C'mon dude. Do you really think Mikesez is an exemplary poster here? I will retract my post if you do.
Also, believe it or not, this is the board that seems to have the most even split between liberals and conservatives, with a slight lean towards conservatism.
(06-04-2020, 08:52 AM)Last42min Wrote: [ -> ]C'mon dude. Do you really think Mikesez is an exemplary poster here? I will retract my post if you do.
Also, believe it or not, this is the board that seems to have the most even split between liberals and conservatives, with a slight lean towards conservatism.
Oh I'm an example of something all right, but exemplary was your word, not his.
I'm a lot less interesting than Officer Chauvin or Atty General Keith Ellison though. Let's stay on topic so the thread stays interesting.
(06-04-2020, 08:33 AM)rollerjag Wrote: [ -> ] (06-03-2020, 02:45 PM)Last42min Wrote: [ -> ]You are one of the least respected posters on this board. You almost never argue in good faith. You talk in circles and pawn wikipedia off as personal knowledge. At least you get paid to be here.
Considering the echo chamber this board has become, being the least respected contributor could be worn as a badge of honor.
Yes, the horrible echo chamber of total agreement by all posters about the tragic death of George Floyd.
The consensus began to suffer soon after it became clear that it was more about new shoes, TVs and $90,000 muscle cars.
(06-04-2020, 10:38 AM)Byron LeftTown Wrote: [ -> ] (06-04-2020, 08:33 AM)rollerjag Wrote: [ -> ]Considering the echo chamber this board has become, being the least respected contributor could be worn as a badge of honor.
Yes, the horrible echo chamber of total agreement by all posters about the tragic death of George Floyd.
The consensus began to suffer soon after it became clear that it was more about new shoes, TVs and $90,000 muscle cars.
You are 100%, completely and utterly wrong about this.
(06-04-2020, 10:45 AM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ] (06-04-2020, 10:38 AM)Byron LeftTown Wrote: [ -> ]Yes, the horrible echo chamber of total agreement by all posters about the tragic death of George Floyd.
The consensus began to suffer soon after it became clear that it was more about new shoes, TVs and $90,000 muscle cars.
You are 100%, completely and utterly wrong about this.
I thought you were Mexico? You've been to Manhattan, to Chicago, to LA, to Minneapolis, to confirm your supposition? Because it's completely about those things for the looters.
(06-04-2020, 10:48 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (06-04-2020, 10:45 AM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ]You are 100%, completely and utterly wrong about this.
I thought you were Mexico? You've been to Manhattan, to Chicago, to LA, to Minneapolis, to confirm your supposition? Because it's completely about those things for the looters.
There are hundreds of thousands of people peacefully protesting across America and the rest of the world. Compared to that number, the amount of people who are looting is absolutely miniscule. Way less than 1%. Unfortunately, media organizations know that footage of looting gets people watching, and peaceful protests not so much.
To say that the protests are not about George Floyd and the ongoing police brutality in America, is an outright lie that is deliberately designed to make people ignore the undeniably real and passionate grievances that millions of people have.
So people all over the world are protesting American police?
(06-04-2020, 11:30 AM)Last42min Wrote: [ -> ]So people all over the world are protesting American police?
Partly, yes. Of course the main message is simply anti-racism. You're right, I should've made that clearer.
(06-04-2020, 11:19 AM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ] (06-04-2020, 10:48 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]I thought you were Mexico? You've been to Manhattan, to Chicago, to LA, to Minneapolis, to confirm your supposition? Because it's completely about those things for the looters.
There are hundreds of thousands of people peacefully protesting across America and the rest of the world. Compared to that number, the amount of people who are looting is absolutely miniscule. Way less than 1%. Unfortunately, media organizations know that footage of looting gets people watching, and peaceful protests not so much.
To say that the protests are not about George Floyd and the ongoing police brutality in America, is an outright lie that is deliberately designed to make people ignore the undeniably real and passionate grievances that millions of people have.
