(06-17-2023, 06:40 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (06-16-2023, 03:13 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]This conversation isn't productive. The conservatives on this board are not wrong about their assessment of the deep state. It's unelected bureaucrats who make policies on behalf of large corporations in the form of giant omnibus bills that nobody reads. Marty and Mikey aren't wrong in that Trump was ill-equipped to stop them. That said, who is? It's a nigh impossible task. Trump has exposed it through sheer stubbornness, which should be a boon to the entire nation if moderate and independents could properly fixate their ire. Until the majority of us fall in line and start putting our foot down, this corruption will not end. Is Trump the man to do it? I'm not sure. He's Toto, though. He's pulling back the curtain. Conservatives are going through an eye-opening of sorts. Until the Mikey's and Marty's start seeing it, we need more Trumps. Not less.
I am seeing it.
What did you think of the DeSantis car dealership bill?
Are you seeing it?
The car dealership bill is multi layered but being made a simple talking point by democrats to attack DeSantis. I think it's HB-67 or something like that but allow me to point a few things out after spending my entire life working in this industry.
For starters I'm not a dealership guy, never worked in a dealership, always in direct competition with their service departments. So let's get the well your part of the system argument out of the way, for me it would be massively beneficial for direct to consumer sales to eliminate dealerships.
Now for this bill let's establish what it does and does not do. It creates a restrictions on established manufactures from competing with already paid for and established franchises. Your local Ford dealership is not owned and operated by the Ford motor company. There is a movement after Tesla for manufactures to undercut franchise holders and sell direct to consumers. Hb-67 says if your an auto manufacture and you already sold franchises you can't compete with them as a supplier and seller. Tesla however has never established or sold franchises rights that's why they are exempt to this law. So yes Ford can not sell you their F-150 and cut out the dealer who already paid millions to have a franchise right, that's not different then any other franchise law established for any other industry.
As for is this good for the consumer, it's a double edged sword. Yes you'll get a cheaper price if you cut out the middle man. However if you've ever owned a vehicle with a major recall or defect imagine trying to get that fixed without dealerships. Kia is in the process of warranting out thousands of engines in the 1.5 and 2.0 if there was no Kia dealership private shops would be flooded with this work. And guess what there is no way in hell I would do those jobs for warranty rates Kia wants to pay. I'd absolutely charge you the consumer whatever I wanted and tell you go fight with Kia for your money but you gotta pay me. Dealers are required by franchise law to go honor manufacture warranties saving the consumer untold hours of headaches and dollars.
Without dealerships you'd have a different used car market. Ever go to those independent used car dealerships? Buy here pay here types that's the real snake oil salesman. Warranties from third parties are as solid as wet toilet paper. Just another benefit to consider when advocating eliminating dealerships.
Finally your talking about millions of jobs, so yes politicians are inclined to support legislation protecting millions of jobs in a major industry. Its not perfect but it's governing within the system we have now. Hardly makes DeSantis an establishment man or swamp creature.
(06-19-2023, 03:26 AM)EricC85 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-17-2023, 06:40 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]I am seeing it.
What did you think of the DeSantis car dealership bill?
Are you seeing it?
The car dealership bill is multi layered but being made a simple talking point by democrats to attack DeSantis. I think it's HB-67 or something like that but allow me to point a few things out after spending my entire life working in this industry.
For starters I'm not a dealership guy, never worked in a dealership, always in direct competition with their service departments. So let's get the well your part of the system argument out of the way, for me it would be massively beneficial for direct to consumer sales to eliminate dealerships.
Now for this bill let's establish what it does and does not do. It creates a restrictions on established manufactures from competing with already paid for and established franchises. Your local Ford dealership is not owned and operated by the Ford motor company. There is a movement after Tesla for manufactures to undercut franchise holders and sell direct to consumers. Hb-67 says if your an auto manufacture and you already sold franchises you can't compete with them as a supplier and seller. Tesla however has never established or sold franchises rights that's why they are exempt to this law. So yes Ford can not sell you their F-150 and cut out the dealer who already paid millions to have a franchise right, that's not different then any other franchise law established for any other industry.
