Quote:Yea... because you know... Peyton has always had a great line. Look who he is working with now! Back up Clark at LT and a 3rd string center. That's pretty much all-pro caliber stuff right there!
There's a huge difference between not having a great offensive line and having an offensive line that can't even hold a block up the middle.
Tough to hit the depth of the pocket and step up when the center and guards are being driven back as fast as the QB can drop back.
Quote:The problem hasn't been the Rookie LT. Far from it. The game is won and lost on the lines of scrimmage. Most casual fans don't see that though. This team needs an offensive line interior over haul.
Yup, I agree. This team is going nowhere with an O-line like this. I don't care who the QB is. A better QB may improve things,, but it still won't be enough to seriously contend until the O-line gets rebuilt(and experienced) in the interior.
Quote:Yea... because you know... Peyton has always had a great line. Look who he is working with now! Back up Clark at LT and a 3rd string center. That's pretty much all-pro caliber stuff right there!
His line may not be the best.......but this one would push him into retirement.
Quote:His line may not be the best.......but this one would push him into retirement.
Lol no, our line is terrible but we get blitzed more than any team in the NFL because everyone knows our QBs can't pass the ball more than 5 yards.
I'd keep Gabbert around as a backup next season. (barring a legitimately solid QB falling to us later in the draft 4th round or later, ala Rob Johnson in 1995, then we could develop/ trade that pick in future years.)
Thats pretty much his ceiling anyway. Always was.
Quote:Lol no, our line is terrible but we get blitzed more than any team in the NFL because everyone knows our QBs can't pass the ball more than 5 yards.
No matter how many times you say this it will get passed by.
If Manning was behind this line teams wouldnt stack the box / free blitz knowing he could dart it to Shorts for 40 yards almost at will. Point blank Marcedes Lewis production would jump right back to where it was and Blackmon would end the season with 75+ receptions despite missing the first 4 games.
Mjd would suddenly find running lanes and Joeckel/Monroe would look great. We would likely end up 8-8 at worse considering the decent D we've had this year and i bet good money we would already have wins against the Raiders and Chiefs with a close game vs Seattle.
Quote:Lol no, our line is terrible but we get blitzed more than any team in the NFL because everyone knows our QBs can't pass the ball more than 5 yards.
Quote:No matter how many times you say this it will get passed by.
If Manning was behind this line teams wouldnt stack the box / free blitz knowing he could dart it to Shorts for 40 yards almost at will. Point blank Marcedes Lewis production would jump right back to where it was and Blackmon would end the season with 75+ receptions despite missing the first 4 games.
Mjd would suddenly find running lanes and Joeckel/Monroe would look great. We would likely end up 8-8 at worse considering the decent D we've had this year and i bet good money we would already have wins against the Raiders and Chiefs with a close game vs Seattle.
It's interesting how you two just don't get it.
You think everyone is beating the crap out of the Jaguars and the Jaguars o-line with scheme. It's not scheme, it's called butt kicked. If you can't win any 1 on 1's you won't win no matter what the scheme is.
If it were scheme and just teams blitzing every down the Jaguars coaching staff would adjust to stop that from being the big issue. You can't outscheme getting your butt kicked across your 3 interior linemen.
Quote:The problem hasn't been the Rookie LT. Far from it. The game is won and lost on the lines of scrimmage. Most casual fans don't see that though. This team needs an offensive line interior over haul.
Funny thing is, this team has been bad in pass blocking from the interior of the OL, for a long, long, time.
Even in the Coughlin years, it was often that OL's achilles heel.
But since Uche posts here sometimes, people had to act like he was good. :confused:
Just because Uche or whomever, had a good GAME once in a while, did not make the Jags interior OL a good pass blocking unit. They were usually a good run blocking unit, but as far back as I can remember the Jags QB's have consistently suffered from a lot of pressure stemming from poor blocking from the interior OL.
Quote:It's interesting how you two just don't get it.
You think everyone is beating the crap out of the Jaguars and the Jaguars o-line with scheme. It's not scheme, it's called butt kicked. If you can't win any 1 on 1's you won't win no matter what the scheme is.
If it were scheme and just teams blitzing every down the Jaguars coaching staff would adjust to stop that from being the big issue. You can't outscheme getting your butt kicked across your 3 interior linemen.
