Quote:Who the pick happens to be is irrelevant. By intentionally losing to gain "access" is dishonest and undermines every honorable concept of sportsmanship and competition. Once one team is perceived to benefit from tanking then others will jump in the fray. Pretty soon the whole league assumes the perception of being rigged. If fans and other teams don't believe that a team is playing to the best of their ability, then win-loss records are nothing but scripts. I liken tanking to people faking injury or illness to draw disability. How many moral and ethical, not to mention legal, lines have to be crossed to gain "access" to that money?
A philosophy of tanking is fundamentally dishonest and insidiously destructive.
Are you serious? This isn't pee wee football. There is no sportsmanship anymore. This is the NFL.
Players bully each other, spit on each other, taunt, steal from each other and just blatantly disrespect one another.
Not to mention there are no guaranteed contracts. Owners can drop players in the drop of a hat and not give them a dime. The NFL is the last place you should expect honesty and sportsmanship
Quote:Are you serious? This isn't pee wee football. There is no sportsmanship anymore. This is the NFL.
Players bully each other, spit on each other, taunt, steal from each other and just blatantly disrespect one another.
Not to mention there are no guaranteed contracts. Owners can drop players in the drop of a hat and not give them a dime. The NFL is the last place you should expect honesty and sportsmanship
Excellent argument for why standards should not be observed or enforced.
Quote:That cat can ball, man.
He makes some mean pancakes too.
Quote:
A philosophy of tanking is fundamentally dishonest and insidiously destructive.
No fair saying it better than me, with less words too.
Quote:Are you serious? This isn't pee wee football. There is no sportsmanship anymore. This is the NFL.
Players bully each other, spit on each other, taunt, steal from each other and just blatantly disrespect one another.
Not to mention there are no guaranteed contracts. Owners can drop players in the drop of a hat and not give them a dime. The NFL is the last place you should expect honesty and sportsmanship
Which is why it would be impossible to tank.
Go up to a NFL football player and convince him to sandbag. Go convince him to willingly let the man in front of him, beat him.
Wont happen.
Now that there are four teams with only one more win than us and no team shares our dismal record, I no longer think there is one team most likely to steal the top pick if we don't get it. Therefore, I am done with this thread because it assumes only the Buccaneers can beat us to Teddy Bridgewater.
Quote:Who the pick happens to be is irrelevant. By intentionally losing to gain "access" is dishonest and undermines every honorable concept of sportsmanship and competition. Once one team is perceived to benefit from tanking then others will jump in the fray. Pretty soon the whole league assumes the perception of being rigged. If fans and other teams don't believe that a team is playing to the best of their ability, then win-loss records are nothing but scripts. I liken tanking to people faking injury or illness to draw disability. How many moral and ethical, not to mention legal, lines have to be crossed to gain "access" to that money?
A philosophy of tanking is fundamentally dishonest and insidiously destructive.
Then why specifically mention Bridgewater and your laughter if he busts? THAT certainly doesn't help the Jaguars. Why would you take joy in the team continuing to fail? Not objecting to team losing in an already hopelessly lost season isn't out of antipathy to the team or desire to score mythical points on a message board. It's the desire to improve the team to see it win lots of those shiny trophies and big gaudy rings they give to the Super Bowl Champions. Saying Nyaaahhh nyaahh to those on the other end of this debate doesn't further the aim of longer term success for the team at all. If your fear that one team is perceived to tank will be the catalyst to widespread dishonesty, then you can argue the Colts already started that ball rolling when they wound up with Luck. What about faking injury to slow down an opponent's hurry up offense? That's happened too. Somehow, the league has survived those acts of dishonesty. What about punters taking a dive after minimal contact to draw a penalty for running into the kicker or roughing the kicker? Does the league's integrity suffer for that? Did you stop watching football because the Patriots were caught in Spygate? Should offensive linemen who hold on a play and don't get called for it self report their infraction of the rules and demand the team be penalize?. I've yet to see that in a game. What about the team that benefits from an obviously blown call? Should honor preclude them from accepting the benefit of those blown calls?
Where is your moral outrage after all of these things? How did the league survive all of these affronts to its integrity?
Unfortunately, I think the team is too inept from a talent perspective to win many games this year, whether tanking or not.
But please don't argue honor and integrity. That toothpaste was out of the tube long ago.
Tampa is definitely tanking.
To quote some brilliance from this board:
Their management obviously "gets it."
That was obvious when Seattle "found a way to win" that game.
Lol
Quote:Tampa is definitely tanking.
To quote some brilliance from this board:
Their management obviously "gets it."
That was obvious when Seattle "found a way to win" that game.
Lol
You tellin me you dont remember last year when the Cheifs tanked for Eric Fisher? They had 5 pro bowlers!!!!!!
