The accountability is on the players and there execution not press taylor
At the end of the day your being paid to do a job and execute your role to the highest degree possible.... this was something that no one bar ETN did
(09-25-2023, 07:12 PM)StrayaJag Wrote: [ -> ]The accountability is on the players and there execution not press taylor
At the end of the day your being paid to do a job and execute your role to the highest degree possible.... this was something that no one bar ETN did
I hate this type of nonsense.
You realize that there are 31 other teams that also pay their players, right?
Your coaches, the management, decides whether the practices are good enough. They also decide who is going to get plays and who the plays should be focused on. They also decide what scheme we will run and how to run an offense based on down/distance/time of game.
Last year our players got paid just the same as this year. And yet last year our team was exceptional, even when we were losing.
Last year's team would smoke this years team. And last year's team has the same players, for the most part.
So, what's changed? The players are almost identical. And yet we look like trash. Maybe the coaches have changed responsibilities and those changes have resulted in poor management and poor overall decision making? Is that so profound? That coaching/managing is a huge factor in holding players accountable?
LOL. You guys kill me. It's obvious this team sucks. This is the same team as last year. And yet we suck all of a sudden. What's changed??
Doug gave up control of the offense. That has changed. And it's obvious this team no longer has the passion they did last year. Same players playing the same positions. The thing that changed is that the coaches are no longer coaching their same jobs. There was a change at the top. And here we are.
It's not that hard to figure out.
It’s the same team but a few players are in different roles. Which upsets the balance we had last season. Ridley.
(09-25-2023, 07:22 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ] (09-25-2023, 07:12 PM)StrayaJag Wrote: [ -> ]The accountability is on the players and there execution not press taylor
At the end of the day your being paid to do a job and execute your role to the highest degree possible.... this was something that no one bar ETN did
I hate this type of nonsense.
You realize that there are 31 other teams that also pay their players, right?
Your coaches, the management, decides whether the practices are good enough. They also decide who is going to get plays and who the plays should be focused on. They also decide what scheme we will run and how to run an offense based on down/distance/time of game.
Last year our players got paid just the same as this year. And yet last year our team was exceptional, even when we were losing.
Last year's team would smoke this years team. And last year's team has the same players, for the most part.
So, what's changed? The players are almost identical. And yet we look like trash. Maybe the coaches have changed responsibilities and those changes have resulted in poor management and poor overall decision making? Is that so profound? That coaching/managing is a huge factor in holding players accountable?
LOL. You guys kill me. It's obvious this team sucks. This is the same team as last year. And yet we suck all of a sudden. What's changed??
Doug gave up control of the offense. That has changed. And it's obvious this team no longer has the passion they did last year. Same players playing the same positions. The thing that changed is that the coaches are no longer coaching their same jobs. There was a change at the top. And here we are.
It's not that hard to figure out.
Did the team also have this many dropped balls/fumbles then last year ?
There execution on the basics has been dog [BLEEP] and u have to acknowledge that
(09-25-2023, 07:46 PM)StrayaJag Wrote: [ -> ] (09-25-2023, 07:22 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ]I hate this type of nonsense.
You realize that there are 31 other teams that also pay their players, right?
Your coaches, the management, decides whether the practices are good enough. They also decide who is going to get plays and who the plays should be focused on. They also decide what scheme we will run and how to run an offense based on down/distance/time of game.
Last year our players got paid just the same as this year. And yet last year our team was exceptional, even when we were losing.
Last year's team would smoke this years team. And last year's team has the same players, for the most part.
So, what's changed? The players are almost identical. And yet we look like trash. Maybe the coaches have changed responsibilities and those changes have resulted in poor management and poor overall decision making? Is that so profound? That coaching/managing is a huge factor in holding players accountable?
LOL. You guys kill me. It's obvious this team sucks. This is the same team as last year. And yet we suck all of a sudden. What's changed??
Doug gave up control of the offense. That has changed. And it's obvious this team no longer has the passion they did last year. Same players playing the same positions. The thing that changed is that the coaches are no longer coaching their same jobs. There was a change at the top. And here we are.