As for is this good for the consumer, it's a double edged sword. Yes you'll get a cheaper price if you cut out the middle man. However if you've ever owned a vehicle with a major recall or defect imagine trying to get that fixed without dealerships. Kia is in the process of warranting out thousands of engines in the 1.5 and 2.0 if there was no Kia dealership private shops would be flooded with this work. And guess what there is no way in hell I would do those jobs for warranty rates Kia wants to pay. I'd absolutely charge you the consumer whatever I wanted and tell you go fight with Kia for your money but you gotta pay me. Dealers are required by franchise law to go honor manufacture warranties saving the consumer untold hours of headaches and dollars.
Without dealerships you'd have a different used car market. Ever go to those independent used car dealerships? Buy here pay here types that's the real snake oil salesman. Warranties from third parties are as solid as wet toilet paper. Just another benefit to consider when advocating eliminating dealerships.
Finally your talking about millions of jobs, so yes politicians are inclined to support legislation protecting millions of jobs in a major industry. Its not perfect but it's governing within the system we have now. Hardly makes DeSantis an establishment man or swamp creature.
Franchise contracts should already control this. There really wasn't an issue unless Ford wants to stop franchising in an area. The Franchise gets screwed over a lot by Ford and they have to do what they say.
Not sure if this is a reaction to Ford closing franchises and going against the owner's wishes but I suspect that is the case. Some rich dealer got his friends to protect his dealerships to stop corporate from shutting them down.
Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk
(06-19-2023, 03:43 AM)p_rushing Wrote: [ -> ] (06-19-2023, 03:26 AM)EricC85 Wrote: [ -> ]The car dealership bill is multi layered but being made a simple talking point by democrats to attack DeSantis. I think it's HB-67 or something like that but allow me to point a few things out after spending my entire life working in this industry.
For starters I'm not a dealership guy, never worked in a dealership, always in direct competition with their service departments. So let's get the well your part of the system argument out of the way, for me it would be massively beneficial for direct to consumer sales to eliminate dealerships.
Now for this bill let's establish what it does and does not do. It creates a restrictions on established manufactures from competing with already paid for and established franchises. Your local Ford dealership is not owned and operated by the Ford motor company. There is a movement after Tesla for manufactures to undercut franchise holders and sell direct to consumers. Hb-67 says if your an auto manufacture and you already sold franchises you can't compete with them as a supplier and seller. Tesla however has never established or sold franchises rights that's why they are exempt to this law. So yes Ford can not sell you their F-150 and cut out the dealer who already paid millions to have a franchise right, that's not different then any other franchise law established for any other industry.
As for is this good for the consumer, it's a double edged sword. Yes you'll get a cheaper price if you cut out the middle man. However if you've ever owned a vehicle with a major recall or defect imagine trying to get that fixed without dealerships. Kia is in the process of warranting out thousands of engines in the 1.5 and 2.0 if there was no Kia dealership private shops would be flooded with this work. And guess what there is no way in hell I would do those jobs for warranty rates Kia wants to pay. I'd absolutely charge you the consumer whatever I wanted and tell you go fight with Kia for your money but you gotta pay me. Dealers are required by franchise law to go honor manufacture warranties saving the consumer untold hours of headaches and dollars.
Without dealerships you'd have a different used car market. Ever go to those independent used car dealerships? Buy here pay here types that's the real snake oil salesman. Warranties from third parties are as solid as wet toilet paper. Just another benefit to consider when advocating eliminating dealerships.
Finally your talking about millions of jobs, so yes politicians are inclined to support legislation protecting millions of jobs in a major industry. Its not perfect but it's governing within the system we have now. Hardly makes DeSantis an establishment man or swamp creature.
Franchise contracts should already control this. There really wasn't an issue unless Ford wants to stop franchising in an area. The Franchise gets screwed over a lot by Ford and they have to do what they say.
