for Monroe then it filed miserably.
That link doesn't really prove anything. When Jones-Drew is allowed to walk in free agency, it will mean even less.
Quote:You are assuming that the two models (Monroe/Joeckel) are exactly the same, which they are not.
It would be like saying you sold your house for 150k and bought a new one for 250k, so you bought high and sold low. That is too simple a way to look at it. You are not factoring in any variables like age and quality.
Age and quality???
He was 26 years old when he was traded and is considered one of the best young LTs in the league and one of the best FAs possibly on the market.
I can't believe this is still an issue.
Why does one team have to win and one team have to lose? Why does it have to be an extreme scenario? One team got fleeced and the other made a great move?
Both teams did well in this trade.
Quote:That link doesn't really prove anything. When Jones-Drew is allowed to walk in free agency, it will mean even less.
It means a lot more than your link.
Quote:He bought a LT high (2nd pick) and sold one low (4th and 5th rd picks). If you can't see that then I would love to do business with you sometime.
Monroe just finished his rookie contract. He is young enough to also have been a building block for this team, except if we had stayed committed to him, we could have added another building block with a DE.
Now we have just one building block for whom the jury is still out on whether or not he will even be as good as Monroe.
If you think what Caldwell did was that bad, I'd really like to know what you think of the Chiefs. They took Eric Fisher with the first pick last year. Had a starting left tackle in Branden Albert that was franchised. If reports are correct, they turned down trade offers for Albert during last year's draft. Now this offseason, they are not going to tag him and he is likely to leave as a free agent. They get nothing in return. Nothing.