If the actual numbers you ascribe count and percentages are applied they are very similar to the numbers of innocent blacks killed by cops compared to not 100's of thousands but millions of interactions and the media reaction is the exact same. Push the anomaly. Certain people are holding the entire nations LEO's and law enforcement system to blame for the actions of a very minuscule number of stupid cops. The same is happening to the peaceful protestors. They are being blamed for the minuscule amount of looters and rioters actions.
Unfortunately these protest are based of perceptions rather than actual numbers. The looting and the riots? Well that is just criminals wanting free [BLEEP] and to cause mayhem because that is their nature.
Anti-racism sounds suspiciously like anti-fascism
A childish word game to intimidate the weak-willed
Anyone who doesn't allow us to enslave them IS A RACIST
So millions hasten to put the chains around their own necks
(06-04-2020, 11:19 AM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ] (06-04-2020, 10:48 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]I thought you were Mexico? You've been to Manhattan, to Chicago, to LA, to Minneapolis, to confirm your supposition? Because it's completely about those things for the looters.
There are hundreds of thousands of people peacefully protesting across America and the rest of the world. Compared to that number, the amount of people who are looting is absolutely miniscule. Way less than 1%. Unfortunately, media organizations know that footage of looting gets people watching, and peaceful protests not so much.
To say that the protests are not about George Floyd and the ongoing police brutality in America, is an outright lie that is deliberately designed to make people ignore the undeniably real and passionate grievances that millions of people have.
The problem is the media (mainstream and social) identifies the rioters and looters as "protesters". The other problem is that "police brutality" isn't that big of a problem and really isn't that prevalent. Sure there are a few "bad apples" in police departments, but the number is probably less than 1% when looking at all law enforcement officers across the country.
Leftists like you try to push the narrative that ALL police abuse their power. That is simply not the case.
Let me ask you this. You said that you are in Mexico. How is the law enforcement there? Any corruption?
(06-04-2020, 03:31 PM)Jagwired Wrote: [ -> ] (06-04-2020, 11:19 AM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ]There are hundreds of thousands of people peacefully protesting across America and the rest of the world. Compared to that number, the amount of people who are looting is absolutely miniscule. Way less than 1%. Unfortunately, media organizations know that footage of looting gets people watching, and peaceful protests not so much.
To say that the protests are not about George Floyd and the ongoing police brutality in America, is an outright lie that is deliberately designed to make people ignore the undeniably real and passionate grievances that millions of people have.
If the actual numbers you ascribe count and percentages are applied they are very similar to the numbers of innocent blacks killed by cops compared to not 100's of thousands but millions of interactions and the media reaction is the exact same. Push the anomaly. Certain people are holding the entire nations LEO's and law enforcement system to blame for the actions of a very minuscule number of stupid cops. The same is happening to the peaceful protestors. They are being blamed for the minuscule amount of looters and rioters actions.
Unfortunately these protest are based of perceptions rather than actual numbers. The looting and the riots? Well that is just criminals wanting free [BLEEP] and to cause mayhem because that is their nature.
Thanks for posting this. Great comparison.
(06-04-2020, 05:49 PM)jagibelieve Wrote: [ -> ] (06-04-2020, 11:19 AM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ]There are hundreds of thousands of people peacefully protesting across America and the rest of the world. Compared to that number, the amount of people who are looting is absolutely miniscule. Way less than 1%. Unfortunately, media organizations know that footage of looting gets people watching, and peaceful protests not so much.
To say that the protests are not about George Floyd and the ongoing police brutality in America, is an outright lie that is deliberately designed to make people ignore the undeniably real and passionate grievances that millions of people have.
