Quote:I have to say... THIS IS A LIE! We fought off the russians and gave afghan back to the afghan people. We fought of sadam and gave kuwait back tot he Kuwaities. We gave Iraq back to Iraq. We didn't even take the oil resources that we could have taken that is now being used to fund the largest terror group in history. We spend billions of dollars defending Saudi Arabia.
Those aren't acts of imperialism!
I'll make it really simple, there is a young girl in Iraq. She just woke up this morning. She is probably about 9-10 years old. her life now is as a sex slave. No matter how much she kicks no matter how much she screams she is going to be rapped, over and over and over again. As she is lying there feeling their hot breath on her skin, being violated in ways that she isn't even old enough to understand, what imperial sins are you going to accuse her of? Did she inspire bush? Was she in on the meetings with [BAD WORD REMOVED] Cheyne?
There's a woman in Saudi Arabia that wishes she could go to work without her fathers permission. She wishes that she could drive a car. Is she being punished because she worked at the state department?
There is a gay man in Qatar that is about to be thrown off of a building. Are you going to tell him that it's ok, he deserves it because he worked at the state department.
Trying to excuse these acts or worse, blame the US is frankly despicable and you should be ashamed of yourself sir.
You have to separate out the question of what is true from the question of what they are thinking. If the question is, why are they doing this, then you have to ask, what are they thinking. What they think may not necessarily be what is true.
I understand your patriotism and love of the United States. I feel the same way. But that's not the question. The question is, why are they doing what they are doing? And to answer that, you have to put yourself in their heads.
Listen to them! They tell us every day!
Its the pseudo intilectual left that tries to say, "well Ahmed didn't really mean that"
Quote:I have to say... THIS IS A LIE! We fought off the russians and gave afghan back to the afghan people. We fought of sadam and gave kuwait back tot he Kuwaities. We gave Iraq back to Iraq. We didn't even take the oil resources that we could have taken that is now being used to fund the largest terror group in history. We spend billions of dollars defending Saudi Arabia.
Those aren't acts of imperialism!
I'll make it really simple, there is a young girl in Iraq. She just woke up this morning. She is probably about 9-10 years old. her life now is as a sex slave. No matter how much she kicks no matter how much she screams she is going to be rapped, over and over and over again. As she is lying there feeling their hot breath on her skin, being violated in ways that she isn't even old enough to understand, what imperial sins are you going to accuse her of? Did she inspire bush? Was she in on the meetings with Dick Cheyne?
There's a woman in Saudi Arabia that wishes she could go to work without her fathers permission. She wishes that she could drive a car. Is she being punished because she worked at the state department?
There is a gay man in Qatar that is about to be thrown off of a building. Are you going to tell him that it's ok, he deserves it because he worked at the state department.
Trying to excuse these acts or worse, blame the US is frankly despicable and you should be ashamed of yourself sir.
You are delusional if you think these are the reasons we are so deeply involved in the Middle East. Are you saying we should be fighting everywhere gays and women are oppressed?
Quote:I tend to agree. It's not that "they hate our freedom." That's bovine excrement. I think that a large part of Arab resentment of the United States is because of
1) our hypocrisy and greed. We say we support democracy and human rights, but at the same time we prop up the Saudi royal family and other non-democratic kingdoms in the region, because we want their oil.
2) our support for Israel, which many Arabs see as a European colony which was placed in their midst by outside powers.
A lot of Arabs just want the United States and its allies to go away and stop trying to run the Middle East. What ISIS wants is the opposite: they want to draw us into a war, with the West on one side and all Muslims on the other side. I suspect that we will see more terrorist incidents over the coming months, in an attempt to influence the election and get Trump elected President. I suspect that ISIS would love for Trump to ban Muslims from entering the United States, because that will enable them to "prove" that the United States is in the Middle East because we hate Muslims.
That's what a lot of people don't understand. ISIS and Al Qaeda don't want us out of the Middle East, they want to draw us into the Middle East. They believe that the more we are in the Middle East, the easier it will be for them to recruit followers.
Edit: also, I would add, we (The West) sends sexually related images and videos into their homes via the Internet. These people are pretty straight-laced, and here we are producing and exporting [BAD WORD REMOVED] free on demand to everyone in the world, corrupting their society with it.
These are all very good points as well.
Something I was thinking about after reading your post...
The excuse that they hate out freedom, and now trumps push that Islam is the problem allows us to be innocent in the while thing.
Hey, it's Islam, it's nothing we did that caused these people to want to attack us. This allows us to not consider that perhaps we should reconsider out military and imperialistic approach to the middle east.
It also allows us to view ourselves as pure and the others as evil.
Quote:These are all very good points as well.
Something I was thinking about after reading your post...
The excuse that they hate out freedom, and now trumps push that Islam is the problem allows us to be innocent in the while thing.
Hey, it's Islam, it's nothing we did that caused these people to want to attack us. This allows us to not consider that perhaps we should reconsider out military and imperialistic approach to the middle east.
It also allows us to view ourselves as pure and the others as evil.