Quote:Then why specifically mention Bridgewater and your laughter if he busts? THAT certainly doesn't help the Jaguars. Why would you take joy in the team continuing to fail? Not objecting to team losing in an already hopelessly lost season isn't out of antipathy to the team or desire to score mythical points on a message board. It's the desire to improve the team to see it win lots of those shiny trophies and big gaudy rings they give to the Super Bowl Champions. Saying Nyaaahhh nyaahh to those on the other end of this debate doesn't further the aim of longer term success for the team at all. If your fear that one team is perceived to tank will be the catalyst to widespread dishonesty, then you can argue the Colts already started that ball rolling when they wound up with Luck. What about faking injury to slow down an opponent's hurry up offense? That's happened too. Somehow, the league has survived those acts of dishonesty. What about punters taking a dive after minimal contact to draw a penalty for running into the kicker or roughing the kicker? Does the league's integrity suffer for that? Did you stop watching football because the Patriots were caught in Spygate? Should offensive linemen who hold on a play and don't get called for it self report their infraction of the rules and demand the team be penalize?. I've yet to see that in a game. What about the team that benefits from an obviously blown call? Should honor preclude them from accepting the benefit of those blown calls?
Where is your moral outrage after all of these things? How did the league survive all of these affronts to its integrity?
Unfortunately, I think the team is too inept from a talent perspective to win many games this year, whether tanking or not.
But please don't argue honor and integrity. That toothpaste was out of the tube long ago.
I said previously the pick was irrelevant. I only mention Bridgewater because that is who most of the tankers are high on.
"If your fear that one team is perceived to tank will be the catalyst to widespread dishonesty, then you can argue the Colts already started that ball rolling when they wound up with Luck."
Yep, they sure did, and you're perpetuating that notion that our win-loss record is contrived by drawing senseless parallels between fudging rules on the field of play with the protracted efforts of an organization to upset a league process. That, IMO, is a completely skewed sense of proportion and sportsmanship. Players will always look for the immediate advantage, that's why those guys with the striped shirts run around on the field. But if we take your comparison at face value, the glaring difference is the players who break the rules are looking to win. You wish to lose. If that's the image you want projected onto our team and this fan base, then I want no association with it.
I agree that the talent level on this team is poor enough to warrant a high draft pick. Why exacerbate the situation by proclaiming to the world that we're intentionally throwing the season? Tanking is only a short term solution that undermines credibility and respect. Did the Patriots, or the Chiefs, or the Saints tank to get to where they are now? They did it through careful selection in FA and the draft. And while those teams had their lean years, I heard no credible accusations they were intentionally losing to gain advantage. I will always choose a culture of 100% effort and winning over one of duplicity.
Quote:I said previously the pick was irrelevant. I only mention Bridgewater because that is who most of the tankers are high on.
"If your fear that one team is perceived to tank will be the catalyst to widespread dishonesty, then you can argue the Colts already started that ball rolling when they wound up with Luck."
Yep, they sure did, and you're perpetuating that notion that our win-loss record is contrived by drawing senseless parallels between fudging rules on the field of play with the protracted efforts of an organization to upset a league process. That, IMO, is a completely skewed sense of proportion and sportsmanship. Players will always look for the immediate advantage, that's why those guys with the striped shirts run around on the field. But if we take your comparison at face value, the glaring difference is the players who break the rules are looking to win. You wish to lose. If that's the image you want projected onto our team and this fan base, then I want no association with it.
I agree that the talent level on this team is poor enough to warrant a high draft pick. Why exacerbate the situation by proclaiming to the world that we're intentionally throwing the season? Tanking is only a short term solution that undermines credibility and respect. Did the Patriots, or the Chiefs, or the Saints tank to get to where they are now? They did it through careful selection in FA and the draft. And while those teams had their lean years, I heard no credible accusations they were intentionally losing to gain advantage. I will always choose a culture of 100% effort and winning over one of duplicity.
Losing out the season really would benefit this team in the long run, we need a franchise QB. That does not mean I intentionally cheer for the opposing team on game days. I'd never do that, however, if losing out the rest of the season potentially got us the franchise QB, then I'd be willing to suffer this year and wait till bridgewater comes in. We are not going to be very good until we get the QB, that's a fact. This league is now QB driven.
Don't care where we draft or who it is, just as long as it's a QB and he gets us out of this misery the jaguars have been the last 3 years. Games at times are unwatchable. History shows usually the best QB prospects are drafted high, so in the best interest of the team, it would be to lose out and get the best prospect. Call me a tanker or what not, I'll be a fan win or lose.
Don't worry about the team tanking though, they are bad enough where we don't need to tank, they are sucking all on their own.
Quote:Wow. How is it possible our SOS is this much harder than everyone else? At this rate, we won't win a tiebreaker against ANY team. (not even sure I care anymore though)
You really shouldn't care as there's no definitive correlation between having the #1 pick and turning around your team.
Quote:You really shouldn't care as there's no definitive correlation between having the #1 pick and turning around your team.
Depends on the draft board I guess. From the team's perspective, Caldwell may think otherwise.
If we do get the top pick, I hope we just get it straight outright by record and not tiebreakers. That way we'll get the first pick in every round, and possibly more trade opportunities.
Quote:You really shouldn't care as there's no definitive correlation between having the #1 pick and turning around your team.
Well, except when theres a QB at the top of the draft such as Troy Aikman, Andrew Luck, Bridgewater and Peyton Manning...
Then the correlation indeed does become skewed in its favor....
But, but I know....you want you some of 'dem meaningless wins at the end of this dead season above all else....ALL ELSE!
^^ what a subtle way to ride teddys nut.
Quote:Wow. How is it possible our SOS is this much harder than everyone else? At this rate, we won't win a tiebreaker against ANY team. (not even sure I care anymore though)
Because it doesn't count future games because it's acting as if the season is ending right now. Our SOS is weaker once you include future opponents.
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