(12-29-2019, 01:10 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 12:49 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]Fowler isn't a consistent pass rusher by any stretch of the imagination, even this year when playing well he disappears for weeks
Even the lead leading pass rushers have stretches where they come up empty. Fowler has played well for LA and has proven to be the guy we thought we were drafting. It sucks for us that he didn't develop until he left (and maybe got a little maturity finally).
He's been good this year while still maintaining his trade mark inconsistency. Before the rams he was inconsistent and not a good pass rusher so has improved for sure.
Still a good while away from living up to his draft status
(12-29-2019, 01:13 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 01:10 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]Even the lead leading pass rushers have stretches where they come up empty. Fowler has played well for LA and has proven to be the guy we thought we were drafting. It sucks for us that he didn't develop until he left (and maybe got a little maturity finally).
He's been good this year while still maintaining his trade mark inconsistency. Before the rams he was inconsistent and not a good pass rusher so has improved for sure.
Still a good while away from living up to his draft status
11.5 sacks screams inconsistency for sure, unlike 8 sacks vs crappy teams.
Flash news for you buddy, neither Fowler nor Yan are elite pass rushers, never will be.
(12-29-2019, 11:39 AM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-28-2019, 08:53 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]We haven’t had as consistent a pass-rusher since Brackens. I don’t think he’s easily replaceable at all.
We drafted one and then let him go to LA (Fowler). We signed one in free agency (Cambell). Both were better against the run. Yan is good though but don't break the bank for him. Signing every good player to franchise money results in a salary cap quickly busted.
Fowler had 16 sacks in his first 3 seasons, and Yannick had 29.5. Yannick, is by far, the most consistent pass rusher we’ve had since Brackens. Even including Fowler’s 2019 season, Yannick Was still more productive in 3 years than Fowler’s 4 years.
As for Campbell, I love Campbell, but he hasn’t been as productive a pass-rusher this season than the previous 2.
(12-29-2019, 01:16 PM)iHaunting Raven Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 01:13 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]He's been good this year while still maintaining his trade mark inconsistency. Before the rams he was inconsistent and not a good pass rusher so has improved for sure.
Still a good while away from living up to his draft status
11.5 sacks screams inconsistency for sure, unlike 8 sacks vs crappy teams.
Flash news for you buddy, neither Fowler nor Yan are elite pass rushers, never will be.
Disappearing for almost two months of games is. Yan at least was playing on one leg to start the year off. We've already seen multiple seasons of elite pass rushing from Yannick too.
(12-29-2019, 01:18 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 01:16 PM)iHaunting Raven Wrote: [ -> ]11.5 sacks screams inconsistency for sure, unlike 8 sacks vs crappy teams.
Flash news for you buddy, neither Fowler nor Yan are elite pass rushers, never will be.
Disappearing for almost two months of games is. Yan at least was playing on one leg to start the year off. We've already seen multiple seasons of elite pass rushing from Yannick too.
Hahaha ok then Fowler 2nd season doesn't count either, he was playing on one leg too
.gif "Laughing")
(12-29-2019, 01:16 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 11:39 AM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]We drafted one and then let him go to LA (Fowler). We signed one in free agency (Cambell). Both were better against the run. Yan is good though but don't break the bank for him. Signing every good player to franchise money results in a salary cap quickly busted.
Fowler had 16 sacks in his first 3 seasons, and Yannick had 29.5. Yannick, is by far, the most consistent pass rusher we’ve had since Brackens. Even including Fowler’s 2019 season, Yannick Was still more productive in 3 years than Fowler’s 4 years.
As for Campbell, I love Campbell, but he hasn’t been as productive a pass-rusher this season than the previous 2.
That is sugar coating it as Fowler didn't play his first year and also coming off a serious injury his 2nd season back should be held into account as well. Seeing that he is now playing in his natural spot we shall see going forward.
(12-29-2019, 01:23 PM)uthill Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 01:16 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]Fowler had 16 sacks in his first 3 seasons, and Yannick had 29.5. Yannick, is by far, the most consistent pass rusher we’ve had since Brackens. Even including Fowler’s 2019 season, Yannick Was still more productive in 3 years than Fowler’s 4 years.
As for Campbell, I love Campbell, but he hasn’t been as productive a pass-rusher this season than the previous 2.
That is sugar coating it as Fowler didn't play his first year and also coming off a serious injury his 2nd season back should be held into account as well. Seeing that he is now playing in his natural spot we shall see going forward.
