Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

(10-11-2022, 10:22 AM)Kane Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-10-2022, 11:04 PM)SamusAranX Wrote: [ -> ]That throw Carr just made…I guess for me that’s the kind of talent I expected out of Trevor with how highly graded he came in the draft

Don't think Carr was making those plays in year 2 though.

Year 2 AND year 1. Remember all the hand wringing that said we should have taken Carr instead of Bortles?

(10-11-2022, 12:48 AM)OzJohnnie Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-10-2022, 09:39 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ]We also had 20 pass plays over 20 yards on Sunday and moved the ball down the field but that is irrelevant it seems. 

This fan base has just had too many rough years and bad games immediately turn you into the last bad player we had. It's been an abusive relationship being a Jags fan and it's weird this first bump in the road and it's throw it all away. You would think we would have learnt from doing that the last 5 years.

Because I have nothing better to do and I was interested to see if it was true we had 20 pass plays over 20 yards, I decided to count them.  The NFL calls any pass with a target 15+ yards down field a long pass.  A short pass is a target <15 yards.

TL threw 47 passes in total.  33 short, 13 long and 1 spike.

The passing results on each drive:

Q1:
  Drive 1: 1/2 short, 0/0 long, dunt
  2: 2/2 short, 0/1 long, punt
  3: 3/5 short, 0/0 long, FG
Q2:
  4: 0/2 short, 1/1 long, downs
  5: 2/4 short, 2/2 long, FG
Q3:
  6: 2/3 short, 1/1 long, INT on a short pass
  7: 4/4 short, 1/2 long, downs
Q4:
  8: 0/3 short, 0/0 long, punt
  9: 2/5 short, 1/3 long, downs
10: 3/3 short, 0/3, INT on a long pass

So overall he was (putting aside the spiked ball) 25/46 (54% completion rate), 19/33 on short passes (57%) and 6/13 on long passes (46%).  That coupled with no TD’s and two INTs netting him a QB rating of 54.0.  Short pass accuracy and better throwing decisions to avoid INTs is the quickest path for TL to improve his play.

He throws inaccurately because his feet aren’t set.
His feet aren’t set because he’s dancing in and around the pocket.
He’s dancing around the pocket because his decision-making is too reactionary.
His decision making is poor because he’s not reading plays until they develop.

Everything improves if he can anticipate play, read the progressions and let his throwing mechanics take care of themselves.  As it is, he’s like a kid learning to drive.  Every move is conscious.  Little behaviour is learned and automatic.

These things you mentioned are 100% correct. However he had issues with these things at Clemson.

The biggest issue with him is his foot work in the pocket. He never fully steps up and I'm afraid you either have that or you don't. At this point it should become second nature to him but it didn't. Guy is afraid of contact.

(10-11-2022, 10:56 AM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-11-2022, 10:22 AM)Kane Wrote: [ -> ]Don't think Carr was making those plays in year 2 though.

Year 2 AND year 1.  Remember all the hand wringing that said we should have taken Carr instead of Bortles?

Eh vaguely. But mostly because of how bad Bortles was in year 2 I thought. Either way, comparing a seasoned vet to a year 2 QB isn't apples and apples

(10-11-2022, 10:29 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-11-2022, 10:22 AM)Kane Wrote: [ -> ]Don't think Carr was making those plays in year 2 though.

That's what is so baffling.

1st year garbage should be thrown out the window because of the worst coaching staff in history. This is game 5 with a new coaching staff, offensive players and new offensive playbook. Should he have seen Stingley? Sure. But if I really wanted to, I could find back interceptions by Rodgers, Brady, Mahomes, Allen or any other QB that you wish. It happens.

How bout Brady hoping for a fifth down a season or two ago? @The goat can't even count!@

---

(10-11-2022, 10:41 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

IDGI.

Don't know if this one's been posted

https://twitter.com/KevinColePFF/status/...7332641795

(10-11-2022, 10:22 AM)Kane Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-10-2022, 11:04 PM)SamusAranX Wrote: [ -> ]That throw Carr just made…I guess for me that’s the kind of talent I expected out of Trevor with how highly graded he came in the draft

Don't think Carr was making those plays in year 2 though.

Carr made the Pro Bowl in his 2nd year

(10-11-2022, 12:28 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-11-2022, 10:22 AM)Kane Wrote: [ -> ]Don't think Carr was making those plays in year 2 though.

Carr made the Pro Bowl in his 2nd year

That doesn't mean much. Pro Bowl voting is a joke.
How many QBs opted out first or were injured lol

Maybe he was good early, I don't really remember. I know people were trashing Carr a couple years ago now he's good or whatever. 
Either way can't really compare.

