Quote:I just hope this guy isnt a liability on the field
I wouldn't worry about that. Fowler might be a bad athlete but he does have the intangibles in spades. He will hustle and motor his way into being a solid football player, just not one that will ever be worth the #3 overall pick (which was also true before the injury).
Quote:I tried very hard during draft season to get people to understand how bad of an athlete Fowler is. Unfortunately people still didn't get it. Fowler is an undersized DE with above average dashes (not very useful for DE) and poor position specific drills (3 cone, broad, and veritcal jumps), or he is a very big OLB with horrible position specific drills. In reality, a LEO is probably best considered a hybrid if you are trying to compare positional numbers so Fowler is an average sized wide 9 pass rusher with very poor position specific drills. Using his SPARQ score, which doesn't take position into account, Dante is merely a 30th percentile athlete period while Khalil Mack was 90th percentile.
Coincidentally there was some interesting reading this summer about how high SPARQ athletes have been healthier as far as soft tissue and non contact injuries than non high SPARQ athletes in their careers. Digging deeper than that is for a different day and probably some more conclusive evidence before it's really worth blaming Fowler's lack of athleticism on his ACL tear (but there's a solid chance it was a factor).
Wow... I don't think I've ever seen someone try so hard in my life.
Quote:I tried very hard during draft season to get people to understand how bad of an athlete Fowler is. Unfortunately people still didn't get it. Fowler is an undersized DE with above average dashes (not very useful for DE) and poor position specific drills (3 cone, broad, and veritcal jumps), or he is a very big OLB with horrible position specific drills. In reality, a LEO is probably best considered a hybrid if you are trying to compare positional numbers so Fowler is an average sized wide 9 pass rusher with very poor position specific drills. Using his SPARQ score, which doesn't take position into account, Dante is merely a 30th percentile athlete period while Khalil Mack was 90th percentile.
Coincidentally there was some interesting reading this summer about how high SPARQ athletes have been healthier as far as soft tissue and non contact injuries than non high SPARQ athletes in their careers. Digging deeper than that is for a different day and probably some more conclusive evidence before it's really worth blaming Fowler's lack of athleticism on his ACL tear (but there's a solid chance it was a factor).
Shows what you know about ACL tears.
We'll be lucky if he becomes Bobby McCray, decent rush and inept against the run. If we're unlucky he's Branch.
Quote:Shows what you know about ACL tears.
It's silly to think that more athletic people can do elite level athletic things with less of a chance at getting hurt than a lesser athletic person can do at the same elite level? Doesn't seem like a preposterous hypothesis to me, and the SPARQ people are/were in the very early stages or correlating that last I saw.
Quote:Who are some of those tackles he beat in those gifs? Are they even in the NFL?
"Beat" isn't the term I'd use for those gifs. Those were just very poor jobs by college offensive linemen. Fowler won't be so fortunate to play against that level of competition every week in the NFL.
Fowler = a slightly bigger Dion Jordan?
Quote:"Beat" isn't the term I'd use for those gifs. Those were just very poor jobs by college offensive linemen. Fowler won't be so fortunate to play against that level of competition every week in the NFL.
Fowler = a slightly bigger Dion Jordan?
Dion Jordan is 6'6 275
Fowler is 6'3 260.
To me, he is a lot like Dwight Freeney in terms of how he plays. I'm not saying he will even come close to being Dwight Freeney, but his play/ role reminds me of him.
Quote:Uh, no.
<a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/dion-jordan?id=2539288'>http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/dion-jordan?id=2539288</a>
Uhhhhh.... Yes.
<a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.nfl.com/player/dionjordan/2539288/profile'>http://www.nfl.com/player/dionjordan/2539288/profile</a>
Believe it or not, people do put on weight after the combine.
Quote:Uhhhhh.... Yes.
<a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.nfl.com/player/dionjordan/2539288/profile'>http://www.nfl.com/player/dionjordan/2539288/profile</a>
Believe it or not, people do put on weight after the combine.
We're talking about guys as prospects, not guys after multiple years in the NFL.
Fowler is the bigger player coming out, period.
Quote:We're talking about guys as prospects, not guys after multiple years in the NFL.
Fowler is the bigger player coming out, period.
I hope so, because Dante Fowler played nothing like Dion Jordan in college, except for the fact that they both played end and LB.
Dante Fowler was far more explosive.
Quote:Dante Fowler played nothing like Dion Jordan in college, except for the fact that they both played end and LB.
Dante Fowler was far more explosive.