They just love to ignore that
(12-29-2019, 01:16 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 11:39 AM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]We drafted one and then let him go to LA (Fowler). We signed one in free agency (Cambell). Both were better against the run. Yan is good though but don't break the bank for him. Signing every good player to franchise money results in a salary cap quickly busted.
Fowler had 16 sacks in his first 3 seasons, and Yannick had 29.5. Yannick, is by far, the most consistent pass rusher we’ve had since Brackens. Even including Fowler’s 2019 season, Yannick Was still more productive in 3 years than Fowler’s 4 years.
As for Campbell, I love Campbell, but he hasn’t been as productive a pass-rusher this season than the previous 2.
So? Fowler missed his first season due to injury, he and Fowler have basically played the same number of games, but Yan has played a lot more football (he was the starter during Fowler's time here). Yan was probably a bit better at that time, but Fowler is playing better right now and is better against the run and for all we know may end up with a better career.
This isn't supposed to be about Yan vs Fowler though, the point was and is that Yan is replaceable. You guys talk about him like he's the second coming of Lawrence Taylor or something. He's pretty good, that's it.
(12-29-2019, 01:29 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 01:16 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]Fowler had 16 sacks in his first 3 seasons, and Yannick had 29.5. Yannick, is by far, the most consistent pass rusher we’ve had since Brackens. Even including Fowler’s 2019 season, Yannick Was still more productive in 3 years than Fowler’s 4 years.
As for Campbell, I love Campbell, but he hasn’t been as productive a pass-rusher this season than the previous 2.
So? Fowler missed his first season due to injury, he and Fowler have basically played the same number of games, but Yan has played a lot more football (he was the starter during Fowler's time here). Yan was probably a bit better at that time, but Fowler is playing better right now and is better against the run and for all we know may end up with a better career.
This isn't supposed to be about Yan vs Fowler though, the point was and is that Yan is replaceable. You guys talk about him like he's the second coming of Lawrence Taylor or something. He's pretty good, that's it.
Replace him with who? Let me know who can replace a top 10 pass rusher next season.
(12-29-2019, 01:34 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 01:29 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]So? Fowler missed his first season due to injury, he and Fowler have basically played the same number of games, but Yan has played a lot more football (he was the starter during Fowler's time here). Yan was probably a bit better at that time, but Fowler is playing better right now and is better against the run and for all we know may end up with a better career.
This isn't supposed to be about Yan vs Fowler though, the point was and is that Yan is replaceable. You guys talk about him like he's the second coming of Lawrence Taylor or something. He's pretty good, that's it.
Replace him with who? Let me know who can replace a top 10 pass rusher next season.
Funny how a top 10 pass rusher in tied at #27 in sacks
. And not even the best pass rusher in his own team, clearly outplayed by a rookie.
(12-29-2019, 01:23 PM)uthill Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 01:16 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]Fowler had 16 sacks in his first 3 seasons, and Yannick had 29.5. Yannick, is by far, the most consistent pass rusher we’ve had since Brackens. Even including Fowler’s 2019 season, Yannick Was still more productive in 3 years than Fowler’s 4 years.
As for Campbell, I love Campbell, but he hasn’t been as productive a pass-rusher this season than the previous 2.
That is sugar coating it as Fowler didn't play his first year and also coming off a serious injury his 2nd season back should be held into account as well. Seeing that he is now playing in his natural spot we shall see going forward.
I’m only including his 2016-2018 seasons. We can assume his 2015 injury effected his 2016 play but that’s an assumption. How does that explain his 4 sacks from 2018? I can use injury as an excuse for Yannick this season, too. I’m talking strictly numbers, and Yannick is far more consistent.
(12-29-2019, 01:29 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 01:16 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]Fowler had 16 sacks in his first 3 seasons, and Yannick had 29.5. Yannick, is by far, the most consistent pass rusher we’ve had since Brackens. Even including Fowler’s 2019 season, Yannick Was still more productive in 3 years than Fowler’s 4 years.
As for Campbell, I love Campbell, but he hasn’t been as productive a pass-rusher this season than the previous 2.
So? Fowler missed his first season due to injury, he and Fowler have basically played the same number of games, but Yan has played a lot more football (he was the starter during Fowler's time here). Yan was probably a bit better at that time, but Fowler is playing better right now and is better against the run and for all we know may end up with a better career.
This isn't supposed to be about Yan vs Fowler though, the point was and is that Yan is replaceable. You guys talk about him like he's the second coming of Lawrence Taylor or something. He's pretty good, that's it.
