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Quote:Because only under your delusional, indoctrinated mind does the Libertarian Party support all of those things which are the complete opposite of every Libertarian principle. 

 

Somehow those atrocities were going on across the entire planet in every different system of government.  It was the times.

 

Apparently to people who hate freedom, it was only going on in America - because we were too free. 

 

Well it's okay then, everyone was doing it.

 

Of course you do realize that with the exception of the industrialized nations in Europe, Japan, and Australia the rest of the world lives in ways you probably wouldn't appreciate.

 

The idea that you can pull all the supports out from under society and that would just be okay is wrong.

 

We already can see the race to the bottom in our own nation due to inequities in the way laws are enforced state to state.

 

Think about Boeing putting their newest production facility in a deep south Taft-Hartley state then turning around and trying to use that as leverage to help break the union of the people working in their older facilities.

 

When you have a strong central power and no ability for the states to drill holes in the laws of the nations then you don't have corporations able to do that.

Quote:Well it's okay then, everyone was doing it.

 

Of course you do realize that with the exception of the industrialized nations in Europe, Japan, and Australia the rest of the world lives in ways you probably wouldn't appreciate.

 

The idea that you can pull all the supports out from under society and that would just be okay is wrong.

 

We already can see the race to the bottom in our own nation due to inequities in the way laws are enforced state to state.

 

Think about Boeing putting their newest production facility in a deep south Taft-Hartley state then turning around and trying to use that as leverage to help break the union of the people working in their older facilities.

 

When you have a strong central power and no ability for the states to drill holes in the laws of the nations then you don't have corporations able to do that.


 

 

Shocker:  The unindustrialized world has a low quality of life!  Apparently its because those countries are too free.  We all need to be more like Greece.

 

Yes, I would pull *most* of the supports out from under the nation... and replace them with crutches.  The government's role isn't to make everyone meet some arbitrary quality of life.  "What did he just say?  He must hate poor people!!!"  No, that's called socialism.  

 

It's embarrassing that socialists don't have the intestinal fortitude to even label themselves as such.  Instead, they are capitalists who just want everyone to have equality.

Quote:Shocker:  The unindustrialized world has a low quality of life!  Apparently its because those countries are too free.  We all need to be more like Greece.

 

Yes, I would pull *most* of the supports out from under the nation... and replace them with crutches.  The government's role isn't to make everyone meet some arbitrary quality of life.  "What did he just say?  He must hate poor people!!!"  No, that's called socialism.  

 

It's embarrassing that socialists don't have the intestinal fortitude to even label themselves as such.  Instead, they are capitalists who just want everyone to have equality.

 

I didn't name all the industrialized nations. You can go to China if you want industrialized and freedom to dump toxic wastes in the rivers if you pay the right bribes or are part of the central government's interests.

 

Quote:I didn't name all the industrialized nations. You can go to China if you want industrialized and freedom to dump toxic wastes in the rivers if you pay the right bribes or are part of the central government's interests.

 

 

 

Again, because China is the epitome of a Libertarian's dream country.......  Come on man...

 

Libertarians are envious of all the freedom the Chinese people have.

Quote:Again, because China is the epitome of a Libertarian's dream country.......  Come on man...

 

If you want the libertarian dream you can go to Somalia, or if you just want to live in the post-libertarian dream you can move to Argentina. They just defaulted on their national debt again last week.

Quote:If you want the libertarian dream you can go to Somalia, or if you just want to live in the post-libertarian dream you can move to Argentina. They just defaulted on their national debt again last week.

 

You really this dense?  Libertarians dream of Somalia and Argentina?  Again, it was the freedom these people have to blame for having never emerged past 3rd world countries.

Quote:You really this dense?  Libertarians dream of Somalia and Argentina?  Again, it was the freedom these people have to blame for having never emerged past 3rd world countries.

 

Of course not, because libertarians are myopic and stupid.

 

What libertarians really dream about is a free ride where they get all the benefits of the American society they've become accustomed to without any social or fiscal responsibility toward it.

Quote:Of course not, because libertarians are myopic and stupid.

 

What libertarians really dream about is a free ride where they get all the benefits of the American society they've become accustomed to without any social or fiscal responsibility toward it.

 

So libertarians are the democratic voter base?

Here's the deal.

