Quote:You do realize it was the left, or should I say, the Labour party voters in every polling district -besides London and Edinburough - that voted to leave.
So looks like you are declaring the liberals the winners.
Dude, you are embarrassing yourself, brah
Go read something
So Brexit was a movement initiated by the British left? Is that your final answer?
Quote:Wasn't expecting that result atall.
Very testing times.We currently have a lame duck government and there are many complex scenarios to get through in the next few months.
Interesting what will happen to Northern Ireland.Some have said a border will have to go up between us where as others have said that this may lead to Northern Ireland leaving Britain. Even though I'm pretty sure that the Northern Irish economy is totally dependent on the UK and would ruin Ireland if we unified.
I think Scotland, if they could get another referendum would leave. NI on the other hand would not. The same reason it has always been separate from the rest of Ireland is still there and they were not nearly as pro-remain as Scotland was.
Quote:So Brexit was a movement initiated by the British left? Is that your final answer?
Thats really not a fair analogy. Brexit was a movement of the British people. People from all parties voted for it. In fact, even tho the 'conservative' Cameron had championed the badness of the EU in the past (as his whole party had), he showed his true colours when his back was against the wall. Just another Globalist.
Interesting how the liberals on this board can't explain how the "polling data" posted is valid. It's simple really, the "results" of the "polling data" posted earlier is designed to be misleading rather than tell the true story.
Quote:Depending on how said polls are conducted.
This should have its own thread... I'll say this, while it's en vogue to poo poo polls, they are actually very useful. Heck, all the trump polling and most of the Hillary voting (besides Michigan) turned out to be accurately predicted by the polling...
Just something to consider
Quote:So Brexit was a movement initiated by the British left? Is that your final answer?
That's funny right there.
What it shows is that Labour doesn't have a clue what their members are thinking.
Ultimately, Brexit looks like the people decided they were done dealing with bloated, corrupt bureaucracies that didn't answer to voters. Yeah, that's a tad simplistic, but I think it's a pretty fair assessment. If you look at who is wringing their hands over this, the cast of characters looks awfully familiar, and they tend to be those who advocate more big government.
Quote:Interesting how the liberals on this board can't explain how the "polling data" posted is valid. It's simple really, the "results" of the "polling data" posted earlier is designed to be misleading rather than tell the true story.
Most political pollsters know all too well how to manipulate data to suit a purpose, especially if that purpose happens to be paying them.
Quote:So Brexit was a movement initiated by the British left? Is that your final answer?
Lol, nice try, badger. But trying to twist my words won't work. Go read stuff and then get back to me.
You literally have no idea what you're talking about... kinda like your boy trump.
The vote was initiated by Cameron, do you know the reasoning behind this initiation? Hint, it wasn't to leave the eu.
This whole thing is alot more complex than you are giving it credit for, which is making you look ignorant. With all due respect.
You really should go read up on this thing before you start bloviating nonsense that makes you look like you don't understand the topic.
And again, liberals voted to leave. Go read, then come back with facts that we can discuss.
Quote:That's funny right there.
What it shows is that Labour doesn't have a clue what their members are thinking.
Ultimately, Brexit looks like the people decided they were done dealing with bloated, corrupt bureaucracies that didn't answer to voters. Yeah, that's a tad simplistic, but I think it's a pretty fair assessment. If you look at who is wringing their hands over this, the cast of characters looks awfully familiar, and they tend to be those who advocate more big government.
They also seem to be the ones that post skewed polls.
Quote:Interesting how the liberals on this board can't explain how the "polling data" posted is valid. It's simple really, the "results" of the "polling data" posted earlier is designed to be misleading rather than tell the true story.
You can pick and choose and move the groups however which way you want, the fact remains the same; the young voted to stay in, the old voted to leave. The old who, by the way, reaped the greatest rewards from the UK's EU membership and now have very little to lose by the UK leaving. It's the same as I've said on multiple threads; the current 50 to 70 year olds are the greediest, most self centered, selfish individuals on this planet. They care not about the future or the prospects of anyone else, they only care about themselves.
Quote:That's funny right there.
What it shows is that Labour doesn't have a clue what their members are thinking.
Ultimately, Brexit looks like the people decided they were done dealing with bloated, corrupt bureaucracies that didn't answer to voters. Yeah, that's a tad simplistic, but I think it's a pretty fair assessment. If you look at who is wringing their hands over this, the cast of characters looks awfully familiar, and they tend to be those who advocate more big government.