I’m talking about consistency. I’m not talking better then or now. I’m saying Yannick was, and is, more consistent. He’s consistently more available. He’s consistent more productive. I’m not sure who you’re saying is treating him like Lawrence Taylor, but that’s certainly isn’t me. You said he’s replaceable and good players aren’t easily replaceable.
(12-29-2019, 01:34 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 01:29 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]So? Fowler missed his first season due to injury, he and Fowler have basically played the same number of games, but Yan has played a lot more football (he was the starter during Fowler's time here). Yan was probably a bit better at that time, but Fowler is playing better right now and is better against the run and for all we know may end up with a better career.
This isn't supposed to be about Yan vs Fowler though, the point was and is that Yan is replaceable. You guys talk about him like he's the second coming of Lawrence Taylor or something. He's pretty good, that's it.
Replace him with who? Let me know who can replace a top 10 pass rusher next season.
If we were to trade Yannick I would draft AJ Epenesa and I think he would do just fine. Epenesa also wont get over powered in the run game like Yan does at times.
(12-29-2019, 01:29 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 01:16 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]Fowler had 16 sacks in his first 3 seasons, and Yannick had 29.5. Yannick, is by far, the most consistent pass rusher we’ve had since Brackens. Even including Fowler’s 2019 season, Yannick Was still more productive in 3 years than Fowler’s 4 years.
As for Campbell, I love Campbell, but he hasn’t been as productive a pass-rusher this season than the previous 2.
So? Fowler missed his first season due to injury, he and Fowler have basically played the same number of games, but Yan has played a lot more football (he was the starter during Fowler's time here). Yan was probably a bit better at that time, but Fowler is playing better right now and is better against the run and for all we know may end up with a better career.
This isn't supposed to be about Yan vs Fowler though, the point was and is that Yan is replaceable. You guys talk about him like he's the second coming of Lawrence Taylor or something. He's pretty good, that's it.
Yeah but this is our problem. If a player isn't incredible in our broken system then its let them go, we will just replace them.
You cant keep letting your best players walk out the door and be a good team. We keep the backups and low round guys instead.
Ramsey, Telvin, Robinson all gone. Yan maybe gone too. What have we got for them?
I give up at times. This cursed damn franchise.
(12-29-2019, 02:33 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 01:29 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]So? Fowler missed his first season due to injury, he and Fowler have basically played the same number of games, but Yan has played a lot more football (he was the starter during Fowler's time here). Yan was probably a bit better at that time, but Fowler is playing better right now and is better against the run and for all we know may end up with a better career.
This isn't supposed to be about Yan vs Fowler though, the point was and is that Yan is replaceable. You guys talk about him like he's the second coming of Lawrence Taylor or something. He's pretty good, that's it.
Yeah but this is our problem. If a player isn't incredible in our broken system then its let them go, we will just replace them.
You cant keep letting your best players walk out the door and be a good team. We keep the backups and low round guys instead.
Ramsey, Telvin, Robinson all gone. Yan maybe gone too. What have we got for them?
I give up at times. This cursed damn franchise.
Ramsey didn't want to stay. I would've kept him out of spite, but the haul was a salve. Telvin is a headcase. Robinson got a nice offer off an ACL tear and chose a different team (Lee had a good season in his absence too). Fowler was a problem off the field and would've cost too much for his production. Who else left that we should've kept? I don't see much there that you're talking about.
(12-29-2019, 02:44 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 02:33 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah but this is our problem. If a player isn't incredible in our broken system then its let them go, we will just replace them.
You cant keep letting your best players walk out the door and be a good team. We keep the backups and low round guys instead.
Ramsey, Telvin, Robinson all gone. Yan maybe gone too. What have we got for them?
I give up at times. This cursed damn franchise.
Ramsey didn't want to stay. I would've kept him out of spite, but the haul was a salve. Telvin is a headcase. Robinson got a nice offer off an ACL tear and chose a different team (Lee had a good season in his absence too). Fowler was a problem off the field and would've cost too much for his production. Who else left that we should've kept? I don't see much there that you're talking about.
But this is it. Ramsey didnt want to be here so lets get rid of him, one of the best young players in his position. Robinson wants to go. Telvin wanted out. Why cant we keep these guys? I dont see Mahomes or Watson pulling that stuff?
We had a young group of talented guys in 2017 and weve slowly let them drop through our fingers. Time and time again I hear people say we have to draft BAP yet that logic doesn't seem to apply to resigning. Having 2 good DE's is much better than 1.
