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What's mind boggling is we average over 5 ypc and we fixed the 2 biggest needs on the oline in LG and C and we are worse than ever. Everyone though if we fix LG, C, and the run game we would be good .

(09-29-2024, 08:25 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]What's mind boggling is we average over 5 ypc and we fixed the 2 biggest needs on the oline in LG and C and we are worse than ever.  Everyone though if we fix LG, C, and the run game we would be good .

We averaged 6 yards per carry before the 4th quarter today. 

I think the run game could still come around. More flashes from it today than we've seen since 2022.

(09-29-2024, 08:17 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-29-2024, 08:05 PM)Jag149 Wrote: [ -> ]On paper our linemen have the size, speed and attributes to be successful.  Is it coaching or scheme? I just do not have the inside knowledge to know for sure. I do know something is definitely missing.  I remember when we hired Rauscher it was reported we sole him from Buffalo. My feeling at the time was he came in second to Aaron Kromer.  I looked at his past jobs and my gut tells me he is a one year wonder type of hire, a nice guy that is well thought of but has never produced results on his own to stay much longer.

Wrong scheme for this assemblage of starters I'd guess. But who knows? 

They did well enough today for this team to eek out a win, even though it didn't happen, so maybe they'll round into some middling form as the weeks wears on.

This is my hope as well. Actually if they can just be average we can win.  Still cannot for the life of me understand why at the point of attack the defense is swarming to that point most plays. This began after the first half of the Miami game and everyone else has picked up on it. Maybe some kind of tell. Heck my 93 year old mom called the QB run before the TV announcer did.

PS. Rauscher is also our run game coordinator.

(09-29-2024, 08:30 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-29-2024, 08:25 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]What's mind boggling is we average over 5 ypc and we fixed the 2 biggest needs on the oline in LG and C and we are worse than ever.  Everyone though if we fix LG, C, and the run game we would be good .

We averaged 6 yards per carry before the 4th quarter today. 

I think the run game could still come around. More flashes from it today than we've seen since 2022.

Damn, i didn't realize we are 2nd in the league in rushing ypc lol.  
https://www.nfl.com/stats/team-stats/off...24/reg/all

(09-29-2024, 08:30 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-29-2024, 08:25 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]What's mind boggling is we average over 5 ypc and we fixed the 2 biggest needs on the oline in LG and C and we are worse than ever.  Everyone though if we fix LG, C, and the run game we would be good .

We averaged 6 yards per carry before the 4th quarter today. 

I think the run game could still come around. More flashes from it today than we've seen since 2022.

And yet, when we were up 3 with 4 minutes to go...  We threw it twice...

(09-29-2024, 08:34 PM)Jag149 Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-29-2024, 08:17 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Wrong scheme for this assemblage of starters I'd guess. But who knows? 

They did well enough today for this team to eek out a win, even though it didn't happen, so maybe they'll round into some middling form as the weeks wears on.

This is my hope as well. Actually if they can just be average we can win.  Still cannot for the life of me understand why at the point of attack the defense is swarming to that point most plays. This began after the first half of the Miami game and everyone else has picked up on it. Maybe some kind of tell. Heck my 93 year old mom called the QB run before the TV announcer did.

PS. Rauscher is also our run game coordinator.

Yeah - I think the run calls may have some tells.
How many hands in the ground, backfield alignment, I don't know, but the LBs are firing quick to the intended gap too often for it to have enough ambiguity. They are picking up on something fairly often. 

I recall a breakdown from Lageman in 2022 that revealed how we were lining up in the same look several times in a game but executing different run designs from it. I wonder if that went out the window with some coach that moved on. Or - it seemed like they tried to do this diverse plays from one look bit during the first half of 2023 but executed so poorly they dumbed down the run calls significantly. This year's book doesn't seem to be revealing an especially diverse set of run play designs thus far. 

That's a failure if so. I haven't watched enough all22 this year to feel certain.

