Quote:The ideal quarterback is one who can make any kind of throw and run with the ball whenever he needs to. The problem with so-called running quarterbacks is they make the wrong deicsions when the play gives them the option to either run or throw. That is partially the coach's fault. Give me a dual-threat quarterback over a pocket passer any day if he can throw like Peyton and run like Terrelle.
No thanks, give me Old Elway (the dude that didn't scramble) or Marino, and you can take any QB that has scrambling abilities. Steve Young I guess is the 1 exception that proves the rule that pocket QBs are the way to a championship, but even he didn't really scramble all that much as he got older.
I can't think of 1 QB that had consistent playoff success and was considered an exceptional running QB. Maybe that will change over time, but as of right now, that's not the case.
And before you mention RGIII, Kaepernick, and Russell Wilson, I want to emphasise consistent playoff success. Consistent meaning at least 4 or 5 playoff runs where they at least won 1 playoff game. Can you really name any in recent memory that did this?
As QBs get older and become better, they take off to run less and less. Probably because it's still a passing league. Untill they put flags on QBs and don't let anyone hit them, the running QB is a short term effect of youth that dies out as QBs either get better at reading Ds and throwing, or they just wash out of the league.
Quote:No thanks, give me Old Elway (the dude that didn't scramble) or Marino, and you can take any QB that has scrambling abilities. Steve Young I guess is the 1 exception that proves the rule that pocket QBs are the way to a championship, but even he didn't really scramble all that much as he got older.
I can't think of 1 QB that had consistent playoff success and was considered an exceptional running QB. Maybe that will change over time, but as of right now, that's not the case.
And before you mention RGIII, Kaepernick, and Russell Wilson, I want to emphasise consistent playoff success. Consistent meaning at least 4 or 5 playoff runs where they at least won 1 playoff game. Can you really name any in recent memory that did this?
As QBs get older and become better, they take off to run less and less. Probably because it's still a passing league. Untill they put flags on QBs and don't let anyone hit them, the running QB is a short term effect of youth that dies out as QBs either get better at reading Ds and throwing, or they just wash out of the league.
I would agree about Elway and Marino. I think the game is evolving tho. The rush rushers are so much quicker and powerful these days (except ours). The blitz packages more complex. Mobility and escapability are becoming more crucial assets in a quarterback. If you are being blitzed and escape....you can make a big play down the field. The days of the likes of Byron Leftwich are over. Great passer but dude was a statue. I thought one of the first modern mobile quarterbacks was Steve McNair. I was a nightmare trying to contain. The knock on him was that he couldn't pass. That was true for a while.....but he got better. Was one yard from a Super Bowl win.
Quote:I would agree about Elway and Marino. I think the game is evolving tho. The rush rushers are so much quicker and powerful these days (except ours). The blitz packages more complex. Mobility and escapability are becoming more crucial assets in a quarterback. If you are being blitzed and escape....you can make a big play down the field. The days of the likes of Byron Leftwich are over. Great passer but dude was a statue. I thought one of the first modern mobile quarterbacks was Steve McNair. I was a nightmare trying to contain. The knock on him was that he couldn't pass. That was true for a while.....but he got better. Was one yard from a Super Bowl win.
It's really not evolving that way. Defenses have learned to adapt to the mobile Quarterbacks. Look at Colin Kaepernick. He's nowhere near where he was last year.
Quote:It's really not evolving that way. Defenses have learned to adapt to the mobile Quarterbacks. Look at Colin Kaepernick. He's nowhere near where he was last year.
Kaep's been missing 3 of his top receivers. He'll do much better when he get's them all back. And, you're right that they are adapting. Some assign a spotter. But that can loosen up the coverage some. I'm not saying that all quarterbacks will become that Russell Wilson style of quarterback, .but I can see that there is more than one way to skin a cat The debate of mobile quarterbacks earning a place in the NFL should be decided in the next few years. It will be interesting.
Anchorman, what makes you think John Elway did not scramble? He holds the team record for rushing yards.
Quote:No thanks, give me Old Elway (the dude that didn't scramble) or Marino, and you can take any QB that has scrambling abilities. Steve Young I guess is the 1 exception that proves the rule that pocket QBs are the way to a championship, but even he didn't really scramble all that much as he got older.
I can't think of 1 QB that had consistent playoff success and was considered an exceptional running QB. Maybe that will change over time, but as of right now, that's not the case.