I'm not even saying we should reconsider our approach, or change anything we are doing. I'm saying if we want to figure this out, why they are doing what they are doing, then we have to put ourselves in their heads. We have to try to figure out what they are thinking and why they are thinking it.
Quote:You are delusional if you think these are the reasons we are so deeply involved in the Middle East. Are you saying we should be fighting everywhere gays and women are oppressed?
If you noticed, jj's post was very emotional. He's not thinking rationally because this type of discussion about the usa's involvement in this so called war on terror triggers him because it goes against his preconceived world view.
The delusion is created to protect his confirmation bias.
Quote:You are delusional if you think these are the reasons we are so deeply involved in the Middle East. Are you saying we should be fighting everywhere gays and women are oppressed?
No. I am stating that this behavior by the enemy demonstrates that they aren't primarily motivated by perceived imperialism.
Quote:<a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2016/06/12/christian-pastor-celebrates-nightclub-massacre-theres-50-less-pedophiles-in-this-world/'>Christian Pastor Celebrates Nightclub Shooting</a>
So, I guess we should shut off all Christian immigration also.
The last time I called a response childish I was threatened with the ignore list. Give me a few seconds to find a thesaurus.
Quote:I'm not even saying we should reconsider our approach, or change anything we are doing. I'm saying if we want to figure this out, why they are doing what they are doing, then we have to put ourselves in their heads. We have to try to figure out what they are thinking and why they are thinking it.
Fair enough, and that's probably another discussion any ways. My opinion is very similar to libertarians when it comes to our involvement overseas. Our military global empire and the industries that profit from it should be reigned in.
But at the end of the day, the first thing that needs to happen is that Americans begin to realize that what we are seeing is not based on Islam any more than the USA's war on terror is based on Christianity
Quote:The last time I called a response childish I was threatened with the ignore list. Give me a few seconds to find a thesaurus.
Say what you want. I won't put you on my ignore list.
Quote:I'm not even saying we should reconsider our approach, or change anything we are doing. I'm saying if we want to figure this out, why they are doing what they are doing, then we have to put ourselves in their heads. We have to try to figure out what they are thinking and why they are thinking it.
Look at their culture. They stone people to death in accepted middle east theocracies. My politically correct deity.
Quote:The last time I called a response childish I was threatened with the ignore list. Give me a few seconds to find a thesaurus.
Oh yeah, because your bed wetting, frothing at the mouth posts so far this morning are not childish. Lol, you're hilarious!
Quote:Oh yeah, because your bed wetting, frothing at the mouth posts so far this morning are not childish. Lol, you're hilarious!
Anchor, normally I get a kick out of our back and forth, but you're off the deep end on this one.
If your perscriptiob worked then why hasn't it worked? We pulled out of Iraq and what thanks did we get?
Quote:I have to say... THIS IS A LIE! We fought off the russians and gave afghan back to the afghan people. We fought of sadam and gave kuwait back tot he Kuwaities. We gave Iraq back to Iraq. We didn't even take the oil resources that we could have taken that is now being used to fund the largest terror group in history. We spend billions of dollars defending Saudi Arabia.
Those aren't acts of imperialism!
I'll make it really simple, there is a young girl in Iraq. She just woke up this morning. She is probably about 9-10 years old. her life now is as a sex slave. No matter how much she kicks no matter how much she screams she is going to be rapped, over and over and over again. As she is lying there feeling their hot breath on her skin, being violated in ways that she isn't even old enough to understand, what imperial sins are you going to accuse her of? Did she inspire bush? Was she in on the meetings with [BAD WORD REMOVED] Cheyne?
There's a woman in Saudi Arabia that wishes she could go to work without her fathers permission. She wishes that she could drive a car. Is she being punished because she worked at the state department?
There is a gay man in Qatar that is about to be thrown off of a building. Are you going to tell him that it's ok, he deserves it because he worked at the state department.
Trying to excuse these acts or worse, blame the US is frankly despicable and you should be ashamed of yourself sir.
First off... This type of discussion clearly triggers you and makes you discuss things emotionally. It's rather childish and actually quite pathetic on your part. Second, your rhetoric is a deflection, which is all you know. You have no argument, so you speak of violence that is happening over seas as though this is the rational for terrorism. Even through, right here in the USA there are girls that are raped and yes, actual sex slaves that are being forced into exploitation. You're a sorry little troll when you behave this way. You create a rhetoric for your self righteiousness which provides to validity to the disucssion. Fortunately, I have seen through your lies and your charade.
Now as for your first paragraph. What I said were not lies. Matter of fact, if you ever took a geo-politcal class at the University level, you'd know what I'm saying is accurate. You're attack that what I wrote are "LIES" is yet another childish reaction from a grown man that cannot control his own emotions. Get a grip on yourself before you post things, man.
Now, your defense that we have done some good for the Kuwaittes and the Afganis is so disingenuous that most people will hopefully see right through it. We helped Kuwait and Afghanistan in the 80s FOR OUR OWN SELF SERVING PURPOSES!!! LOL, your emotional responses and lack of objectivity make you fail to see that your two examples actually MAKE MY POINT!!!!