You couldn't be more wrong. You mean to tell me Manning wouldn't be playing well right now on our team? Granted he wouldn't have 12 touchdowns because we don't have their weapons but come on. Manning audibles every single play so that the blockers are in the exact spot where pressure is going to be. He's been doing it forever with some of the worst offensive lineman ever. Charlie Johnson was his LT for a while and he is some trash. Monroe would be the second best LT he has ever had behind Clady who some think is the best tackle in football.
And again, you can't send blitzers at Manning because he will carve you up. Why do you think Hillman, Moreno and Ball have open holes? Because defenses are sitting back waiting for the pass because they respect Manning.
Our line is bad, we all agree on this. But to think this offense wouldn't look different with Manning or to think Manning wouldn't have figured out some way to make these linemen better is just plain dumb.
Quote:You couldn't be more wrong. You mean to tell me Manning wouldn't be playing well right now on our team? Granted he wouldn't have 12 touchdowns because we don't have their weapons but come on. Manning audibles every single play so that the blockers are in the exact spot where pressure is going to be. He's been doing it forever with some of the worst offensive lineman ever. Charlie Johnson was his LT for a while and he is some trash. Monroe would be the second best LT he has ever had behind Clady who some think is the best tackle in football.
And again, you can't send blitzers at Manning because he will carve you up. Why do you think Hillman, Moreno and Ball have open holes? Because defenses are sitting back waiting for the pass because they respect Manning.
Our line is bad, we all agree on this. But to think this offense wouldn't look different with Manning or to think Manning wouldn't have figured out some way to make these linemen better is just plain dumb.
This is a silly and academic argument, but I'll definitely take the side of Manning failing behind this o-line. It's not like the guy hasn't shown in his career what happens when you put a good rush on him and manage to cover. The Patriots beat him repeatedly by doing so, as did the Chargers. Brady did the same against the Giants.
The Jaguars problem isn't scheme. Period. There is no amount of gyrations or audibles that would allow Meester to suddenly be 3 years younger and Rackley and Nwaneri to suddenly be able to stop guys from blowing them back off the line of scrimmage.
To sum it up, your feelings about Gabbert are clouding your recognition of just how bad this team is right now.
Quote:You couldn't be more wrong. You mean to tell me Manning wouldn't be playing well right now on our team? Granted he wouldn't have 12 touchdowns because we don't have their weapons but come on. Manning audibles every single play so that the blockers are in the exact spot where pressure is going to be. He's been doing it forever with some of the worst offensive lineman ever. Charlie Johnson was his LT for a while and he is some trash. Monroe would be the second best LT he has ever had behind Clady who some think is the best tackle in football.
And again, you can't send blitzers at Manning because he will carve you up. Why do you think Hillman, Moreno and Ball have open holes? Because defenses are sitting back waiting for the pass because they respect Manning.
Our line is bad, we all agree on this. But to think this offense wouldn't look different with Manning or to think Manning wouldn't have figured out some way to make these linemen better is just plain dumb.
I agree with your general point.
A good QB doesn't need a pristine pocket 100% of the time (like Gabbert does) just to be average/ good.
QB like Dan Marino & Peyton Manning made their OL's look better than they were.
The proof was in the pudding. Whenever thy would come out of the game, or whenever the backup would start, he'd be sacked plenty - same OL/ same offensive weapons to throw to.
Good QB have the ability to extend plays & buy the time necessary to at least give a play a chance.
Look at Bridgewater on that clip that is floating around the message board....he steps up into the pocket not once but twice. If that was Blaine Gabbert on the same exact play, he'd have likely either been sacked, or the deep pass never would have been completed or probably even attempted. The play never would have developed to that point.
Quote:Funny thing is, this team has been bad in pass blocking from the interior of the OL, for a long, long, time.
Even in the Coughlin years, it was often that OL's achilles heel.
But since Uche posts here sometimes, people had to act like he was good. :confused:
Just because Uche or whomever, had a good GAME once in a while, did not make the Jags interior OL a good pass blocking unit. They were usually a good run blocking unit, but as far back as I can remember the Jags QB's have consistently suffered from a lot of pressure stemming from poor blocking from the interior OL.
Quote:Funny thing is, this team has been bad in pass blocking from the interior of the OL, for a long, long, time.
Even in the Coughlin years, it was often that OL's achilles heel.
But since Uche posts here sometimes, people had to act like he was good. :confused:
Just because Uche or whomever, had a good GAME once in a while, did not make the Jags interior OL a good pass blocking unit. They were usually a good run blocking unit, but as far back as I can remember the Jags QB's have consistently suffered from a lot of pressure stemming from poor blocking from the interior OL.