(10-11-2022, 12:28 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-11-2022, 10:22 AM)Kane Wrote: [ -> ]Don't think Carr was making those plays in year 2 though.

Carr made the Pro Bowl in his 2nd year

First 5 weeks of year 2?

Raiders were 2-3. Carr had 8 TDs to 7 interceptions. 218 yards a game. 55% completion.

Week 6 is where he turned a corner in year 2.

(10-11-2022, 12:58 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-11-2022, 12:28 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Carr made the Pro Bowl in his 2nd year

First 5 weeks of year 2?

Raiders were 2-3. Carr had 8 TDs to 7 interceptions. 218 yards a game. 55% completion.

Week 6 is where he turned a corner in year 2.

You realize what you just did here right?

(10-11-2022, 01:15 PM)imtheblkranger Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-11-2022, 12:58 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]First 5 weeks of year 2?

Raiders were 2-3. Carr had 8 TDs to 7 interceptions. 218 yards a game. 55% completion.

Week 6 is where he turned a corner in year 2.

You realize what you just did here right?

Yes sir!

All in baby!

Carr is not very good either. He's in the same tier as Cousins and Alex Smith.

I mean their game managing QBs. Nothing wrong with that but personally I wont be satisifed with a game manager especially when you invested in the #1 pick.

Coach Campo on 1010 saying he's very pleased with what he sees in TL, and says he's improved every game. The problem, he states, is TL forcing it out of frustration. He also says the frustration is borne of impatience by not just TL, but by the fanbase, and most importantly, by the coaches.

With that being said, has anyone else noticed how the running game disappears somewhere in the 2nd quarter? It makes me think Doug is forcing Lawrence to get the ball downfield.

He also stated that Troy Aikman was a three-year project before he started making strides. Coach Campo preaches patience, it will come. Good to hear from him because I trust his opinion more than just about anyone else's.

(10-11-2022, 02:33 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]Coach Campo on 1010 saying he's very pleased with what he sees in TL, and says he's improved every game. The problem, he states, is TL forcing it out of frustration. He also says the frustration is borne of impatience by not just TL, but by the fanbase, and most importantly, by the coaches.

With that being said, has anyone else noticed how the running game disappears somewhere in the 2nd quarter? It makes me think Doug is forcing Lawrence to get the ball downfield.

He also stated that Troy Aikman was a three-year project before he started making strides. Coach Campo preaches patience, it will come. Good to hear from him because I trust his opinion more than just about anyone else's.

Yeah I was just listening to that and it was good to hear, and he's right. The thing I heard earlier on 1010 that had me thinking was saying Doug is so determined to develop Trevor that he might be sacrificing wins in the process. Doug knows the reps and throwing and seeing things is what will develop Trevor the fastest so he's making him take on more than he necessarily should because he wants him to learn, in the process of that we are losing games.

(10-11-2022, 02:47 PM)imtheblkranger Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-11-2022, 02:33 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]Coach Campo on 1010 saying he's very pleased with what he sees in TL, and says he's improved every game. The problem, he states, is TL forcing it out of frustration. He also says the frustration is borne of impatience by not just TL, but by the fanbase, and most importantly, by the coaches.

With that being said, has anyone else noticed how the running game disappears somewhere in the 2nd quarter? It makes me think Doug is forcing Lawrence to get the ball downfield.

He also stated that Troy Aikman was a three-year project before he started making strides. Coach Campo preaches patience, it will come. Good to hear from him because I trust his opinion more than just about anyone else's.

Yeah I was just listening to that and it was good to hear, and he's right. The thing I heard earlier on 1010 that had me thinking was saying Doug is so determined to develop Trevor that he might be sacrificing wins in the process. Doug knows the reps and throwing and seeing things is what will develop Trevor the fastest so he's making him take on more than he necessarily should because he wants him to learn, in the process of that we are losing games.

Which is why last year really sucks for Trevor. Essentially a wasted season.

Now I know some people will just use that as an excuse but it's the truth.

(10-11-2022, 02:33 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]Coach Campo on 1010 saying he's very pleased with what he sees in TL, and says he's improved every game. The problem, he states, is TL forcing it out of frustration. He also says the frustration is borne of impatience by not just TL, but by the fanbase, and most importantly, by the coaches.

With that being said, has anyone else noticed how the running game disappears somewhere in the 2nd quarter? It makes me think Doug is forcing Lawrence to get the ball downfield.

