Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

(10-27-2017, 09:43 PM)JaguarsWoman Wrote: [ -> ]Bills fans seem to be shocked and upset Buffalo only got a sixth rounder out of it.

https://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/1...ksonville/

(10-30-2017, 05:06 PM)Etdavis2006 Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-30-2017, 04:47 PM)Billsfan1212 Wrote: [ -> ]This ISNT about Doug Marrone.... but dont tell me about a strong enough coaching staff. This man managed to alienate an entire city....overplayed his hand and then had to tuck his tail between his legs and be an ast coach before this opportunity.
I'm not sure you understand what the word FLEECE actually means.
I think the words you are ACTUALLY looking for are mutually beneficial  as this could potentially be...to BOTH parties involved (IE one team gets rid of an overpaid distraction who had worn out his welcome and would be forced to cut if no one was willing to give anything, while the other sees a risk/reward situation that could pay dividends IF said distraction ever finds the fire in his belly and decides he actually cares enough to stay in shape and act like a professional making millions of dollars).
When you say words like FLEECE, but dont actually understand the situation or context in which you use said word... well... you tend to just look kinda dumb.
Stop being a homer and use your brain. Once you can string some sort of intelligent and/or informed thoughts together on the subject I'd be more than happy to have a discussion.

In reference to Doug, I heard he didn’t want EJ Manuel and your silly owner made it happen anayway. He also wrote a clause in the contract that he could opt out at anytime and still make all his money. What is it with you guys paying for players and coaches and go aren’t even there anymore. So nice try distorting the facts again. Bro y’all traded an all pro DT for a sixth rounder. For reference the Jets got a second and a wr for Sheldon Richardson who is on the last year of his contract and has less sacks than Dareus had in less games last season. How’s that for intelligent informed thoughts for you lol. 

Don’t comes to a jags board spreading “knowledge” or “cautionary tales” of how y’all couldn’t get an all pro player to produce after y’all changed the defense and his role in said defense and now wonder why he isn’t productive anymore. That’s football 101. That’s literally like putting JJ Watt at nose tackle and wondering why he can get 20 sacks again. Y’all screwed up. That’s all it is. Y’all mismanaged a high end player and couldn’t get max minimum value for him. Oh and by the way, y’all are still paying 10 million this year for him and 14 million for him next year? Y’all are carrying 24 million of dead cap over 2 years for a player not even on your roster and only got a 6th out of it. 

Yep sounds like a good ole fleecing to me lol. Now you can try and refute any point that was brought up with out dodging any point, resorting to name calling and shallow digs. Otherwise you look like the blind homer looking to “educate” the silly southern hicks. I guess the city slicker is all knowing. We clearly don’t know football. Der wees justa one horse town...

(10-30-2017, 04:30 PM)Etdavis2006 Wrote: [ -> ]I have never heard of a player being an all pro and being considered a bust.

(10-30-2017, 05:38 PM)JaguarsWoman Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-30-2017, 05:09 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]The play calling from Marrone has been largely very good in his time here. Especially considering he's been doing it with a mostly one dimensional offense. 

I can understand why your perception of Marrone and Hackett would be so colored, but they are both making lots of believers out of a large number of fans that were not originally happy about them being hired/retained here. 

Three of the four wins by the Jags have actually featured some very smart game-planning and play calling IMO. Exploiting weaknesses and/or keeping a defense off balance with a bit of smoke and mirrors seem to come fairly easy to this staff compared to many others I've observed closely.

Did we win one game despite bad play calling?

One thing that really helps is we have a HC and OC who worked together somewhere else before getting jobs in Jacksonville. They have a great chemistry that allows a more flexible, strength-tailored game plan each week.

(10-30-2017, 05:44 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]There's a giant landscape of gray area in between "bad play calling" and "very smart play calling."  It's not one or the other.

The Jags did not have bad play calling in the Steelers game, but calling it "very smart" would be a stretch. 
They took the safest and most obvious approach to that game and the Steelers simply could not stop the run.

