Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Colts fans think we our second meeting will be another shutout and Andrew Luck will have to run for his life.

(10-29-2017, 02:37 AM)JaguarsWoman Wrote: [ -> ]Colts fans think we our second meeting will be another shutout and Andrew Luck will have to run for his life.

(10-28-2017, 05:13 PM)JaG4LyFe Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-28-2017, 02:54 PM)Jags02 Wrote: [ -> ]Wow, they have a lot tied up in that DL.

I hate to use the word "renegotiation" because it reminds me of the trouble we got into with Michael Huyughe trying to keep the '99 roster intact. However, Linder might be a prime candidate because his deal was front loaded. They could easily shave about $6 mil off Linder's cap hit with a fat signing bonus that's split up against the cap over his remaining years.

Why would he do that? To fire his agent?

Are you asking me why Linder would renegotiate? Are you kidding me? Players love to renegotiate because they're converting future salary into a big fat upfront check. Every player, and every player's agent, always immediately renegotiateswhen asked. 

---

(10-28-2017, 04:52 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-28-2017, 02:11 PM)Jags02 Wrote: [ -> ]Colvin may get prove-it starter offers. I see a guy like Buster Skrine with a $8.5 mil cap hit this year and I have to think Colvin will command at least as much. Sean Smith signed a 4-year contract with the Raiders this past season averaging $9.5 mil per year while their other CB David Amerson signed for right about $8.5 mil per year.

The mid-tier range for QBs is $8 to $10 mil. The top CBs are making $12 to $16 mil per.

I think you're probably correct that he'll get more to sign elsewhere than he'll be able to get from the Jaguars, I'm just saying what I'd offer a guy that is good as a tackler but that never gets interceptions.

Colvin is more than just a good tackler. He doesn't get many INTs because CBs don't like to throw his direction. Any offer shy of $8 mil per is not an offer at all. 

(10-28-2017, 07:37 PM)JaguarsWoman Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-28-2017, 03:23 PM)Jags02 Wrote: [ -> ]My being the only one to bring it up doesn't make it any less true. The Boycotts have EVERYTHING to do with it.

If boycotts had ANYTHING to do with it that would already be all over the Internet exactly the way you said it: "NFL boycotts are guaranteed to cause a reduction in the salary cap in 2018 and beyond." Until a statement along those lines is published on NFL.com or something like that there is no reason to believe boycotts have "everything" to do with salary caps.

Don't put words in my mouth. I never said "guaranteed." Earlier in this thread I mentioned...

Quote:This NFL boycott is taking a huge toll on the league's numbers wherein the overall cap for each team very well may drop instead of growing like we're used to.

These boycotts are going to be felt. Someone was saying the TV revenue is already in.... well, it's not in for next year then. The TV ratings are taking massive hits as well... it's not just ticket sales... and so is virtually everything NFL related. Sponsors are pulling out right and left. It's not a good situation for the league, so we have to consider what this might mean for next year's salary cap. We're accustomed to seeing the cap grow considerably every year, and I'm just saying that might soon no longer be the case. We're very likely to see a considerable hit if not this year then the next. 

(10-28-2017, 05:26 PM)Billsfan1212 Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-27-2017, 09:43 PM)JaguarsWoman Wrote: [ -> ]Bills fans seem to be shocked and upset Buffalo only got a sixth rounder out of it.

https://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/1...ksonville/

(10-28-2017, 02:55 PM)Achilles Wrote: [ -> ]The bills front office has been making terrible decisions for years now. Their gm has no idea what he's doing. I'm glad Dave and Tom took advantage of that and brought in a guy that's low risk, massive reward. 

Also stated, even if he isn't AS good as his 2014 self, even currently he's one of the best DTs in the game. With the right coaching and players around him, he's going to be dangerous.

With all due respect, when you say something like that you should probably have some sort of idea what you are talking about.
I'll spare you the rehortic, but this regime is cleaning the mess that Whaley and Rex brought upon this team. 
Their play and their actions have been night and day.
Both franchises seek to have figured things out for the time being and are on the rise
I like the Jags and am familiar to a degree bc my father lives in the area.
Let's not pretend either are a model franchise though.
Both have issues, and neither are the cream of the crop of the NFL. Very similar teams.
There was hope a return to 4-3 would set him off again this yr and he'd return to form.
Sadly, he couldn't get on the field and when he did he found a new way to get into trouble, get injured, or make a dumb play. 
This move wasn't a GM going rouge, this was something that NEEDED to happen whether it be paying someone to take him or a cut. He was the lone guy who couldn't get on board. 
My ONLY point was essentially you guys got yourselves a player who could turn it around....but, maybe not. 
Only time will tell.
Just know, he was given a babysitter as well as every opportunity conceivable and then some to figure it out and he couldn't.
He will go down in BUF history as one of their biggest busts behind Williams, Maybinn, McGahee either way now that his time with the team is through

I'm sure a lot of Buffalo fans would like to spin this as getting rid of a player who needed to go.   But another way to look at it is, Buffalo got a new coach and a new GM, they were handed a young underachieving player who had played at a pro bowl level, and they failed to turn him back around. 