Not sure if this is a reaction to Ford closing franchises and going against the owner's wishes but I suspect that is the case. Some rich dealer got his friends to protect his dealerships to stop corporate from shutting them down.
Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk
My understanding is that's exactly what's going on. Ford saw what Teslas doing and said they where going to cut out the dealerships. This bill HB-67 prevents that for the reasons I described above.
(06-19-2023, 05:45 AM)EricC85 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-19-2023, 03:43 AM)p_rushing Wrote: [ -> ]Franchise contracts should already control this. There really wasn't an issue unless Ford wants to stop franchising in an area. The Franchise gets screwed over a lot by Ford and they have to do what they say.
Not sure if this is a reaction to Ford closing franchises and going against the owner's wishes but I suspect that is the case. Some rich dealer got his friends to protect his dealerships to stop corporate from shutting them down.
Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk
My understanding is that's exactly what's going on. Ford saw what Teslas doing and said they where going to cut out the dealerships. This bill HB-67 prevents that for the reasons I described above.
As I understood it, Ford was only hoping to sell electric cars direct to consumers, they would still continue to sell conventional and hybrid cars and trucks through dealerships only.
In theory an electric car should have much less maintenance needs, and much less potential recalls, It might be a totally different type of mechanic executing the recall repair anyways.
There are many car dealers that do not want to handle electric or hybrid cars at all. Many car dealers try to minimize the options they will stock to best sellers only, and if you base your buying decisions on what sold last year, the product mix can't change. Manufacturers have been frustrated by this for years.
Also, to p_rushing's point, the franchise contract itself should handle most of this. If a car dealer needs some security that they will have a sales territory and not get undercut by direct sales before they would be willing to provide a service department dedicated to recalls, that's a textbook example of something that a good contract can handle, no legislature needed. Just judges.
Personally I think, electric or not, dealerships are total leaches in all but the largest and most competitive geographic areas, and only for the brands with the biggest sales volume. When Ford wants to move 10,000 F-150s per quarter into Florida, I can see how dealers could add value buying in bulk and taking on risks like "customers like this paint color more than we thought they would" or "customers liked this upgrade package in Jacksonville but not Tampa." But once you get into smaller sales volumes and more choices of packages and paint colors in less densely populated areas, I just don't see the value at all. Customers in these situations are usually fine if they have to wait a few weeks for the exact car they want to roll off the line.
If Progressive insurance can find a body shop they'll contract with in every market they operate in, I don't see why Hyundai and Kia couldn't do the same thing for recalls.
(06-19-2023, 11:22 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (06-19-2023, 05:45 AM)EricC85 Wrote: [ -> ]My understanding is that's exactly what's going on. Ford saw what Teslas doing and said they where going to cut out the dealerships. This bill HB-67 prevents that for the reasons I described above.
As I understood it, Ford was only hoping to sell electric cars direct to consumers, they would still continue to sell conventional and hybrid cars and trucks through dealerships only.
In theory an electric car should have much less maintenance needs, and much less potential recalls, It might be a totally different type of mechanic executing the recall repair anyways.
There are many car dealers that do not want to handle electric or hybrid cars at all. Many car dealers try to minimize the options they will stock to best sellers only, and if you base your buying decisions on what sold last year, the product mix can't change. Manufacturers have been frustrated by this for years.
Also, to p_rushing's point, the franchise contract itself should handle most of this. If a car dealer needs some security that they will have a sales territory and not get undercut by direct sales before they would be willing to provide a service department dedicated to recalls, that's a textbook example of something that a good contract can handle, no legislature needed. Just judges.
Personally I think, electric or not, dealerships are total leaches in all but the largest and most competitive geographic areas, and only for the brands with the biggest sales volume. When Ford wants to move 10,000 F-150s per quarter into Florida, I can see how dealers could add value buying in bulk and taking on risks like "customers like this paint color more than we thought they would" or "customers liked this upgrade package in Jacksonville but not Tampa." But once you get into smaller sales volumes and more choices of packages and paint colors in less densely populated areas, I just don't see the value at all. Customers in these situations are usually fine if they have to wait a few weeks for the exact car they want to roll off the line.
