Quote:A strong coalition was thinking Leaf was the answer
Anyone who actually was paying attention to that draft back in 98 (and not someone who's just using revisionist theory today) would know that there was a major split between Manning/Leaf not only in the media...but even in the Colts war room before they eventually went with the decision to go with Peyton.
But hey, this is the Jaguars message boards. Let's not allow facts to get in the way...
Quote:See Smith, Geno: fans fall in love with guy when we're in desperate need for a franchise QB.
And love is blind.
*sign* this again....
Quote:Anyone who actually was paying attention to that draft back in 98 (and not someone who's just using revisionist theory today) would know that there was a major split between Manning/Leaf not only in the media... but even in the Colts war room before they eventually went with the decision to go with Peyton.
But hey, this is the Jaguars message boards. Let's not allow facts to get in the way...
This article was written April 13, 1998 about a week before the draft.
<a class="bbc_url" href='http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1012545/1/index.htm'>http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1012545/1/index.htm</a>
There was no debate with the people who actually make the decisions.
As for the part in bold:
Quote:Finally, the uncertainty cleared. By the week before the draft, "it was 99 percent for (Manning)," Polian said.
<a class="bbc_url" href='http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/football/story/2012-03-07/Peyton-Manning-Colts-Ryan-Leaf/53400044/1'>http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/football/story/2012-03-07/Peyton-Manning-Colts-Ryan-Leaf/53400044/1</a>
Its fun to make stuff up isn't it?
Quote:* He's not the consensus # 1 player in the draft (see Andrew Luck) - He's not the #1 overall ranked player, but he is top 5.
* He's not the consensus # 1 QB in his own class (see Geno Smith) - Yes, he is. He's the #1 rated QB in this class.
* He has no elite skills or traits - Have you watch him play?
* Below average size for the position - Ok, he's kinda thin, but he can alway bulk up. And I thought Brees and Wilson already threw the size debate out the window.
* The Texans seem willing to move down from the # 1 overall pick, with a dire need at QB - Just because they are willing to overlook on a QB means that TB doesn't deserve his praise?
As you begin to evaluate him as a prospect you see a good QB with a high floor but a suspect ceiling. (Game manager) In the right system he could be decent but he's not a player who will elevate the rest of the team by himself like you would like to see from a franchise QB. - I'm pretty sure Louisville wouldn't have the success they have had these last two years without him. Sorry, come up with something better.
When you step back and look at everything with an unbiased eye there's no way you can make a case for Bridgewater as a QB who should go # 1 overall. He's not a Manning, Luck, RG3 level prospect. He's more in line with the Alex/Geno Smiths' of the NFL world. No, he's not the Luck, or even RG3 type of prospect in term of overall abilities. Not every QB prospect is 6'4, built like a fullback and plays like Tom Brady early in his career the way Luck is doing right now; Luck is rare. People often compare TB to Luck because TB came from a pro-style offense in which he was given full control on the line of scrimmage; he's also the most NFL ready QB in this and last year's draft class. And just because he keep comparing him to Geno Smith doesn't mean there's any substance to it. lol. And I can prove to you that he is nothing like Geno as a prospect.
He's good but not great. -- and he's not overrated, either.
Quote:He is an idiot,
tall darkskinned and skinny = Geno Smith
that is his evaluation
Wiseman, you haven't said a damn thing worth anything in this thread. All I've seen you do is basically insult everyone who you don't agree with by calling them idiots and morons. Im sure it makes you feel special and tingly inside when you insult others to make yourself seem ”wise” and dominant.
Why don't YOU tell us why you think TB is the second coming? Why is he comparable to Luck? If NFL scouts and execs are questioning him; if the Texans are willing to trade their pick (Colts didn't do this and were transparent that they were taking Luck); then what makes you soo positive that you're calling other posters who disagree with you morons and idiots?
Quote:Wiseman, you haven't said a damn thing worth anything in this thread. All I've seen you do is basically insult everyone who you don't agree with by calling them idiots and morons. Im sure it makes you feel special and tingly inside when you insult others to make yourself seem ”wise” and dominant.
Why don't YOU tell us why you think TB is the second coming? Why is he comparable to Luck? If NFL scouts and execs are questioning him; if the Texans are willing to trade their pick (Colts didn't do this and were transparent that they were taking Luck); then what makes you soo positive that you're calling other posters who disagree with you morons and idiots?
I just got done reading this thread and was going to post something similar. You look like the fool to everyone when you start slinging around personal insults while debating something.
I can't imagine Teddy not going in the top 2.
I'll defer judgement until after the combine. As I recall before the season there were many on this board clamoring for Tajh Boyd. After it all played out he is rarely mentioned anywhere.
TB is going top 5 for sure.
I also don't understand all the Geno hate. I mean he did have somewhat of a rough rookie year, but the man did win 8 games and had some plays and drives that made you a believer. I'm not saying he is the future of the jets but he certainly still has a chance
Quote:Wiseman, you haven't said a damn thing worth anything in this thread. All I've seen you do is basically insult everyone who you don't agree with by calling them idiots and morons. Im sure it makes you feel special and tingly inside when you insult others to make yourself seem ”wise” and dominant.