(09-29-2024, 08:45 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-29-2024, 08:34 PM)Jag149 Wrote: [ -> ]This is my hope as well. Actually if they can just be average we can win.  Still cannot for the life of me understand why at the point of attack the defense is swarming to that point most plays. This began after the first half of the Miami game and everyone else has picked up on it. Maybe some kind of tell. Heck my 93 year old mom called the QB run before the TV announcer did.

PS. Rauscher is also our run game coordinator.

Yeah - I think the run calls may have some tells.
How many hands in the ground, backfield alignment, I don't know, but the LBs are firing quick to the intended gap too often for it to have enough ambiguity. They are picking up on something fairly often. 

I recall a breakdown from Lageman in 2022 that revealed how we were lining up in the same look several times in a game but executing different run designs from it. I wonder if that went out the window with some coach that moved on. Or - it seemed like they tried to do this diverse plays from one look bit during the first half of 2023 but executed so poorly they dumbed down the run calls significantly. This year's book doesn't seem to be revealing an especially diverse set of run play designs thus far. 

That's a failure if so. I haven't watched enough all22 this year to feel certain.

Our running backs are hitting different gaps/holes and cutting back when there is over pursuit. Otherwise they would just run into our linemen. I was thinking that was why ETN was on the sidelines watching Tank do that early in today's game. That is the reason for a high YPC.  Also the ONE draw we ran surprised the hell out of them .., it may have been years since we ran a draw. lol

(09-29-2024, 08:36 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-29-2024, 08:30 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]We averaged 6 yards per carry before the 4th quarter today. 

I think the run game could still come around. More flashes from it today than we've seen since 2022.

Damn, i didn't realize we are 2nd in the league in rushing ypc lol.  
https://www.nfl.com/stats/team-stats/off...24/reg/all

I think the Jaguars have good running backs.  If you give them a hole, they often take advantage.  They've gotten some big runs which has raised the yards per carry average.  The problem is that the Jaguars can't run when teams know they are going to run.  We consistently get stopped on third down, fourth down, red zone, trying to kill the clock, etc.  I think it goes back to the offensive line.  They don't have the size and strength to open a hole if the other team knows it's coming.  Our running game is only effective when they can take advantage of the element of surprise.  In obvious running situations, they struggle.

(09-29-2024, 09:01 PM)TheDuke007 Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-29-2024, 08:36 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Damn, i didn't realize we are 2nd in the league in rushing ypc lol.  
https://www.nfl.com/stats/team-stats/off...24/reg/all

I think the Jaguars have good running backs.  If you give them a hole, they often take advantage.  They've gotten some big runs which has raised the yards per carry average.  The problem is that the Jaguars can't run when teams know they are going to run.  We consistently get stopped on third down, fourth down, red zone, trying to kill the clock, etc.  I think it goes back to the offensive line.  They don't have the size and strength to open a hole if the other team knows it's coming.  Our running game is only effective when they can take advantage of the element of surprise.  In obvious running situations, they struggle.

That's a coaching problem...  Scheme, play design, play call, run designs/pass designs.  

This is all on coaching.  You're right, defenses know what we are going to run.  In the NFL, every team has high caliber talent.  These guys aren't scrubs.  These are the best athletes in the world.  On both sides.  So what is the difference between a 0-4 team and a 3-1 team?  The coaches putting the players in the best spots to be successful more consistently than the other team's coaches.

This O-Line has conistently proven than running up the middle isn't going to work.  And yet, we still do that.  This O-Line has shown they can run block off tackle and if their is a run play up the middle that isn't expected they can do just enough to open a hole.

But this O-Line isn't pushing anyone around.  So why try to put them in those types of situations over and over again.  Especially on critical downs in critical times???  That's on the coaching staff.