It's not that hard to figure out.
Did the team also have this many dropped balls/fumbles then last year ?
There execution on the basics has been dog [BLEEP] and u have to acknowledge that
I don't have ESPN money to actually spend money to confirm it... But Zay Jones, who was a baller for us last year, and one of my favorite players, had 12 drops last year, which led the league...
https://blackandteal.com/posts/jaguars-s...jones-2023
And if our #2 WR led the league in drops per targets, then it would assume that we had our fair share of drops last year.
And, on top of that, let's face it, our O-Line last year was just as bad as it is this year. It's not like last year's O-Line was something special. It wasn't.
You know what was different last year? Our play calling. We had defenses on their heels. They didn't know whether we were running, screening (which by the way we rarely did last year) or going with a crossing mid route concept with a streaker on the sidelines.
Our offense last year was dynamic. It was inspired. It was amazing. This offense is trash. It just is. You can just watch how crappy we are.
I just don't get how anyone looks at what we are doing this year and think it looks anything like what we did last year.
It's changed. And we still have the same players. So why did we change what was working?
(09-25-2023, 08:55 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ] (09-25-2023, 07:46 PM)StrayaJag Wrote: [ -> ]Did the team also have this many dropped balls/fumbles then last year ?
There execution on the basics has been dog [BLEEP] and u have to acknowledge that
I don't have ESPN money to actually spend money to confirm it... But Zay Jones, who was a baller for us last year, and one of my favorite players, had 12 drops last year, which led the league... https://blackandteal.com/posts/jaguars-s...jones-2023
And if our #2 WR led the league in drops per targets, then it would assume that we had our fair share of drops last year.
And, on top of that, let's face it, our O-Line last year was just as bad as it is this year. It's not like last year's O-Line was something special. It wasn't.
You know what was different last year? Our play calling. We had defenses on their heels. They didn't know whether we were running, screening (which by the way we rarely did last year) or going with a crossing mid route concept with a streaker on the sidelines.
Our offense last year was dynamic. It was inspired. It was amazing. This offense is trash. It just is. You can just watch how crappy we are.
I just don't get how anyone looks at what we are doing this year and think it looks anything like what we did last year.
It's changed. And we still have the same players. So why did we change what was working?
Not trying to be a downer but our offense wasnt that insane last year, we definitely had 4-6 games where it was, and our run game was pretty insane etn averaged like 5 ypc most of the year. But it wasnt some crazy offense..
(09-25-2023, 09:05 PM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ] (09-25-2023, 08:55 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ]I don't have ESPN money to actually spend money to confirm it... But Zay Jones, who was a baller for us last year, and one of my favorite players, had 12 drops last year, which led the league... https://blackandteal.com/posts/jaguars-s...jones-2023
And if our #2 WR led the league in drops per targets, then it would assume that we had our fair share of drops last year.
And, on top of that, let's face it, our O-Line last year was just as bad as it is this year. It's not like last year's O-Line was something special. It wasn't.
You know what was different last year? Our play calling. We had defenses on their heels. They didn't know whether we were running, screening (which by the way we rarely did last year) or going with a crossing mid route concept with a streaker on the sidelines.
Our offense last year was dynamic. It was inspired. It was amazing. This offense is trash. It just is. You can just watch how crappy we are.
I just don't get how anyone looks at what we are doing this year and think it looks anything like what we did last year.
It's changed. And we still have the same players. So why did we change what was working?
Not trying to be a downer but our offense wasnt that insane last year, we definitely had 4-6 games where it was, and our run game was pretty insane etn averaged like 5 ypc most of the year. But it wasnt some crazy offense..
I've been a Jaguars fan since 2007. Last year's offense was the first time I actually believed I was watching an NFL offense. Last year reminded me of when I was a kid. It was joyous. That's why I'm so mad now.
2022 minus 2007 equals 15 years.
It's been 15 years since I've seen a real Jaguars offense. "Oh but Bortles!" Naw Bortles was trash. He had one great half against Pittsburg in the playoffs. And that was it.