Why don't YOU tell us why you think TB is the second coming? Why is he comparable to Luck? If NFL scouts and execs are questioning him; if the Texans are willing to trade their pick (Colts didn't do this and were transparent that they were taking Luck); then what makes you soo positive that you're calling other posters who disagree with you morons and idiots?
The only thing they are questioning is his size, I don't know what delusional world you live in but I don't like stuff that is made up. Clearly you have an agenda if you say otherwise
Quote:I just got done reading this thread and was going to post something similar. You look like the fool to everyone when you start slinging around personal insults while debating something.
Say it then, instead of making stuff up about the kid keep to the facts, clearly something you have a problem with
ok,if Teddy,Johnny and Bortles are there at 3,who does dave take?
This is assumming Clowney goes first and maybe Mathews second
Quote:Jameis would be taken above Teddy 99 times out of 100
Oops. How will the fools like solid snake try to spin this to make me look racist since both share the same race.
One season of Jameis and you're already creaming your pants. Too bad we wont sniff the guy even if he becomes the top QB prospect. We'll find a way to be just good enough to be out of the Winston sweepstakes, probably finishing 5-11.
Quote:The only thing they are questioning is his size, I don't know what delusional world you live in but I don't like stuff that is made up. Clearly you have an agenda if you say otherwise
The scouts and execs are legitimately questioning his size for durability reasons. How is that making stuff up? Have your beef with them, not the people staying what the scouts are saying.
Why is Winston even mentioned? He's not in this draft. And guess what, once Winston does come out people will knock him and compare him to past and future prospects
Quote:The scouts and execs are legitimately questioning his size for durability reasons. How is that making stuff up? Have your beef with them, not the people staying what the scouts are saying.
His size and durability does not take away from his qbing ability.
Glad we're focusing on the topic of the thread, guys...
My two cents, from what I've seen:
Teddy is the most pro-ready QB because of his style of offense and his mental game. His command of the play before the snap and after, in addition to his proficiency at making pre-snap adjustments, is a skill most QBs take years to develop. HOWEVER his physical tools are lacking. He makes up for a lack of top end arm-strength with his phenomenal touch. He makes up for a lack of top-end speed by running smart. He makes up for a lack of Luck-esque stature by his fantastic pocket navigation skills.
This tells me that he has a high floor, but his ceiling isn't much higher. Why? Because the stuff he is good, even great at, are teachable things. The stuff he is only above-average at, the strength, speed, and size, are things that CANNOT be coached. I believe he will have little room for progression. He will consistently be in that Top 10 QB range, but will never advance into the Top 5.
Just my thoughts, take them for what they're worth.
Quote:See Smith, Geno: fans fall in love with guy when we're in desperate need for a franchise QB.
And love is blind.
I will say that pirkster is indeed right with the above, on its own.
I've done it with QB in the past that were not that great, but I elevated because I was just so desperate to see Jax get a good one. It happened with Mark Sanchez in that draft several years ago. And I was far from the only one that were buying into that hype.
But, Bridgewater indeed has QB skill that is WAY above QB of the Mark Sanchez and even Geno Smith ilk. If you can't see it, then you don't want to see it.
Quote:Glad we're focusing on the topic of the thread, guys...
My two cents, from what I've seen:
Teddy is the most pro-ready QB because of his style of offense and his mental game. His command of the play before the snap and after, in addition to his proficiency at making pre-snap adjustments, is a skill most QBs take years to develop. HOWEVER his physical tools are lacking. He makes up for a lack of top end arm-strength with his phenomenal touch. He makes up for a lack of top-end speed by running smart. He makes up for a lack of Luck-esque stature by his fantastic pocket navigation skills.
This tells me that he has a high floor, but his ceiling isn't much higher. Why? Because the stuff he is good, even great at, are teachable things. The stuff he is only above-average at, the strength, speed, and size, are things that CANNOT be coached. I believe he will have little room for progression. He will consistently be in that Top 10 QB range, but will never advance into the Top 5.
Just my thoughts, take them for what they're worth.
Peyton manning had all those concerns, people said that he peaked in college
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/footbal...ers/4.html
Same stuff your saying now is the the same things I heard back in 98
Quote:Glad we're focusing on the topic of the thread, guys...
My two cents, from what I've seen:
Teddy is the most pro-ready QB because of his style of offense and his mental game. His command of the play before the snap and after, in addition to his proficiency at making pre-snap adjustments, is a skill most QBs take years to develop. HOWEVER his physical tools are lacking. He makes up for a lack of top end arm-strength with his phenomenal touch. He makes up for a lack of top-end speed by running smart. He makes up for a lack of Luck-esque stature by his fantastic pocket navigation skills.
This tells me that he has a high floor, but his ceiling isn't much higher. Why? Because the stuff he is good, even great at, are teachable things. The stuff he is only above-average at, the strength, speed, and size, are things that CANNOT be coached. I believe he will have little room for progression. He will consistently be in that Top 10 QB range, but will never advance into the Top 5.
Just my thoughts, take them for what they're worth.
He uses very little lower body in his throws as well, imagine what a qb coach and 20 lbs of weight gain would do for him