Okay, now that we have established that I'm right about who was the bigger player coming out, I think you're incorrect about their explosiveness and I think Fowler's career will be much like Jordan/Branch. Guys that had good measurables but couldn't rush the passer against NFL quality linemen.
What's worse is next year when Gus is canned I could see a guy like Fowler being released as he was apparently selected specifically because Gus HAS TO RUN A SPECIFIC SCHEME rather than fitting the scheme to the players. Joeckel was a bad selection, but Fowler could end up being worse, and while I think Caldwell overall is a pretty good GM so far he could be 1 for 3 on first round top five overall picks in his first three years, partially thanks to getting cute and making a scheme selection in Fowler.
Quote:Okay, now that we have established that I'm right about who was the bigger player coming out, I think you're incorrect about their explosiveness and I think Fowler's career will be much like Jordan/Branch. Guys that had good measurables but couldn't rush the passer against NFL quality linemen.
What's worse is next year when Gus is canned I could see a guy like Fowler being released as he was apparently selected specifically because Gus HAS TO RUN A SPECIFIC SCHEME rather than fitting the scheme to the players. Joeckel was a bad selection, but Fowler could end up being worse, and while I think Caldwell overall is a pretty good GM so far he could be 1 for 3 on first round top five overall picks in his first three years, partially thanks to getting cute and making a scheme selection in Fowler.
Lol congratulations, you were right about something that's not true anymore. Not to mention the fact that since you wrote " Fowler = Jordan", you clearly never watched them play in college. Glad we established that for you.
I'm pretty sure if Dave Caldwell thought Fowler was the same type of talent as Jordan, Caldwell wouldn't of taken LJ over Jordan. No way to tell, but hey, we had just as big of a need at pass rusher as LT. Not to mention, everyone and their mother thought Jordan at 3 was a reach. DFJ was widely considered to be the best pass rusher suited for the NFL last year.
There really is no comparison between DFJ and Dion Jordan, except that the both played end and LB, and they were selected high in the draft.
Some of you clowns need to send your resumes in to Khan immediately.
Quote:Lol congratulations, you were right about something that's not true anymore. Not to mention the fact that since you wrote " Fowler = Jordan", you clearly never watched them play in college. Glad we established that for you.
I'm pretty sure if Dave Caldwell thought Fowler was the same type of talent as Jordan, Caldwell wouldn't of taken LJ over Jordan. No way to tell, but hey, we had just as big of a need at pass rusher as LT. Not to mention, everyone and their mother thought Jordan at 3 was a reach. DFJ was widely considered to be the best pass rusher suited for the NFL last year.
There really is no comparison between DFJ and Dion Jordan, except that the both played end and LB, and they were selected high in the draft.
To sum your post up:
"Okay, you were right about the facts of that, but you're wrong about everything else, though I have no proof or desire to prove it!"
Gus is going to need to really stock up on the sprinkles or Dave is going to need to sign the all pro team if the team is going to succeed under current coaching.
Quote:Okay, now that we have established that I'm right about who was the bigger player coming out, I think you're incorrect about their explosiveness and I think Fowler's career will be much like Jordan/Branch. Guys that had good measurables but couldn't rush the passer against NFL quality linemen.
What's worse is next year when Gus is canned I could see a guy like Fowler being released as he was apparently selected specifically because Gus HAS TO RUN A SPECIFIC SCHEME rather than fitting the scheme to the players. Joeckel was a bad selection, but Fowler could end up being worse, and while I think Caldwell overall is a pretty good GM so far he could be 1 for 3 on first round top five overall picks in his first three years, partially thanks to getting cute and making a scheme selection in Fowler.
lol @ Fowler being cut. Once again your username is spot on.
Quote:To sum your post up:
"Okay, you were right about the facts of that, but you're wrong about everything else, though I have no proof or desire to prove it!"
Gus is going to need to really stock up on the sprinkles or Dave is going to need to sign the all pro team if the team is going to succeed under current coaching.
To sum up yours
" I have no idea what I'm talking about, so I'm just going to google the height/weight comparisons."
Are you expecting me to give you a play by play analysis to compare DFJ and Dion Jordan's college game tape? Look on YouTube, it's really not hard to see the difference.
Seriously, go on YouTube, compare the two, and with a straight face, tell me their play is the same.
Terrell Suggs 40 yard dash time at the Combine: 4.84
Some guys are just good football players.
Quote:Terrell Suggs 40 yard dash time at the Combine: 4.84
Some guys are just good football players.
Matt Jones had a better vertical, judging by the logic of this thread, he was more explosive and had better lower body strength than Suggs.