(09-29-2024, 09:01 PM)TheDuke007 Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-29-2024, 08:36 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Damn, i didn't realize we are 2nd in the league in rushing ypc lol.  
https://www.nfl.com/stats/team-stats/off...24/reg/all

I think the Jaguars have good running backs.  If you give them a hole, they often take advantage.  They've gotten some big runs which has raised the yards per carry average.  The problem is that the Jaguars can't run when teams know they are going to run.  We consistently get stopped on third down, fourth down, red zone, trying to kill the clock, etc.  I think it goes back to the offensive line.  They don't have the size and strength to open a hole if the other team knows it's coming.  Our running game is only effective when they can take advantage of the element of surprise.  In obvious running situations, they struggle.

I have no doubt in my mind we have 2 good backs.  I agree with most of what you say but the good to great  play callers always has  the defense thinking.  Do the opposite of what the defense thinks you are going to do.  Still, 2nd in the league in ypc is a good stat to have.

(09-26-2024, 07:00 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-26-2024, 06:50 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]LOL

You are something else. 

Ezra's contract is a bargain if he stays on his current level of play, dude.
 His salary rank and pff grades don't need to match each other. That's just silly. 
We'll see how he shakes out this season. 

The Walker / Hutch argument is stupid and doesn't belong in this thread. Take it elsewhere.

You have taken a lot of L's as of late man and its ok.

I even think Cleveland can play better than he has because he has been a top 10 G at one point.  Will he?  Not sure  You are acting like Cleveland has been great when hes been average at best.  

You are the one that brought up the PFF grades and if you are using that as to how well he has been playing it doesnt match his contract.  Once again, I liked the contract when I seen the numbers and I havent said anything bad about Cleveland this year even when he got destroyed.  Hes been ok but he needs to be better as well but the problem lies at the tackle spots for the most part so far this year.  Im sorry im not jumping for joy for the way Cleveland has played so far and the safety week 2 was on him that if he blocked his guy we might have a win right now.

would you two just make out already?

We had some big runs, and enough production that should be respected by the defense which is all we really want out of the running game. I thought the protection was the best it had been all season, we just get into trouble against blitzes where RB's and TE's are involved in protection.. it's like a communication thing or something idk but there definitely shouldn't be a DB or someone just screaming at Trevor's face. Especially when Trevor's first instinct is to run backwards like twirling like a ballerina.

(09-29-2024, 08:12 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]I think the oline played decent today and definitely good enough to win.  You can't put this loss on the oline today.

agreed.

This one was 1000% on the coaches' heads. We offered this game on a platter. tinhorns had very little to do to go out there and take it. 

We are success averse.

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(09-29-2024, 08:25 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]What's mind boggling is we average over 5 ypc and we fixed the 2 biggest needs on the oline in LG and C and we are worse than ever.  Everyone though if we fix LG, C, and the run game we would be good .

I think the prob is we shellshocked our QB. That spin out of the pocket is the result of running scared after too many near-immediate rushers in his face. You can't turn your back to a play, it's a really ugly habit that has to be broken out of muscle memory.

(09-30-2024, 08:30 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-29-2024, 08:12 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]I think the oline played decent today and definitely good enough to win.  You can't put this loss on the oline today.

agreed.

This one was 1000% on the coaches' heads. We offered this game on a platter. tinhorns had very little to do to go out there and take it. 

We are success averse.

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(09-29-2024, 08:25 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]What's mind boggling is we average over 5 ypc and we fixed the 2 biggest needs on the oline in LG and C and we are worse than ever.  Everyone though if we fix LG, C, and the run game we would be good .

I think the prob is we shellshocked our QB. That spin out of the pocket is the result of running scared after too many near-immediate rushers in his face. You can't turn your back to a play, it's a really ugly habit that has to be broken out of muscle memory.

Agreed, as ar as that spin, he has done it 2 weeks in a row now.  The coaches should have got onto him about that last week and now we see it again.

(09-29-2024, 08:17 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-29-2024, 08:05 PM)Jag149 Wrote: [ -> ]On paper our linemen have the size, speed and attributes to be successful.  Is it coaching or scheme? I just do not have the inside knowledge to know for sure. I do know something is definitely missing.  I remember when we hired Rauscher it was reported we sole him from Buffalo. My feeling at the time was he came in second to Aaron Kromer.  I looked at his past jobs and my gut tells me he is a one year wonder type of hire, a nice guy that is well thought of but has never produced results on his own to stay much longer.