(10-30-2017, 04:30 PM)Etdavis2006 Wrote: [ -> ]I have never heard of a player being an all pro and being considered a bust.

Derrick Harvey now that’s a bust.

Y’all got fleeced. Just like the good old days. Accept it and move on. Y’all didnt have a strong enough coaching staff and front office to keep his production up. Don’t worry I’ve seen it with Gus Bradley so I understand.

(10-30-2017, 05:44 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-30-2017, 05:38 PM)JaguarsWoman Wrote: [ -> ]Did we win one game despite bad play calling?

One thing that really helps is we have a HC and OC who worked together somewhere else before getting jobs in Jacksonville. They have a great chemistry that allows a more flexible, strength-tailored game plan each week.

There's a giant landscape of gray area in between "bad play calling" and "very smart play calling."  It's not one or the other.

The Jags did not have bad play calling in the steelers game, but calling it "very smart" would be a stretch. 
They took the safest and most obvious approach to that game and the steelers simply could not stop the run.

(10-30-2017, 05:37 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-30-2017, 02:19 PM)Billsfan1212 Wrote: [ -> ][quote pid='1051111' dateline='1509154980']
Gee wiz man... 

Quote:1It's pretty easy to lump him in with that group just by simply taking into account that the contract he was given was anchored by the big expectations that came along with it.

Quote:Even if he didnt keep going to the pro bowl, he was at least expected to be productive. 
He wasn't.
That simple.
Would you be happy if Bortles came out and made the pro bowl 2x in his 1st 4 years, you then made him the highest paid player on your team and then he proceeded to get multiple suspensions, cause problems, and hurt the teams performance?
No, you wouldnt. You'd consider him a bust - and even more so b/c of the hindrance he caused to your cap.
I cant even imagine what would happen if he remained in BUF and got another strike or worse -makes him sit for AN ENTIRE YEAR!!!!!.
At the end of 2013, he was late for team meetings twice.
Marrone benched him for a quarter in a game against Miami as punishment, then the day after the game, he was late again, so in the final game against the Patriots, he was benched for a half.
Five months later, in a span of about 30 days in May 2014, he was arrested on a synthetic drug-possession charge back home in Alabama.
Then he lost control of his car and slammed into a tree outside a restaurant in the Buffalo suburb of Hamburg while he was drag racing with teammate Jerry Hughes.

More substance abuse issues resurfaced while Ryan was in town, and Dareus was suspended by the league for one game at the start of the 2015 season.
Then got nailed again and had to sit out the first four games of 2016.
In between, he did a 30-day stint in rehab (though it turned out it was at One Bills Drive, not at a rehab facility) and announced that he had been afflicted with attention deficit hyperactivity disorder since he was younger.
This year he was sent home bc he was too cool to ride the bus with the team to the game even after he was told he needed to....
So....DONT COME AT ME WITH FREAKING AARON MAYBINS STATS like you know whats up.
The fact that you are totally yippie skippy about this without taking into account that theres a possibility this dosent turn out the way you think it does tells me you might not know that much about football...
Seriously, linking aaron freaking maybins stats.... good god man.
For as bad as Maybin was, at least he didnt come with all the baggage.
Dareus didn't seem to be missed yesterday.
In fact, it was nice not having to watch out for his bone headed play of the game. 
He was traded bc he was far more of a distraction than he was worth.
Again, no one trades a superstar for peanuts.
If its too good to be true, it probably is.
These are just simple facts of not only this situation, but life in general.
Did you stop to consider if it was THAT big of a fleecing, maybe you would have had to give more than a 6th bc teams would be lining up around the block for his services even with his contract?

I assure you, there is no butt hurtedness here.
Quite a callus has been built up over the last 17 years.
Uninformed folks on message boards aside, this was a universally celebrated trade amongst fans. 
Again... if this is such a bang up move for the jags, i don't get why there is sooo much reassuring going on.

It's a gamble plain and simple...