If Progressive insurance can find a body shop they'll contract with in every market they operate in, I don't see why Hyundai and Kia couldn't do the same thing for recalls.
Dealers are good if you want to test drive before you buy. And of course, repairs if your car is under warranty. But that's about it. They never have the car you want on the lot. The last time I bought a car, it took 6 months to get it. You go online, you configure your car, select the color and the options, see the price, go to the dealer and make an offer, and then it takes 6 months to get it.
(06-20-2023, 10:02 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (06-19-2023, 11:22 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]As I understood it, Ford was only hoping to sell electric cars direct to consumers, they would still continue to sell conventional and hybrid cars and trucks through dealerships only.
In theory an electric car should have much less maintenance needs, and much less potential recalls, It might be a totally different type of mechanic executing the recall repair anyways.
There are many car dealers that do not want to handle electric or hybrid cars at all. Many car dealers try to minimize the options they will stock to best sellers only, and if you base your buying decisions on what sold last year, the product mix can't change. Manufacturers have been frustrated by this for years.
Also, to p_rushing's point, the franchise contract itself should handle most of this. If a car dealer needs some security that they will have a sales territory and not get undercut by direct sales before they would be willing to provide a service department dedicated to recalls, that's a textbook example of something that a good contract can handle, no legislature needed. Just judges.
Personally I think, electric or not, dealerships are total leaches in all but the largest and most competitive geographic areas, and only for the brands with the biggest sales volume. When Ford wants to move 10,000 F-150s per quarter into Florida, I can see how dealers could add value buying in bulk and taking on risks like "customers like this paint color more than we thought they would" or "customers liked this upgrade package in Jacksonville but not Tampa." But once you get into smaller sales volumes and more choices of packages and paint colors in less densely populated areas, I just don't see the value at all. Customers in these situations are usually fine if they have to wait a few weeks for the exact car they want to roll off the line.
If Progressive insurance can find a body shop they'll contract with in every market they operate in, I don't see why Hyundai and Kia couldn't do the same thing for recalls.
Dealers are good if you want to test drive before you buy. And of course, repairs if your car is under warranty. But that's about it. They never have the car you want on the lot. The last time I bought a car, it took 6 months to get it. You go online, you configure your car, select the color and the options, see the price, go to the dealer and make an offer, and then it takes 6 months to get it.
My wife did a lot of that online configuration stuff on her last vehicle purchase, and she ended up being pretty rigid once she narrowed it down. Had to be a specific accessory package, and had to be a dark blue exterior.
We went to multiple dealers and expected them to say things like, "we don't have that now, but you can put money down and reserve it, and it will be here in X weeks."
They didn't say that. We dealt with a very rude and condescending dealer and a very courteous and straightforward dealer, but at the end of the day, neither of them wanted to do a deal like that, and they were both very cagey about it. They both spent a lot of time trying convince us to get the "wrong car" we test drove, then they made vague promises about "the car you want might be here in 4 or 6 weeks, but no we won't hold it for you. You'd have to check with us weekly."
Finally we figured it out.
The dealers could see that the car we wanted was already in stock at a dealership 2 hours away. They wouldn't tell us that, and they wouldnt offer to trade with that dealer, but it was there.
The place 2 hours away, unfortunately, was one of the rude places. They made us sit through multiple songs and dances about dealer fees and warranty extensions and it literally took all day. I would rather have done business with either of the first two even ignoring the fact that they were 2 hours away.
The Chief Jag was an engineer for the automotive industry. I always thought it interesting that he said car manufacturers regard dealerships as the customer. Car buyers are considered end users.
(06-20-2023, 10:14 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (06-20-2023, 10:02 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]Dealers are good if you want to test drive before you buy. And of course, repairs if your car is under warranty. But that's about it. They never have the car you want on the lot. The last time I bought a car, it took 6 months to get it. You go online, you configure your car, select the color and the options, see the price, go to the dealer and make an offer, and then it takes 6 months to get it.