No, 2022 was the first time I actually thought we were entering a real NFL offense and it was because Pederson was running the show. And to watch the last 3 weeks?? And then to see mods insult me as though they know what real offense looks like... Dude, sometimes I wonder if this team is ever going to be legit if we have fans that won't hold coaches accountable.
Point out the obvious. This is not Pederson's offense. This is Pederson either giving up control or maybe he's just retiring. I don't know. But this isn't the same team we saw last year. And it's the same guys! So you tell me what's changed....
(09-25-2023, 07:46 PM)StrayaJag Wrote: [ -> ] (09-25-2023, 07:22 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ]I hate this type of nonsense.
You realize that there are 31 other teams that also pay their players, right?
Your coaches, the management, decides whether the practices are good enough. They also decide who is going to get plays and who the plays should be focused on. They also decide what scheme we will run and how to run an offense based on down/distance/time of game.
Last year our players got paid just the same as this year. And yet last year our team was exceptional, even when we were losing.
Last year's team would smoke this years team. And last year's team has the same players, for the most part.
So, what's changed? The players are almost identical. And yet we look like trash. Maybe the coaches have changed responsibilities and those changes have resulted in poor management and poor overall decision making? Is that so profound? That coaching/managing is a huge factor in holding players accountable?
LOL. You guys kill me. It's obvious this team sucks. This is the same team as last year. And yet we suck all of a sudden. What's changed??
Doug gave up control of the offense. That has changed. And it's obvious this team no longer has the passion they did last year. Same players playing the same positions. The thing that changed is that the coaches are no longer coaching their same jobs. There was a change at the top. And here we are.
It's not that hard to figure out.
Did the team also have this many dropped balls/fumbles then last year ?
There execution on the basics has been dog [BLEEP] and u have to acknowledge that
Yeah, they did. And they were 2 and 6 to start the season. When the players make mistakes they lose games, it's really not more complicated than that no matter what histrionics some people post ad nauseum.
(09-25-2023, 10:33 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (09-25-2023, 07:46 PM)StrayaJag Wrote: [ -> ]Did the team also have this many dropped balls/fumbles then last year ?
There execution on the basics has been dog [BLEEP] and u have to acknowledge that
Yeah, they did. And they were 2 and 6 to start the season. When the players make mistakes they lose games, it's really not more complicated than that no matter what histrionics some people post ad nauseum.
More discipline needed then...maybe urban Meyer has a jaguar voodoo doll somewhere and is playing with it
(09-25-2023, 09:19 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ] (09-25-2023, 09:05 PM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ]Not trying to be a downer but our offense wasnt that insane last year, we definitely had 4-6 games where it was, and our run game was pretty insane etn averaged like 5 ypc most of the year. But it wasnt some crazy offense..
I've been a Jaguars fan since 2007. Last year's offense was the first time I actually believed I was watching an NFL offense. Last year reminded me of when I was a kid. It was joyous. That's why I'm so mad now.
2022 minus 2007 equals 15 years.
It's been 15 years since I've seen a real Jaguars offense. "Oh but Bortles!" Naw Bortles was trash. He had one great half against Pittsburg in the playoffs. And that was it.
No, 2022 was the first time I actually thought we were entering a real NFL offense and it was because Pederson was running the show. And to watch the last 3 weeks?? And then to see mods insult me as though they know what real offense looks like... Dude, sometimes I wonder if this team is ever going to be legit if we have fans that won't hold coaches accountable.
Point out the obvious. This is not Pederson's offense. This is Pederson either giving up control or maybe he's just retiring. I don't know. But this isn't the same team we saw last year. And it's the same guys! So you tell me what's changed....
Its pretty similar to last year from week 1-8.. the biggest difference is our run game was potent early on.
It's the same team from last year. Same mistakes. Same penalties. Same failures. Bad throws. Dropped passes. Fumbles. Blown assignments. Poor line play on both sides.
They won't be lucky like last year because it's just rare that a 2 - 6 team catches fire, rips off 7 wins, while one team in the division collapses and limps into the play off race.