I see this all the time.  I new regime takes over and they start chucking players out the window because they're not "my type of player."  Or "they don't fit the culture."  Or something like that. 

That seems like pure failure to me.  Nothing to be happy about. 

On the other hand, the Jags have a shot at the playoffs this year, and one of their major weaknesses is run defense, and they get a guy with this potential for a 6th round pick?    The Jags' head coach is the same head coach who coached him into the pro bowl.  The Jags' locker room is filled with very strong leadership.  Who wouldn't make this move in the same circumstances?  It's an absolute no-brainer.

(10-29-2017, 06:24 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-28-2017, 05:26 PM)Billsfan1212 Wrote: [ -> ]With all due respect, when you say something like that you should probably have some sort of idea what you are talking about.
I'll spare you the rehortic, but this regime is cleaning the mess that Whaley and Rex brought upon this team. 
Their play and their actions have been night and day.
Both franchises seek to have figured things out for the time being and are on the rise
I like the Jags and am familiar to a degree bc my father lives in the area.
Let's not pretend either are a model franchise though.
Both have issues, and neither are the cream of the crop of the NFL. Very similar teams.
There was hope a return to 4-3 would set him off again this yr and he'd return to form.
Sadly, he couldn't get on the field and when he did he found a new way to get into trouble, get injured, or make a dumb play. 
This move wasn't a GM going rouge, this was something that NEEDED to happen whether it be paying someone to take him or a cut. He was the lone guy who couldn't get on board. 
My ONLY point was essentially you guys got yourselves a player who could turn it around....but, maybe not. 
Only time will tell.
Just know, he was given a babysitter as well as every opportunity conceivable and then some to figure it out and he couldn't.
He will go down in BUF history as one of their biggest busts behind Williams, Maybinn, McGahee either way now that his time with the team is through

I'm sure a lot of Buffalo fans would like to spin this as getting rid of a player who needed to go.   But another way to look at it is, Buffalo got a new coach and a new GM, they were handed a young underachieving player who had played at a pro bowl level, and they failed to turn him back around. 

I see this all the time.  I new regime takes over and they start chucking players out the window because they're not "my type of player."  Or "they don't fit the culture."  Or something like that. 

That seems like pure failure to me.  Nothing to be happy about. 

On the other hand, the Jags have a shot at the playoffs this year, and one of their major weaknesses is run defense, and they get a guy with this potential for a 6th round pick?    The Jags' head coach is the same head coach who coached him into the pro bowl.  The Jags' locker room is filled with very strong leadership.  Who wouldn't make this move in the same circumstances?  It's an absolute no-brainer.

Its a good move for both teams. Building a team culture as a new HC/GM combo isn't easy and its only made harder by players who don't buy in with what you are selling, even if they are talented.  You can only lead the horse to water.   

Dareus is a very talented guy but has off the field issues, suspension issues and perhaps isn't the easiest person to have in the locker room. Has a huge contract that that he wasn't playing up as of late , add that to the other issues and you have a guy that isn't very valuable to the new Bills regime.

(10-29-2017, 02:52 AM)haveaseat Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-29-2017, 02:37 AM)JaguarsWoman Wrote: [ -> ]Colts fans think we our second meeting will be another shutout and Andrew Luck will have to run for his life.

JDuhb...it makes perfect sense.

A national observer hates the Dareus trade from the Jaguars perspective.  

https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/10/28/week-8...onferences

Quote:"2a. I can’t believe you can’t believe the Marcell Dareus trade! O.K., fair enough, no one ever gets traded, so you were right to spit-take. And, actually, it’s pretty stunning that now two teams have been willing to take on the albatross that is Dareus’s contract.

I could be wrong (I often am!), but I am bordering on physically ill over this deal from the Jaguars standpoint. (I also just ate 11 ounces of candy corn, which could be a contributing factor.) There are the obvious non-football concerns with Dareus; he’s been suspended twice under the league’s substance-abuse policy and the Bills sent him home from a preseason game this past summer for violating team rules. After that, he was made him available via a “free stuff” ad on Craigslist and a guy from West Seneca emailed to say he’d take him but then never showed to pick him up."

The contract, signed in 2015, was absolutely toxic, one of the worst deals for any team in football, hefty and inescapable for a player who can be great but more often . . . well. But a 2018 cap hit just north of $10 million for a high-risk player is only part of the problem. There is incredible depth at interior defensive line across the NFL right now. Remember what happened to Johnathan Hankins this past offseason? He’s a quality interior D-lineman, and he eventually had to settle for course credit as compensation with the Colts, and he’s not even sure those credits are gonna transfer. I kid, he got a three-year $27 million deal with the $10 million in guarantees due up front—essentially a one-year deal with two one-year options for the team—which means he has a more palatable deal than what remains on Dareus’s contract. Hankins, of course, isn’t quite the talent Dareus is. But he also doesn’t bring the baggage...."