See? because you decided to be ignorant to the situation and insulting, you've got me bashing... which wasnt my intent as I contend I liked the kid. He seems to have a big heart and although he will remain a bust in BUF, I sincerely hope he finds his way and regains his form. The league could use a success story rather than another clown having everything handed to him and blowing it....

And just so I dont get some smart response about 'gee, it sounds like you really like him' he did do excellent things away from the field and seems to have a big heart....
https://buffalowdown.com/2016/11/22/marc...s-charity/
(which counts for NOTHING during game day mind you... but its nice)

(10-30-2017, 05:53 PM)Billsfan1212 Wrote: [ -> ]So you are easily grouping a guy who earned a SECOND contract to guys who didn't make it through their first?  Must be liberating to not be burdened by thinking.

Quote:Even if he didnt keep going to the pro bowl, he was at least expected to be productive. 
He wasn't.
That simple.
Would you be happy if Bortles came out and made the pro bowl 2x in his 1st 4 years, you then made him the highest paid player on your team and then he proceeded to get multiple suspensions, cause problems, and hurt the teams performance?
No, you wouldnt. You'd consider him a bust - and even more so b/c of the hindrance he caused to your cap.
I cant even imagine what would happen if he remained in BUF and got another strike or worse -makes him sit for AN ENTIRE YEAR!!!!!.
At the end of 2013, he was late for team meetings twice.
Marrone benched him for a quarter in a game against Miami as punishment, then the day after the game, he was late again, so in the final game against the Patriots, he was benched for a half.
Five months later, in a span of about 30 days in May 2014, he was arrested on a synthetic drug-possession charge back home in Alabama.
Then he lost control of his car and slammed into a tree outside a restaurant in the Buffalo suburb of Hamburg while he was drag racing with teammate Jerry Hughes.

More substance abuse issues resurfaced while Ryan was in town, and Dareus was suspended by the league for one game at the start of the 2015 season.
Then got nailed again and had to sit out the first four games of 2016.
In between, he did a 30-day stint in rehab (though it turned out it was at One Bills Drive, not at a rehab facility) and announced that he had been afflicted with attention deficit hyperactivity disorder since he was younger.
This year he was sent home bc he was too cool to ride the bus with the team to the game even after he was told he needed to....
So....DONT COME AT ME WITH FREAKING AARON MAYBINS STATS like you know whats up.
The fact that you are totally yippie skippy about this without taking into account that theres a possibility this dosent turn out the way you think it does tells me you might not know that much about football...
Seriously, linking aaron freaking maybins stats.... good god man.
For as bad as Maybin was, at least he didnt come with all the baggage.
Dareus didn't seem to be missed yesterday.
In fact, it was nice not having to watch out for his bone headed play of the game. 
He was traded bc he was far more of a distraction than he was worth.
Again, no one trades a superstar for peanuts.
If its too good to be true, it probably is.
These are just simple facts of not only this situation, but life in general.
Did you stop to consider if it was THAT big of a fleecing, maybe you would have had to give more than a 6th bc teams would be lining up around the block for his services even with his contract?

I assure you, there is no butt hurtedness here.
Quite a callus has been built up over the last 17 years.
Uninformed folks on message boards aside, this was a universally celebrated trade amongst fans. 
Again... if this is such a bang up move for the jags, i don't get why there is sooo much reassuring going on.

It's a gamble plain and simple...

See? because you decided to be ignorant to the situation and insulting, you've got me bashing... which wasnt my intent as I contend I liked the kid. He seems to have a big heart and although he will remain a bust in BUF, I sincerely hope he finds his way and regains his form. The league could use a success story rather than another clown having everything handed to him and blowing it....

And just so I dont get some smart response about 'gee, it sounds like you really like him' he did do excellent things away from the field and seems to have a big heart....
https://buffalowdown.com/2016/11/22/marc...s-charity/
(which counts for NOTHING during game day mind you... but its nice)

Since we are going down memory lane here let's review some more facts.