This team has to now cross every "t" and dot ever "i" to win football games. They're not the Chiefs. They're not the 49ers. They're not good enough talent wise to overcome multiple errors in one game.
This is not college football. Most NFL teams treat turnovers, especially average NFL teams, they treat turnovers like they're a solid 5 in a nightclub and they just had a really good looking 8, 9 or 10 fall into their lap looking for a good revenge [BLEEP] after a tough break up.
Going forward? Players need to be benched for that nonsense. It may not hurt their paycheck's. It may not even hurt their ego's. But, it may prevent them from hurting the team and the guys that want to win and earn a big contract here or elsewhere.
Agnew? I wouldn't put him on offense at all for a few weeks. Time to activate Washington or Cooks. Ridley? Knock him down a peg or two on the depth chart. Move him into a different role. Start feeding other guys that can actually catch it.
Defensively? If Walker can't take advantage of what the tinhorns rolled out with on Sunday? Maybe the experiment ends there with him being an outside rusher.
Time to swallow your pride as a front office and staff and move him into a more traditional role. He clearly doesn't have enough to handle it currently where he's at.
We're not getting Nick Bosa or TJ Watt out of this guy. It's just not in his DNA. Kick him inside and closer to the line. Seen enough.
Sent from my SM-S906U using Tapatalk
We have to stop beating ourselves. We can talk about not executing, being outplayed, low talent or whatever but the mental errors, special teams blunders and just creating bad situations for ourselves has to change. It's surprising that is an issue this year given our coaching from last year.
(09-26-2023, 01:15 AM)JaguarJosh2 Wrote: [ -> ]We have to stop beating ourselves. We can talk about not executing, being outplayed, low talent or whatever but the mental errors, special teams blunders and just creating bad situations for ourselves has to change. It's surprising that is an issue this year given our coaching from last year.
It was always an issue though. Even in the games they won. Go back to the Dallas home game or Baltimore home game. Lawrence got blasted, fumbled it and they got lucky and got the ball back again. Look at the home play off win. Then look at the play off loss.
This team routinely played loose, reckless and gambled a lot and got lucky a lot. The Henry fumble on the road. The near pick that was tipped for a TD to Zay Jones. That's a lot of luck.
We're not getting that again in 2023. Teams know we're capable now of scoring. We're sloppy. We've always been sloppy with a few rare exceptions. They need to dig their heads out of their [BLEEP].
I kind of hate how Doug said they're better than this or they're good. No. No, Doug. You're not. You're what your record and percentages say you are until you prove otherwise.
You might want to tell these guys the truth. They're not so good guys. Time to dump out the teal kool aid. That [BLEEP] sat in the fridge too long and it's given this team brain freeze. Make a new batch. Start from scratch.
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(09-24-2023, 06:59 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]https://blackandteal.com/posts/jaguars-n...oss-texans
Thank god.
I think it's of primary importance that the calls are from one source. Either fully hand off to Press and let him sink or swim (potentially dragging you whichever way he goes) or take the reins yourself and claim full responsibility for what we see called.
I am not saying that Press is the problem; but it's gotta be a challenge for the offense to have multiple voices of authority, especially if they differ in any philosophical sense.
I want to see this team running like a fine-tuned machine. They are capable. We've been misfiring all season, hopefully this helps.
(09-24-2023, 07:09 PM)enigma Wrote: [ -> ] (09-24-2023, 06:59 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]https://blackandteal.com/posts/jaguars-n...oss-texans
Well this corroborates everything we speculated previously.
Press Taylor is absolutely terrible as a playcaller and has rightfully been stripped of those duties for the sake of this teams success. Hopefully the team manages to look and play competently with Doug back at the helm, but I fear that our woes stem from both terrible coaching decisions and absolutely abysmal on-field performances by our players through 3 weeks.
Doug needs to emphasize the penalty problem in addition to the myriad of other issues, because its evident that our team can't overcome a minor deficit especially when we endure self-imposed errors.
