(03-16-2022, 10:46 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]I guess he really is a Russian Bot.
Look at the war map, it's over unless WW3 starts. They both need to come to terms or the people are really going to suffer. Russia was always going to win unless NATO got involved.
You don't have to like it but the strategy they have used is sound. They will continue to shrink the circles around the enclosed military. Citizens will die though because they are splitting up and using more and more buildings to fight from. Russia is bombing and firing on the buildings now.
A leader has to see that they can't win and make the decision to save the most people. Russia has committed enough troops, won't just quit and go home, and the elites won't fight Russia directly much as they talk about how bad they are.
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(03-16-2022, 10:46 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]I guess he really is a Russian Bot.
I've suspected that for a long time. I'm not joking.
An interesting article from the New York Times.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/16/us/po...eaths.html
Believable intelligence reports say the Russians have lost 7,000 troops killed, with 14-21,000 wounded, including 4 generals killed. Russian generals have been talking on unsecured radios and phones, enabling the Ukrainians to locate them and attack their positions.
Putin has arrested 2 top intelligence officials for providing bad intelligence leading up to the invasion.
Russian troops are suffering low morale, sometimes parking their vehicles and walking off into the woods.
Here's a fascinating article from the Wall Street Journal.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/ukraine-rus...1647444734
=====quote=====
A Ukrainian Town Deals Russia One of the War’s Most Decisive Routs
In the two-day battle of Voznesensk, local volunteers and the military repelled the invaders, who fled leaving behind armor and dead soldiers
Russian survivors of the Voznesensk battle left behind nearly 30 of their 43 vehicles—tanks, armored personnel carriers, multiple-rocket launchers, trucks—as well as a downed Mi-24 attack helicopter, according to Ukrainian officials in the city. The helicopter’s remnants and some pieces of burned-out Russian armor were still scattered around Voznesensk on Tuesday.
Russian forces retreated more than 40 miles to the southeast, where other Ukrainian units have continued pounding them. Some dispersed in nearby forests, where local officials said 10 soldiers have been captured.
======endquote=====
It's pretty interesting. The Ukrainians blew up a bridge and set up obstacles that funneled the Russians into areas the Ukrainians could hit with artillery. The Ukrainians used a combination of Artillery and Javelin missiles to hit the Russian armor. Ukrainians on cell phones were calling in the artillery coordinates.
While the Russians were in the town, some of them looted local homes for food and valuables.
(03-17-2022, 07:23 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]Here's a fascinating article from the Wall Street Journal.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/ukraine-rus...1647444734
=====quote=====
A Ukrainian Town Deals Russia One of the War’s Most Decisive Routs
In the two-day battle of Voznesensk, local volunteers and the military repelled the invaders, who fled leaving behind armor and dead soldiers
Russian survivors of the Voznesensk battle left behind nearly 30 of their 43 vehicles—tanks, armored personnel carriers, multiple-rocket launchers, trucks—as well as a downed Mi-24 attack helicopter, according to Ukrainian officials in the city. The helicopter’s remnants and some pieces of burned-out Russian armor were still scattered around Voznesensk on Tuesday.
Russian forces retreated more than 40 miles to the southeast, where other Ukrainian units have continued pounding them. Some dispersed in nearby forests, where local officials said 10 soldiers have been captured.
======endquote=====
It's pretty interesting. The Ukrainians blew up a bridge and set up obstacles that funneled the Russians into areas the Ukrainians could hit with artillery. The Ukrainians used a combination of Artillery and Javelin missiles to hit the Russian armor. Ukrainians on cell phones were calling in the artillery coordinates.
While the Russians were in the town, some of them looted local homes for food and valuables.
Not surprising from the people that raped over 100,000 women and girls in Berlin once they took the city.
(03-17-2022, 07:23 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]Here's a fascinating article from the Wall Street Journal.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/ukraine-rus...1647444734
=====quote=====
A Ukrainian Town Deals Russia One of the War’s Most Decisive Routs
In the two-day battle of Voznesensk, local volunteers and the military repelled the invaders, who fled leaving behind armor and dead soldiers
Russian survivors of the Voznesensk battle left behind nearly 30 of their 43 vehicles—tanks, armored personnel carriers, multiple-rocket launchers, trucks—as well as a downed Mi-24 attack helicopter, according to Ukrainian officials in the city. The helicopter’s remnants and some pieces of burned-out Russian armor were still scattered around Voznesensk on Tuesday.