My wife did a lot of that online configuration stuff on her last vehicle purchase, and she ended up being pretty rigid once she narrowed it down. Had to be a specific accessory package, and had to be a dark blue exterior.
We went to multiple dealers and expected them to say things like, "we don't have that now, but you can put money down and reserve it, and it will be here in X weeks."
They didn't say that. We dealt with a very rude and condescending dealer and a very courteous and straightforward dealer, but at the end of the day, neither of them wanted to do a deal like that, and they were both very cagey about it. They both spent a lot of time trying convince us to get the "wrong car" we test drove, then they made vague promises about "the car you want might be here in 4 or 6 weeks, but no we won't hold it for you. You'd have to check with us weekly."
Finally we figured it out.
The dealers could see that the car we wanted was already in stock at a dealership 2 hours away. They wouldn't tell us that, and they wouldnt offer to trade with that dealer, but it was there.
The place 2 hours away, unfortunately, was one of the rude places. They made us sit through multiple songs and dances about dealer fees and warranty extensions and it literally took all day. I would rather have done business with either of the first two even ignoring the fact that they were 2 hours away.
You used the wrong option. There are 2 ways to shop now, build your configuration and search inventory or order it.
Dealerships always want to move the cars THEY have purchased. They will work on the pricing with you or throw in free dealer options, etc. You would think that they would want to take orders but they don’t because of how it works.
Orders are cars the dealer has to buy. The dealer is on the hook to pay for the car. If you change your mind, they can keep your deposit. If you are picky and get full options or go cheap, they may not be able to sell the car depending on the area and market.
Basically you need to just give them the build # and say order the car. Expect no pricing discussions except for addon warranty. Should be able to do it online.
I have employee pricing for most of them, so I'm able to just print it out and walk into a dealership and say give me this car for this price and doesn't matter if they need to order it or not. Makes it some much simpler.
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(06-20-2023, 10:48 AM)p_rushing Wrote: [ -> ] (06-20-2023, 10:14 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]My wife did a lot of that online configuration stuff on her last vehicle purchase, and she ended up being pretty rigid once she narrowed it down. Had to be a specific accessory package, and had to be a dark blue exterior.
We went to multiple dealers and expected them to say things like, "we don't have that now, but you can put money down and reserve it, and it will be here in X weeks."
They didn't say that. We dealt with a very rude and condescending dealer and a very courteous and straightforward dealer, but at the end of the day, neither of them wanted to do a deal like that, and they were both very cagey about it. They both spent a lot of time trying convince us to get the "wrong car" we test drove, then they made vague promises about "the car you want might be here in 4 or 6 weeks, but no we won't hold it for you. You'd have to check with us weekly."
Finally we figured it out.
The dealers could see that the car we wanted was already in stock at a dealership 2 hours away. They wouldn't tell us that, and they wouldnt offer to trade with that dealer, but it was there.
The place 2 hours away, unfortunately, was one of the rude places. They made us sit through multiple songs and dances about dealer fees and warranty extensions and it literally took all day. I would rather have done business with either of the first two even ignoring the fact that they were 2 hours away.
You used the wrong option. There are 2 ways to shop now, build your configuration and search inventory or order it.
Dealerships always want to move the cars THEY have purchased. They will work on the pricing with you or throw in free dealer options, etc. You would think that they would want to take orders but they don’t because of how it works.
Orders are cars the dealer has to buy. The dealer is on the hook to pay for the car. If you change your mind, they can keep your deposit. If you are picky and get full options or go cheap, they may not be able to sell the car depending on the area and market.
Basically you need to just give them the build # and say order the car. Expect no pricing discussions except for addon warranty. Should be able to do it online.
I have employee pricing for most of them, so I'm able to just print it out and walk into a dealership and say give me this car for this price and doesn't matter if they need to order it or not. Makes it some much simpler.