He also stated that Troy Aikman was a three-year project before he started making strides. Coach Campo preaches patience, it will come. Good to hear from him because I trust his opinion more than just about anyone else's.

That statement in bold. Is that an assumption or known within the locker room? If he's forcing something out of frustration due to coaching that's a bit of a concern. 

I am pretty much over the whole "we need to run the football more" mantra. I was a proponent of this earlier on, however, it was working in weeks two and three with him airing it out. 

Week four on the road is tough to gauge how it would have played out. That's the one game where I felt they should have ran it strictly because of the weather. 

Then week five happened at home. My personal opinion, I think Pederson wanted to give Lawrence more opportunities in the passing game to make up for the mistakes he made in Philadelphia. 

I am willing to bet that if he doesn't throw that INT in the end zone and we go up 13 to 6 that it completely changes the course of the game and it's possible Pederson turns Robinson loose in the running game. 

Despite this perception of the team not running the football? They're ranked 5th in total rushing yardage in the AFC and they're 15th overall in the NFL in total rushing yardage. Robinson has close to 300 yards on the ground and Etienne has a little over 200 yards on the ground. Also looks like Hasty is getting into the mix these past two games. 

Also, Lawrence missed a wide open Robinson in a check down opportunity on 2nd and goal this past Sunday. The one thing I kept calling for, the use of the TE's in the passing game? That finally seemed to be more incorporated into the game plan with Manhertz, Arnold and Engram all getting involved. 

It's just situational football man. I cannot get pissed off at Pederson when he's calling passes with his QB that he's trusting to make the play, which, he ultimately does, but then he proceeds to miss the right read, makes the wrong read and forces a really bad pass that leads into a turnover. 

That's on Lawrence. Not Pederson. When the ball is in your hands, you have to protect it, you have to make the right decisions and you have to get it done. Period. Running game this, passing game that, look, to an extent, I GET IT. BUT.... if the play calling is getting you into the red zone? You have to execute within scoring range. He's let the team down a bit in that regard. 

Maybe after five games and this team officially being on the wrong side of .500? Maybe Pederson starts to shift his overall approach and starts taking the ball out of Lawrence's hands once he gets them closer and inside the red zone. I think we'll see it this Sunday on the road. 

Fully expect something like this by the time the game is finished and we're taking a knee for the win to close it out. 

Jaguars - 24
Clots - 13

Lawrence: 19/26 - 270 yards passing - 1 TD / 0 INT - 4 Rushes for 33 yards - 1 TD / 0 FUM
Robinson: 13 carries for 89 yards - 2 receptions for 19 yards - 1 TD RUSH
Etienne: 9 carries for 43 yards - 4 receptions for 47 yards - 1 TD REC

That's a balanced game IMHO. BUT.... that only occurs if Lawrence gets off to a fast start and doesn't turn it over like he's done in the last two games early.

(10-11-2022, 02:54 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-11-2022, 02:33 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]Coach Campo on 1010 saying he's very pleased with what he sees in TL, and says he's improved every game. The problem, he states, is TL forcing it out of frustration. He also says the frustration is borne of impatience by not just TL, but by the fanbase, and most importantly, by the coaches.

With that being said, has anyone else noticed how the running game disappears somewhere in the 2nd quarter? It makes me think Doug is forcing Lawrence to get the ball downfield.

He also stated that Troy Aikman was a three-year project before he started making strides. Coach Campo preaches patience, it will come. Good to hear from him because I trust his opinion more than just about anyone else's.

That statement in bold. Is that an assumption or known within the locker room? If he's forcing something out of frustration due to coaching that's a bit of a concern. 

I am pretty much over the whole "we need to run the football more" mantra. I was a proponent of this earlier on, however, it was working in weeks two and three with him airing it out. 

Week four on the road is tough to gauge how it would have played out. That's the one game where I felt they should have ran it strictly because of the weather. 

Then week five happened at home. My personal opinion, I think Pederson wanted to give Lawrence more opportunities in the passing game to make up for the mistakes he made in Philadelphia. 

I am willing to bet that if he doesn't throw that INT in the end zone and we go up 13 to 6 that it completely changes the course of the game and it's possible Pederson turns Robinson loose in the running game. 

Despite this perception of the team not running the football? They're ranked 5th in total rushing yardage in the AFC and they're 15th overall in the NFL in total rushing yardage. Robinson has close to 300 yards on the ground and Etienne has a little over 200 yards on the ground. Also looks like Hasty is getting into the mix these past two games. 