Russian forces retreated more than 40 miles to the southeast, where other Ukrainian units have continued pounding them. Some dispersed in nearby forests, where local officials said 10 soldiers have been captured.
======endquote=====
It's pretty interesting. The Ukrainians blew up a bridge and set up obstacles that funneled the Russians into areas the Ukrainians could hit with artillery. The Ukrainians used a combination of Artillery and Javelin missiles to hit the Russian armor. Ukrainians on cell phones were calling in the artillery coordinates.
While the Russians were in the town, some of them looted local homes for food and valuables.
Have you watched Winter On Fire: Ukraine's Fight For Freedom on Netflix? Those folks are
resourceful. The way they built barricades and personal shields and everything else they did to defend themselves was inspiring. They set up aid stations, people were cooking food and still others had a "tech tent" set up where volunteers had charging stations for cellphones and other equipment and internet set up so people could communicate with whomever.
Russia
may have more/better equipment (debatable) but the Ukrainians are able to make something out of nothing and make it work. And they have the mental game worked out. Those civilians in Maidan 2013/14 were willing to die for their freedom, and many did. They went knowing there was a high probability. That says a lot about the Ukrainian people.
(03-17-2022, 09:47 AM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ] (03-17-2022, 07:23 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]Here's a fascinating article from the Wall Street Journal.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/ukraine-rus...1647444734
=====quote=====
A Ukrainian Town Deals Russia One of the War’s Most Decisive Routs
In the two-day battle of Voznesensk, local volunteers and the military repelled the invaders, who fled leaving behind armor and dead soldiers
Russian survivors of the Voznesensk battle left behind nearly 30 of their 43 vehicles—tanks, armored personnel carriers, multiple-rocket launchers, trucks—as well as a downed Mi-24 attack helicopter, according to Ukrainian officials in the city. The helicopter’s remnants and some pieces of burned-out Russian armor were still scattered around Voznesensk on Tuesday.
Russian forces retreated more than 40 miles to the southeast, where other Ukrainian units have continued pounding them. Some dispersed in nearby forests, where local officials said 10 soldiers have been captured.
======endquote=====
It's pretty interesting. The Ukrainians blew up a bridge and set up obstacles that funneled the Russians into areas the Ukrainians could hit with artillery. The Ukrainians used a combination of Artillery and Javelin missiles to hit the Russian armor. Ukrainians on cell phones were calling in the artillery coordinates.
While the Russians were in the town, some of them looted local homes for food and valuables.
Not surprising from the people that raped over 100,000 women and girls in Berlin once they took the city.
Sure, those are facts, but also, those men are long dead. Let's not tar the current generation with the sins of their fathers. We don't like it when people do that to us.
(03-17-2022, 12:21 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (03-17-2022, 09:47 AM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]Not surprising from the people that raped over 100,000 women and girls in Berlin once they took the city.
Sure, those are facts, but also, those men are long dead. Let's not tar the current generation with the sins of their fathers. We don't like it when people do that to us.
Our ancestors killed the Native Americans in the 1800s due to a mistaken belief in manifest destiny.
Those Russians, who are two generations removed, not 15, are barbaric rapists... and they've never changed. My oma told me when the Russian "soldiers" invaded they stuck their heads in toilets and drank because they thought they were those new fangled sinks they'd heard about but never saw. [BLEEP] the Russians.
(03-17-2022, 02:35 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ] (03-17-2022, 12:21 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Sure, those are facts, but also, those men are long dead. Let's not tar the current generation with the sins of their fathers. We don't like it when people do that to us.
Our ancestors killed the Native Americans in the 1800s due to a mistaken belief in manifest destiny.
Those Russians, who are two generations removed, not 15, are barbaric rapists... and they've never changed. My oma told me when the Russian "soldiers" invaded they stuck their heads in toilets and drank because they thought they were those new fangled sinks they'd heard about but never saw. [BLEEP] the Russians.
There were many Ukrainians in the Red Army in 1945, too. The history books don't usually break the Red Army down by nationality, but they were there, and participated in all of the Red Army's crimes.