Sent from my SM-S901U using Tapatalk
A few years ago, I was looking to buy a new car, and by coincidence, a guy I worked with was also looking to buy the exact same car with the exact same options. His wife, who comes from China and, like many Chinese immigrants I have met, simply will not overpay for anything, went to the dealer and dickered over the price endlessly, walking out and going home several times without a deal. It took her a month of negotiating to finally get that car for the price she wanted. After she got the car, I went to the same dealership and said, "Give me the exact same car you sold Mrs. X and the exact same price, and you have a sale." He pulled out her file and said okay. Easiest deal I ever made for a car.
(06-20-2023, 10:48 AM)p_rushing Wrote: [ -> ] (06-20-2023, 10:14 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]My wife did a lot of that online configuration stuff on her last vehicle purchase, and she ended up being pretty rigid once she narrowed it down. Had to be a specific accessory package, and had to be a dark blue exterior.
We went to multiple dealers and expected them to say things like, "we don't have that now, but you can put money down and reserve it, and it will be here in X weeks."
They didn't say that. We dealt with a very rude and condescending dealer and a very courteous and straightforward dealer, but at the end of the day, neither of them wanted to do a deal like that, and they were both very cagey about it. They both spent a lot of time trying convince us to get the "wrong car" we test drove, then they made vague promises about "the car you want might be here in 4 or 6 weeks, but no we won't hold it for you. You'd have to check with us weekly."
Finally we figured it out.
The dealers could see that the car we wanted was already in stock at a dealership 2 hours away. They wouldn't tell us that, and they wouldnt offer to trade with that dealer, but it was there.
The place 2 hours away, unfortunately, was one of the rude places. They made us sit through multiple songs and dances about dealer fees and warranty extensions and it literally took all day. I would rather have done business with either of the first two even ignoring the fact that they were 2 hours away.
You used the wrong option. There are 2 ways to shop now, build your configuration and search inventory or order it.
Dealerships always want to move the cars THEY have purchased. They will work on the pricing with you or throw in free dealer options, etc. You would think that they would want to take orders but they don’t because of how it works.
Orders are cars the dealer has to buy. The dealer is on the hook to pay for the car. If you change your mind, they can keep your deposit. If you are picky and get full options or go cheap, they may not be able to sell the car depending on the area and market.
Basically you need to just give them the build # and say order the car. Expect no pricing discussions except for addon warranty. Should be able to do it online.
I have employee pricing for most of them, so I'm able to just print it out and walk into a dealership and say give me this car for this price and doesn't matter if they need to order it or not. Makes it some much simpler.
Sent from my SM-S901U using Tapatalk
I asked them if they could just order the car exactly for us and they all said no. At first my wife wanted a specific blue Toyota and they said no, we don't do that. Then my wife saw Honda had a very similar vehicle with the same color and options and we went to some Honda dealers and they said the same thing. We will not order it for you. They send us what they send us.
I’ve owned only one new car, which is the first car I ever bought. Used cars are where the value is.
(06-20-2023, 12:37 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]I’ve owned only one new car, which is the first car I ever bought. Used cars are where the value is.
My only new vehicles where Jeep Wranglers because they don't really depreciate the initial 2 years. My other vehicles were at least 2 years old when I bought them.
(06-20-2023, 12:37 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]I’ve owned only one new car, which is the first car I ever bought. Used cars are where the value is.
Been running my ford into the ground after college since 2010.
(06-20-2023, 10:25 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]The Chief Jag was an engineer for the automotive industry. I always thought it interesting that he said car manufacturers regard dealerships as the customer. Car buyers are considered end users.
It was obviously before online ordering, but I believe Lee Iacocca used to say dealerships were the manufacturers only customers.
(06-20-2023, 03:34 PM)Sneakers Wrote: [ -> ] (06-20-2023, 10:25 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]The Chief Jag was an engineer for the automotive industry. I always thought it interesting that he said car manufacturers regard dealerships as the customer. Car buyers are considered end users.
It was obviously before online ordering, but I believe Lee Iacocca used to say dealerships were the manufacturers only customers.
Right. And that's always been my experience. I've bought 5 new cars in my life. I've never come close to the experience p_rushing and Marty describe.
It's always,
If it's not here, we don't want to talk about it.