I hate to burst your partisan bubble, there, friend... but you do realize it was the conservative party that called for this vote with the intention of it being a mandate to stay in the eu.
You want to talk about a party freaking out and wetting themselves, you may want to figure out who just stepped down from being the PM and what party he's in!!!! Lol
This is a complex issue that the corporate elite on both sides, liberal and conservative messed up on. To express it differently would be incorrect
Quote:I think Scotland, if they could get another referendum would leave. NI on the other hand would not. The same reason it has always been separate from the rest of Ireland is still there and they were not nearly as pro-remain as Scotland was.
Not now no but its something that could develop in 5-6 years time depending on how this all plays out.
How funny would it be that the Unionists campaigned for a vote that eventually led to a unified Ireland.My grandfather and great uncles would be rolling around in their graves with laughter!
Quote:You can pick and choose and move the groups however which way you want, the fact remains the same; the young voted to stay in, the old voted to leave. The old who, by the way, reaped the greatest rewards from the UK's EU membership and now have very little to lose by the UK leaving. It's the same as I've said on multiple threads; the current 50 to 70 year olds are the greediest, most self centered, selfish individuals on this planet. They care not about the future or the prospects of anyone else, they only care about themselves.
Go ahead and post accurate details regarding this.
I would counter that the "old" are the ones most sad because of the direction that we are going.
Quote:I hate to burst your partisan bubble, there, friend... but you do realize it was the conservative party that called for this vote with the intention of it being a mandate to stay in the eu.
You want to talk about a party freaking out and wetting themselves, you may want to figure out who just stepped down from being the PM and what party he's in!!!! Lol
This is a complex issue that the corporate elite on both sides, liberal and conservative messed up on. To express it differently would be incorrect
I hate to burst your partisan bubble, sunflower, but you do realize that both "conservative" and liberal leadership was rejected with this vote, dismissing the establishment on both sides for all intents and purposes.
Quote:You can pick and choose and move the groups however which way you want, the fact remains the same; the young voted to stay in, the old voted to leave. The old who, by the way, reaped the greatest rewards from the UK's EU membership and now have very little to lose by the UK leaving. It's the same as I've said on multiple threads; the current 50 to 70 year olds are the greediest, most self centered, selfish individuals on this planet
. They care not about the future or the prospects of anyone else, they only care about themselves.
If you asked me about this 10 or even 5 years ago I would completely agree. But I feel as tho there has been a shift, I see a lot of comment about 'I want my grandkids to have a future.' I actually think they are finally doing things that will benefit us.
Quote:I hate to burst your partisan bubble, sunflower, but you do realize that both "conservative" and liberal leadership was rejected with this vote, dismissing the establishment on both sides for all intents and purposes.
I hate to dampen your smugness, chief... but didn't you read my last paragraph? You basically just reworded what I said.
Quote:If you asked me about this 10 or even 5 years ago I would completely agree. But I feel as tho there has been a shift, I see a lot of comment about 'I want my grandkids to have a future.' I actually think they are finally doing things that will benefit us.
I concede the point that the older generation in the US might be generally more inclined to the sentiment you're describing. However, in Europe as well as the Netherlands specifically I see a generation that only cares about themselves. A generation that thinks they are exempt from cutbacks because they "worked all their lives", even though most of them retired well before 65.
Quote:Not now no but its something that could develop in 5-6 years time depending on how this all plays out.
How funny would it be that the Unionists campaigned for a vote that eventually led to a unified Ireland.My grandfather and great uncles would be rolling around in their graves with laughter!
It is rather ironic. As hard as the UK fought to keep its piece, and now it wants to put it all back. But a unified Ireland isn't for the best IMO. The North and its traditionally pro British sentiment hasn't changed. Not to mention the whole protestant/Catholic thing. But still, your right it could happen.
IMO, this situation is similar to how all the folks who opposed an independent Scotland now wish they hadn't so they could migrate there and still be part of the EU.
What a hell of a time to be alive!! just had to say it. So much going on in the world...
Quote:I hate to dampen your smugness, chief... but didn't you read my last paragraph? You basically just reworded what I said.
I hate to dampen your smugness, moon beam, but you clearly missed my point in the initial post. This wasn't about liberal or conservative. So, you basically reworded what I said.