Can't run block, can't pass block, can't win.
Quote:I am sorry Blaine Gabbert has a 68.3 rating for his entire career with a QBR of 24.1, 19 interecptions, 9 fumbles, avg 5.51 yards per throw, 53.4% comp.
compare that to the QB that is not on any NFL team, that a lot of fans on here say is a horrible QB that will never play at QB again, Tim Tebow whom has
75.3 career rating, 9int, 7 fumbles, 6.71 yards per throw, so if he's a garbage QB why is Blaine Gabbert our starter if Tebow has better stats (oh and Tebow can run, really, really well)!
I'm not saying Tebow is the answer but he's a better solution than Blaine & Chad appear to be...
It truly is sad to continue to hope that Gabbert gets better. The front office made a horrible over calculation relying on him. I don't even want him as a backup next year.
Check out this weeks power rankings and be sure to read Buffalo. It talks about the Texans being made to look "Gabbertish" by the Ravens.
<a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000249985/article/power-rankings-week-4-bears-saints-ascend-49ers-plummet'>http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000249985/article/power-rankings-week-4-bears-saints-ascend-49ers-plummet</a>
This team needs to wake up.
Quote:It truly is sad to continue to hope that Gabbert gets better. The front office made a horrible over calculation relying on him. I don't even want him as a backup next year.
Check out this weeks power rankings and be sure to read Buffalo. It talks about the Texans being made to look "Gabbertish"by the Ravens.
<a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000249985/article/power-rankings-week-4-bears-saints-ascend-49ers-plummet'>http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000249985/article/power-rankings-week-4-bears-saints-ascend-49ers-plummet</a>
This team needs to wake up.
I'd take Gabbert as a backup if no better option was available. Being a backup is his ceiling.
I'm not saying keep at all costs.
Quote:You mean this?
well, thats another one....
LOL....can you imagine Blaine on that play?
.gif "Laughing")
He'd have crumbled at the first pressure for a sack - probably would have ran right into the pressure.
Quote:It truly is sad to continue to hope that Gabbert gets better. The front office made a horrible over calculation relying on him. I don't even want him as a backup next year.
Check out this weeks power rankings and be sure to read Buffalo. It talks about the Texans being made to look "Gabbertish" by the Ravens.
<a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000249985/article/power-rankings-week-4-bears-saints-ascend-49ers-plummet'>http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000249985/article/power-rankings-week-4-bears-saints-ascend-49ers-plummet</a>
This team needs to wake up.
You can choose to believe what other people say about this team and it's QB.....I choose to believe what I see.
Quote:You couldn't be more wrong. You mean to tell me Manning wouldn't be playing well right now on our team? Granted he wouldn't have 12 touchdowns because we don't have their weapons but come on. Manning audibles every single play so that the blockers are in the exact spot where pressure is going to be. He's been doing it forever with some of the worst offensive lineman ever. Charlie Johnson was his LT for a while and he is some trash. Monroe would be the second best LT he has ever had behind Clady who some think is the best tackle in football.
And again, you can't send blitzers at Manning because he will carve you up. Why do you think Hillman, Moreno and Ball have open holes? Because defenses are sitting back waiting for the pass because they respect Manning.
Our line is bad, we all agree on this. But to think this offense wouldn't look different with Manning or to think Manning wouldn't have figured out some way to make these linemen better is just plain dumb.
No point in arguing with a Gabbot
If Gabby cant succeed with this team, hall of famers surely cant :whistling:
Quote:This is a silly and academic argument, but I'll definitely take the side of Manning failing behind this o-line. It's not like the guy hasn't shown in his career what happens when you put a good rush on him and manage to cover. The Patriots beat him repeatedly by doing so, as did the Chargers. Brady did the same against the Giants.
The Jaguars problem isn't scheme. Period. There is no amount of gyrations or audibles that would allow Meester to suddenly be 3 years younger and Rackley and Nwaneri to suddenly be able to stop guys from blowing them back off the line of scrimmage.
To sum it up, your feelings about Gabbert are clouding your recognition of just how bad this team is right now.
This had nothing to do with Gabbert but thanks for bringing his crappyness into this.
To think that this team wouldn't be better with Manning at QB is ridiculous. He would win us the raiders, rams, Broncos (they wouldnt have him), chargers, Titans, Cards Browns and Bills... Thats 8 wins... Not to mention he would give our defense a rest every once in a while.