The problem is the media (mainstream and social) identifies the rioters and looters as "protesters". I completely agree with your first point. The other problem is that "police brutality" isn't that big of a problem and really isn't that prevalent. Sure there are a few "bad apples" in police departments, but the number is probably less than 1% when looking at all law enforcement officers across the country. Your comment here instantly made me think of this Chris Rock bit, it's only 2 mins long so definitely worth a watch. Might even make you chuckle! https://youtu.be/1h5sRgW6sQY
Leftists like you try to push the narrative that ALL police abuse their power. That is simply not the case. Here you go with the classic conservative straw man tactic, where have I ever said that ALL police abuse their power? I know for certain that there are many good, honest, decent police officers out there who have dedicated their lives to trying to make the world a better place. At the same time, I think the general tactics of the police in America are ludicrous. It's all designed to be so adversarial, and so often it makes a bad situation immediately worse. These are the kinds of things that need to be reformed.
Let me ask you this. You said that you are in Mexico. How is the law enforcement there? Any corruption?
I'm not sure why this is relevant. I'm not criticizing American police and praising the rest of the world's police. Mexico has an entirely [BLEEP] up situation with police; widespread corruption, violence, and the fact they are generally pretty useless are all big issues. But how is this relevant? Do you simply want to say that American police are better than Mexican police? Because you should really aim higher.
(06-04-2020, 06:15 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (06-04-2020, 03:31 PM)Jagwired Wrote: [ -> ]If the actual numbers you ascribe count and percentages are applied they are very similar to the numbers of innocent blacks killed by cops compared to not 100's of thousands but millions of interactions and the media reaction is the exact same. Push the anomaly. Certain people are holding the entire nations LEO's and law enforcement system to blame for the actions of a very minuscule number of stupid cops. The same is happening to the peaceful protestors. They are being blamed for the minuscule amount of looters and rioters actions.
Unfortunately these protest are based of perceptions rather than actual numbers. The looting and the riots? Well that is just criminals wanting free [BLEEP] and to cause mayhem because that is their nature.
Thanks for posting this. Great comparison.
While there is some truth to the comparison that the actions of a massive group are being unfairly judged by the actions of a tiny minority, it is also a massive false equivalency. The people looting and rioting (which, again, I condemn) are
citizens commiting criminal acts, they have taken no oath to "protect and serve". The police officers commiting brutal acts against citizens have taken that oath; they are meant to be the ones who enforce the laws, not break them. They are meant to be the ones to protect ALL Americans. Hence the increased level of outrage when the very people that are supposed to uphold the law are the ones who commit heinous acts of violence against citizens.
(06-04-2020, 09:21 PM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ] (06-04-2020, 06:15 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Thanks for posting this. Great comparison.
While there is some truth to the comparison that the actions of a massive group are being unfairly judged by the actions of a tiny minority, it is also a massive false equivalency. The people looting and rioting (which, again, I condemn) are citizens commiting criminal acts, they have taken no oath to "protect and serve". The police officers commiting brutal acts against citizens have taken that oath; they are meant to be the ones who enforce the laws, not break them. They are meant to be the ones to protect ALL Americans. Hence the increased level of outrage when the very people that are supposed to uphold the law are the ones who commit heinous acts of violence against citizens.
Excuses excuses.
And one final point about the "few bad apples" argument. George Floyd died because one officer knelt on his neck for 8 minutes and 47 seconds. He was surrounded by 3 other officers, who did nothing to stop him killing this man. Multiple onlookers repeatedly said that he was dying, it was obvious. The officer continued to kneel on his neck for almost 3 minutes after his body had gone limp and lifeless, still none of the other 3 officers stopped him. That makes 4 "bad apples". What a terribly tragic coincidence that all 4 officers at the scene that day happened to be from this tiny tiny minority of "bad apple" cops. Or maybe the problem is more widespread than you are making out?
To be clear, I'm not suggesting that all 4 of these cops were dispicable racist thugs who set out that day to take a black man's life. I am saying that this incident shows how their are clear and obvious problems with how the police operate. Too often these situations are made worse by the actions of police; this needs to be the basis of police reform.
