(03-01-2024, 10:25 AM)Newton Wrote: [ -> ]Beef up the interior of the offensive line. It’s that simple really.
This. The lack of balance last year and the inability to pick-up chump change on the ground has been the bane of this team's existence for the past two years.
Fix the push inside, and it will allow everything else to flow properly. From the running game to the play action game. All of that was missing last year when we needed it the most against the better defenses we had to play on that schedule.
(02-23-2024, 04:37 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (02-23-2024, 04:30 PM)JagsFanSince95 Wrote: [ -> ]Makes you wonder if teams might go full moneyball on the QB position and try to build stud teams around a rookie QB if things ever tighten up cap wise.. Thinking SF with younger Jimmy G/Purdy. Unless you have the next Mahomes, might not be worth to tie up 30%+ of your cap on 1 player and keep trying to find the next big thing at QB with loads of talent everywhere else.
Dilfer (arguably best defense of all time), Foles and Flacco are the only average to below average QBs to win a SB in the last 30 years. So that’s almost one every 10 years.
You basically need an really good to elite QB to win a SB.
You could argue that a 2nd year Big Ben was an average QB at that point in his career when the Squeelers won in 2006.
(03-01-2024, 07:29 PM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ] (02-23-2024, 04:37 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Dilfer (arguably best defense of all time), Foles and Flacco are the only average to below average QBs to win a SB in the last 30 years. So that’s almost one every 10 years.
You basically need an really good to elite QB to win a SB.
You could argue that a 2nd year Big Ben was an average QB at that point in his career when the Squeelers won in 2006.
Yes, you can argue that about Ben, and I would until the death. Pittsburgh won despite him, and with an assist from the refs.
Brad Johnson of the Buccaneers (also an awesome defense) won in 2003.
Jughead was NOT an average QB, but he sure played like one when he and the Broncos won Super Bowl 50 in 2016. It's hard to win without an elite QB, but not impossible.
(03-01-2024, 10:11 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ] (02-29-2024, 05:44 PM)JagFanatic24 Wrote: [ -> ]To be honest, a trio like Calvin Ridley, Christian Kirk, and Zay Jones could lead the league in receiving as a trio unit, which also means you can win a Super Bowl with that unit.
Add Engram and Etienne to the mix, and now those defenses have all kinds of problems.
His value has skyrocketed and he ain’t playing on the tag. Just like Engram last year didn’t. He will be signed before the season.
Allen will too. The draft pick don’t matter because if they see a guy in round 2 they can trade up. The tag ain’t what it used to be bc guys can act hurt and still get paid, and the coaches know that.
You say these things like they are hypotheticals. Every last one of them was on the roster last year and the offense did not revolutionize the game of football as we know it.
You like stats, so here's some for us to digest:
All 5 players active: 4-2 W-L, 25.67 PPG. avg 16.8 rush / 67.6 yds / 4TD (.67/gm). avg 22 rec / 243.5 yds / 7TD (1.16/gm) that's 4.4rec/48.7yds avg per receiver
No Zay (4 receivers): 4-2 W-L 27 PPG. avg 17.3 rush / 60.83 yds / 4TD (.67/gm). avg 17.8 rec / 192.17yds / 4TD (.67/gm) that's 4.5rec/48.04yds avg per receiver
No Kirk (4 receivers): 0-3 W-L 18 PPG. avg 13.3 rush / 41 yds / 1TD (.33/gm). avg 23 rec / 210 yds / 4TD (1.33/gm) that's 5.75 rec/52.5 yds avg per receiver
No Zay No Kirk (3 rcvr): 1-1 W-L 19 PPG. avg 11 rush / 57 yds / 2TD (1/gm). avg 15.5 rec / 158.5 yds / 2TD (1/gm) that's 5.1rec/52.83 yds avg per receiver
Ridley's stats when all 5 active: 33 rec / 473 / 4TD (5.5/78.83/.67 per game) when at least 1 inactive: 43/543/4 (3.9/49.36/.36 per game)
So you can see that losing Kirk hurt us, W-L wise, but that also coincided with Trevor getting hurt. Zay out of the lineup did not result in any of these four picking up his slack - we either lost those yards or passed to other WR. Our run game has a slight benefit when all 5 players are playing, but not enough to say they are posing significant distraction to a D.
Ridley's numbers are the interesting one, though. You'd think that when at least one of our primary targets are unavailable, more work would be sent his way. He personally benefitted from the extra distraction of a full roster of targets, averaging 1.5 more catches and 60% more yards per game when everyone was active.