1.  Buffahole hired Doug Marrone and signed him to a deal that allowed him to escape if Wilson was no longer the owner.    Wilson died, Pegula became owner, and did not bother to renegotiate the clause that allowed Marrone to leave once Wilson was not owner, or otherwise failed to persuade Marrone to stay.  Marrone coaches the Bills to their first winning season in ten years.  Marrone exercises his rights to leave under the terms negotiated by both parties, and Butt hurt Bills fans like yourself call him a quitter, a lousy coach, yada yada yada.  Nevermind his immediate successor in title did not match his level of success.

2.  Faced with the unexpected job opening, Pegula and Buffahole had ample opportunity to hire Jim Schwartz as the new head coach.  Schwartz was your defensive coordinator in 2014, when the Bills finished 4th in total defense, and when Dareus was most productive.  Instead you let him walk, and bring in, of all people, the walking dumpster fire known as Rex Ryan.  Rex Ryan promptly switches from a very successful scheme and installs his 3-4 defense.  Yes, Dareus' productivity dropped... primarily because he moved from a DT to a NT.  That sort of thing tends to happen to DTs that move to NT. But while you portray Dareus as the one malingerer on the Bills defense, the simple truth (since you like simple but apparently not truth) is that defensive productivity for the Bills dropped ACROSS THE BOARD.  They went from 4th in scoring in 2014, to 15th in scoring in 2015, to 16th last year.  They went from first in the league with 54 sacks in 2014 to 31st in the league with 21 in 2015.  Dareus, Jerry Hughes, Mario Williams...ALL had dramatic dropoffs in sacks.  But I guess that's Dareus' fault?  They went from 11th in rush defense in '14 to 16th in 2015 to 28th overall last year.  But that's all on Dareus, too...right?  Nobody else dropped off...right?  The scheme change had nothing to do with anything and was at all times perfect for the personnel...right?  But no...you aren't butt hurt at all. (insert eye roll here)

3.  Based upon your ridiculous hypothetical, Bortles would be a disappointment, not a bust.  Of course the impact of a starting QB going in total meltdown would be far different from a DT going into meltdown because of the roles each play on a team, but nevermind that obvious fact for now.  As much as you'd like to, you can't simply gloss over the two Pro Bowls Bortles made in your hypothetical, any more than you anyone with an appreciation of fact can ignore the two Pro Bowls Dareus made for you.  The fact is, even with all of his off field baggage, Dareus was way more productive than Maybin.  Hell. even taking your drivel about not missing him at face value, Dareus still produced a sack against Cincinnati earlier this year, which, taken alone, still made him more productive than Aaron Freaking Maybin.  There is no way anyone can SENSIBLY put Dareus in the same category as Maybin, even factoring in the off field stuff.

4.  You say nobody trades superstars for peanuts.  Interesting.  Would you say San Francisco got good value for Charles Haley when they sent him to Dallas?  What about Atlanta trading away Brett Favre or Tampa trading away Steve Young?  Do you think the 2nd round pick the Colts got for Marshall Faulk was good return for someone who wound up being league MVP, a Super Bowl champion and a Hall of Famer?  The Raiders traded Randy Moss to New England for a 4th round pick.  Miami traded Welker for a 3rd.  You remember those deals don't you?  You should, because those guys have absolutely owned you.    

5.  Nobody, not me or anyone posting in this thread, denied that Dareus has had some off field issues, so your edit adding this stuff was absolutely worthless and shined no light on this matter.  For that matter, nobody has guaranteed Dareus will be a rousing success here, nor has anyone reassured themselves or anyone else.  The overwhelming majority of posters here have argued it's a trade with low risk and high potential for reward.  At the end of the day, we have a Bills fan on a Jaguars board trying to convince Jaguars fans that a 27 year old, two time Pro Bowler is no different than another first round draft pick of yours that lasted all of two years and mustered as many sacks for the Bills as you or I have.

Now...you were saying something about uninformed posters...?

(10-30-2017, 05:59 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]BillsFan

What’s your goal here dude? Just to say “beware Jags fans. Dareus is lazy and not motivated but I hope it works out for you!” You did that. Thanks.