Wrong scheme for this assemblage of starters I'd guess. But who knows? 

They did well enough today for this team to eek out a win, even though it didn't happen, so maybe they'll round into some middling form as the weeks wears on.

Rounding into form...

https://x.com/Demetrius82/status/1840770356665086302

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https://twitter.com/Demetrius82/status/1...6665086302

(09-30-2024, 05:53 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-29-2024, 08:17 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Wrong scheme for this assemblage of starters I'd guess. But who knows? 

They did well enough today for this team to eek out a win, even though it didn't happen, so maybe they'll round into some middling form as the weeks wears on.

Rounding into form...

https://x.com/Demetrius82/status/1840770356665086302

---

https://twitter.com/Demetrius82/status/1...6665086302

For the first time in a long, long time I will say that the OL was not the problem this past Sunday. They played pretty good overall for the most part. Hopefully they can keep that up.

(09-29-2024, 08:12 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]I think the oline played decent today and definitely good enough to win.  You can't put this loss on the oline today.

I think they are capable of playing like last week consistently. We just need Trevor to help them out a little bit and give them directions on where the pressure is coming from. Cam isn't really a fan favorite on these boards but when he is on he is one of the best LTs in the game in the pass pro. 

Trevor has to start releasing the ball quicker to help the line a little instead of hanging on to the ball like a dead turtle.

A quick release helps everyone out, I can't seem to find the stat but I believe in 2015 - Brady held on to the ball for 2.5 seconds for 75% of his pass attempts under a pathetic line that year.

(10-02-2024, 10:52 PM)TDOSS Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-29-2024, 08:12 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]I think the oline played decent today and definitely good enough to win.  You can't put this loss on the oline today.

I think they are capable of playing like last week consistently. We just need Trevor to help them out a little bit and give them directions on where the pressure is coming from. Cam isn't really a fan favorite on these boards but when he is on he is one of the best LTs in the game in the pass pro. 

Trevor has to start releasing the ball quicker to help the line a little instead of hanging on to the ball like a dead turtle.

A quick release helps everyone out, I can't seem to find the stat but I believe in 2015 - Brady held on to the ball for 2.5 seconds for 75% of his pass attempts under a pathetic line that year.

I wonder if there was someone that could help him recognize that?  If only there was a way to teach him...  If only...

(10-02-2024, 11:28 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-02-2024, 10:52 PM)TDOSS Wrote: [ -> ]I think they are capable of playing like last week consistently. We just need Trevor to help them out a little bit and give them directions on where the pressure is coming from. Cam isn't really a fan favorite on these boards but when he is on he is one of the best LTs in the game in the pass pro. 

Trevor has to start releasing the ball quicker to help the line a little instead of hanging on to the ball like a dead turtle.

A quick release helps everyone out, I can't seem to find the stat but I believe in 2015 - Brady held on to the ball for 2.5 seconds for 75% of his pass attempts under a pathetic line that year.

I wonder if there was someone that could help him recognize that?  If only there was a way to teach him...  If only...

Well, you can't substantially increase IQ.

(10-02-2024, 11:32 PM)TDOSS Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-02-2024, 11:28 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ]I wonder if there was someone that could help him recognize that?  If only there was a way to teach him...  If only...

Well, you can't substantially increase IQ.

Finally, we agree.  This Pederson staff can't figure it out.  LOL.  I'm being sardonic.

Trevor, on the other hand has the potential to be better.  OK, we're just going back and forth.  But let me ask you an honest question.  First, you clearly think T-Law is a bust.  You clearly think we need a new QB.  I think I understand your premise.  Let me know if I'm wrong.  

Here's the question:

If T-Law is a bust and we need a new QB, do you think that Doug Pederson and his coaching staff is the best staff to develop a franchise QB?