I want Yan and Allen for a long time. We judge players purely on their first 3 seasons, NFL careers are much longer and I hate this attitude of just getting rid of guys I'd they haven't played lights out. We churn our roster so much. We have no vets, we have no 10 year guy that loves the team and city.
(12-29-2019, 01:34 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 01:29 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]So? Fowler missed his first season due to injury, he and Fowler have basically played the same number of games, but Yan has played a lot more football (he was the starter during Fowler's time here). Yan was probably a bit better at that time, but Fowler is playing better right now and is better against the run and for all we know may end up with a better career.
This isn't supposed to be about Yan vs Fowler though, the point was and is that Yan is replaceable. You guys talk about him like he's the second coming of Lawrence Taylor or something. He's pretty good, that's it.
Replace him with who? Let me know who can replace a top 10 pass rusher next season.
By top 10, I suppose you mean top 30. But he was beat up in the beginning of the year, so probably more like top 20, but then you have to knock off a couple of notches because of his average play against the run. This sounds like I don't like him as a player, I do.
(12-29-2019, 03:00 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 02:44 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Ramsey didn't want to stay. I would've kept him out of spite, but the haul was a salve. Telvin is a headcase. Robinson got a nice offer off an ACL tear and chose a different team (Lee had a good season in his absence too). Fowler was a problem off the field and would've cost too much for his production. Who else left that we should've kept? I don't see much there that you're talking about.
But this is it. Ramsey didnt want to be here so lets get rid of him, one of the best young players in his position. Robinson wants to go. Telvin wanted out. Why cant we keep these guys? I dont see Mahomes or Watson pulling that stuff?
We had a young group of talented guys in 2017 and weve slowly let them drop through our fingers. Time and time again I hear people say we have to draft BAP yet that logic doesn't seem to apply to resigning. Having 2 good DE's is much better than 1.
I want Yan and Allen for a long time. We judge players purely on their first 3 seasons, NFL careers are much longer and I hate this attitude of just getting rid of guys I'd they haven't played lights out. We churn our roster so much. We have no vets, we have no 10 year guy that loves the team and city.
But those situations have zero to do with resigning. Ramsey quit. Telvin quit. DFJ was a problem child. An unknown quantity in post-ACL Robinson chose another offer. Yan was given a very good offer by all reports, he chose not to sign it. Outside of the tags no team can make a guy stay who doesn't want to stay. Not one of those was just "gotten rid of", the reasons were specific and as much about the player's desires as the team's.
(12-29-2019, 02:33 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 01:29 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]So? Fowler missed his first season due to injury, he and Fowler have basically played the same number of games, but Yan has played a lot more football (he was the starter during Fowler's time here). Yan was probably a bit better at that time, but Fowler is playing better right now and is better against the run and for all we know may end up with a better career.
This isn't supposed to be about Yan vs Fowler though, the point was and is that Yan is replaceable. You guys talk about him like he's the second coming of Lawrence Taylor or something. He's pretty good, that's it.
Yeah but this is our problem. If a player isn't incredible in our broken system then its let them go, we will just replace them.
You cant keep letting your best players walk out the door and be a good team. We keep the backups and low round guys instead.
Ramsey, Telvin, Robinson all gone. Yan maybe gone too. What have we got for them?
I give up at times. This cursed damn franchise.
I'd rather have him than not. My main point is not to overpay for merely good players.
(12-29-2019, 05:16 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (12-29-2019, 03:00 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ]But this is it. Ramsey didnt want to be here so lets get rid of him, one of the best young players in his position. Robinson wants to go. Telvin wanted out. Why cant we keep these guys? I dont see Mahomes or Watson pulling that stuff?
We had a young group of talented guys in 2017 and weve slowly let them drop through our fingers. Time and time again I hear people say we have to draft BAP yet that logic doesn't seem to apply to resigning. Having 2 good DE's is much better than 1.
I want Yan and Allen for a long time. We judge players purely on their first 3 seasons, NFL careers are much longer and I hate this attitude of just getting rid of guys I'd they haven't played lights out. We churn our roster so much. We have no vets, we have no 10 year guy that loves the team and city.
But those situations have zero to do with resigning. Ramsey quit. Telvin quit. DFJ was a problem child. An unknown quantity in post-ACL Robinson chose another offer. Yan was given a very good offer by all reports, he chose not to sign it. Outside of the tags no team can make a guy stay who doesn't want to stay. Not one of those was just "gotten rid of", the reasons were specific and as much about the player's desires as the team's.
source on the very good offer? or is that the short term offer rumor with no real numbers given