And before you mention RGIII, Kaepernick, and Russell Wilson, I want to emphasise consistent playoff success. Consistent meaning at least 4 or 5 playoff runs where they at least won 1 playoff game. Can you really name any in recent memory that did this?
As QBs get older and become better, they take off to run less and less. Probably because it's still a passing league. Untill they put flags on QBs and don't let anyone hit them, the running QB is a short term effect of youth that dies out as QBs either get better at reading Ds and throwing, or they just wash out of the league.
Donovan Mcnabb went 9-7 in playoffs. Cunningham went 1-4 but mainly due to cheating refs in dallas. In this day and age Cunningham would easily have a super bowl ring. But I hear what you are saying. But with no line a non mobile qb wont win
Quote:Donovan Mcnabb went 9-7 in playoffs. Cunningham went 1-4 but mainly due to cheating refs in dallas. In this day and age Cunningham would easily have a super bowl ring. But I hear what you are saying. But with no line a non mobile qb wont win
I wouldn't call McNabb an exceptional running QB. He could scramble and buy time with his feet but he is not the same kind of runner as Cunningham, Vick,, and RG3 etc.
I will never understand the bias against mobile quarterbacks. If your offensive line sucks, you need the ability to not only scramble in the pocket, but also get a first down with your legs. Sneaks, draws, bootlegs, and reverses are plays that make having a mobile quarterback helpful. It is not just scrambling in the pocket that they need to be mobile for.
Quote:I will never understand the bias against mobile quarterbacks. If your offensive line sucks, you need the ability to not only scramble in the pocket, but also get a first down with your legs. Sneaks, draws, bootlegs, and reverses are plays that make having a mobile quarterback helpful. It is not just scrambling in the pocket that they need to be mobile for.
If they can beat you with their arm, that's great for them but that means they don't really need to run. Falcons Vick (he became more of a passer under Reid), Pryor, Tebow, etc. seem to have either a run first mentality or they just aren't good enough passers to win that way and that makes them one demensional. Once you figure out their patterns or know how to draw them out then it becomes fairly simple when it comes to stopping them.
The QBs like Manning, Brees, Brady, Rodgers, Marino, etc. can pick apart a defense. Even if you think you know how to stop them, they can still carve you up because they are great at what they do. If they scramble here and there or buy time with their feet than it is a perk but it is only when they really need to. Sometimes that is never necessary. Remember Manning in Indy? He got the ball out so quickly he was rarely under pressure. There was never a need for him to run to evade the rush.
The game is evolving? QB evolving?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5aFszmY6S4
The pro quarterback exists for two reasons:
1. To hand the ball off.
2. To throw for a first down once in a while.
A running quarterback is a symbol of offensive weakness. It means there's no passing game and no running game.
Parcells once said, "you need three things to win a Super Bowl: a great quarterback (or great play from your quarterback), you have to run the football, and play solid defense."
That's it.
Quote:Yeah, I am bummed. I want a QB so bad and now we're gonna go on a meaningless run.
"A meaningless run" (sigh) What has become of true sports fans?
There is one dimension of the game that will never change and will always act to limit the 'evolution' of running QBs - injury. Once that prized high dollar play caller becomes exposed to high speed impact from mid and back field defensive players, the odds of him getting seriously injured and missing games exponentially rises. Brett Farve surely didn't attribute his longevity to his willingness to juke around bloodthirsty back fielders beyond the LOS.
Quote:The game is evolving? QB evolving?
The pro quarterback exists for two reasons:
1. To hand the ball off.
2. To throw for a first down once in a while.
A running quarterback is a symbol of offensive weakness. It means there's no passing game and no running game.
Parcells once said, "you need three things to win a Super Bowl: a great quarterback (or great play from your quarterback), you have to run the football, and play solid defense."
That's it.
That's nice. And if we were still living in the 70's you'd be right.
Quote:Donovan Mcnabb went 9-7 in playoffs. Cunningham went 1-4 but mainly due to cheating refs in dallas. In this day and age Cunningham would easily have a super bowl ring. But I hear what you are saying. But with no line a non mobile qb wont win
lolz @ "cheating refs"....smh...
Bucs came to play! Will give us some cushion if Indy benches starters.
Quote:Bucs came to play! Will give us some cushion if Indy benches starters.
They continue their march to 8-8, wheres that beatles guy... BTW... I have to admit, Glennon actually looks legit, I think he has really gotten overlooked cause of the whole 0-8 thing. The Bucs might not even need Teddy or any QB anyway.
Bucs winning can let me rest easy today.