This isn't an overreaction but rather, a straightforward observation that our team (from coaching down to players) are absolutely in the bottom echelon of the NFL so far. And the issue I take with this, like many others, is that we all EXPECTED an improved product carrying from the second half of last season - which is why this stings a little more.
Sure, "we're only 3 weeks in" but damn it if we don't get this sinking ship turned around quickly, we're going to be in some deep water with regards to the season.
I think you've gone a step too far, I highly doubt Doug would give him the reins at all if he were "terrible". I think we need some consistency. We can get fancy when everyone is 5+ years into the same system and all facets are clicking. That is distinctly not the case right now, and adding this wrinkle into weekly gameplan is showing in our sloppiness.
(09-26-2023, 09:08 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ] (09-24-2023, 06:59 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]https://blackandteal.com/posts/jaguars-n...oss-texans
Thank god.
I think it's of primary importance that the calls are from one source. Either fully hand off to Press and let him sink or swim (potentially dragging you whichever way he goes) or take the reins yourself and claim full responsibility for what we see called.
I am not saying that Press is the problem; but it's gotta be a challenge for the offense to have multiple voices of authority, especially if they differ in any philosophical sense.
I want to see this team running like a fine-tuned machine. They are capable. We've been misfiring all season, hopefully this helps.
Doug refuted that report in yesterday's presser.
He said he did not reclaim play calling from Press.
They obviously made a few halftime adjustments though, because they came out and scored 10 points pretty quickly in the 3rd before the special teams gaffe of the decade took all the wind back out of the sails.
(09-25-2023, 09:05 PM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ] (09-25-2023, 08:55 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ]I don't have ESPN money to actually spend money to confirm it... But Zay Jones, who was a baller for us last year, and one of my favorite players, had 12 drops last year, which led the league... https://blackandteal.com/posts/jaguars-s...jones-2023
Not trying to be a downer but our offense wasnt that insane last year, we definitely had 4-6 games where it was, and our run game was pretty insane etn averaged like 5 ypc most of the year. But it wasnt some crazy offense..
I was thinking the same thing. Heck, one just has to look at the final regular season game last year (vs Titans) and the 1st half of the Chargers playoff game to realize that Offense was about as bad as it gets.
(09-25-2023, 07:00 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ] (09-25-2023, 04:33 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]https://twitter.com/haydenwinks/status/1...915L-t18Xg
So I went and read the play by play for the KC and the Houston game.
If it's 1st down. I guarantee Trevor is in Shotgun and ETN is next to him. Invariably the formation is with 1 TE and the receivers tight to the line. Rarely, if ever did we have a WR outside the hashes.
So, like I said. First down... We're in shotgun. ETN next to Lawrence. 11 personelle with WR's bunched.
On this down, for the last 2 weeks... 90% of the time it was a run to ETN. 70% of the time it was a run up the middle. And then the other 30% was off tackle, but not a wide sweeping run. Basically they were all runs right up the middle. Every time. 1st and 10? Bank on it being shotgun, bunch formation and a run by ETN between the hashes.
I could set my clock on it for the last 2 weeks.
Except... In the second half against Houston, after falling down 17 to ZERO, all of a sudden our offense started getting slightly more aggressive... We stopped running from shotgun on 1st and 10 everytime.
Now... Doug (I originally typed out Gus, maybe a Freudian slip?) says he didn't call plays in the 2nd half. But if you go and you read the play by play for the KC game and the 1st half of the Houston game... I think you might question whether Doug was being honest or was protecting his prodigy...
You seem to require a singular focus to blame even when it's clear there are multiple culprits. Could it be that game situation dictated a more aggressive approach in the 2nd half versus reading between the lines and filling in blanks to again find your singular focus? Hey, you might be right, but to get there requires a bunch of assumptions. I would generally temper my anger toward someone if I'm arriving there relying on multiple assumptions, but that's just me.
(09-26-2023, 09:54 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ] (09-25-2023, 07:00 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ]So I went and read the play by play for the KC and the Houston game.