(10-29-2017, 03:53 AM)Jags02 Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-28-2017, 05:13 PM)JaG4LyFe Wrote: [ -> ]Why would he do that? To fire his agent?

Are you asking me why Linder would renegotiate? Are you kidding me? Players love to renegotiate because they're converting future salary into a big fat upfront check. Every player, and every player's agent, always immediately renegotiateswhen asked. 

---

(10-28-2017, 04:52 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]I think you're probably correct that he'll get more to sign elsewhere than he'll be able to get from the Jaguars, I'm just saying what I'd offer a guy that is good as a tackler but that never gets interceptions.

Colvin is more than just a good tackler. He doesn't get many INTs because CBs don't like to throw his direction. Any offer shy of $8 mil per is not an offer at all. 

Doesn't get many ints? He literally has zero in his career. http://www.nfl.com/player/aaroncolvin/2543501/profile

He gets thrown at plenty because of what the alternative is, throwing at Ramsey. He's a good roleplayer on a great defense, but when you have talent and salary like the Jaguars do you have to decide where your difference makers are and where your replaceable guys are. Colvin is replaceable and while there might be a drop off, if the coaching staff is any good they'll figure out a way to teach the next guy up to tackle.

I'll take a chance on a player like Dareus for a 6th rounder 10/10 times

(10-29-2017, 08:43 AM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]I'll take a chance on a player like Dareus for a 6th rounder 10/10 times

Me too.

There's another team in the NFL which has excelled at taking other teams' unwanted recent high draft picks and using them to their strengths; if it works out, fine, if not then off they go. Sometimes it doesn't work out, Albert Haynesworth comes to mind, but more often than not, it does.

It pleases me that TC/DC/DM may embark on the same path. With MD, there's off the field stuff and a big contract but our front office is not stupid, they will have mitigated the risk or least calculated that they can handle it. The boom/bust on this move is very favorable, IMO.

If this were the Gus/Caldwell making the deal, I would think it's awful.  But given the success that Marrone/Coughlin have had with free agents and the draft, they saw 2017 as the year to win the division title and they needed to get better against the run. 

There is still plenty of cap space this year that will be rolled over to next year.  And if the Jags move on from Bortles, that clears $19 M.  Cut Ivory and that saves close to $4M.  Lots of other players like Abry Jones, Parnell, Lewis, Hurns, etc. that can be replaced with younger/cheaper players.

(10-29-2017, 09:59 AM)PF* Wrote: [ -> ]There's another team in the NFL which has excelled at taking other teams' unwanted recent high draft picks and using them to their strengths; if it works out, fine, if not then off they go. Sometimes it doesn't work out, Albert Haynesworth comes to mind, but more often than not, it does.

It pleases me that TC/DC/DM may embark on the same path. With MD, there's off the field stuff and a big contract but our front office is not stupid, they will have mitigated the risk or least calculated that they can handle it. The boom/bust on this move is very favorable, IMO.

Which team are you referring to?

One thing that just came to mind is we don't know the specifics of the team rule violation. Was it an isolated incident or behavior Rex Ryan let slide?

I can't wait to see him suit up and play on the defensive line.

I do wonder how accepting the players will be to this move. I would think it will have more to do with his attitude upon arrival and his work ethic but there might be some small amount of resentment. Like damn, wern't we doing pretty damn good before type of sentiment?

Success breeds success....
I would think he's happy coming here to be a part the Jaguars' top ranked defense.
I'm betting he plays like his early years.
And I'm sure Calais and Coach Marrone will give him the ground rules.

Besides....in Buffalo you never see the sun...it's depressing.

(10-29-2017, 11:52 AM)Mowerguy Wrote: [ -> ]Success breeds success....
I would think he's happy coming here to be a part the Jaguars' top ranked defense.
I'm betting he plays like his early years.
And I'm sure Calais and Coach Marrone will give him the ground rules.

Besides....in Buffalo you never see the sun...it's depressing.

True dat. Plus no state income tax. Essentially a raise on his already huge pay.

(10-29-2017, 11:36 AM)Jagwired Wrote: [ -> ]I do wonder how accepting the players will be to this move. I would think it will have more to do with his attitude upon arrival and his work ethic but there might be some small amount of resentment. Like damn, wern't we doing pretty damn good before type of sentiment?

I think the players know the run D hasn't been all that great

Can someone tell me how much dead money there would be on our cap if we cut him after the 2018 and 2019 seasons? I see a lot of analysis of the financial from the Bills' standpoint, but not from our perspective if, Dareus continues to be the Dareus of the last year and a half (sorry if I missed it somewhere in this thread).