Should we expect a $20M receiver to be able to do that without the benefit of needing a complete arsenal around him? Do we think that a comparable, drafted receiver would be capable of producing similar results in the same situation? Does anyone think he's not going to settle for a payday somewhere near the tag?
We've seen this team both with and without Ridley. Both years resulted in 9-8 records, Passing numbers were comparable. I don't think Ridley is as necessary as some others here might, especially at that price tag. I think we are just as capable without him. We need SOMEBODY, mind you, that can produce similar results, but breaking the bank to keep the gang together doesn't seem like it's going to yield any different results.
Agreed. The real issue last year was when Kirk got hurt. Zay got nicked up "practicing" against the Lions and never got really healthy. What we need to go with our core receiver set is a big body burner. someone about 6'4". When everyone is healthy Kirk, Zay and Engram are our core group. Ridley last year was a 20 million dollar receiver with a 5 cent head. He could not be counted on to be where he was suppose to be. That can be covered up if the QB has more time, unfortunately that was not the case in 2023.
Ridley will be gone because Baalke will have to tag Allen here soon.
Just the nature of the business and current situation.
Got a one year rental for a 3rd RD pick on a year that netted no play off appearance.
Ouch.
With that said? WR is not only deep this year but the odds that a good replacement is there at 17 is higher now after the combine.
Brian Thomas Jr.
Rome Odunze
Adonai Mitchell
Xavier Worthy
Keon Coleman
Take your pick, but, good chance at least a minimum of seven receivers are drafted on the opening night and we'll be one of those teams at the minimum.
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Ridley might not be gone, but he will definitely be allowed to test free agency. As Cleatwood and a bunch of others said, the 2nd round pick is that important this year.
There's a chance we're the highest bidder for his services. Not a great chance, but there's a chance.
(03-03-2024, 02:20 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]Ridley will be gone because Baalke will have to tag Allen here soon.
Just the nature of the business and current situation.
Got a one year rental for a 3rd RD pick on a year that netted no play off appearance.
Ouch.
With that said? WR is not only deep this year but the odds that a good replacement is there at 17 is higher now after the combine.
Brian Thomas Jr.
Rome Odunze
Adonai Mitchell
Xavier Worthy
Keon Coleman
Take your pick, but, good chance at least a minimum of seven receivers are drafted on the opening night and we'll be one of those teams at the minimum.
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No doubt the team needs a receiver. But I still like the idea of fixing both lines first.
So much depends on what the team does in free agency. I agree that Allen is tagged with Ridley testing the market. What will he ask? Around 18 million a year minimum??
Corner, receiver and both lines. That’s a lot to deal with.
Some very tough, very important decisions are coming up.
(03-03-2024, 02:20 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]Ridley will be gone because Baalke will have to tag Allen here soon.
Just the nature of the business and current situation.
Got a one year rental for a 3rd RD pick on a year that netted no play off appearance.
Ouch.
With that said? WR is not only deep this year but the odds that a good replacement is there at 17 is higher now after the combine.
Brian Thomas Jr.
Rome Odunze
Adonai Mitchell
Xavier Worthy
Keon Coleman
Take your pick, but, good chance at least a minimum of seven receivers are drafted on the opening night and we'll be one of those teams at the minimum.
Sent from my SM-S906U using Tapatalk
With those WRs, this should be their order:
1. Rome. After the way he tested, they will have to trade up for him but he’s that good.
2. AD Mitchell
3. Brian Thomas Jr
4. Keon Coleman
I wouldn’t take Worthy in round 1. He is lightning fast but they need some bigger dudes
Ridley had a season almost identical to Jimmy Smith’s 2002 season. They both scored a 2 point conversion. Both missed playoffs.
Another something to think about is you let Ridely walk, and he goes out next season and puts up 96 1400 12.
Tag deadline is tomorrow.
(03-04-2024, 07:31 AM)JagFanatic24 Wrote: [ -> ]Ridley had a season almost identical to Jimmy Smith’s 2002 season. They both scored a 2 point conversion. Both missed playoffs.
Another something to think about is you let Ridely walk, and he goes out next season and puts up 96 1400 12.
Tag deadline is tomorrow.
...and we get our third back, essentially.
KC didn't sweat losing Hill, in fact they sent him home in the tournament. Smith also did his in 16 games, so he had a better per-game average than Rid, even if stats were similar.
What if we pay him, and he blows an ACL in week 2? Just as much likelihood of that happening as him blowing the doors open for an offense.
Can't go into an auction scared to lose, or you're gonna get taken for a ride. We'll put an offer on the table, don't worry. If he passes on the deal, next man up.