Sounds like an ex GF. “Well just so you know, your new BF never took me out to nice places and didn’t return all my calls but I hope he treats you well!”

Thanks for your input but almost every Jags poster on this board knows the risks and are willing to accept it. Now go watch Bills Mafia tailgaters jump through tables.

(10-30-2017, 05:57 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-30-2017, 05:53 PM)Billsfan1212 Wrote: [ -> ]So you are easily grouping a guy who earned a SECOND contract to guys who didn't make it through their first?  Must be liberating to not be burdened by thinking.


Since we are going down memory lane here let's review some more facts.

1.  Buffahole hired Doug Marrone and signed him to a deal that allowed him to escape if Wilson was no longer the owner.    Wilson died, Pegula became owner, and did not bother to renegotiate the clause that allowed Marrone to leave once Wilson was not owner, or otherwise failed to persuade Marrone to stay.  Marrone coaches the Bills to their first winning season in ten years.  Marrone exercises his rights to leave under the terms negotiated by both parties, and Butt hurt Bills fans like yourself call him a quitter, a lousy coach, yada yada yada.  Nevermind his immediate successor in title did not match his level of success.

2.  Faced with the unexpected job opening, Pegula and Buffahole had ample opportunity to hire Jim Schwartz as the new head coach.  Schwartz was your defensive coordinator in 2014, when the Bills finished 4th in total defense, and when Dareus was most productive.  Instead you let him walk, and bring in, of all people, the walking dumpster fire known as Rex Ryan.  Rex Ryan promptly switches from a very successful scheme and installs his 3-4 defense.  Yes, Dareus' productivity dropped... primarily because he moved from a DT to a NT.  That sort of thing tends to happen to DTs that move to NT. But while you portray Dareus as the one malingerer on the Bills defense, the simple truth (since you like simple but apparently not truth) is that defensive productivity for the Bills dropped ACROSS THE BOARD.  They went from 4th in scoring in 2014, to 15th in scoring in 2015, to 16th last year.  They went from first in the league with 54 sacks in 2014 to 31st in the league with 21 in 2015.  Dareus, Jerry Hughes, Mario Williams...ALL had dramatic dropoffs in sacks.  But I guess that's Dareus' fault?  They went from 11th in rush defense in '14 to 16th in 2015 to 28th overall last year.  But that's all on Dareus, too...right?  Nobody else dropped off...right?  The scheme change had nothing to do with anything and was at all times perfect for the personnel...right?  But no...you aren't butt hurt at all. (insert eye roll here)

3.  Based upon your ridiculous hypothetical, Bortles would be a disappointment, not a bust.  Of course the impact of a starting QB going in total meltdown would be far different from a DT going into meltdown because of the roles each play on a team, but nevermind that obvious fact for now.  As much as you'd like to, you can't simply gloss over the two Pro Bowls Bortles made in your hypothetical, any more than you anyone with an appreciation of fact can ignore the two Pro Bowls Dareus made for you.  The fact is, even with all of his off field baggage, Dareus was way more productive than Maybin.  Hell. even taking your drivel about not missing him at face value, Dareus still produced a sack against Cincinnati earlier this year, which, taken alone, still made him more productive than Aaron Freaking Maybin.  There is no way anyone can SENSIBLY put Dareus in the same category as Maybin, even factoring in the off field stuff.

4.  You say nobody trades superstars for peanuts.  Interesting.  Would you say San Francisco got good value for Charles Haley when they sent him to Dallas?  What about Atlanta trading away Brett Favre or Tampa trading away Steve Young?  Do you think the 2nd round pick the Colts got for Marshall Faulk was good return for someone who wound up being league MVP, a Super Bowl champion and a Hall of Famer?  The Raiders traded Randy Moss to New England for a 4th round pick.  Miami traded Welker for a 3rd.  You remember those deals don't you?  You should, because those guys have absolutely owned you.    