I didn't think this should be it's own thread so I posted it here since it has to do with the war in Ukraine
Unofficial Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelenskyy Lego created to raise money for war-torn country
Independent retailer Citizen Brick also made Lego-like molotov cocktails in support of the Ukrainian people
A Chicago-based retailer that specializes in building custom Lego-like items raised money for the war-torn country by creating a minifigure based on President Volodymyr Zelenskyy.
Along with the Lego-like version of the Ukrainian leader, customers could also purchase tiny Lego-like Molotov cocktails.
https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/un...rn-country
For the love of all that is good in this world, how much longer will NATO (or whoever) allow this to go on? Shopping centers, chemical plants, neighborhoods, buildings used for shelter all getting decimated with hundreds of people dying. People who didn't do a damn thing.
Everyday people suffering and dying at the hands of politics, ego, ineptness and fear. It's disgusting.
Officials Report Ukrainian Civilians are being Deported to ‘Remote Cities in Russia’
Ukrainian officials are releasing new horrific information about the devastating attacks by the Russian invasion, including how people are being deported to “remote cities in Russia.” Ukraine’s human rights spokesperson Lyudmyla Denisova said on Telegram that residents were being transported across the border to Russia.
https://joepags.com/news/officials-repor...3TL7bMOV-4
(03-21-2022, 10:59 AM)americus 2.0 Wrote: [ -> ]For the love of all that is good in this world, how much longer will NATO (or whoever) allow this to go on? Shopping centers, chemical plants, neighborhoods, buildings used for shelter all getting decimated with hundreds of people dying. People who didn't do a damn thing.
Everyday people suffering and dying at the hands of politics, ego, ineptness and fear. It's disgusting.
What would you have them do?
It's a extremely difficult. You want to help them more, but it could trigger a world war. It's too risky.
(03-21-2022, 11:41 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (03-21-2022, 10:59 AM)americus 2.0 Wrote: [ -> ]For the love of all that is good in this world, how much longer will NATO (or whoever) allow this to go on? Shopping centers, chemical plants, neighborhoods, buildings used for shelter all getting decimated with hundreds of people dying. People who didn't do a damn thing.
Everyday people suffering and dying at the hands of politics, ego, ineptness and fear. It's disgusting.
What would you have them do?
I don't know. It sucks because there is no easy answer. No one wants WW3 but at the same time how much longer can world leaders let Putin destroy a country? And if/when he succeeds and decides to invade another country will NATO (or anyone) else deal with him?
Ukrainian doctor tells TV interviewer he has ordered his staff to CASTRATE Russian soldiers because they are 'cockroaches'
Gennadiy Druzenko, 49, told Ukraine-24 he gave order to castrate Russian POWs
The owner of a war-zone mobile hospital told broadcast 'they are cockroaches'
The Russian Investigative Committee opened a criminal case into the comments
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article...KhTFPS1iJk
Cockroaches they may be but that's not really a good idea. You should always hold yourself to a higher standard than your enemy. Now if the Russian POWs are caught raping women and children that's a different story entirely.
(03-21-2022, 02:42 PM)americus 2.0 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-21-2022, 11:41 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]What would you have them do?
I don't know. It sucks because there is no easy answer. No one wants WW3 but at the same time how much longer can world leaders let Putin destroy a country? And if/when he succeeds and decides to invade another country will NATO (or anyone) else deal with him?
The war in Ukraine so far reveals to me that the Russian military is no threat to Nato, and Nato would kick their [BLEEP] fairly easily in a conventional war if it came to that.
The real threat is that Putin is crazy enough to use those 6,000 nukes he has.
It's tough to watch what's happening to Ukraine's civilians, but it seems like the best course is to arm the Ukrainians, like we're doing. It's a horrible choice to make, and it seems like we're sacrificing hundreds of thousands of civilians, but right now, whatever is worst for Putin is what is best for us. And what is worst for Putin is that this war drags on with no end in sight.
The worst outcome is that the Russians win this war. The second worst outcome might be that the Ukrainians win the war. Because that could lead to Putin doing something really crazy. MAYBE the best outcome is that the war drags on, because that would lead to Putin's downfall.