 

America is at an impasse.  We are caught halfway between Authoritarian Socialism or Libertarian Capitalism.  A government can't support both.  Its led to the collapse of almost every alpha country in the world in history.  You can have Authoritarian Socialism with a few aspects of Libertarian Capitalism if you want, but I'm taking Libertarian Capitalism with a few aspects of Authoritarian Socialism.  

Quote:So libertarians are the democratic voter base?

 

From all of the ones I've met they certainly should be. Sadly most people I've known wouldn't know which side of their bread was buttered if the buttering was currently going on in front of their eyes.

Quote:From all of the ones I've met they certainly should be. Sadly most people I've known wouldn't know which side of their bread was buttered if the buttering was currently going on in front of their eyes.

 

Because Authoritarian aligns so perfectly with the libertarian base.

Quote:Because Authoritarian aligns so perfectly with the libertarian base.

 

Belief and reality don't always coincide, and in the case of libertarians they almost never do.

Wasn't it you that posted that chart in defense of your argument that democrats were right leaning and... authoritarian.  So that chart does or doesn't apply?  Or only when it supports what you have to say?

 

Democrats are very liberal and authoritarian... and would win the libertarian vote if they were less authoritarian and more libertarian.  Republicans are conservative and authoritarian, which is even further from libertarian ideals, but at least there's a small growing sect within the republican party that is more centrist in both respects.

Quote:From all of the ones I've met they certainly should be. Sadly most people I've known wouldn't know which side of their bread was buttered if the buttering was currently going on in front of their eyes.

That's because you hang out with fellow democrats who have been swimming in the Kool Aid. 

Quote:Wasn't it you that posted that chart in defense of your argument that democrats were right leaning and... authoritarian.  So that chart does or doesn't apply?  Or only when it supports what you have to say?

 

Democrats are very liberal and authoritarian... and would win the libertarian vote if they were less authoritarian and more libertarian.  Republicans are conservative and authoritarian, which is even further from libertarian ideals, but at least there's a small growing sect within the republican party that is more libertarian and centrist.

 

Democratic voters are just voting for what's there.

 

The vote doesn't determine the alignment of the candidate, the candidate decides that.

 

Either way the solution to the issue is a rejection of the continued migration to the right, and that can only be accomplished once those leaning to the reactionary side are rejected and unelectable.

 

Just start voting democratic party and the rest will take care of itself. Once the republican party is essentially dead a new one will become viable in its place, whether that's a new left-wing party, or the libertarian party. Though I suspect it would be an actual left-leaning party.

Quote:That's because you hang out with fellow democrats who have been swimming in the Kool Aid. 

 

My dearest Junior, you don't find liberals around here. I'm talking about you and your kind.

Quote:Wasn't it you that posted that chart in defense of your argument that democrats were right leaning and... authoritarian.  So that chart does or doesn't apply?  Or only when it supports what you have to say?

 

Democrats are very liberal and authoritarian... and would win the libertarian vote if they were less authoritarian and more libertarian.  Republicans are conservative and authoritarian, which is even further from libertarian ideals, but at least there's a small growing sect within the republican party that is more centrist in both respects.

You answered the question yourself. 

Quote:Democratic voters are just voting for what's there.

 

The vote doesn't determine the alignment of the candidate, the candidate decides that.

 

Either way the solution to the issue is a rejection of the continued migration to the right, and that can only be accomplished once those leaning to the reactionary side are rejected and unelectable.

 

Just start voting democratic party and the rest will take care of itself. Once the republican party is essentially dead a new one will become viable in its place, whether that's a new left-wing party, or the libertarian party. Though I suspect it would be an actual left-leaning party.

 

Libertarian IS left leaning.

 

This is why I'm not a libertarian and I'm an independent.  I'm more of a centrist libertarian.

Quote:Libertarian IS left leaning.

 

This is why I'm not a libertarian and I'm an independent.  I'm more of a centrist libertarian.

Actually, it's not.  There are leftist tendencies on social issues, but on the key issues that matter, they're leaning the other way.

Quote:Libertarian IS left leaning.

 

In its purest form it could contain left-wing ideals, but the problem with libertarianism is it is inherently self defeating. With no authority it can't provide enforcement of any ideals at all, except for the notion of no central authority.