Quote:Replace "devalues anyones humanity" with "threatens to kill anyone" and it will better represent the danger of Iran, ISIS, and a significant percentage of the citizens of the rest of the Middle East.
Never mind. There is no talking sense.
Generalizing is stupid and dangerous but helps people sleep at night I suppose.
Quote:Never mind. There is no talking sense.
Generalizing is stupid and dangerous but helps people sleep at night I suppose.
Not believing people who are adamant about killing you is far worse.
I have about a million things to say on the issue, but i think we should start with this.
The systematic rape torture and killing isn't wrong because America's past is perfect, its not wrong because white Europeans are perfect, its not wrong to make my fourth of july party any better, Its not wrong because we magically erased slavery and Jim Crowe from the history books, its wrong because it defies any concept of human value or decency and defies any standard of how we as human beings should treat one another.
This isn't about demonization or moral relativism. This is about plainly articulating the truth about the behavior of a subset of people and making the case that the behavior should stop.
The first step in SMART power is identifying the motivations of the enemy. In order for that to work you have to be honest about it.
Quote:I have about a million things to say on the issue, but i think we should start with this.
The systematic rape torture and killing isn't wrong because America's past is perfect, its not wrong because white Europeans are perfect, its not wrong to make my fourth of july party any better, Its not wrong because we magically erased slavery and Jim Crowe from the history books, its wrong because it defies any concept of human value or decency and defies any standard of how we as human beings should treat one another.
This isn't about demonization or moral relativism. This is about plainly articulating the truth about the behavior of a subset of people and making the case that the behavior should stop.
The first step in SMART power is identifying the motivations of the enemy. In order for that to work you have to be honest about it.
I think this, as a general statement, it's something we can all agree on.
Obviously the philosophies of how to wisely exert the power of our government is what is in contention.
The reason I bring up the past of the US is not to exploit our tenancy towards moral relativism.
It's to point out that there are clear instances where propaganda was used to expedite the political will of a nation towards an action that may not be as savory if we did not demonize that perceived enemy.
The Iranian regime is not a good actor. The Iranian people should not be demonized as the same as their government... we've seen what happens when we lump an entire group into one homogenous evil.
That's all
Oh and also, we've been doing the sanctions approach since the 80s, it seems like a new approach is needed. I for one applaud this new approach...
Quote:Not believing people who are adamant about killing you is far worse.
Assuming a vocal minority is representative of a whole community is much much worse.
Quote:I have about a million things to say on the issue, but i think we should start with this.
The systematic rape torture and killing isn't wrong because America's past is perfect, its not wrong because white Europeans are perfect, its not wrong to make my fourth of july party any better, Its not wrong because we magically erased slavery and Jim Crowe from the history books, its wrong because it defies any concept of human value or decency and defies any standard of how we as human beings should treat one another.
This isn't about demonization or moral relativism. This is about plainly articulating the truth about the behavior of a subset of people and making the case that the behavior should stop.
The first step in SMART power is identifying the motivations of the enemy. In order for that to work you have to be honest about it.
Agreed, that's why we are trying are best to make people stop discriminating against the LGBT community despite the vehement opposition to such behavioral change in this country. Oh that's not what you were talking about. Carry on.
Quote:Assuming a vocal minority is representative of a whole community is much much worse.
That "vocal minority" is also in charge.
Quote:That "vocal minority" is also in charge.
You reasoning is sound. It's why we can't let the racist bigots win elections here next year.
Oh that's not what you meant is it.
Quote:You reasoning is sound. It's why we can't let the racist bigots win elections here next year.
Oh that's not what you meant is it.
So who exactly are the racist bigots?
Quote:How do you know it's a minority?
The same way I know the racist bigots on the conservative right are a minority.
Quote:So who exactly are the racist bigots?
I was being sarcastic in regards to my comment about not generalizing entire groups based on vocal minorities.
Quote:I was being sarcastic in regards to my comment about not generalizing entire groups based on vocal minorities.
I think you should answer MalabarJag's question.
Quote:I think you should answer MalabarJag's question.
Sure I'll answer an unanswerable question when you guys answer how you know it's not the minority. Stupid games are stupid.
Or is this your way of telling me I'm wrong about my assumptions of the right wing crazies being a minority?
Quote:How do you know it's a minority?
Because if they were the majority the attacks would be exponentially more frequent and more often on our soil.
Quote:Because if they were the majority the attacks would be exponentially more frequent and more often on our soil.
No, the embargo prevented that.
Quote:Sure I'll answer an unanswerable question when you guys answer how you know it's not the minority. Stupid games are stupid.
Or is this your way of telling me I'm wrong about my assumptions of the right wing crazies being a minority?
Right, so my argument is that their leadership and street is quite vocal about "DEATH TO AMERICA! DEATH TO ISRAEL!!!!!"
Your argument is "Most of em don't really mean it so we should totally do this deal that gives them the bomb in the next 20 years."
Great idea.
Quote:No, the embargo prevented that.
I believe the thread of thought to which I replied was about all Muslims, not just Iran.
Quote:I believe the thread of thought to which I replied was about all Muslims, not just Iran.
Ah, I was only speaking to the Persians.