If it's definitely on the way, we will begrudgingly discuss, but you have to be here the day it gets here. We won't hold it for you or for anyone.
If it's not here and it's not on the way, forget it.
If it's at another dealership, go there! We don't like other dealerships, and other dealerships do not like us.
If it's here, you better come now, it's not going to be here long!
I wonder what manufacturer they bought from. All 5 of those cars were Asian brands with North American VINs. They didn't come on a ship.
(06-20-2023, 04:25 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (06-20-2023, 03:34 PM)Sneakers Wrote: [ -> ]It was obviously before online ordering, but I believe Lee Iacocca used to say dealerships were the manufacturers only customers.
Right. And that's always been my experience. I've bought 5 new cars in my life. I've never come close to the experience p_rushing and Marty describe.
It's always,
If it's not here, we don't want to talk about it.
If it's definitely on the way, we will begrudgingly discuss, but you have to be here the day it gets here. We won't hold it for you or for anyone.
If it's not here and it's not on the way, forget it.
If it's at another dealership, go there! We don't like other dealerships, and other dealerships do not like us.
If it's here, you better come now, it's not going to be here long!
I wonder what manufacturer they bought from. All 5 of those cars were Asian brands with North American VINs. They didn't come on a ship.
I've had your type of experience one time, at Ernie Palmer Toyota. My parents wanted a new Toyota. So I took them down to Ernie Palmer Toyota. The sales manager sat in front of me and told me his life story, all about his hobbies, etc, and would not respond to the simplest questions. Things like "How much does this model with these specs cost?" It was the weirdest thing. He wouldn't even make me an offer. He was wearing cowboy boots, and he put his feet up on the table and went on and on would not answer a single question. Eventually I left. I never went back there.
Every other time I've bought a car, I've had a pretty good experience.
(06-20-2023, 10:48 AM)p_rushing Wrote: [ -> ] (06-20-2023, 10:14 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]My wife did a lot of that online configuration stuff on her last vehicle purchase, and she ended up being pretty rigid once she narrowed it down. Had to be a specific accessory package, and had to be a dark blue exterior.
We went to multiple dealers and expected them to say things like, "we don't have that now, but you can put money down and reserve it, and it will be here in X weeks."
They didn't say that. We dealt with a very rude and condescending dealer and a very courteous and straightforward dealer, but at the end of the day, neither of them wanted to do a deal like that, and they were both very cagey about it. They both spent a lot of time trying convince us to get the "wrong car" we test drove, then they made vague promises about "the car you want might be here in 4 or 6 weeks, but no we won't hold it for you. You'd have to check with us weekly."
Finally we figured it out.
The dealers could see that the car we wanted was already in stock at a dealership 2 hours away. They wouldn't tell us that, and they wouldnt offer to trade with that dealer, but it was there.
The place 2 hours away, unfortunately, was one of the rude places. They made us sit through multiple songs and dances about dealer fees and warranty extensions and it literally took all day. I would rather have done business with either of the first two even ignoring the fact that they were 2 hours away.
You used the wrong option. There are 2 ways to shop now, build your configuration and search inventory or order it.
Dealerships always want to move the cars THEY have purchased. They will work on the pricing with you or throw in free dealer options, etc. You would think that they would want to take orders but they don’t because of how it works.
Orders are cars the dealer has to buy. The dealer is on the hook to pay for the car. If you change your mind, they can keep your deposit. If you are picky and get full options or go cheap, they may not be able to sell the car depending on the area and market.
Basically you need to just give them the build # and say order the car. Expect no pricing discussions except for addon warranty. Should be able to do it online.
I have employee pricing for most of them, so I'm able to just print it out and walk into a dealership and say give me this car for this price and doesn't matter if they need to order it or not. Makes it some much simpler.
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That's basically the way I do it. I build the car online, I figure out what I am willing to pay for it, and I go in and say this is what I want and this is what I'll pay. Last time I did that, my car had to be built from scratch in Finland, so it took a few months to get it.
What car is made in Finland?
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