Well Mike Evans just resigned in Tampa.... Ridley the new #1 WR in FA.
(03-04-2024, 10:18 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Well Mike Evans just resigned in Tampa.... Ridley the new #1 WR in FA.
Yep. Brian Thomas Jr. or Adonai Mitchell would be my targets at 17. If both of those guys are gone, also, assuming Rome Odunze is gone, I would try and trade down, nab a 2nd or 3rd RD pick and take an interior offensive lineman.
I think we can maybe opt for some other receivers in RD2 and RD3 instead. Baalke really fumbled this [BLEEP] opportunity though.
Techincally, he has today and until tomorrow's tag deadline to hammer a deal out with Allen so he could keep Ridley but I just don't see it in him.
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(03-04-2024, 10:24 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ] (03-04-2024, 10:18 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Well Mike Evans just resigned in Tampa.... Ridley the new #1 WR in FA.
Yep. Brian Thomas Jr. or Adonai Mitchell would be my targets at 17. If both of those guys are gone, also, assuming Rome Odunze is gone, I would try and trade down, nab a 2nd or 3rd RD pick and take an interior offensive lineman.
I think we can maybe opt for some other receivers in RD2 and RD3 instead. Baalke really fumbled this [BLEEP] opportunity though.
Techincally, he has today and until tomorrow's tag deadline to hammer a deal out with Allen so he could keep Ridley but I just don't see it in him.
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This is the #1 point here.
He doesn't seem to have a grasp on situations like this. The locker room pays attention to who gets paid and how.
It's really no wonder you guys work yourselves up into clown paint. You can't possibly know anything about the negotiations between Ridley and Baalke other than players generally want to test free agency for obvious reasons. Just let it play out. The player also has to be willing to sign while forgoing the potentially true higher value he has that he can only find out by testing the market. Evans probably wanted to retire a Buc. And also, Cleatwood specifically, weren't you just saying don't pay him AND give up the 2nd? That's what you have to do to keep him IF he's even willing to forgo free agency.
(03-04-2024, 10:33 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ]It's really no wonder you guys work yourselves up into clown paint. You can't possibly know anything about the negotiations between Ridley and Baalke other than players generally want to test free agency for obvious reasons. Just let it play out. The player also has to be willing to sign while forgoing the potentially true higher value he has that he can only find out by testing the market. Evans probably wanted to retire a Buc. And also, Cleatwood specifically, weren't you just saying don't pay him AND give up the 2nd? That's what you have to do to keep him IF he's even willing to forgo free agency.
For me, it boils down to, why did you even fork over a 3rd RD pick to begin with for Ridley? Correct me if I am wrong, but, wasn't that trade worked out before this offense showed any signs of life or competency during that turnaround in 2022?
It felt like they had a long term vision for Ridley in this offense. I can understand trying to game the system, where, you technically tag him and you're not losing a 2nd RD pick in the deal, however, it does shows a little bit of lack of awareness or know how in these situations.
Did he bank on Josh Allen NOT being as good as he was in 2023?
Did he bank on NOT having to use the franchise tag potentially on two different players?
Just seems reckless. Funny enough, this is the year you would WANT both of your third round picks because you're looking at a deep WR class. So, again, shows a lack of foresight and tactfulness as a general manager.
Again, we'll see what happens. I get that players can test the market and drive up their value, however, he could have and probably should have thought this through a little bit more to avoid being in this predicament to start with.
Additionally, if he leaves in free agency, aren't we likely to get some form of compensatory pick in 2025?
(03-04-2024, 10:18 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Well Mike Evans just resigned in Tampa.... Ridley the new #1 WR in FA.
And he signed for $25 mil/yr, that's the line for Ridley now and we can't pay that.
(03-04-2024, 10:33 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ]It's really no wonder you guys work yourselves up into clown paint. You can't possibly know anything about the negotiations between Ridley and Baalke other than players generally want to test free agency for obvious reasons. Just let it play out. The player also has to be willing to sign while forgoing the potentially true higher value he has that he can only find out by testing the market. Evans probably wanted to retire a Buc. And also, Cleatwood specifically, weren't you just saying don't pay him AND give up the 2nd? That's what you have to do to keep him IF he's even willing to forgo free agency.
Baalke just sucks and has zero concept of how humans work outside of his myopic view. He just concentrates on kissing khans [BLEEP] and putting the right leaks out at the right time to make him seem like the smart guy in the front office.
If Josh Allen has to make a statement that starts with "of course I'd like to stay in jacksonville" it shows baalke has already [BLEEP] up.