(06-04-2020, 09:22 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (06-04-2020, 09:21 PM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ]While there is some truth to the comparison that the actions of a massive group are being unfairly judged by the actions of a tiny minority, it is also a massive false equivalency. The people looting and rioting (which, again, I condemn) are citizens commiting criminal acts, they have taken no oath to "protect and serve". The police officers commiting brutal acts against citizens have taken that oath; they are meant to be the ones who enforce the laws, not break them. They are meant to be the ones to protect ALL Americans. Hence the increased level of outrage when the very people that are supposed to uphold the law are the ones who commit heinous acts of violence against citizens.
Excuses excuses.
Wow, you really didn't read anything I just wrote, did you?
(06-04-2020, 09:34 PM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ]And one final point about the "few bad apples" argument. George Floyd died because one officer knelt on his neck for 8 minutes and 47 seconds. He was surrounded by 3 other officers, who did nothing to stop him killing this man. Multiple onlookers repeatedly said that he was dying, it was obvious. The officer continued to kneel on his neck for almost 3 minutes after his body had gone limp and lifeless, still none of the other 3 officers stopped him. That makes 4 "bad apples". What a terribly tragic coincidence that all 4 officers at the scene that day happened to be from this tiny tiny minority of "bad apple" cops. Or maybe the problem is more widespread than you are making out?
To be clear, I'm not suggesting that all 4 of these cops were dispicable racist thugs who set out that day to take a black man's life. I am saying that this incident shows how their are clear and obvious problems with how the police operate. Too often these situations are made worse by the actions of police; this needs to be the basis of police reform.
(06-04-2020, 09:22 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Excuses excuses.
Wow, you really didn't read anything I just wrote, did you?
I did.
(06-04-2020, 09:46 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (06-04-2020, 09:34 PM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ]And one final point about the "few bad apples" argument. George Floyd died because one officer knelt on his neck for 8 minutes and 47 seconds. He was surrounded by 3 other officers, who did nothing to stop him killing this man. Multiple onlookers repeatedly said that he was dying, it was obvious. The officer continued to kneel on his neck for almost 3 minutes after his body had gone limp and lifeless, still none of the other 3 officers stopped him. That makes 4 "bad apples". What a terribly tragic coincidence that all 4 officers at the scene that day happened to be from this tiny tiny minority of "bad apple" cops. Or maybe the problem is more widespread than you are making out?
To be clear, I'm not suggesting that all 4 of these cops were dispicable racist thugs who set out that day to take a black man's life. I am saying that this incident shows how their are clear and obvious problems with how the police operate. Too often these situations are made worse by the actions of police; this needs to be the basis of police reform.
Wow, you really didn't read anything I just wrote, did you?
I did.
Okay, please explain who exactly I am making excuses for, and what that excuse I'm making is.
I am waiting for my next marching orders from Lebron James, the oppressed black man who drove a hummer in high school.
Also, cannot believe Brees bowed to the mob. What was he thinking?
(06-04-2020, 09:34 PM)JagJohn Wrote: [ -> ]And one final point about the "few bad apples" argument. George Floyd died because one officer knelt on his neck for 8 minutes and 47 seconds. He was surrounded by 3 other officers, who did nothing to stop him killing this man. Multiple onlookers repeatedly said that he was dying, it was obvious. The officer continued to kneel on his neck for almost 3 minutes after his body had gone limp and lifeless, still none of the other 3 officers stopped him. That makes 4 "bad apples". What a terribly tragic coincidence that all 4 officers at the scene that day happened to be from this tiny tiny minority of "bad apple" cops. Or maybe the problem is more widespread than you are making out?
To be clear, I'm not suggesting that all 4 of these cops were dispicable racist thugs who set out that day to take a black man's life. I am saying that this incident shows how their are clear and obvious problems with how the police operate. Too often these situations are made worse by the actions of police; this needs to be the basis of police reform.
How do you reform something when the problem is individual people? People may not present as problems immediately, it is usually an issue that builds over time after having to constantly deal with criminals. If there are reports, you can hopefully intervene, but how can you truly trust reports from people being arrested? Sure patterns form, so hopefully you catch them, but you can't catch everyone.
Police already have many steps in place to stop this, but guess what, another democratic platform police union stops them from getting rid of the bad cops unless something like this happens.