Also, Lawrence missed a wide open Robinson in a check down opportunity on 2nd and goal this past Sunday. The one thing I kept calling for, the use of the TE's in the passing game? That finally seemed to be more incorporated into the game plan with Manhertz, Arnold and Engram all getting involved. 

It's just situational football man. I cannot get pissed off at Pederson when he's calling passes with his QB that he's trusting to make the play, which, he ultimately does, but then he proceeds to miss the right read, makes the wrong read and forces a really bad pass that leads into a turnover. 

That's on Lawrence. Not Pederson. When the ball is in your hands, you have to protect it, you have to make the right decisions and you have to get it done. Period. Running game this, passing game that, look, to an extent, I GET IT. BUT.... if the play calling is getting you into the red zone? You have to execute within scoring range. He's let the team down a bit in that regard. 

Maybe after five games and this team officially being on the wrong side of .500? Maybe Pederson starts to shift his overall approach and starts taking the ball out of Lawrence's hands once he gets them closer and inside the red zone. I think we'll see it this Sunday on the road. 

Fully expect something like this by the time the game is finished and we're taking a knee for the win to close it out. 

Jaguars - 24
Clots - 13

Lawrence: 19/26 - 270 yards passing - 1 TD / 0 INT - 4 Rushes for 33 yards - 1 TD / 0 FUM
Robinson: 13 carries for 89 yards - 2 receptions for 19 yards - 1 TD RUSH
Etienne: 9 carries for 43 yards - 4 receptions for 47 yards - 1 TD REC

That's a balanced game IMHO. BUT.... that only occurs if Lawrence gets off to a fast start and doesn't turn it over like he's done in the last two games early.

That's for sure. If Trevor doesn't throw that pick, Jags win that game 16-6 I think. I also think if Taylor doesn't get the hold on the ETN sideline catch, Jags win the game. And I think if Walker doesn't get the personal foul, Jags win the game.

Just an overall crappy game man.

(10-11-2022, 02:59 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-11-2022, 02:54 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]That statement in bold. Is that an assumption or known within the locker room? If he's forcing something out of frustration due to coaching that's a bit of a concern. 

I am pretty much over the whole "we need to run the football more" mantra. I was a proponent of this earlier on, however, it was working in weeks two and three with him airing it out. 

Week four on the road is tough to gauge how it would have played out. That's the one game where I felt they should have ran it strictly because of the weather. 

Then week five happened at home. My personal opinion, I think Pederson wanted to give Lawrence more opportunities in the passing game to make up for the mistakes he made in Philadelphia. 

I am willing to bet that if he doesn't throw that INT in the end zone and we go up 13 to 6 that it completely changes the course of the game and it's possible Pederson turns Robinson loose in the running game. 

Despite this perception of the team not running the football? They're ranked 5th in total rushing yardage in the AFC and they're 15th overall in the NFL in total rushing yardage. Robinson has close to 300 yards on the ground and Etienne has a little over 200 yards on the ground. Also looks like Hasty is getting into the mix these past two games. 

Also, Lawrence missed a wide open Robinson in a check down opportunity on 2nd and goal this past Sunday. The one thing I kept calling for, the use of the TE's in the passing game? That finally seemed to be more incorporated into the game plan with Manhertz, Arnold and Engram all getting involved. 

It's just situational football man. I cannot get pissed off at Pederson when he's calling passes with his QB that he's trusting to make the play, which, he ultimately does, but then he proceeds to miss the right read, makes the wrong read and forces a really bad pass that leads into a turnover. 

That's on Lawrence. Not Pederson. When the ball is in your hands, you have to protect it, you have to make the right decisions and you have to get it done. Period. Running game this, passing game that, look, to an extent, I GET IT. BUT.... if the play calling is getting you into the red zone? You have to execute within scoring range. He's let the team down a bit in that regard. 

Maybe after five games and this team officially being on the wrong side of .500? Maybe Pederson starts to shift his overall approach and starts taking the ball out of Lawrence's hands once he gets them closer and inside the red zone. I think we'll see it this Sunday on the road. 

Fully expect something like this by the time the game is finished and we're taking a knee for the win to close it out. 

Jaguars - 24
Clots - 13

Lawrence: 19/26 - 270 yards passing - 1 TD / 0 INT - 4 Rushes for 33 yards - 1 TD / 0 FUM
Robinson: 13 carries for 89 yards - 2 receptions for 19 yards - 1 TD RUSH
Etienne: 9 carries for 43 yards - 4 receptions for 47 yards - 1 TD REC

That's a balanced game IMHO. BUT.... that only occurs if Lawrence gets off to a fast start and doesn't turn it over like he's done in the last two games early.