5.  Nobody, not me or anyone posting in this thread, denied that Dareus has had some off field issues, so your edit adding this stuff was absolutely worthless and shined no light on this matter.  For that matter, nobody has guaranteed Dareus will be a rousing success here, nor has anyone reassured themselves or anyone else.  The overwhelming majority of posters here have argued it's a trade with low risk and high potential for reward.  At the end of the day, we have a Bills fan on a Jaguars board trying to convince Jaguars fans that a 27 year old, two time Pro Bowler is no different than another first round draft pick of yours that lasted all of two years and mustered as many sacks for the Bills as you or I have.

Now...you were saying something about uninformed posters...?

LOL *Bullseye*

Thanks for further proving my point

(10-30-2017, 06:07 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-30-2017, 05:59 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]BillsFan

What’s your goal here dude? Just to say “beware Jags fans. Dareus is lazy and not motivated but I hope it works out for you!” You did that. Thanks.

Sounds like an ex GF. “Well just so you know, your new BF never took me out to nice places and didn’t return all my calls but I hope he treats you well!”

Thanks for your input but almost every Jags poster on this board knows the risks and are willing to accept it. Now go watch Bills Mafia tailgaters jump through tables.

It's catharsis for him.

He can't admit his team was stupid enough to take their entire defense out of a scheme that was working and switch it to one that failed miserably, so he has to blame the good player the switch hurt the most.

(10-30-2017, 06:07 PM)PF* Wrote: [ -> ]Great thread, working on my third bag of popcorn. J-dub's in there trying but can't derail it. Through 7 rounds, I've got BillsFan ahead of ETDavis on points and at a draw with Bullseye.

Now back to the action.

(10-30-2017, 06:07 PM)PF* Wrote: [ -> ]Great thread, working on my third bag of popcorn. Jdub's in there trying but can't derail it. Through 7 rounds, I've got BillsFan ahead of ETDavis on points and at a draw with Bullseye.

Now back to the action.

(10-30-2017, 05:53 PM)Billsfan1212 Wrote: [ -> ]I said...

Quote:1.  Buffahole hired Doug Marrone and signed him to a deal that allowed him to escape if Wilson was no longer the owner.    Wilson died, Pegula became owner, and did not bother to renegotiate the clause that allowed Marrone to leave once Wilson was not owner, or otherwise failed to persuade Marrone to stay.  Marrone coaches the Bills to their first winning season in ten years.  Marrone exercises his rights to leave under the terms negotiated by both parties, and Butt hurt Bills fans like yourself call him a quitter, a lousy coach, yada yada yada.  Nevermind his immediate successor in title did not match his level of success.

Billsfan

Quote:EXPLAINED WHERE YOU MISSED THE MARK HERE IN A PREVIOUS POST. GO READ IT

I already read it.  Marrone's rationale for having the clause in the contract or the fact he may have overestimated the Jets interest in him doesn't change the fact he exercised a duly negotiated clause in his deal that Pegula assumed when he bought the team.  It doesn't change the fact that clause enabled Marrone to leave when Pegula had no intent to fire him or make any coaching change.  It doesn't change the fact that Pegula botched the transition from Marrone and the team was less successful as a result of his departure.

Quote:2.  Faced with the unexpected job opening, Pegula and Buffahole had ample opportunity to hire Jim Schwartz as the new head coach.  Schwartz was your defensive coordinator in 2014, when the Bills finished 4th in total defense, and when Dareus was most productive.  Instead you let him walk, and bring in, of all people, the walking dumpster fire known as Rex Ryan.  Rex Ryan promptly switches from a very successful scheme and installs his 3-4 defense.  Yes, Dareus' productivity dropped... primarily because he moved from a DT to a NT.  That sort of thing tends to happen to DTs that move to NT. But while you portray Dareus as the one malingerer on the Bills defense, the simple truth (since you like simple but apparently not truth) is that defensive productivity for the Bills dropped ACROSS THE BOARD.  They went from 4th in scoring in 2014, to 15th in scoring in 2015, to 16th last year.  They went from first in the league with 54 sacks in 2014 to 31st in the league with 21 in 2015.  Dareus, Jerry Hughes, Mario Williams...ALL had dramatic dropoffs in sacks.  But I guess that's Dareus' fault?  They went from 11th in rush defense in '14 to 16th in 2015 to 28th overall last year.  But that's all on Dareus, too...right?  Nobody else dropped off...right?  The scheme change had nothing to do with anything and was at all times perfect for the personnel...right?  But no...you aren't butt hurt at all. (insert eye roll here)

Quote:KINDA HARD TO BE A TEAM LEADER WHEN YOU ARE SUSPENDED FOR THIS, THAT, AND THE OTHER - NO?