If it's 1st down. I guarantee Trevor is in Shotgun and ETN is next to him. Invariably the formation is with 1 TE and the receivers tight to the line. Rarely, if ever did we have a WR outside the hashes.
So, like I said. First down... We're in shotgun. ETN next to Lawrence. 11 personelle with WR's bunched.
On this down, for the last 2 weeks... 90% of the time it was a run to ETN. 70% of the time it was a run up the middle. And then the other 30% was off tackle, but not a wide sweeping run. Basically they were all runs right up the middle. Every time. 1st and 10? Bank on it being shotgun, bunch formation and a run by ETN between the hashes.
I could set my clock on it for the last 2 weeks.
Except... In the second half against Houston, after falling down 17 to ZERO, all of a sudden our offense started getting slightly more aggressive... We stopped running from shotgun on 1st and 10 everytime.
Now... Doug (I originally typed out Gus, maybe a Freudian slip?) says he didn't call plays in the 2nd half. But if you go and you read the play by play for the KC game and the 1st half of the Houston game... I think you might question whether Doug was being honest or was protecting his prodigy...
You seem to require a singular focus to blame even when it's clear there are multiple culprits. Could it be that game situation dictated a more aggressive approach in the 2nd half versus reading between the lines and filling in blanks to again find your singular focus? Hey, you might be right, but to get there requires a bunch of assumptions. I would generally temper my anger toward someone if I'm arriving there relying on multiple assumptions, but that's just me.
I've mentioned other factors of why we stink. But I tend to blame coaching/play calling more often than not. I'm just trying to make my point. Like I've said many times before, there's plenty of blame to go around... But it's my opinion that the offense's main issue is the one I keep harping on...
(09-26-2023, 10:25 AM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ] (09-26-2023, 09:54 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ]You seem to require a singular focus to blame even when it's clear there are multiple culprits. Could it be that game situation dictated a more aggressive approach in the 2nd half versus reading between the lines and filling in blanks to again find your singular focus? Hey, you might be right, but to get there requires a bunch of assumptions. I would generally temper my anger toward someone if I'm arriving there relying on multiple assumptions, but that's just me.
I've mentioned other factors of why we stink. But I tend to blame coaching/play calling more often than not. I'm just trying to make my point. Like I've said many times before, there's plenty of blame to go around... But it's my opinion that the offense's main issue is the one I keep harping on...
Coaching and preparation are definitely lacking. That's on the whole group of coaches and if anyone in particular deserves criticism from that, it's Doug because the buck stops there. It's hard to fully blame play calling/Press for me with execution being what it has been, but I'll be watching those 1st and 10 calls for sure these next couple of weeks to see if you are right or if they've made some changes.
(09-25-2023, 07:46 PM)StrayaJag Wrote: [ -> ] (09-25-2023, 07:22 PM)carp8dm Wrote: [ -> ]I hate this type of nonsense.
You realize that there are 31 other teams that also pay their players, right?
Your coaches, the management, decides whether the practices are good enough. They also decide who is going to get plays and who the plays should be focused on. They also decide what scheme we will run and how to run an offense based on down/distance/time of game.
Last year our players got paid just the same as this year. And yet last year our team was exceptional, even when we were losing.
Last year's team would smoke this years team. And last year's team has the same players, for the most part.
So, what's changed? The players are almost identical. And yet we look like trash. Maybe the coaches have changed responsibilities and those changes have resulted in poor management and poor overall decision making? Is that so profound? That coaching/managing is a huge factor in holding players accountable?
LOL. You guys kill me. It's obvious this team sucks. This is the same team as last year. And yet we suck all of a sudden. What's changed??
Doug gave up control of the offense. That has changed. And it's obvious this team no longer has the passion they did last year. Same players playing the same positions. The thing that changed is that the coaches are no longer coaching their same jobs. There was a change at the top. And here we are.
It's not that hard to figure out.
Did the team also have this many dropped balls/fumbles then last year ?
There execution on the basics has been dog [BLEEP] and u have to acknowledge that
Yes. Jags were top 5 in drops last year.