That's for sure. If Trevor doesn't throw that pick, Jags win that game 16-6 I think. I also think if Taylor doesn't get the hold on the ETN sideline catch, Jags win the game. And I think if Walker doesn't get the personal foul, Jags win the game.

Just an overall crappy game man.

Yeah. Plenty of blame to go around. Lawrence unfortunately catches the brunt of it because of the five turnovers in Philadelphia and the crucial interception in the red zone. 

It is what it is. So what? Now what? I kind of knew this was going to be how the first year played out with Pederson. Especially for Lawrence. My expectations were around them getting to six wins at the minimum, establishing an identity and playing better, more competitive football across the board. 

Which, in five games? Check, check & check. It's just a process and with that process comes a path of progression that will have it's fair share of growing pains as well as it's fair share of high fives and good times to go around for the fans and players alike. 

It's just too easy to get swept up in sensationalism. We're all armchair GM's, Coaches & Monday Morning QB know-it-all's now thanks to the various media outlets, social networking, etc. 

We all go back and forth on here as fans and I have to even dull my tongue in text messages just within my own family because everybody is pretty much dogmatic and they desperately want to be able to say "See!? I told you so!". That's all it boils down to. 

I just want to be as fair as humanly possible with my judgements and assessments. It's all still coming together. It's still really, really early. The fact that they're losing games sucks, however, it doesn't suck as much as it did over the last two, three years. That's something I have to catch myself with and remind myself and family with as well. 

We're on here or texting back and forth [BLEEP] about literally one or two plays in three losses Vs. what would have been a [BLEEP] fest in the past by half time. 

It's all going to be fine.

(10-10-2022, 10:00 AM)WingerDinger Wrote: [ -> ]This is a competitive team.. Competitive teams lose sometimes, competitive teams win sometimes.

Dominant teams rarely lose.. This team isn't dominate, yet..

Funny, just a short few months ago, most people on this board were DYING for this team to be competitive. Now that we have it, ya'll whine like little [BLEEP].. Losses are going to happen.

Oh my! You nailed it!

Thank You!

(10-11-2022, 02:52 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-11-2022, 02:47 PM)imtheblkranger Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah I was just listening to that and it was good to hear, and he's right. The thing I heard earlier on 1010 that had me thinking was saying Doug is so determined to develop Trevor that he might be sacrificing wins in the process. Doug knows the reps and throwing and seeing things is what will develop Trevor the fastest so he's making him take on more than he necessarily should because he wants him to learn, in the process of that we are losing games.

Which is why last year really sucks for Trevor. Essentially a wasted season.

Now I know some people will just use that as an excuse but it's the truth.

I'm in complete agreement with you here. It just irritates me that we wasted a year. But it got us Pederson who wasn't ready to come back yet last year so there's that.

I see a couple of people are wanting to turn their backs on Coach Pederson for whatever reasons, but all I have to say, if the QB doesn’t squander away 7 possessions in the last 2, then Pederson is in the early discussion of coach of the year.

All of a sudden we’re not worried about Taylor and Henry trouncing us for 200. We saw his vision in Kirk from the first game of the year. The kicker has only missed 1 kick. And the Oline has been pretty dang solid.

The 200 we gave up to Philly was because a certain qb gave them 5 extra possessions.

This team is way farther along then any of us ever thought. Coach is calling the same plays as he did the first few games. 16 just has to make it all work.

I hope we don’t mess this one up. It’s hard to come by a quality head coach these days. Especially trying to get them down here.

All three 1st round picks have cost this team about 2 wins this year. 3 wins if you count the Philly game.

1st round pick Etienne flat out dropped the 4th and goal pass.
1st round pick Walker made a rookie mistake on 3rd and a country mile against Houston.
1st round pick Trevor turns the ball over 5 times against Philly, and he throws a pick in the redzone.

Sounds cliche, but this is a 5-0 team that has a record of 2-3 heading into Indy. As WingerDinger said earlier, we ain’t going undefeated. It’s nice to be competitive right??? We have yet to get blown out.

In divisional games the Jaguars have only given up 13 points.

AFC South Standings

Titans 3-2 (on a bye week, and play Indy next week)
Colts 2-2 (back to back division games)
Jaguars 2-3 (a chance to right the ship)
Texans 1-3-1 (on a bye week, and play raiders next)

IF we can beat the Colts, we’re right back in this division thing. Yes we could be 5-0 but that’s football. Let’s not fire everybody after every game. Walker Little isn’t the savior of this team and the Oline isn’t the reason we’re 2-3.

Ol boy just needs to play better.