Bruce Smith, Michael Irvin, and Lawrence Taylor were all suspended at one point or another and did pretty well.  But I specifically responded to your charge that Dareus' production declined.  Funny how you didn't address that.

Quote:3.  Based upon your ridiculous hypothetical, Bortles would be a disappointment, not a bust.  Of course the impact of a starting QB going in total meltdown would be far different from a DT going into meltdown because of the roles each play on a team, but nevermind that obvious fact for now.  As much as you'd like to, you can't simply gloss over the two Pro Bowls Bortles made in your hypothetical, any more than you anyone with an appreciation of fact can ignore the two Pro Bowls Dareus made for you.  The fact is, even with all of his off field baggage, Dareus was way more productive than Maybin.  Hell. even taking your drivel about not missing him at face value, Dareus still produced a sack against Cincinnati earlier this year, which, taken alone, still made him more productive than Aaron Freaking Maybin.  There is no way anyone can SENSIBLY put Dareus in the same category as Maybin, even factoring in the off field stuff.

Quote:THIS IS PETTY AS IT IS JUST SEMANTICS, TOMATO TOMOTO
MAYBE HAS A RAP ABOUT HIM - MD WENT TO 2X PROBOWLS = EVEN

I realize not making the playoff this millenium is enough to drive you crazy, but it's not semantics at all.  There is a large swath of area in between the extremes of "first Ballot Hall of Famer" and "Bust." There is no sensible way to equate a player who made two Pro Bowls and reached his second contract to a first round pick edge rusher who only lasted 2 years with his original team and never notched a single sack with his original team.  But let's assume for argument's sake that Dareus unquestionably qualifies as a "bust."  Buffalo is the team that invested a top 3 first round pick on him.  Jacksonville invested a 6th, or at most a 5th on him.  Buffalo is the team that took him out of a scheme in which he was productive and put him in a scheme that made him less productive.  Jacksonville is putting him in a scheme in which he has had success.  Buffalo is the team that signed him to a second deal, including a signing bonus.  Jacksonville paid him no signing bonus, and can cut him after 2018 with minimal cap ramifications.  Buffalo is the team that relied on him for leadership.  In Jacksonville, he'll be in a non leadership role until he proves worthy.  In light of the above, where does any Bills fan get off lecturing Jaguars fans on bad football investments?

Quote:4.  You say nobody trades superstars for peanuts.  Interesting.  Would you say San Francisco got good value for Charles Haley when they sent him to Dallas?  What about Atlanta trading away Brett Favre or Tampa trading away Steve Young?  Do you think the 2nd round pick the Colts got for Marshall Faulk was good return for someone who wound up being league MVP, a Super Bowl champion and a Hall of Famer?  The Raiders traded Randy Moss to New England for a 4th round pick.  Miami traded Welker for a 3rd.  You remember those deals don't you?  You should, because those guys have absolutely owned you.    

Quote:AFTER JUST POINTING OUT THE DIFFERENCE TO ME VIA SEMANTICS - THIS IS THE KINDA CRAP YOU COME BACK AT ME WITH? SHAME ON YOU... POT CALLING KETTLE BLACK AND A LITTLE TOO HYPOCRITICAL FOR MY TASTES

Hypocritical?!?  I responded to your post.  YOU made the assertion that nobody trades superstars for peanuts.  Which of the players above did NOT make a Pro Bowl?  Which of the teams that traded them got good return for the players they traded?