Anyways, I had to respond to this. This post is a rare gem by you jj, I hope you calm down and can begin to disucss this topic without lashing out like a child.
Thank you.
Quote:Anchor, normally I get a kick out of our back and forth, but you're off the deep end on this one.
If your perscriptiob worked then why hasn't it worked? We pulled out of Iraq and what thanks did we get?
You've lost your mind. Seriously, I dont' even know what you're trying to get at here. It's like you had a stroke that wiped your memory of 2001-2009
Quote:I have to say... THIS IS A LIE! We fought off the russians and gave afghan back to the afghan people. We fought of sadam and gave kuwait back tot he Kuwaities. We gave Iraq back to Iraq. We didn't even take the oil resources that we could have taken that is now being used to fund the largest terror group in history. We spend billions of dollars defending Saudi Arabia.
Those aren't acts of imperialism!
I'll make it really simple, there is a young girl in Iraq. She just woke up this morning. She is probably about 9-10 years old. her life now is as a sex slave. No matter how much she kicks no matter how much she screams she is going to be rapped, over and over and over again. As she is lying there feeling their hot breath on her skin, being violated in ways that she isn't even old enough to understand, what imperial sins are you going to accuse her of? Did she inspire bush? Was she in on the meetings with [BAD WORD REMOVED] Cheyne?
There's a woman in Saudi Arabia that wishes she could go to work without her fathers permission. She wishes that she could drive a car. Is she being punished because she worked at the state department?
There is a gay man in Qatar that is about to be thrown off of a building. Are you going to tell him that it's ok, he deserves it because he worked at the state department.
Trying to excuse these acts or worse, blame the US is frankly despicable and you should be ashamed of yourself sir.
jj, What are you talking about? Our activities with the m
ujahideen in Afghanistan against the Russians was a pretty standard proxy war. That's geopolitics. We gave Iraq back to Iraq? What? We went into Iraq under bogus claims of WMD's and imminent risk of nuclear and CBW annihilation. I don't have much beef with GW1, as that was more of an internationally accepted action against an aggressor state. And I don't have much beef against our actions with the m
ujahideen either; I will note that proxy wars seem imperialistic to me, but doing what we did there vs the Russians seemed like a shrewd move, even though I do consider it, and most other proxy war actions Imperialistic. Maybe you have a different meaning for Imperialism. And none of this addresses our history with Saddam, or Pahlavi, or any of the other folks in the region. Look, I am not sitting here saying the U.S. is any different from other major powers in its views toward international actions. And this is nothing new. But to claim that the the U.S. hadn't acted in Imperialistic ways again makes me wonder about our different view of the word itself.
As far as that next part, I don't even know what the hell you are going on about. Does sex slavery and defenestration of gays seem bad to me? Well, yeah. You then go off on Saudi Arabia, the country you list earlier as an example of our non-Imperialsim as we are giving them billions to defend themselves. What are you going on about?
Edit ..
test of profanity filter
Edit 2..
Getting rid of any perceived attempts to sidestep the profanity filter :-)
Quote:First off... This type of discussion clearly triggers you and makes you discuss things emotionally. It's rather childish and actually quite pathetic on your part. Second, your rhetoric is a deflection, which is all you know. You have no argument, so you speak of violence that is happening over seas as though this is the rational for terrorism. Even through, right here in the USA there are girls that are raped and yes, actual sex slaves that are being forced into exploitation. You're a sorry little troll when you behave this way. You create a rhetoric for your self righteiousness which provides to validity to the disucssion. Fortunately, I have seen through your lies and your charade.
Now as for your first paragraph. What I said were not lies. Matter of fact, if you ever took a geo-politcal class at the University level, you'd know what I'm saying is accurate. You're attack that what I wrote are "LIES" is yet another childish reaction from a grown man that cannot control his own emotions. Get a grip on yourself before you post things, man.
Now, your defense that we have done some good for the Kuwaittes and the Afganis is so disingenuous that most people will hopefully see right through it. We helped Kuwait and Afghanistan in the 80s FOR OUR OWN SELF SERVING PURPOSES!!! LOL, your emotional responses and lack of objectivity make you fail to see that your two examples actually MAKE MY POINT!!!!
Anyways, I had to respond to this. This post is a rare gem by you jj, I hope you calm down and can begin to disucss this topic without lashing out like a child.
Thank you.
Imperialism is a type of advocacy of empire. Its name originated from the Latin word "imperium", which means to rule over large territories. Imperialism is "a policy of extending a country's power and influence through colonization, use of military force, or other means"
If you paid attention in you geopolitical course you would see that I clearly articulated our military policy doesn't have a desire for control of territory or confiscating resources. Your minor premise was Proven wrong and your syllogism fell apart.
Examining the full scope of a groups behavior is always a key to classifying their aims and motivations. You said this threat had nothing to do with religion. I cited specific sets of behavior that were directly motivated by their religious understanding.
But hey man. More than anything in here to help. Less get those academice jerks that scammed you out of your money.
![[Image: terror.stats.1.png]](http://markhumphrys.com/Bitmaps/terror.stats.1.png)
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